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American Morning

Interview of Jerrold Post, Former CIA Profiler

Aired December 14, 2001 - 09:46   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: The administration believes that watching Osama bin Laden recounting the events of September 11th and reflecting on a job well done speaks for itself. But upon closer examination, the bin Laden tape may tell us more about the terror leader than mere words. What, for example, can we learn if his body language? Psychiatrist Jerrold Post is a former CIA profiler. Dr. Post joins us now from Washington. Welcome. Good to have you with us this morning.

JERROLD POST, FORMER CIA PROFILER: My pleasure to be with you.

ZAHN: So, Doctor, what I'd like to do is share some video with you and our audience, and we've highlighted it in a way to make it -- Osama bin Laden a little bit clearer. Now, in this first clip, he is basically telling his other dinner guests that another al Qaeda member has told him about a dream he had had a year ago, and in this dream he saw a soccer game against the Americans, and on his team, showed up on the field, they were all pilots. When you look at this, what is being communicated? Dr. Post, what do you see, when you see that portion of the tape?

POST: What I see there, was two aspects. First, there's the kind of jovial aspect about -- about bin Laden, and the metaphor is really quite striking. One has a feeling, almost, of good old boys talking about the big game in which they were the underdog, and the total indifference to loss of life and the jovial self congratulatory aspect is really quite striking.

ZAHN: And then, there's another excerpt where Osama bin Laden makes it quite clear, and we're going to share the video now with our audience, that a number of the hijackers weren't aware, until they boarded those planes, that they were on a martyrdom mission. What do you see when you look at this tape? We know what the words say, but what does his body language tell us?

POST: Well, again, it's -- and if I were a member of al Qaeda, I would be quite chilled by this and be questioning the selfless leadership of the cause that he professes to manifest, because he basically is almost chortling over the fact that they were unaware of what they were doing until just before, and, personally, I doubt that they were told just before. In seeking martyrdom, it's very important to be able to prepare yourself psychologically the night before, the ritual bathing, the prayers, and here, he is laughing over the fact that he unwittingly led his own people to their death. This is pretty chilling.

ZAHN: Let's move on to another part of the tape where is he talking about the position of the tower, and let's closely examine how he uses his hands here, where he basically said that he had calculated that the floors that would be hit would be three or four floors, and we'll let the translation continue on the screen. What are the -- his hand movements convey here?

POST: Well, again, it's certainly designates clear foreknowledge and an active role in the planning and, when he goes on to speak about the fact of the -- his own experience as an engineer, and that this goes way beyond his most optimistic views, the fact of the magnitude of the casualties, he is now seeing as confirmation that Allah is on his side, and his total indifference to this dreadful loss of human life, again, gives us a portrayal, not of some new found profit, but of -- but, really of the evil of his indifference to human life.

ZAHN: Well, we appreciate your dropping by to share your analysis with us this morning. Dr. Post, thank you very much.

POST: My pleasure.

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