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American Morning

America's New War: How Afghans Fight

Aired September 20, 2001 - 10:33   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's bring in somebody who's actually been there, walked these hills, and can tell us a little bit about it.

His name is Tom Carew. But actually, in full discloser, that's an alias. Tom Carew is with the SAS, which British secret forces, and he joins us on the line from London.

Mr. Carew, thanks for being with us.

TOM CAREW, FORMER SAS SOLDIER: I'm honored. Thank you.

O'BRIEN: All right, as we look through here -- actually, he's on line from Antwerp, Belgium. I apologize for that.

Let's take a fly through the Khyber Pass. What brought you to Afghanistan in the first place in 1979?

CAREW: Well, actually Mit was My 1980. We went there to actually assess the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) regime's (ph) fighting capability against the Soviet invasion forces and also to retrieve whatever items of Soviet hardware was available at the time to be recovered.

O'BRIEN: And when you first got there, were you a bit surprised with what you had to contend with?

CAREW: Yes, that's a bit of an understatement. Yes, it was quite a task. Basically, it was a new thing that had to be done. It's quite a task there, the Khyber Pass. Well, the actual Hindu Kush is a mountain range like you've never seen before.

O'BRIEN: Let's hit some of the points that you've been mentioning there. There are some articles you've written, you have a book out, as I understand it, which talks about this. The book is called, "Jihad: The Secret War in Afghanistan." One of the things you talk about is it's a natural fortress. What do you mean by that?

CAREW: Well, it's very easy there for the person, especially the guerrilla fighter, to actually engage the enemy and then just vaporize, you know. they simply just disappear. It's very much similar to your guys having the jungle in Vietnam, they sort of engage you, and then they just vanish, and you're left firing at nothing, you know.

O'BRIEN: All right.

CAREW: They're specialist about...

O'BRIEN: And the other thing is supply lines. Whenever you're putting troops into a position in a place you want to keep them supplied. Obviously, if they're trying to trek through these high altitudes and -- with a pack on, that's a difficult thing, to keep them supplied, isn't it?

CAREW: Very hard work. You are better off speaking to some of the Russians about that. They had nightmare there.

O'BRIEN: Really?

What about the mountain snows we were referring to? That's -- winter is upon us in this part of the world. How much will that come into play?

CAREW: Well, it will take a real good part of it. When you're in your planning there you have snow from anything from your waist up to your neck, and sometimes deeper.

O'BRIEN: How much does that slow you down?

CAREW: I'm sorry?

O'BRIEN: It must slow you down tremendously, I assume.

CAREW: Well, really, nothing really moves that much in the wintertime, especially static lines, until about April time, you know. I'm not sure what everybody has planned, but if they're going into the planning phases, the training phases, it's ideal because it gives you some periods where you can actually train the guys up, albeit, it's going to be cold training them up, you know.

O'BRIEN: All right. And finally, we talked a little bit about what it's like to be there in the high altitudes,that's got to be challenging. The other thing is detection avoidance. You mention in your article, I that was very interesting, that the locals where a sandal that has a tire tread for its sole, and a western boot would be very obviously detected. Tell us a little bit about just avoiding detection in a place like this for something that is a covert operation.

CAREW: Yes, well, of course your guys will be well versed in that, so that's not a big problem. But yet, you're very true, when you start walking in western boots you immediately leave a distinctive tread. And especially with the winter coming on, you've got the snow, you have to take countermeasures and a lot of them, because for those guys, they live there all the time. A strange tread and they've immediately got you, you know.

O'BRIEN: All right. Mr. Carew, I'm going to ask you to hang on the line for just moment..

I want to bring in Nic Robertson, who, until very recently, was the last western journalist inside the Taliban-controlled regions of Afghanistan. He joins us now from Quetta, Pakistan on the videophone.

And, Nic, I just want to ask you, we've talked a little bit about you, about the situation inside there. We've talked less about the ordeal that which you've undergone, just trekking through those hills, carrying the equipment, trying to do your job. It makes one wonder how difficult it would be to engage in any sort of military action.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, I'm by no means a military expert, and certainly, the technology we use these days with video telephone to transmit pictures certainly makes getting around the country very easy. And we're able to travel the country's highways. The infrastructure there is decimated by 20-odd years of war, and most of the main roads don't have tarmac on them.

But the issues that are going to make life there for any outside force difficult up the Taliban, who are very well used to operating in those conditions, the things that make it actually safer for the Taliban, and one of the things we're talking about, the weather at this time of year. One of the things about the weather at this time of year is that it is very, very dusty. It is very, very windy, and there's a lot of airborne dust. The country has also been under drought for the last three or four years; this compounds the dust in the air, and winds, that are a common at this time of year sweeping down off the mountains, tend to blow that dust up.

But the other issue as well, the country has been under drought for the last three or four years, which means water is very, very -- in scarce supply. So you insert troops there on the ground, but how are they going to have enough water supplies to operate with?

And these are issues that are going to compound military -- the problems for military analyst as they look at the situation right now.

Certainly, the mountains are very, very rugged and they're very, very difficult to pass through. The snows tend to come right high in the Hindu Kush probably sort of late October.

O'BRIEN: All right. Let's go back to Mr. Carew.

I know you couldn't hear Nic Robertson, but as we take another fly in there, what's your assessment of the capabilities of these people as a fighting force in general? Do you have the sense that they are a formidable foe?

CAREW: Well, if you can get them tied down it won't be a problem, you can virtually steamroll them. But the biggest problem will be tying them down.

O'BRIEN: What do you mean by that, sir?

CAREW: Well, engage them into an actual open combat, because they're so used to just disappearing again. You have to sort of get them consolidated and tie them down, then it won't be too much of a problem, but it's very hard to get them tied down. The Russians tried it for a long time, to tie them down.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Carew, Tom Carew, once again, an alias for a SAS soldier who has written a book about this.

Nic Robertson, who is in Quetta, Pakistan, thanks for being with us as well, thanks for you insights helping us understanding a little bit more about this region and what may lie ahead.

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