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American Morning

Why Rudy Giuliani Is Man of the Year

Aired December 24, 2001 - 08:06   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Eric Pooley of "Time" magazine interviewed Mayor Giuliani, preparing the "Person of the Year" cover story. He joins us from New York to talk a little bit about the Mayor and their choice there at the magazine.

Welcome to our program, Eric.

ERIC POOLEY, "TIME" MAGAZINE: Hi, Miles.

O'BRIEN: Why Rudy Giuliani?

POOLEY: Well, as we've said before, we think the response to the attack is in many ways a bigger and more surprising story than the attack. And, you know, I spent a lot of time with Rudy Giuliani, reporting and writing this piece. And the more I looked at what he had done in the aftermath, the more impressed I became.

I'll tell you a couple of things. You know, when we think about it now, it almost seems preordained, that New York rises from the ashes. He leads us, you know, back, puts us together again.

At the time the towers came down, it was by no means certain that we were going to bounce back as rapidly as we did.

Sixteen hours after the attack, he got back to his apartment. He was exhausted. It's 2:30 in the morning. He reaches -- he can't sleep. He reaches for a biography of Winston Churchill, and starts reading about Churchill's wartime words.

When he told me that, we were riding toward ground zero in his truck, going through the switchbacks and barricades that lead into the heart of ground zero.

And he told me that he was really interested, he wondered to himself, how much of what Churchill had said during the war, those brave words, were bluff.

And I asked him, well, "Mr. Mayor, how much of what you said on September 11th was bluff?"

And he said immediately, he said, "some of it was." He said, he said, "during a crisis, you have to be positive. And I didn't know that we were going to get through this." He said, "there's a part of you that's saying, we're really not -- maybe we're not going to get through this."

But you have to push those voices aside and lead, and really, right at the moment of impact, he was the guy on the scene. The President, for security reasons, was out of sight for most of that day. Rudy Giuliani was the guy that brought the country out of this.

Something he said a week after, Miles, at the first memorial service. He said, "maybe the purpose of this was to find out if Americans are every bit as tough and patriotic and loving and willing to die for their country as was the generation during the World War II, during the Civil War, during the War for Independence."

And, you know, we proved that we are as courageous. We are as up to the task, if you will, as those great generations were.

And Giuliani was the first person who passed the test. He was the first person who really told us what the test meant.

So he was the leader. He was the guy. And we're rewarding greatness.

O'BRIEN: Well, I'm curious. Let us inside to the editorial discussions a little bit. Was there a lot of dissension about this? Was there a faction that was pushing, for example, for Osama bin Laden as the -- maybe more aptly titled the newsmaker of the year?

POOLEY: Early on, there was certainly a faction that thought that Osama should be the man of the year. A lot of those people, the more they thought about it, and the more they learned and read and reported about Osama bin Laden, a lot of those people came over to the Rudy Giuliani camp.

And here's why. As I said, this is about greatness. And Osama bin Laden is ultimately a small character. He's not an original. The Ayatollah Khomeini was an original. We hadn't seen his like before. He transformed the Muslim world.

This is a terrorist who happens to have a lot of money and a good organization behind him. But right now it looks like what he did on September 11th may have been a lucky punch. And it also looks like, you know, he's a guy who's fleeing for his life, hiding in caves, maybe dead underneath rubble.

Is that the most important figure of the year? Somebody who's cowering for his life? Or maybe even dead?

You know, it's just not the, you know, the large enough character to be "Times" man of the year for 2001.

O'BRIEN: Another choice that came up in a lot of the discussion and debate in advance was George W. Bush. Of course, he received that distinction last year.

Did that disqualify him?

POOLEY: No, it did not. And George W. Bush was under serious consideration. And he did a terrific job leading the country through this war. And he has grown immeasurably as a leader in the course of this crisis.

It does strike us, however, that Rudy Giuliani was the leader at ground zero, at the moment of impact. And he carried us through the first really pivotal days of this crisis. And then he sort of handed the baton to George W. Bush, if you will.

And George W. Bush became the leader who carried us through the war. That's not to be minimized. But we think that the Mayor's contribution was the most important newsmaking contribution of the year.

O'BRIEN: Eric Pooley is at "Time" magazine. Thanks for taking us inside the editorial boardroom there, if you will, and helping us understand how "Time" magazine chose Rudy Giuliani Person of the Year.

And happy holidays to you.

POOLEY: Thanks, Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right.

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