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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports
America Strkes Back: Taliban Vow to Keep Fighting, U.S. Commanders Vow to Step Up the Pressure
Aired November 21, 2001 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: Today on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS: "America Strikes Back." The commander-in-chief rallies the troops, offering the nation thanks on Thanksgiving eve.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe in the fearless hearts of the United States military.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Heading into the holiday, the mood of a nation that finds itself at war, at home and abroad.
Mystery in Connecticut: A suspicious envelope is discovered as an elderly woman dies from inhalation anthrax.
As the Taliban vow to keep fighting, U.S. commanders vow to step up the pressure.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All forms of military power remain on the table for consideration.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: We'll get the latest from Afghanistan, as "America Strikes Back."
JOHN KING, CNN GUEST ANCHOR: I'm John King in Washington, in for Wolf Blitzer.
It's already Thanksgiving Day for U.S. troops fighting America's new war in Afghanistan. And for the anti-Taliban forces, already something to be thankful for. Reports of surrender by the Taliban for one of its last strongholds inside Afghanistan. We'll have a live report in just a moment. And we'll assess the impact of today's anthrax, anthrax death on the investigation.
But first to Catherine Callaway, for an update on today's developments in America's new war -- Catherine. CATHERINE CALLAWAY, CNN ANCHOR: Good afternoon, John. Good to see you. And as you just said, the Taliban say that they will surrender the city of Konduz. That's their last stronghold in northern Afghanistan. Details of that surrender are still being worked out. The decision apparently was reached today during talks between the Taliban and the Northern Alliance.
Thousands of Taliban troops and Muslim fighters from abroad have been holed up in Konduz. Heavy fighting is taking place in and around that city in recent days.
And anthrax has claimed another victim. A 94-year-old Connecticut woman, diagnosed with inhalation anthrax, died today. She is the fifth anthrax fatality since several anthrax-laced letters began turning up in the mail last month. The emergency room at the hospital was sealed off today after someone brought in an envelope with a powdery substance. We'll have more on this in just a moment.
And President Bush delivered tough fighting words today to Army troops at Fort Campbell, Kentucky. Mr. Bush vowed to destroy Osama bin Laden's terrorist network piece by piece. But he warned that Afghanistan is just a start, and that the war against terror will take a long time.
And in southern Afghanistan, the Taliban vow a fight to the death. A Taliban spokesman says they will never surrender their stronghold of Kandahar. He also says that the Taliban have no idea where bin Laden is holed up.
Three more Air Force AC-130 gunships are headed for action in Afghanistan. The heavily-armed planes will operate out of Uzbekistan. Pentagon sources say that the planes will be in a good position to attack targets in northern Afghanistan.
And finally, the number of people missing or dead in the World Trade Center attack continues to fall. The official tally now below 3,900. Early estimates had placed that figure at 6,500, John. And we're going to give it back to you in Washington.
KING: All right, Catherine, thank you for that.
More on that puzzling anthrax death in a few moments. But first, a major development on the military front. CNN has learned the Taliban have agreed to surrender the city of Konduz, their last stronghold in northern Afghanistan. CNN's Alessio Vinci wrote this story just a short time ago, and he joins us now live on the phone with more details -- Alessio.
ALLESSIO VINCI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, John. It is now 3:00 in the morning here in Mazar-e Sharif,in northern Afghanistan. We left the meeting room where Northern Alliance commanders and Taliban leaders are meeting just about 45 minutes ago. Journalists were allowed inside that meeting room briefly before being kicked out of that room.
And the Taliban leader, Mullah Faisel (ph), who, we are told, is the assistant minister of defense for the Taliban, told reporters in the meeting that all of the Taliban fighters, including what are known as the foreign fighters -- the Chechens, the Pakistanis and the Arabs -- will surrenders in Konduz. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) in Konduz, nothing will happen.
Chairing that meeting was General Abdul Rashid Dostum, who is one of the top Northern Alliance commanders here in Mazar-e Sharif. And he also said that the Konduz problem will be solved without a fight. Details of how the surrender will take place are being discussed, I believe, as we speak now.
There are, of course, a lot of issues that have to be solved, mainly: how will the Taliban surrender their weapons, to whom they will surrender the weapons, and what will happen to those Taliban fighters who will decide to give themselves up? It may be too early, perhaps, to call the war in Afghanistan to an end. But if the decision taken here in Mazar-e Sharif will pass into reality in Konduz, then certainly, peace is one step closer -- John.
KING: Alessio, here in the United States, the Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has been quite skeptical about these negotiations, especially on the issue you just mentioned, the foreign nationals, in helping the Taliban. Secretary Rumsfeld saying he doesn't want those fighters to escape Afghanistan under any circumstances.
Did that factor at all into these negotiations, and is the agreement for those forces to surrender, or is it for them to lay down their arms and perhaps leave the country?
VINCI: We asked those questions, John, earlier today, when we met with some of the commanders who were arriving at the meeting place before the actual Taliban leaders arrived. And basically, what they told us, is that they would give the Taliban fighters, first of all, a chance to switch sides. And this is a very common thing here in Afghanistan, where you have tribal leaders, local commanders who basically control a pocket of maybe a thousand fighters or so, who are switching sides. Those soldiers would not have to give up their weapons, if they were to decide to fight on the side of the Northern Alliance.
The commanders were also told that there would be no amnesty, no deal, for the so-called foreign fighters. These are the ones who are believed to be the most hard core fighters, the ones that committed the worst atrocities in Afghanistan. We've seen town after town falling in the hands of the Northern Alliance with very little resistance. And whatever resistance has been proposed against the Northern Alliance, it usually comes from those foreign fighters.
But as far as what will help to those foreign fighters if they were to give themselves up, the commanders here were very adamant in telling us that they will be kept here in this country. They will not be extradited to their country of origin, and they will stand trial here. So it is still one of the major issues being discussed here as we speak inside the meeting room.
As it is now 3:00 in the morning, John, I think they will have to resume those talks tomorrow morning. But certainly, the way it is handled, or the way they surrender will take place, and it is one of the details that will be discussed, as we speak now.
KING: CNN's Alessio Vinci in northern Afghanistan, with first word of a very significant, perhaps major development in the military front.
Back here at home, using very tough language, President Bush today vowed to destroy every facet of Osama bin Laden's terror network. The commander-in-chief addressed thousands of cheering men and women of the Army's 101st airborne division in Fort Campbell, Kentucky.
Some members of the 101st, known as the Screaming Eagles, have been deployed to Pakistan. Mr. Bush said that no matter how long the war against terror takes, the United States will keep fighting until victory is in hand.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: We made a good start in Afghanistan, yet there is still a lot to be done. There are still terrorists on the loose in Afghanistan. And we will find and destroy their network, piece by piece. The most difficult steps in this mission still lie ahead. Our enemies hide in sophisticated cave complexes located in some of the most mountainous and rugged territory. These hideouts are heavily fortified, and defended by fanatics who will fight to the death. Unlike efforts to liberate a town or destroy Taliban equipment, success against these cells may come more slowly.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: The president's defense secretary, like Mr. Bush, also out of Washington today, doing his part to boost the spirits of American soldiers who might see action in the war against terrorism. Donald Rumsfeld travelled to Fort Bragg, North Carolina, the home of the Army's special operations command. He said those special forces troops, already on the ground in Afghanistan, are doing -- quote -- "a world class job."
And he said they were crucial to the recent success of anti- Taliban rebels. Rumsfeld also said U.S. special forces, along with opposition fighters, have intensified the search for Osama bin Laden.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: We have dropped leaflet after leaflet all over Afghanistan, offering high rewards for people to spend their weekends and evenings on an exciting pursuit. And they are doing that. And there are teams of people that are out looking. They're going to have to look in towns and villages. They're going to have to look in the mountains. They're going to have to look in caves.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: At today's Pentagon briefing, Rumsfeld's deputy echoed President Bush's warning that the Afghan war is far from over.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL WOLFOWITZ, DEPUTY DEFENSE: This is a president who encourages debate among advisers, encourages having options presented to him. Has no hesitation to make decisions. He has set some very clear guidance as to where we're focused now, and that is in Afghanistan. And we're very far from finished there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz also sharply dismissed the Taliban's suggestion that the United States should get over the September 11th attacks. Wolfowitz said America will never forget. But he said before long, the world will forget about the Taliban.
Joining us now for more on the was in Afghanistan and the latest military developments, CNN military analyst and former NATO supreme commander, General Wesley Clark.
General, the significance of what we just heard from Alessio Vinci, negotiations apparently in the works, a Taliban surrender in northern Afghanistan, the city of Konduz -- what would that mean to the war?
GEN. WESLEY CLARK (RET), FMR. NATO SUPREME COMMANDER: Well, several things. First of all, I think it will free up the Northern Alliance to get on with its political task of forming a government in conjunction with other groups in the country. Because some of the fighters on the other side may defect, it's a possibility of strengthening the Pashtun component of the Northern Alliance, and that, in turn, would be good news for us.
It's also a time of risk for us, because if, for some reason these Arab fighters that are mixed in with the Taliban were to escape, they might either rejoin the group in Kandahar that's resisting, they might link up with al Qaeda elsewhere in the world, or even reinforce Osama bin Laden's defense somewhere.
And so we're going to want to have very good accountability for them. But it clearly marks a transition in the war. This frees up a lot of resources to focus on the south.
KING: Let's follow up on that very point. If you were General Tommy Franks, the commander in charge of this operation, or the president, or Don Rumsfeld, for that matter, what assurances would you want from the Northern Alliance? We heard Alessio Vinci say some of these troops are simply saying, "we'll switch sides. We'll come over to your side."
Is that a scenario that you would like to see play out, if you were in charge of these forces? After all, whether it be the Northern Alliance or U.S. special operations forces, other allied forces, they may be in there hunting for Osama bin Laden, al Qaeda, other Taliban commanders. Would you want troops, that just yesterday were on the other side, next to you during those operations?
CLARK: Well, the art of this is going to be, you will have some of those troops. That's just the fact of war in Afghanistan. People do switch sides. The art of it is to set up the incentives in such a way that you have some greater degree of trust that they're going to operate for you, rather than operating against you.
One of the things you might do, for example, is you put them in areas where they're not operating against the people they were just on sides with. Another thing you can do is, you put U.S. or other allied liaison personnel with them so you know exactly what they're doing, when. And you bring them in tightly on the operation.
But you've got to assess everything like this on the ground, face to face. It puts a lot of burden on the individual judgment of those great special forces troops out there. They're the ones that are going to have to make the tough calls and the tough recommendations to Tommy Franks, and I'm sure he'll listen to them.
KING: And, General, when you hear reports that perhaps 1,500 or so Marines may be going into Afghanistan, what does that tell you? Does that tell you the United States wants to use more of its forces to hunt for Osama bin Laden and key deputies, or would they be going in there for something else?
CLARK: Sounds to me like we would be putting together a reaction force, that if we got hot information, that we needed an area to be cordoned off, and searched, that we have Marines in the area who could quickly be moved to cordon it off.
The first method of operation here is to survey the land and find out where the hiding places are. I'm sure that's already has been done. And then, what the escape routes are, if he's in a particular area, and then to block those routes, so he's sealed in to a particular cave complex, or set of cave complexes. And then, to narrow that noose even tighter. And that's where the Marines could come in very handy.
KING: And, General, you have been in this position, commander of an operation as the holiday season approaches here in the United States. Help us understand the psychology of military morale. You saw the president out today, the defense secretary out today. I recall, during the Kosovo campaign, President Clinton making trips overseas to bases to cheer up the troops.
What is it like to be in live combat, as the holiday season approaches -- not only for the troops, but for their families here back home?
CLARK: Well, it's a great privilege to be in uniform serving your country, and I think every one of the men and women in the armed forces feel that, especially now, when it's so clear how much the United States needs and values its armed forces. For the families it's a time of sacrifice when the loved ones are away. There's jut no escaping that. But I think the families also feel good, knowing that the men and women in uniform are doing something that's not only important and worthwhile, but valued by other people in the country. So I think it's a great thing, that he's gone down to visit at Fort Campbell, and that the secretary of defense was at Fort Bragg today. I think it's very important for the families.
KING: General Wesley Clark, we thank you for your analysis and your thoughts there, and happy Thanksgiving to you, sir.
CLARK: Thank you.
KING: Defiant as ever, the Taliban today vow to fight to the last man. The Taliban's tough words were delivered at a news conference for international journalists in southern Afghanistan. CNN's Nic Robertson was there.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: From amid a horde of journalists, a senior Taliban official emerges to deliver the Taliban view of their losses to the Northern Alliance forces. The message: there is a new front line.
SYED TAYYAD AGHA, MULLAH OMAR'S SPOKESMAN: Our forces withdrawn from different provinces, and now they have reached to southern Afghanistan, and controls about four or five provinces.
ROBERTSON: Those four- to five provinces he says the Taliban controls are around the movement's spiritual capital, Kandahar. He denied rumors they would cede their heartland to tribal leaders as baseless propaganda.
AGHA: The nation living in Kandahar and surrounding provinces, they are with us, and they are ready for any kind of sacrifices to secure the Islamic (UNINTELLIGIBLE), and secure this nation.
ROBERTSON: That Syed Tayyad Agha, the first secretary to Taliban leader Mullah Mohammed Omar, was chosen to deliver these messages, an indication the communication comes directly from the top. On the question of Osama bin Laden...
AGHA: We have no idea where he is.
ROBERTSON: And on Mullah Omar's location, Tayyad Agha says that's now a secret to insure his security. Dozens of reporters, invited by the Taliban to briefly visit Afghanistan for the news conference, listened for almost an hour as the Taliban leaders youthful confidant laid out the Taliban position on the war so far.
Late in the news briefing, he rejected a U.N. proposal for an international conference to determine an interim government for Afghanistan.
AGHA: We will never take part in political or any other reports outside of Afghanistan. ROBERTSON: International intervention, he said, would bring instability, adding, the Northern Alliance could not deliver security to the people. The bottom line message from the Taliban leadership:
(on camera): No surrender of their spiritual capital, Kandahar, and the surrounding provinces. And no surrender of their spiritual leader, Mullah Mohammed Omar. And definitely no indication of any surrender by Osama bin Laden.
Nic Robertson, CNN, Spin Boldak, Afghanistan.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: That defiant talk in the south, obviously, in Afghanistan, prior to the events we've just reported on in northern Afghanistan, an apparent Taliban surrender in the town of Konduz.
Tonight in the war room, the sentiment in the Arab world. That's at 7:00 Eastern, 4:00 Pacific. To participate, go to cnn.com/wolf. Click on "Send Questions," and I will pose those questions to our panel.
And get today's developments front the front lines on "Live from Afghanistan with Christiane Amanpour." That's at 8:00 Eastern, 5:00 Pacific.
Now back to the anthrax case in Connecticut. First, the death of an elderly woman. And now an examination of a package that was taken today to the hospital, where the woman already had died. Of the five deaths from anthrax, this appears to be the strangest case yet. Ninety-four-year-old Ottilie Lundgren had no known connections to the known risk groups. And beyond that, acquaintances say she rarely left home.
How did she get anthrax? Our first report from CNN's Michael Okwu, who's at Griffin Hospital in Derby, Connecticut -- Michael.
MICHAEL OKWU, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, hello. Ottilie Lundgren died at 10:32 this morning, six days after arriving here complaining about respiratory problems.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PATRICK CHARMEL, PRES., GRIFFIN HOSPITAL: We have reported since yesterday that her condition was critical. We knew she was in severe condition, and she had not made progress. And we reported that this morning, that her condition remained the same.
Again, we knew that there was a pretty high probability that she might succumb to the illness. Again, we're all saddened by the fact that she did die as a result of the illness, but it was not totally unexpected.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
OKWU: Now, asked what role her age might have played, doctors stress the mortality rate for inhalation anthrax is extraordinary high. This is now the second perplexing anthrax death in as many months. The first being, of course, Kathy Nguyen, the 61-year-old hospital worker who died in New York last month.
Now, the FBI has sealed Lundgren's remote home this morning. And they began interviewing relatives, friends and neighbors, essentially trying to retrace her steps. And this afternoon, a bit more drama at the hospital. A woman received a package at home. She said it may possibly have contained a suspicious white powder, and she sought help from the hospital.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHARMEL: She subsequently decided, after consulting with a physician, that she should present here at the hospital. She unfortunately brought the envelope with her, which is something that we don't encourage people to do. It was enclosed in a plastic bag. It was subsequently contained further, and brought out of the hospital.
But the local emergency response personnel and hazardous material response personnel did come in and contain the area. And the contents of the envelope are being tested currently by the state health department. There's a fairly low probability that there is any contaminant in the envelope, but the necessary precautions are being taken.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
OKWU: Now, hazmat teams, as you heard, were on hand, as the woman handed the package to the police. It was quite a scene here in a very quiet Derby community. The emergency room was temporarily closed. And even now, there are sections of the E.R. that have been cordoned off for testing.
In the meantime, the package was sent to the Department of Environmental Protection. We understand that 5:30 this afternoon, just momentarily, the mayor will hold a press conference where we expect he will give us the results of tests taken on that particular package -- John.
KING: Michael Okwu in Derby, Connecticut. We will check back with you for more when those results come back. Thank you very much.
And as we said at the start, this is the fifth known death from anthrax. And Connecticut now is the fourth state in the east, plus here in Washington, D.C., where anthrax cases have been reported. Of the other four deaths, one occurred in Florida, two in Washington, and one in New York. Joining us now as we try to explain this -- emphasis on "try" to explain this latest anthrax death -- our bioterrorism analyst, CNN's Javed Ali.
As they try to investigate this -- and they say readily that they are puzzled, they call this bizarre. Connect the dots for us, if you will. If you are the first man in to investigate, and you have the death of this 94-year-old woman, what are you looking for? JAVED ALI, CNN BIOTERRORISM ANALYST: It certainly is puzzling, like you said, John. But at least with the case of Ms. Lundgren in Connecticut. I think the investigators are going to have to go back and try to track her activities over the last two or three weeks, to determine exactly where she was, what were the items she came into contact with. Because, at least right now, it doesn't seem that anyone near her, or anything near her, either, was -- became exposed to the spores.
So if that isn't the case, how did she, as an individual, come into contact with an infectious dose?
KING: One of the theories when the New York woman died mysteriously, is perhaps by some freak of nature that she had came in contact with those responsible for putting the anthrax in the mail, or had been at some facility where that was happening.
Now you have a second mysterious death. Does that debunk the theory that perhaps the first woman has somehow just bumped into the source of the anthrax?
ALI: I think it does debunk this in a way. And both cases are very strange. Exactly what was the source, when exactly did they did get it. The fact that they were both elderly -- the woman in New York was 61, this woman in Connecticut was 94. It's harder for elderly people, or people who have weakened immune systems, to fight off any disease. So that may have contributed to the rapid death in both cases.
KING: Doctors thought this woman had the flu, or flu-like symptoms. Tens of thousands of Americans will go to their doctor or some medical care facility over the next several months with flu-like symptoms. Do these two deaths now mean that doctors have to, from the get-go, skip the normal protocols and test for anthrax?
ALI: I think there will be an adjustment of protocols, and that will have to be sort of in consultation with federal health authorities working with state and local authorities. But that's not to say that every case that now comes into a hospital emergency room is going to be definitively assessed as a potential anthrax case. I mean, there are clues that would point you one way or the other.
If anything, I think it'll be sort of a media or public information challenge, to calm people, to reassure them, that they have not been exposed to anthrax.
KING: Yet another challenge for a government that has few answers to the many questions. CNN bioterrorism analyst, Javed Ali. Thank you for that.
And how do we feel going into this holiday season? A reality check from a couple of the nation's premier pollsters later this hour. And reality at the check-inn counter for millions on the fly. Holiday travel, just ahead.
Also, one big city mayor tells why she won't help the feds interrogate immigrants.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: A look now at stories topping the CNN NEWSWIRE. Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon is to come to Washington early next month for a working visit with President Bush. Today's announcement is yet another sign the Bush administration is becoming more involved in peace making efforts in the Middle East.
Former Argentine President Carlos Menem, released today from house arrest, is free to reenter politics. Argentina's highest court dropped charges of arms smuggling that allegedly occurred during Menem's final years in office. He remains a target of money- laundering charges.
Jack Kevorkian loses a bid for freedom. Dr. Kevorkian is serving a murder conviction for one of the 100-plus suicides he says he assisted. In rejecting the bid, Michigan's court of appeals said endorsing euthanasia would be a step down a slippery slope.
In Florida, F. Lee Bailey has been disbarred. The action, a result of Bailey's handling some disputed stock, originally owned by his prison clients. In 1996, Bailey was jailed for six weeks, before finally deciding to surrender the stock to the state.
Next, an update on today's developments in America's new war, and Portland, Oregon's defiance of the federal government, when it comes to one aspect of the antiterrorism campaign.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Welcome back.
We are expecting any minute a news conference at Griffin Hospital in Derby, Connecticut, scene of the latest anthrax investigation. We will take you there live when that news conference begins.
But, for now, let's turn it over to Catherine Callaway in Atlanta for a look at the latest developments in America's new war -- Catherine.
CALLAWAY: Thank you, John.
For the second day in a row, President Bush is warning that the war in Afghanistan has entered a dangerous new phase. But once again, the president also said that this is just the beginning of the war against terrorism. Mr. Bush was welcomed today as commander in chief by the Army's 101st Airborne at Fort Campbell, Kentucky.
An elderly woman in Connecticut is the fifth person to die nationwide from the inhaled form of anthrax. Acquaintances say that 94-year-old Ottilie Lundgren rarely left her home. How she came into contact with anthrax remains a mystery.
And from New York, as we take a live look at the Trade Center site, comes news about the death toll. It has dropped again: Mayor Rudy Giuliani saying that the number of people confirmed dead at the site or missing and presumed dead now stands at 3,682.
We're going to give it back now to John King in Washington -- John.
KING: Thank you, Catherine.
An unusual dispute has broken out between the Justice Department and the city of Portland, Oregon. The city's police chief says his force will not help the government interview thousands of immigrants who might have information about terrorism. City officials say state law only allows police to interview people suspected of being involved in a crime.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VERA KATZ, MAYOR OF PORTLAND: If our laws are more strict than the federal law, than our officers have to abide by state law. In this particular case, on some of the questions, they would be stricter. And we can't violate state law.
JOHN MUSSMAN, U.S. ATTORNEY: I respect their decision. If they don't want to do these interviews, that is fine with us. I disagree that it violates state law. I think it's a perfectly legal and appropriate law enforcement tool.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: The government wants to question some 5,000 men nationwide who entered the United States last year from countries linked to the September 11 attacks and perhaps to the al Qaeda organization.
Administration officials are playing down a report that they're seriously considering trying a jailed terror suspect before a military tribunal. Zacarias Moussaoui is being held on immigration charges. But prosecutors are building a case linking him to the September 11 hijackers and other terrorists. A senior administration official tells CNN that a military tribunal has not been ruled out, but that it is not right now the leading option. President Bush signed a controversial executive order last week allowing tribunals for terror suspects.
Next, the holiday rush: how getting out of town for Thanksgiving has changed following the September 11 attacks.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: We want to take you now to Griffin Hospital in Derby, Connecticut, where officials are briefing on developments in the latest anthrax investigation. Let's listen in.
MARC GAROFALO, MAYOR OF DERBY: All right, good evening, everyone.
My name is Marc Gadhafi. I'm mayor in the city of Derby. And we are here to report from this afternoon the results of the tests. The DEP has conducted their tests in Hartford. And the preliminary tests have come back negative. So there is no -- in the preliminary tests, there are no signs of anthrax or any other problem with the envelope that was received here today.
The -- they will do further testing over the course of the next day, which should be ready tomorrow at 11:00. But we don't anticipate anything further on this matter. And the hospital will be returned immediately to its normal status. We have just received that from the DEP. Fire Chief Parker is here, and Chief Koda (ph), and Tom Leonard (ph) from the ambulance and EMS rescue.
QUESTION: Mayor, can you tell us if you anything, if you can, about what the content of this package was? You used the word "envelope," so what the content of the envelope was?
GAROFALO: We don't know that at this time. The only test that they did run was a preliminary test for this bacteria, anthrax.
(CROSSTALK)
QUESTION: ... there was some sort of substance...
KING: The Mayor of Derby, Connecticut there briefing reporters -- some good out of this briefing: a package delivered by a resident to the hospital where a 94-year-old woman died of inhalation anthrax, some tests conducted on that package, a white powdery substance in it, the mayor saying preliminary tests are negative, that it is not anthrax or any suspicious dangerous substance in that envelope.
We will bring you more details as necessary in that case.
Now back to a recurring story and a peek at Chicago's Lakeside Drive, as we get to it, at some holiday traffic: thousands, millions of Americans trying to make their way somewhere to see family and friends on this Thanksgiving holiday. We see the beautiful Chicago skyline there -- heavy traffic, but it seems to be moving along fairly well at this hour.
It is crunch day, of course, for many of the 35 million Americans trying to get to Thanksgiving dinner; 20 percent fewer people are flying, largely in part to the September 11 attacks. But fewer people doesn't mean fewer hassles at the airport.
CNN's Brian Palmer is at New York's La Guardia Airport, where it's always busy, much more so today -- Brian.
BRIAN PALMER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Indeed, John, we are here at La Guardia Airport.
The situation has actually calmed down a bit from this morning. There was a lull in midday. It's picking a bit here in the American Airlines' terminal and over at AirTran and ATA. There are longer lines.
We are also joined by Johnny (ph) and Aman Sharma (ph), who are passing through New York on their way to Toronto.
How has your travel experience been today, Aman?
AMAN SHARMA, AIRLINE TRAVELER: Well, actually, we had a horrible experience today. There was so much traffic. And, unfortunately, we missed our plane. So -- but the people at -- from American Airlines, at the gate, they were really nice. So we got new tickets.
PALMER: And you also plan to -- you planned in advance. You left enough time, the sort of thing?
A. SHARMA: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Definitely, we did.
PALMER: Now, Johnny, you are traveling just a few months after September 11 -- a very different context. Are you worried, concerned about safety, security, things like that?
JOHNNY SHARMA, AIRLINE TRAVELER: Of course I'm concerned. But I'm a consultant and I have to travel a lot. So I try not to think about it. I can't quit my job. So I have to travel.
PALMER: Now, security measures, it's sort of hard to see anything different here. But have you noticed any increased security, anything like that, Aman?
A. SHARMA: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. It was really, really good. Today, it was really good. I still don't find it as strict as I find it in Europe, but, still, it was good today. I feel safer.
PALMER: Johnny, how do you feel?
J. SHARMA: I feel better. I travel a lot. Today -- it's been really strict today. But, usually, it's not -- it's OK. Still, in Europe, it's totally different.
PALMER: Great. Johnny, Aman, thank you so.
We have also talked to other travelers. It's sort of hard to gauge any sort of general mood. But there are people who say, just like Johnny and Aman: You have to travel. We have to travel. So we try to put this stuff out of our mind.
And then there is the other school of thought: You have to live. Que sera sera -- John.
KING: And, Brian, as you look around, those people seem to be in pretty good spirits. As you look around, how visible is the security? Do you see National Guard troops? Do you see increased airline security or state police or local police?
PALMER: Actually, on this side of the security checkpoint, the far side, not really any sort of visible increased security measures. Of course, there could be things going on we just don't know about. However, we have seen a handful of National Guards men and Guards women with automatic weapons going to the other side of the security checkpoint. So, yes, there is increased security -- John.
KING: CNN's Brian Palmer on pre-holiday duty at La Guardia Airport in New York -- thank you very much, Brian.
Now, Boston's Logan Airport is stuck for now with the security company it tried to fire. A local judge says the airport's security chief did not follow proper procedure when he revoked the license of Argenbright Security. That company screens passengers at Logan and other airports across the country. Argenbright has been under fire since September 11 for continued security breaches. The company also pleaded guilty to two security-related felony charges. Argenbright's license has been temporarily reinstated, but Logan Airport officials indicate they'll try again to have it suspended.
For more on airline security, log on to flightrisk@CNN.com. Among the features, see the amounts paid in security-related fines by the top 10 airlines since 1998 -- the AOL keyword CNN.
Here are some other stories now making the headlines on the international front. The World Food Program is resuming shipments from Pakistan to Afghanistan. A convoy of 58 trucks left Peshawar, Pakistan for Kabul today. The shipments stopped last week because the roof was unsafe -- the route, excuse me.
Two members of the Senate Armed Services Committee want an increased role for U.S. forces in Uzbekistan, which borders Afghanistan. Chairman Carl Levin and ranking Republican John Warner lobbied Uzbek officials yesterday. The senators wouldn't give details of what they are seeking, but they did say it does not involve more ground troops.
And India is reestablishing ties with Afghanistan. The New Delhi government has sent a diplomatic mission to Kabul for the first time since 1996. That's when the Taliban seized the capital and India closed its embassy.
How has the nation's mood changed since September 11? We will check the pulse of America just ahead on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: It's been more than two months now since the terror attacks of September 11. But when it comes to the war on terror, the mood of the country has not changed much.
Joining me here in Washington with a finger on the public pulse is Democratic pollster Peter Hart, and from Fort Lauderdale, Florida Republican pollster Frank Luntz.
Peter Hart, let's begin with you. Some of the politicians call it the new normal: an increased security around the country, another anthrax death today -- obviously a new environment for the American people. What is different if you look at public opinion now as opposed to, say, September 10?
PETER HART, PETER J. HART RESEARCH: Not an awful lot, to be perfectly honest, John.
The only thing that has really changed is, we continue to be pretty nervous and uncertain about our own personal safety, but very confident, very upbeat about nation. Better than two-thirds of us are positive about the direction of the country. And we are optimistic about the future.
At the same time, as you could hear from the other voices, people are very reflective as they think about this Thanksgiving, but positive about the country.
KING: Now, Frank Luntz, the country has been on bit of roller coaster, if you will, the past two months: progress in recent days reported on the military front; but after a bit of a break, another anthrax case, the tragic death of a 94-year-old woman in Connecticut today.
How is the public processing this: an uncertain war that may go on for quite a long time, the president says; concerns about domestic security and the anthrax scare back home? How does the public process this information?
FRANK LUNTZ, POLLSTER: Well, Peter is right.
I mean, there are three components to this. There is national security, personal security and economic security. And Americans are looking at all three. In terms of their personal security, tomorrow is a very important day, Thanksgiving. And it's chance for Americans to renew their commitment to family. And I think that you are actually going to see an uptick in public confidence because of what happens tomorrow. It's a return to normalcy.
In terms of economic security, you are still a few weeks away from Americans really processing what is going on with the economy out there. And in national security, with what we are reading in the newspaper and seeing on CNN, we are starting to believe that we actually are going to be successful. It may take a while longer, but that our military will succeed in addressing terrorism, at least in short term. So, in that sense, I think you are going to see a slight uptick in the mood over the coming days and weeks.
KING: Peter Hart, we are not, to say the least, known as a patient nation. Have the American people settled in? Are they comfortable with the idea that their I.D. will be checked three or four times at the airport, that they will see National Guard troops, that perhaps if they are of Arab descent, that they might be profiled by the government, if you will, and watched more closely, perhaps even interviewed by law enforcement authorities? Are the American people ready to accept that?
HART: John, two different questions.
The first half is, the American public is very patient. And whether you go through an airport or you look at our patience and how long it will take internationally to be successful, the public has shown great restraint. In terms of civil liberties and questions related to civil liberties, a lot of that is still being played out. And I think there are out a lot of questions on the part of many Americans of what the tradeoff is. And the public is willing to take certain steps. But I think they have a boundary line. And they have drawn a line in the sand. And that is going to be tested, certainly, over the next month or two.
KING: Frank Luntz, follow up on the point of civil liberties. The Justice Department wants broad new authority. There is talk of these military tribunals in which the defendants would have far fewer rights than they would in a courtroom: secret evidence, secret proceedings, perhaps the evidence not even shared with the person on trial. Are the American people ready to embrace that because of what happened on September 11?
LUNTZ: The American people are prepared to do anything that will make the nation more secure and make them feel more secure. But the more details that you provide, I think the more hesitation the public would have.
And, by the way, there is a difference. You can't really refer to the American people as the public. Men and women have very sharply different views about this. Men are prepared to do virtually anything. They are prepared to sacrifice, go to war, just go all the way, whereas women are much more cautious, much less willing to make some of the kinds of commitments that you hear talked about.
KING: Peter Hart, help me understand what the American people think of their president at this moment. Eight months ago, you questioned whether this president would have the support of the American people because of the circumstances of the election. He has high approval ratings right now. You see him here with the troops today. They are obviously embracing the commander in chief.
Yet, were there not a war under way, we would be having a pretty fierce political debate over the state of an economy that, by all indications, appears to be in a recession.
HART: I think there are two different things happening here.
One, I think the president has tremendous support from the American public. Our latest poll showed it over 85 percent. But there is another side of this. And that is our domestic front. And on the domestic front, all of the problems which the president was going to confront during this fall season have not been swept away. They are still there. They are still ahead of him.
And on the economic front, Frank says maybe we are a month or two away from making a judgment. I think it's just the opposite. I think that we have made a judgment. And I think we are in a recession. And I think that comes back to how we get out of this recession. And that is going to be the president's challenge.
KING: Well, Frank Luntz, let's address the president's challenge. When he talks of his father post-Persian Gulf War, he says George Bush, the 41st president of the United States, made a grave mistake. He had built up all this political capital and he did not spend it. Many Republicans here in Washington privately say that about this George Bush right now. They say he is at 80, 90 percent approval in the polls, but he is not flexing his muscles when it comes to issues like economic stimulus, like the airline security debate. Is he potentially to pay a price down the road?
LUNTZ: It's tough to tell.
Look, this -- everything will be decided 12 months from now. And a lot is going to focus on the economy. And we know that the economy is in recession. Although one thing I would point out -- and I would be curious to see if Peter would agree with this -- is that the American people believe that the -- they have faith in the economy. They actually think the economy is going to improve in the near to mid term, even though they themselves are nervous about their own economic situation.
For corporate CEOs who are watching a program like this, they have got to be concerned. We have never had that situation before. So when George Bush looks at the issue of an economic stimulus package, he has got to know that if they don't pass anything, and the economy meets with what people expect for themselves -- that is, if it deteriorates -- then the Republican Party is going to have a problem 12 months from now.
Although one other point, John: No one is talking politics in Washington. Yes, there are these forays into partisanship. But right now, the American people, they don't want to hear Republicans. They don't want to hear Democrats. They want to sit down to a turkey dinner. They want to be with friends and family. And they don't want to hear anything of what goes on in Washington. They want a return to normalcy.
KING: Peter Hart, you agree with Frank Luntz -- quickly?
HART: Absolutely. They do want a return to normalcy. And, at the same time, I think there is a lot of uncertainty on personal security and the personal economic front. And there we find 23 percent saying: I'm worried that I will lose my job or somebody in my family.
So there is going to be a lot of prayers around Thanksgiving tables.
KING: Peter Hart and Frank Luntz, thank you both for your insight. To both of you a happy Thanksgiving.
HART: Thank you, John.
KING: The next steps for Afghan women -- when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Let's go to New York now and get a preview of "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE," which begins in just a few minutes at the top of the hour.
Jan Hopkins is sitting in for Lou today -- Jan. JAN HOPKINS, "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE": Thanks, John.
Coming up on "MONEYLINE" tonight: The Taliban agrees to surrender Kunduz in Afghanistan. We will be joined by Ronald Reagan's former deputy defense secretary, Lawrence Korb. We'll also have the latest on the death of a 94-year-old Connecticut woman -- that death from anthrax. As Americans head home for the holidays, we will go live to some of the nation's busiest airports. And we'll tell you what was behind today's sell-off on Wall Street.
John King will be back right after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Many Afghan women are looking for their place in a post- Taliban Afghanistan. For some, there is finally new hope for a better life.
CNN's Ben Wedeman has the story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BEN WEDEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The daily bread prepared at a women's bakery in Kabul. The Taliban forbade women from going to bakeries to avoid contact with men, but allowed them to set up their own bakeries.
Here the talk is of hope revived for the women of Afghanistan.
Tuba Abawe (ph) she says she was a member of the Afghan Academy of Sciences. Under Taliban rule, she stayed at home. Now hopes to go back to work.
Morning at a women's clinic brings a steady stream of patients. Under the Taliban, health services were strictly segregated. The all- women's staff basking in newfound freedom.
"Now I can come to work by myself," says nurse Maria Shahazad (ph). Under the Taliban, I had to come with a male relative."
(on camera): The departure of the Taliban has allowed the women of Kabul to breathe a bit more freely. Another oppressor, however, shows no sign of leaving.
(voice-over): Grinding poverty is the unrelenting tyrant ruling the lives of millions of Afghan women.
For Kabul's poor, a fetid putrid stream trickling through the city is the place to do the wash.
"Why are you taking my picture?" ask Leyla (ph). "I have to do because no water in my house."
The comings and going of Afghanistan's feuding factions means little for the women here.
"Nothing has changed for me since the Taliban left," says Leyla. "Nothing."
At a carpet sweatshop, the daily bread is earned at the cost of a childhood. These girls, some as young as five years old, work from first light until sunset, earning as little as 8 cents a day, enough for a loaf of bread. They toil away under image of womanhood that seems galaxies away from Afghanistan, stitching and knotting day after day as they grow from girls into women.
Ben Wedeman, CNN, Kabul.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: I'm John King in Washington. I will be back in one hour with the "War Room."
CNN's coverage of America's new war continues with "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE," which begins right now.
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