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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports
Did Authorities Stop Suicide Mission in Israel?; Are Osama bin Laden Sightings Fact or Fiction?
Aired March 26, 2002 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KATE SNOW, CNN ANCHOR: Now on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS, have authorities stopped another suicide mission inside Israel? And what's the connection to the U.S.?
He's here, there, and everywhere. More Osama bin Laden sightings -- fact, or fiction?
As if Afghanistan hasn't suffered enough. An earthquake levels mountain villages. It may take weeks to count the dead.
He's going further than the pope: outrage from a Roman Catholic cardinal.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have never felt so devastated, so sad, so besieged, because of the horrific and sinful crimes of priests across the country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SNOW: And, seeking compensation for the suffering of the past. Can top U.S. companies be made to pay for a grim chapter in American history?
Hello, I'm Kate Snow, in for Wolf Blitzer, in Washington. Topping our "News Alert", a developing story: a possible suicide mission, foiled.
Federal investigators say it involves two men who flew to Israel last December. FBI documents indicate the pair boarded an El Al flight in New York, but were denied entry into Israel and forced to return to the U.S. One had a letter, the FBI says it believes alludes to a terrorist attack in Israel. More on that in a moment.
An Arab League summit, focusing on Middle East peace, gets under way in the morning, without two of the major players. Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat has decided to skip the summit because of restrictions placed on him by Israel. Earlier, Egypt's president abruptly pulled out of the same summit.
The world's most-wanted man: could he still be in Afghanistan? U.S. officials say it's possible, but they have no specific information about Osama bin Laden. Unconfirmed sightings have placed him in the southeastern part of that country. America's military focus is shifting in that direction.
The former chairman of the joint chiefs of staff is said to be partially paralyzed, after falling off a ladder on Saturday. Doctors say General Hugh Shelton, who has been retired less than six months, suffered a central spinal cord injury, and initially had no movement in his arms and legs.
Smiles and hugs today in Norfolk, Virginia, as some of the fighter pilots aboard the USS Theodore Roosevelt returned home. More of the same is on tap for tomorrow, when the ship itself will dock. It's steaming toward Virginia after returning to New York City, the flag that three firefighters raised from the ruins of the World Trade Center.
More now on a federal investigation just coming to light involving two men, a flight from New York to Tel Aviv last December and an ominous letter. Here to help sort it all out, CNN national correspondent, Susan Candiotti -- Susan.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Kate. This a very, very strange case involving the FBI. They indicate that the FBI agents there may have stopped an Alexandria, Virginia man suspected of possibly planning to carry out a suicide attack in Israel.
The FBI's case started in December, when two men were about to board an El Al flight, and the two men were questioned by El Al security. The questioning took so long that apparently they left behind some of their belongings, including a four page letter.
When the plane landed in Israel, in Tel-Aviv, the two men never got off the plane but were returned to the United States, where they were arrested by the FBI, sources say, on material witness warrants. As the investigation went on, it was learned, according to court documents, that the letter turned out to be what the FBI describes as a farewell letter written from one brother to another who was on board the flight, indicating that one of the men was apparently intending to die in the suicide attack.
Here's one excerpt from the letter, according to court documents. Quote: "When I heard what you were going to carry out, my heart was filled with the feeling of grief and joy." It goes on to say -- quote -- "we must do for our hereafter as if we were dying tomorrow. And the best actions for Allah, to whom we ascribe all perfection and majesty, is jihad."
Now, according to an FBI affidavit, an agent wrote -- quote -- "I know the term jihad does not necessarily refer to violence, yet the overall tone of the letter," this states, "clearly implies the use of violence and/or the loss of life."
Now, eventually we just learned today, because these court documents were unsealed, that the man carrying that letter has been set free, as well as another man, who had written the letter. However, a third man evidently has been charged in connection with all of this. He was on board the flight with the man who was carrying this letter.
His name is Mohammad el-Yacoubi (ph). And he told our CNN producer just a little while ago that all of this was, in his words, "a big misunderstanding that has been cleaned up." He went on to say that 98 percent of the information, in his words, "relied upon was false and inaccurate."
So, it's a very strange case indeed. Apparently no one is being held in custody at this time. However, one person is charged and has been freed on his own recognizance. And he's being charged with lying before a federal grand jury and allegedly, also being involved in false documents.
Kate, a very confusing situation.
SNOW: Very complicated. Thanks for sorting it out. Susan Candiotti, here in Washington.
As Arab leaders get ready to talk about a peace plan for the Middle East, the death toll in that region climbs again. Two international observers are among the latest victims, shot to death in the West Bank. And there's word that Yasser Arafat will not be traveling to Beirut for the Arab League summit, that gets under way tomorrow.
CNN's Michael Holmes is keeping track of these latest developments in Jerusalem.
MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Hi, Kate. That is true. Confirmed just a short time ago -- well, a couple of hours ago, Yasser Arafat, after days of will he or won't he be going to Beirut for this key Arab summit. The answer comes from Yasser Arafat, he will not be going.
Now, he said -- or, his cabinet accused Israel of trying to blackmail him with tough conditions for letting him go, despite calls from the United States for Arafat to be allowed to leave. The Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, earlier this evening in an interview on Israeli television, introduced a new condition on Yasser Arafat.
He did say that in essence, a U.S. guarantee -- if there was a U.S. guarantee, that Israel would be able to prevent Yasser Arafat from returning to the West Bank from the summit, if there were terror attacks while he was away. Well, that guarantee was never likely to be coming about. And Yasser Arafat and his cabinet deciding that it was better to stay home.
There is teleconferencing equipment set up in Ramallah at his headquarters there. And it's likely he will be addressing the Arab summit via television rather than in person. Now, you mentioned those two international observers who were shot earlier this evening. That is...
(CROSSTALK)
HOLMES: ... time, members of this international observers group, have been targeted or injured at all in the area. The two dead, one man from Turkey, one woman from Switzerland, were driving along a road near the West Bank town of Hebron.
Now, one wounded observer in that group, a Turkish man, told Israel radio that a man in a Palestinian police uniform stepped out and fired his AK-47 into the car. Two observers killed there, Kate.
SNOW: Michael Holmes, reporting live from Jerusalem. Thank you.
While Arab leaders stream into Beirut for tomorrow's summit, the leader of one of the most important countries in the Arab world is not making any travel plans. Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak is staying home. CNN's Beirut bureau chief, Brent Sadler, joins us now with the latest on that -- Brent.
BRENT SADLER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Kate. Yes, indeed. Egyptian leader President Hosni Mubarak also announcing, more or less the same time as Yasser Arafat's side said that the Palestinian leader wasn't coming, Mr. Hosni Mubarak also not going to be here. The Egyptian president, of course a key player in Middle East peacemaking.
So, as things stand now, Arab commentators here do not know quite the real reason why Mr. Mubarak is not coming. It certainly adds another dramatic dimension to an already complicated summit.
Now, you heard from Michael Holmes there, the Palestinians have set up in Mr. Arafat's quarters a teleconferencing system. We heard, yet today, before this Arafat announcement, that indeed they're expecting that the images, live images, of Mr. Arafat can be transmitted into the conference center at that hotel complex behind me there. After the Saudi Arabia peace initiative, which envisages a withdrawal by Israel from land occupied since 1967, from normal relations with Israel. Back to you, Kate.
SNOW: Brent Sadler in Beirut. Thank you.
Coverage of the Arab summit is just a click away at cnn.com. You can also find out more on the struggle for peace in the Mideast with our in-depth special, featuring an interactive look at the region's tumultuous history and much more. The AOL keyword for that, CNN.
Now to Afghanistan, and reports that terrorist mastermind Osama bin Laden is alive and well, near Khowst. This latest sighting from the "Christian Science Monitor," which quotes Afghan military officials working with U.S. forces the region. Pentagon officials say they believe that area is a likely place for bin Laden to hide. But they also say he could be anywhere.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is almost a weekly occurrence, though, that there seem to be a couple of reports. But what has stayed very consistent is that we get reports that they're here, we get reports that they're there. We get reports that he's alive and we get reports that he's dead. But we just don't know.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SNOW: Let's bring in David Isby right now, an intelligence analyst, to talk a little more about this. What do you make of that report in the "Christian Science Monitor," that perhaps he's in the area of Khowst, perhaps he's living there?
DAVID ISBY, INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, I wouldn't bet a whole lot of money on him precisely being there. But the Afghans who are helping us in that area do have a lot of connections with the people who are still loyal to the Taliban and bin Laden. In fact, the Zhidrani (ph) tribe, which is big in the area near Khowst, is split basically 50/50, pro and anti- Taliban.
SNOW: We have a map we can show our viewers where we're talking about. Here's Khowst.
ISBY: And this is in the very remote, rugged border land of Afghanistan. The Soviet military was besieged in Khowst for almost 10 years.
SNOW: And talk about Pakistan, right below there, where we see, in that northeastern portion of Pakistan, that's sort of a no-man's land.
ISBY: It's a northwest frontier province. It's a tribal area. The Pakistani government doesn't normally have a military presence there. And indeed, it's very rough terrain. And certainly Pakistani law literally does not apply off the main roads.
SNOW: The Pentagon has been very careful today about responding to this report. It's basically on one source, one military commander from Khowst province. Couldn't he have an interest in wanting to say, "I've seen Osama bin Laden"? Because he's working with U.S. troops, he wants to look important...
ISBY: Oh, sure, he wants to looks important. But it also may be a way for covering up, say, "my third cousin who's still in with the bad guys has told me this." And that's the difficult thing with Afghanistan. Human intelligence in Afghanistan is a great source, but there are so many hidden agendas in that country. You have to be very careful and have a great deal of local expertise.
SNOW: Have to be skeptical about...
ISBY: Absolutely.
SNOW: How much support do you think Osama bin Laden still has, particularly in that part of Afghanistan?
ISBY: In that part of Afghanistan, you still have a quote/unquote "Taliban culture." That's their unique cushion. The Zhudrany (ph) tribe. You have a local leader, Danin Jalaladin Jukarni (ph), who's a tribal leader, was leader against the Soviets, was a cabinet minister under the Taliban, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) Many of the people in that part of the world doesn't. So that's going to be a hot spot of anti-American pro-Taliban resistance. SNOW: Joe, quickly, if the U.S. wants to go after him in that region, what do they do?
ISBY: Start working on the Pakistani side. Pakistanis have to work with the local people. Because if they come in there with a big operation, they'll just run.
SNOW: OK, David Isby...
ISBY: Thank you.
SNOW: Thank you so much. Appreciate you being here.
Elsewhere in Afghanistan, the devastation mounts. And officials say it could be weeks before we know how many hundreds of men, women and children died in the tremendous earthquake that struck this morning. It was centered in the mountains north of Kabul, which is where CNN's senior international correspondent, Walter Rodgers, is.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WALTER RODGERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The pair of earthquakes delivered a lethal 1-2 punch in northeastern Afghanistan. There is as yet, no accurate figure on the number of people who perished in those twin earthquakes. Although Afghan officials are saying the death toll will be in the thousands.
The epicenter of the earthquake was the Baghlan province,northeastern Afghanistan. The provincial capital, Nahari, 10,000 people. That particular city is supposed to be totally flattened. Afghan officials here in Kabul also report that some 15 other villages totally flattened.
United Nations aid and relief agencies are speeding tents and blankets to the area. As many as 30,000 Afghans are said to be homeless or displaced as a result of this earthquake. The infrastructure here in this war-torn country is at best disorganized. And it will be days, weeks, before we know how many people perished.
Again, the twin earthquakes. The first one hit with a magnitude of 6.0. Then shortly afterwards, another earthquake, 5.0. And there were numerous aftershocks after that. This is a highly earthquake- prone region, just west of the Hindu Kush. In the past few years, as a matter of fact, in 1998, 7,000 people perished in another earthquake in these same provinces.
Walter Rodgers, CNN, Kabul.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: The former chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, General Hugh Shelton, is being treated for partial paralysis. The retired Army general injured his spinal cord when he fell off a ladder at his home in Virginia over the weekend. For more details, we turn now to CNN's military affairs correspondent, Jamie McIntyre. Jamie, a terrible story. JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN MILITARY AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Kate. How ironic is this, that a battle-hardened general who survived Vietnam, served through the Persian Gulf war, even jumped out of airplanes as a chairman of the joint chiefs of staff as a paratrooper, now is seriously injured from a fall from a is ladder at his home in Fairfax, Virginia on Saturday.
The good news is he does seem to be improving, according to the latest statement from the Walter Reed Army Medical Center. Shelton is now in serious condition resting comfortably. He initially experienced some partial paralysis, but they say he is now just experiencing weakness in his right leg and both arms.
But he's continuing to show gradual improvement. He's got no problems with his speech or his breathing. He's alert, he's able to sit up. He's conversing with the medical staff and his wife, Carolyn, who has been at his side since this happened. So it looks like the prognosis is fairly optimistic, although it looked bad there for a time.
Shelton, of course, was the joint chiefs chairman just until the end of September. He was the chairman during the September 11th attacks, but then his term ended at the end of that month. Again though, although he has suffered damage to his spinal cord, it appears to be the kind that it results in a bruising or a swelling that can result in temporary partial paralysis. But he continues to improve and doctors are hopeful that he will continue to get even better -- Kate.
SNOW: Jamie McIntyre, we certainly hope so. Thanks so much.
Responding to legal pressure, the energy department released scores of documents this week. All were generated during the White House's controversial energy policy meetings last year. The DOE released 11,000 pages, less then half of the documents. CNN White House correspondent, Kelly Wallace, is following this story -- Kelly.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate, the release of these documents is not putting to rest the controversy surrounding the crafting of the administration's energy policy, with some of the administration's biggest critics pointing to the documents, which were released and the thousands of pages which are still not being released to the public, as proof that big energy companies had the most influence over the administration's energy plan.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(voice-over): As Vice President Cheney arrived at the White House, his aides braced for questions about the more than 11,000 pages the energy department made public, about industry access to a key member of Cheney's energy task force.
The information showed Energy Secretary Spencer Abraham held eight meetings with industry officials, some of their companies, large contributors to the Republican Party. But Abraham held no meetings with environmental or consumer groups.
Environmentalists say the documents prove that big energy had the most influence over Cheney's plan.
SHARON BUCCINO, NATURAL RESOURCES DEFENSE COUNCIL: The plan benefits big energy companies at the expense of the public's health and the environment. And it is payback to polluters.
WALLACE: The Bush administration counters that EPA administrator Christie Whitman met with environmental groups, and that pro- environmental policy made it into the final plan.
ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: You'll see that, of the recommendations that are in here, there are many in here that were supported by the environmental community.
WALLACE: Critics charge large portions of the documents were omitted, and that another 15,000 pages were not released. Administration officials argue the law allows internal policy deliberations to be held back. But the conservative group, Judicial Watch, is not satisfied, suing the administration for access to more information.
LARRY KLAYMAN, JUDICIAL WATCH: And if nothing has been done incorrectly here, and the very fact that the administration is fighting this tooth and nail suggests that perhaps it has, then there's nothing to hide and all these documents should be produced.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WALLACE: The administration still refuses to release information about the secret meetings of Vice President Cheney's energy task force. But some of the administration's critics think the release of these new documents will put more political pressure on the White House to make more information public, to show that big contributors did not have undue influence -- Kate.
SNOW: Kelly, do the documents show anything about Enron and its connection to the administration?
WALLACE: Very interesting. The documents show that two executives, then-CEO Jeffrey Skilling, and the chairman at the time, Kenneth Lay, both requested meetings in July of last year with Energy Secretary Spencer Abraham. But Mr. Abraham did not have those meetings.
We do know though, Kate, from other information released in the past, that the vice president and/or his aides met with Enron executives about six times last year -- Kate.
SNOW: Kelly Wallace at the White House tonight. Thank you.
Is there a link between antidepressants and cancer? We'll have a report from our medical correspondent.
New evidence that IBM was cooperating closely with the Third Reich. We'll hear from the man who brought it to light.
And from the closet of some of the nation's oldest companies, a lawsuit calling for them to pay back profits they made from slavery. We'll talk to one of the plaintiffs in that suit.
But first, today's news quiz. According to a lawsuit filed today, how many Africans and their descendants were enslaved in the U.S., from 1619 to 1865? Was it closer to 800,000, 8 million or 80 million? The answer, coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SNOW: Earlier we asked, according to a lawsuit filed today, how many Africans and their descendants were enslaved in the U.S. from 1619 to 1865? The answer, more than 8 million.
Slavery in the United States officially ended in 1865, but the trouble of racial equality continues to haunt the nation. Today a lawsuit was filed in New York City demanding slavery reparations from three blue chip companies. CNN Financial News reporter, Peter Viles, has more on that.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETER VILES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This could be a face of history. A former legal scholar named Deadria Farmer Peallmann, lead plaintiff in a lawsuit that argues corporate America profited from slavery and should now, 137 years later, repay millions of black Americans.
DEADRIA FARMER PEALLMANN, SUING FOR SLAVERY REPARATIONS: I'm so happy to have come to this point, where we are going to finally hold corporations accountable for the crimes against humanity that they've committed against my ancestors.
VILES: The allegations could spread to 100 companies, but for now they target three: Aetna, accused of insuring the lives of slaves to benefit their owners. CSX, accused of running railroads built partly by slave labor. And FleetBoston, accused of lending money to slave traders.
The suit does not seek a specific dollar amount, but here's a hint of what might come. The suit cites research that says slave labor in the 1800s added $40 million in value to the American economy, which would have a value today of $1.4 trillion.
ROGER WAREHAM, SUING FOR SLAVERY REPARATIONS: This not about individuals receiving checks in their mailbox. It's about the establishment of a collective fund that will address the vestiges of slavery that linger to this point, in the lives of people of African descent.
VILES: Aetna said -- quote -- "We do not believe that a court would permit lawsuits over events which, however regrettable, occurred hundreds of years ago. These issues in no way reflect Aetna today." CSX had a similar response, saying the suit is -- quote -- "wholly without merit, and should be dismissed." Critics of the suit agree.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's a bad idea. It's an attempt to punish people who never owned slaves, and to reward people who never were slaves.
VILES (on camera): Now, if a federal judge does what the plaintiffs are asking for in this case, it will begin with a massive economic research project. Trying to figure out how much money corporate America made off of slavery, and which companies made the money.
Peter Viles, CNN Financial News, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: With me now, one of the other plaintiffs. Richard Barber and his attorney, Ed Fagen, joining us. Appreciate you being here, gentlemen. Mr. Barber, let me start with you. Why are you doing this?
RICHARD BARBER, SUING FOR SLAVERY REPARATIONS: Well, first of all, as a farmer, and my father being a sharecropper, I grew up on a tobacco farm in North Carolina. And if we were to trace the beginning of the tobacco industry to slave period, we will understand that tobacco was introduced into America seven years before slavery. It was introduced in 1612.
And I don't think it's any historical coincidence that slavery came seven years later, primarily because the American columnists, they needed cheap labor. Or better still, free labor, slave labor, in order to increase the profitability of the crop. This expanded crop, which became the cornerstone of America.
And so slavery was introduced. And because of that, the industry was built on the backs of slaves, their blood, sweat and tears. And so, as a son of a former sharecropper, and finally he owned his own farm, one who had direct contact and linkage to the slave era -- my Aunt Anna, for example, was born in 1846, died in 1947 when I was about 7, 8 years old. And we would sit on her porch and she would talk about the slavery in terms of that. So there's a direct link.
And it's just that I think it's time for the American corporations to come to grips with this whole issue.
SNOW: With all due respect though, sir, it's been -- you're not the person who was a victim here. Directly, anyway. You're a descendant of them. And a lot of people might say it's been hundreds of years, let bygones be bygones.
BARBER: My response to that would be, when did the statute of limitation expire, for the trust and the wealth that was created and passed on from generation to generation, either individually, family trust, foundation, and American corporations? I don't think there's been any termination of the statute of limitations. And it seems to me that the -- the ancestors of those who created the wealth, surely that ascendant should share in the wealth. And that's what it's all about.
SNOW: Mr. Fagen, what are you seeking? What do your clients want out of this -- money?
ED FAGEN, ATTORNEY: Let me address one of the questions you asked a moment ago. The issue is not an issue about whether or not Mr. Barber's grandparents are alive. The issue is that companies, blue chip companies in America, built their wealth upon a practice of enslaving Africans. That practice built them enormous money.
The issue is not, is Mr. Barber's grandfather alive. The issue is, should those companies be allowed to retain the moneys that they earned unjustly. That's the issue.
SNOW: Why these three companies? Why these three companies? You singled out three.
FAGEN: Well, no, we actually started with three. There are many more companies coming. We're talking about industry groups. You've got the banking industry, you have the insurance industry, the transportation industry, the agricultural industry. You have the tobacco industry. This is literally the -- corporate America has got to fess up to a crime against humanity. And the longer it...
(CROSSTALK)
FAGEN: Go ahead.
SNOW: No, that's OK. I wanted to ask one last question of Mr. Barber. I wonder whether you're getting support from your friends and family, other African-Americans. Are you getting support? Is anyone giving you any grief for going to the courts for this?
BARBER: No, not at all. I started this effort about 15 or 20 years ago, in terms of the basic research. And it was about four years ago that I read of Deadria Farmer Peallmann's efforts, and I called her. Because we were on parallel tracks, but our basic premise was the same. And so I called her. We exchanged documents. We met, we discussed it by telephone. And we became partners in this whole effort.
I've been very supported by my family and friends, because I think most of my life I've devoted to economic empowerment of African- Americans.
FAGEN: The question is really going to be a question of: Is it right that victims of the European Holocaust are able to recover reparations; victims of the Japanese, who were interned in the United States, they're able to recover reparations for the wrongs against them; and the African-American community is not entitled to make its claims? I think that is not justice.
SNOW: Mr. Fagen, Mr. Barber, I'm going to leave it at that. I hope you will come back. This is a very interesting case. Thanks so much for your time.
FAGEN: Thank you.
BARBER: Thank you very much.
SNOW: IBM, another blue-chip company, is in the news also for its dealings during the Third Reich. In his book, "IBM and the Holocaust," Edwin Black accuses Big Blue of profiting from the Nazi war machine. That book just went to paperback today.
Author Edwin Black joins me now to talk a little more about this issue.
Appreciate you being here tonight.
These are dramatic charges that you're making against IBM: that they were intimately involved with the Holocaust, with the Nazis. Do you think they really knew? When did they start their involvement? And did they know what the Nazis were up to?
EDWIN BLACK, AUTHOR, "IBM AND THE HOLOCAUST": Well, of course, it's been known for about a year that IBM had an extensive strategic business and co-planning alliance with Nazi Germany from the very first day, 1933, right through the war up until the 1945.
But the new evidence and the new eyewitness testimony, which has come out in this paperback today, shows that this involvement was far more than just its German subsidiary. We have now discovered that IBM in New York established a special subsidiary in Poland right after the Nazis occupied the Polish territory. And that special subsidiary had nothing to do with its German subsidiary and was established to automate and to help manage the Polish Holocaust and the rape of Poland.
SNOW: To do what sorts of things?
BLACK: Well, for instance we found at 22 Pavia Strasa (ph) in Cracow the IBM facility that sent the trains to Auschwitz and Treblinka. We interviewed the man and he made it clear these were not German machines; these were English machines, American machines under this new special subsidiary called Watson Business Machines.
We also found a new never-discovered facility, 500-man Hollerith group at 22 Murnen Strasa (ph) in Cracow that did all the statistics for Nazi Germany and Poland.
SNOW: Let's show some pictures, actually, while you're talking about this. We do have some pictures to show. There's one of the machines. How does that fit in?
BLACK: Well, that's a machine from the U.S. Holocaust Museum. That's the first machine that I saw: 15 million have seen that machine, but no one ever put the dots together. That is a typical sorter. And there were punching machines, sorting machines and tabulating machines that would make up the Nazi organization. For example, at the railroad facility, there 15 women punching. There were two sorters and one calculator.
SNOW: You say in your book, to date, IBM has never acknowledged or explained its 12-year involvement with the Hitler regime. Reading from your book now: "IBM should take a lesson," you say, "from its Nazi customers: Acknowledge and reveal its activities and move on."
I also want to road you, though, a statement from IBM that's been posted on their Internet. And they say: "IBM does not have much information about this period. Most documents were destroyed or lost during the war. IBM takes the allegations made by the author" -- you -- "very seriously and looks forward and will fully cooperate with appropriate scholarly assessments of the historical record."
Is IBM to blame here? They say they don't have a lot of information about what happened.
BLACK: Well, that is absolutely false.
That statement was put up by IBM one year ago. And, as recently as a few hours ago, they issued a statement to Reuters that they would not have a further comment, that they just don't have the information. In point of fact, IBM has over 8,100 square feet of documents in the United States alone. It has documents in Poland, Brazil, Germany, England. IBM knows what it has and that's why it wants to not comment.
SNOW: Edwin Black, author of the book about IBM and the Third Reich, thank you so much. "IBM and the Holocaust" is the title of the book. Thanks for being with us.
BLACK: Thank you.
SNOW: Six months since it first surfaced, should you still be worried about anthrax? We'll have the latest on the investigation. A yacht runs aground in the Keys. We will tell you what happened to the passengers. And Britney Spears gets a less-than-warm welcome in London. We'll tell you a little later why.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SNOW: Checking our "News Alert": An Arizona doctor is President Bush's choice for surgeon general. He is Richard Carmona of Tucson, a trauma surgeon who is also a SWAT team leader for the sheriff's department. Two years ago, he was named one of the nation's top cops. The Senate has to approve that nomination.
In Wisconsin, at least four deaths and a dozen injuries are reported in a collision between a tour bus and delivery truck. The accident happened in the town of Ixonia, west of Milwaukee.
An outing in the Florida Keys turned into a frightening experience for some boaters today. The 58-foot yacht they were on hit a reef and then capsized, but everyone on board was rescued.
The Postal Service is preparing to decontaminate the anthrax- tainted Brentwood mail facility in Washington D.C. The building is now sealed to prevent anthrax spores from getting out. The next step is to pump in chlorine dioxide gas to kill the bacteria. That could take weeks or even months.
It has been six months now since the anthrax scare began. And the investigation goes on.
CNN national correspondent Susan Candiotti brings us up to date on what's being down try solve the mystery.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The latest anthrax analysis is yielding another key clue. CNN has learned the deadly spores filling the letters to Senators Tom Daschle and Patrick Leahy are even more pure than investigators thought, making it highly unlikely the anthrax killer could have made and treated the spores in a makeshift setting.
VAN HARP, ASST. FBI DIRECTOR: The person knew what they were doing.
CANDIOTTI: Assistant FBI Director Van Harp is leading the investigation.
HARP: Contrary to what was initially out there at the beginning of the investigation, this anthrax, we do not believe, was made up in a garage or a bathtub.
CANDIOTTI: The FBI has narrowed the labs to about two dozen believed capable of making the deadly spores.
HARP: There are only so many people, so many places that this can be done.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CANDIOTTI: Tonight at 8:00, we will give you a rare inside look at one of the laboratories being used by the FBI in its anthrax investigation. And you will hear more from the man leading the FBI's case. Nearly six months after the first anthrax death, the FBI says it is lightyears ahead of where it was when their investigation started.
But investigators cannot predict when they make an arrest. And they don't even know the motive. In the words of one official, "We may not know the motive until we identify who's responsible" -- Kate.
SNOW: Susan Candiotti, thank you.
You can find out more about what's going on in the anthrax investigation coming up this evening. I will be hosting a CNN special report: "The Anthrax Mystery." That's at 8:00 p.m. Eastern.
Our "Web Question of the Day": "Do you still worry about anthrax being used again as a weapon of terror?" Vote at CNN.com/Wolf. And while you're there, let Wolf know what you're thinking." There is a "Click Here" icon on the left side of the Web page. Send him your comments and some of them will be read on the air every day.
Questions about a possible link between anti-depressants and cancer -- we'll hear from Dr. Sanjay Gupta coming up -- and an FDA warning regarding a possible herbal supplement right after this.
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SNOW: Amid the growing sexual abuse scandal in the Roman Catholic Church, parishioners and priests are beginning to speak out. And that includes the head of the nation's largest archdiocese.
CNN's Anne McDermott has more on his message from Los Angeles.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNE MCDERMOTT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It is the holiest of the church's seasons, but Cardinal Roger Mahoney of Los Angeles is talking of evil.
CARDINAL ROGER MAHONEY, LOS ANGELES: I never dreamed that any priest could so betray and defile his vows and wreak such havoc upon innocent children and youth.
MCDERMOTT: And he repeated his zero-tolerance for sexual misconduct.
It is not that priestly misbehavior in the region has been a secret until now. Last August, a young man named Ryan DiMaria accepted a multimillion-dollar settlement from the church after he claimed he had been abused a decade earlier by a Southern California priest.
MARCUS RYAN DIMARIA, ALLEGED ABUSE VICTIM: We felt this was absolutely necessary to protect other children.
MCDERMOTT: His lawyer says DiMaria's case began to change things.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It wasn't until we reached a settlement with the Archdiocese of Los Angeles that Cardinal Mahoney finally agreed to adopt this zero-tolerance policy.
MCDERMOTT: The cardinal, meanwhile, has raised some eyebrows by saying he is not opposed to debates about marriage in the priesthood.
MAHONEY: I just think it should be very much discussed.
MCDERMOTT: He adds, no link should be made between celibacy and the current sexual abuse scandal. But some critics believe, if priests were allowed to marry, the church would have a wider and perhaps psychologically stronger pool of applicants to choose their clergy from. But are the parishioners ready for married priests? Some are.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do believe they human, just like us.
MCDERMOTT: Some, though, worry priests would be torn between parish and family.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So I would still say that it is still better for them not to get married.
MCDERMOTT: But parishioners and priests alike are less concerned about marriage than overcoming the current scandal, so they can get back to good instead of evil.
Anne McDermott, CNN, Los Angeles.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: Now checking these stories on today's "Newswire": Scientists are puzzled by a strange pool of black water forming just off the Florida Keys in the Gulf of Mexico. According to the "Naples Daily News," scientists have no clear theory. Researchers are testing the water for chemicals, dissolved matter and living creatures. Another source could be an underwater spring spewing black water from the ocean floor.
A drought emergency now in place in New York City: Mayor Michael Bloomberg declared the emergency today. He says six months of unusually dry weather have left the city's water supplies critically low. The emergency also affects about one million city water customers who live in four Upstate New York counties.
It only happens about once in 11 million births, but it just happened in California. Identical quadruplets were born yesterday in Sacramento. They are all girls. They are expected to be just fine.
On the medical front, a warning for users of the popular herbal supplement Kava: The FDA reports it may be linked to serious liver damage. Most of the reported cases have occurred in Europe, four of them requiring transplants.
For millions of people with anxiety and depression, Prozac and other such drugs have proven to be the answer. But a British researcher says there could -- and we emphasize the word "could" -- be a possible link to cancer. He says his experiments have shown Prozac can encourage the growth of a type of brain cancer.
Joining us from Atlanta: CNN medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta.
Dr. Gupta, this doctor based his findings, I gather, not on humans, but on test-tube results. So why release these results now?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Kate.
This has been all in the test tube, all been in the laboratory thus far. There is a lot of interest in the way that Prozac and lot of these other anti-depressants affect the body; 40 million people do take these medications around the world. It's a large industry, so a lot of interest in it. So, I think even some of these early results were interesting enough to enough people to go ahead and release them. SNOW: Millions of Americans clearly are on anti-depressant medication. Is there any reason for them to be concerned about this report?
GUPTA: No, there really isn't at this point.
These medications, because they are so popular, have been studied thoroughly. And there have been no links between these anti- depressants, such as Prozac, Paxil, a lot of the other medications. None have been linked to cancer.
What the study really looked at, Kate, was looking at, basically, serotonin, a neurotransmitter in the brain, and showing that it actually some has abilities to fight off cancers. So it was more the fact that the serotonin, which is blocked in some ways by these medications, might have some cancer-fighting abilities.
Again, all of that is in the laboratory. It might be a good thing. It might be a way for scientists to actually look at seratonin and find out new ways to treat cancer. But, at this point, no one is saying it is a risk for people who take these medications.
SNOW: And bottom line, would the risk of not taking your medication far outweigh the risk of what this researcher discovered?
GUPTA: Well, absolutely.
These medications have been great for so many people. They treat depression. We have certainly heard some tragic stories about not treating depression recently in the news. Absolutely. Not taking the medication is not the right answer -- all laboratory findings at this point. There might be some encouraging news in all this that there might be some new treatments for cancer.
So that's really the way, the bottom-line way to look at this, not so much to think that Prozac or any of these other medications might in fact cause it. That is not what they were trying to say.
SNOW: And are drug companies that make Prozac and these other drugs coming out to defend their drugs, their work?
GUPTA: Absolutely. The spokespeople for companies have already come out and, again, reaffirmed the fact that these medications are heavily studied medications, and not just in the laboratory, not just in test tubes, but in real-life human beings. And there hasn't been any links between anti-depressant medications and cancer. So, these test-tube findings should not be extrapolated to human beings as of yet. It is just what it is. And that is that seratonin, this particular neurotransmitter, might have a role in fighting cancer.
It doesn't mean don't take the medications. That's what the drug companies are saying.
SNOW: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thanks for filling us in on all this.
GUPTA: Thank you, Kate. SNOW: Appreciate it.
This just coming in now to CNN, some news to report: CNN Financial News has learned Arthur Andersen CEO Joseph Berardino is resigning. Berardino will speak live with Lou Dobbs on "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE" following our show, "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS."
Boos for Britney? Why did the crowd go from cheers to jeers? We will tell you what happened last night in London. And an enticing offer to Enron employees from "Playboy" magazine: details on that after this.
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SNOW: Pop star Celine Dion tonight on "LARRY KING LIVE -- make sure to tune in for that, 9:00 p.m. Eastern, 6:00 Pacific.
Now checking "The Scoop" for today: Thousands of Britney Spears' fans turned out for the London premiere of her new movie hoping to catch a glimpse of the pop star. And a glimpse is all that she gave them. After a few quick turns for the cameras, she dashed inside, leaving a lot of fans disappointed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Come down and sign, Britney.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She knew that we were waiting for her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a little bit disappointing that she didn't come and sign our poster.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She got out of the car and walked straight. And, obviously, it was (UNINTELLIGIBLE) the door. She can stick her film up her ass.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SNOW: A man finds pictures, awards, and other personal effects believed to have belonged to Robert Downey Jr. in a Los Angeles dumpster. Now Downey's attorneys are offering $20,000 for those items, but the mysterious man has disappeared.
Enron's naked truth: "Playboy" magazine is looking for the women of Enron to help fill the pages of their gentlemen's magazine. "Playboy" says it is doing a photo layout called "The Women of Enron." And it's courting current and former Enron employees to bare all.
Let's go to New York now get a preview of "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE," which begins at the top of the hour -- Lou.
LOU DOBBS, "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE": Kate, thank you very much.
Tonight on "MONEYLINE": a big change at Andersen. We have just received word that its chief executive official, Joseph Berardino, has resigned. I'll have an exclusive interview with Joseph Berardino. The Dow Jones industrials finishes higher for the first time in four sessions. We'll have all of the day's activity on Wall Street. And tonight, Bob Knight, the college basketball coach whose passion and winning record are tough to match, speaks out about his coaching record, his new career and a brand new book -- all that and a lot more coming up. Please join us at the top of the hour.
Now back to Kate Snow -- Kate.
SNOW: Thanks, Lou.
Your turn to weigh in is coming up next. Do you still worry about anthrax being used again as a weapon of terror?
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SNOW: Our "Web Question of the Day": "Do you still worry about anthrax being used again as a weapon of terror?" Most of you, 61 percent, said yes, while 39 percent said no. A reminder: This poll is not scientific.
Time now to hear from you. Vern responded to my interview with the chairman of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission yesterday: "While operating a vending machine service company, I routinely entered a nuclear power plant by just showing my business card and driver's license. No checks were ever run. No special permission was required. Adequate security? No way."
Dave is skeptical of Saddam Hussein's recent offer. He writes: "We need to go into Iraq secretly to gather information about Commander Michael Scott Speicher rather than sending a delegation invited and approved by Saddam Hussein."
And the Afghanistan earthquakes have Tim concerned: "Could the heavy bombing carried out by the U.S. have triggered an earthquake which otherwise might not have naturally occurred? Perhaps it's doing more harm than good."
I'm Kate Snow, for Wolf Blitzer in Washington. Join Andrea Koppel for the "War Room" in just one hour. The focus: Even with all the aid and troop presence, can Afghanistan really be a stable country? I'll be back at 8:00 with our special report on anthrax.
Thanks for joining us. "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE" begins right now with an interview with Arthur Andersen CEO, who we have just learned is resigning.
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