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American Morning
New Revelations About Brutal Fire Fight Between Taliban and Northern Alliance in Mazar-e-Sharif
Aired November 15, 2001 - 10:01 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: And we begin this hour in the northern city of Taloqan. Satinder Bindra reporting that U.S. bombs have fallen on Taliban forces in nearby Kunduz, the city we just mentioned, for a second day now, and Satinder joins us live with more from there. Hello.
SATINDER BINDRA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Bill. Night has fallen in Kunduz and Taloqan. It's all quiet on the battle front, but this could be the lull before the storm. Senior Northern Alliance commanders are telling us that Kunduz has been surrounded on all four sides. A senior Northern Alliance commander also told us recently that two days ago, two Pakistani planes touched down in Kunduz.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: According to our information, Pakistani planes were evacuating their military personnel out of Kunduz.
BINDRA: Now, this is a claim that cannot be independently verified. So far, Bill, there is also been no response from the Pakistani side, but what we are hearing from Northern Alliance commanders here is an attack against Kunduz is imminent and Northern Alliance commanders are also saying the fighting in Kunduz is expected to be the toughest and bloodiest yet of this campaign.
HEMMER: Satinder Bindra in Northern Afghanistan. Thank you. Now also to Mazar-e-Sharif, also in the north, there are new revelations now about Taliban fighters killed in a battle with a Northern Alliance last Saturday after Alliance fighters took control of that city. CNN Alessio Vinci now by video phone in Mazar-e-Sharif for a report and an update in that part of the country. Alessio, hello.
ALESSIO VINCI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Bill. Actually I have to tell you, I'm not in the downtown Mazar-e-Sharif, I'm about 30 miles north of that town.
However, we spent all day today in Mazar-e-Sharif with Northern Alliance commanders who have confirmed to us that last Saturday, as the Northern Alliance was consolidating its hold on power here in Mazar-e-Sharif, a bloody fire fight broke off between Taliban forces, and in the Northern Alliance. About 720 fighters which -- whom the Northern Alliance here described as mainly Pakistani Kashmiri and Chechen fighters refused to lay down their weapons, even as Northern Alliance was taking control of Mazar-e-Sharif, doing a tense two day stand off, about 200 of those Pakistani and Chechen fighters agreed to lay down their weapons.
However, after that, a bloody fire fight, according one of the generals here, broke out, and during that fight, as many as 520 Taliban fighters were killed in one incident alone. What happened that moment, we understand from some of the fighters and some of the generals who were there this Saturday, that tanks -- the Northern Alliance used tanks in order to bring the bloody fire fight to an end.
We were able today to go to that school, and as we arrived there, it is now five days -- more than five days after the Northern Alliance took control of Mazar-e-Sharif. They were still pulling bodies out of the rubble. The tanks have destroyed a good part of the right-hand side of the school, and they were still today pulling bodies out of those -- of those --out of the rubble.
In addition to that, Bill, we were then taken to a nearby compound where some of the POWs, some of the prisoners of wars that were taken during that fight, were still inside a freight container, one of those big containers that are used to move goods around. They were locked in there. As we arrived there, the fighters, the Tal -- the Northern Alliance open up this container and these men start coming out of the container one by one. Some of them could barely walk. We counted -- we counted 42 of them. I asked one of the commanders how come these people were treated this way, how come these they are not in prison, the commander said they would be moved soon to a prison, but for now there was no room. Bill?
HEMMER: All right, Alessio Vinci by videophone there in Mazar-e- Sharif. We lost him at the end there, but Alessio, thanks for that update from there.
Also, the Taliban supreme leader Mullah Mohammed Omar saying a plan is in the works to destroy the United States. In an interview with the BBC's Pashtun Language Service, Mullah Omar says -- I'm quoting now -- "the current situation in Afghanistan is related to a bigger cause that is the destruction of America." He goes on to say, "if God's help is with us, this will happen within a short period of time. Keep in mind this prediction," he warns. In the interview, Mullah Omar also says destroying the U.S. is a -- quote -- "huge task beyond the will and comprehension of human beings."
For the latest now from the Pentagon and what is happening there from the U.S. military point of view, the Pentagon now reminding Americans once again, the war against the Taliban, said to be far from over at a news briefing about an hour ago. Defense officials saying there could be thousands of Taliban fighters still fighting, and that Afghanistan is not the only battlefield in the U.S.-led war on terrorism.
GEN. RICHARD MYERS, JOINT CHIEFS CHAIRMAN: We're heavily engaged in what will be a long and difficult fight. We've seen some -- some successes over the past few days, but there is much fighting that remains to be done until we achieve the victory that we want. It's important to remember that these activities, these military activities in Afghanistan are only the beginning of a global campaign. HEMMER: Again, the general went on to say that small units of U.S. Forces remain in southern Afghanistan helping to identify targets there. And still a lot of fighting going on on the ground as we have mentioned. As Northern Alliance and anti-Taliban forces try gain more ground. While the U.S. continues to pound the Taliban with airstrikes, Joie Chen in the war room with the latest from this front. Joie, with the general. Good morning.
JOIE CHEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning again, Bill. Yes, General Shepperd is with us. One of our CNN Military Analysts joining us to talk about the some of the latest information we have been getting. This morning, General, we had heard from one of our correspondents at the Pentagon, Bob Franken, this report from the Pentagon that some key leaders and key figures in the Taliban and al Qaeda may have been killed in bombing attacks. I guess part of my surprise is that given the number of Northern Alliance and opposition gains in the last few days that there would be airstrikes at all.
MAJ. GEN. DON SHEPPERD (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Not surprising at all. A lot of mopping up to do around this country. And there will be emerging targets where Taliban or al Qaeda will go back into the areas that have been previously seen as conquered. So, it's not surprising at all. But a lot of questions remain to be answered. We'll be asking a lot of questions, I'm sure, at the Pentagon briefing today about where exactly were these buildings, and how do we know who was there.
CHEN: And when this bombing actually occurred.
SHEPPERD: Indeed.
CHEN: Talk to us about the latest on the situation on the ground. We've heard some reports from Alessio Vinci and Satinder Bindra in the north, but --
SHEPPERD: Right. The latest reports up there in the Kunduz area. Reportedly fierce fighting with the fighting -- with the remaining Taliban and al Qaeda being surrounded on four sides in the town of Kunduz, reported as fierce fighting, tanks involved, this is the area where you have a lot of Chechens, Pakistanis, and Kashmiri, and remember, the closer you get to the Pakistan border, the more sympathy you have for the Taliban cause in these particular areas.
But a lot of fighting going on here, and it's going to be ugly. It is the house-to-house type. And very unlikely to have a bunch of prisoners taken. These people will probably fight to the death up in this area.
CHEN: I guess what I'm struck by is Kandahar is what we emphasized as being a Taliban stronghold. Why would they be fighting so hard for Kunduz?
SHEPPERD: Yeah, I -- again, I think it is the type of people, the type of fighters that here -- are here and where they're from. And they're not Taliban, they're the invading forces, if you will, the people that have supported al Qaeda. Rather than -- CHEN: From the outside.
SHEPPERD: -- the indigenous Taliban, you're right. In the Kandahar area down here, lots of reports about fighting going on. The airport's been taken, the airport's not been taken. We still are not clear what's going on there. But all of the Taliban, this is the only place they have to retreat to. As far as the roads being available to them, they can retreat here, they can retreat into the desert to the west, they of course can try to flee into Pakistan. But this is the only place left to go. Some of them will probably fight. Some of them will probably go into the hills up here with the idea of guerrilla warfare over an extended period of time. But there is no place left for them to go. They are finished as an effective fighting force.
CHEN: We have talked a lot about the Northern Alliance and the -- anti -- other anti-Taliban forces gaining ground in some of these cities, and yet we heard from Alessio Vinci just a short time ago, Mazar-e-Sharif, still being some contested areas there, and still being some of these issues about taking prisoners, and so forth.
SHEPPERD: Right, I think you will find, again, contested pockets pop up from time to time. This war will go on for a while, especially in the al Qaeda. The difference down here, of course, is also that this is not Northern Alliance area. This is the Pashtun tribes switching sides and now rising up against the Taliban, an important element.
Also our special forces have been very heavily involved up in the northern part. Not as heavily involved down here because there weren't people to be involved with. Now they will race down to this area to establish liaisons, gain intelligence, this type of thing, so that airstrikes and other ground operations can take place.
CHEN: Checking to see first if they are welcome among these Pashtun tribes.
SHEPPERD: Indeed, indeed.
CHEN: Major General Don Shepperd, one of our CNN Military Analysts, joining us here in the war room to get a better picture on what's going on on the ground. Bill.
HEMMER: All right, Joie, thanks. And the General as well. See you a bit later this morning.
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