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American Morning

Former Prime Minister Netanyahu, Palestinian Negotiator Saeb Erakat Discuss Violence in Israel

Aired April 02, 2002 - 08:12   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: To the Middle East now, where despite international criticism, the Israeli incursion grows wider and deeper into Palestinian territories. And this morning the Israeli hunt for a Palestinian terrorist continues in Ramallah and Bethlehem. It follows another suicide bombing yesterday, this time in Jerusalem, the sixth attack in six days.

Earlier today, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said Yasser Arafat could leave his compound in Ramallah but couldn't come back, an exile rejected by Arafat.

Sharon is also reaching out to his predecessor for help in selling his newly declared war on terror to the world.

Joining us now from Jerusalem is former Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Welcome back. Good to see you.

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, FORMER ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: Good morning, Paula.

ZAHN: First of all, Mr. Netanyahu, your reaction to what Secretary of State Colin Powell told me earlier this morning, that he has no plans to go to the region any time soon. Is that a mistake?

NETANYAHU: No, I don't think diplomacy is going to help at this point. I think Yasser Arafat has declared a terror war on Israel. He's nightly and daily calling for a million shaheedeen, a million suicide bombers in Jerusalem. He's not getting a million, but he's getting, as you correctly said, quite a few. And with that kind of implacability and with that kind of terror from a terrorist regime par excellence, it simply has to go.

I think it's inexorable. It's no secret I've been calling for the removal of his regime and the removal of Arafat from the region because he is really the generator of this constant renewal of terrorist cells. Unless he goes, new forces can't come to the fore and a new Palestinian leadership will not arise. He simply will kill anybody who will challenge him. Away, I think we have a chance.

ZAHN: But if you would, could you come back to the question of what role you think U.S. involvement should play? You have the Palestinians saying, or Saeb Erakat in particularly telling me yesterday that they very much want Colin Powell to come to even further bolster Anthony Zinni's efforts.

NETANYAHU: Well, you know, the Taliban, when the U.S. was finally going to wipe out that terror regime, were ready to negotiate. They wanted not only a cease-fire, they wanted various intermediaries and interlocutors. And that reminds me pretty much of what you have there.

Arafat is putting on a brave show. He's got his spokesmen speaking in English, speaking moderation and sense to the Western media. But while they're doing that, in Arabic Arafat calls for Israel's destruction and for these endless suicide bombers. So I think the only difference between him and Hamas is that Hamas calls for Israel's destruction in Arabic and in English, whereas Arafat only does it in Arabic.

As long as he's here, you're not going to see a change. You're not going to see a stop because he's poisoning the minds of millions and millions of young people.

ZAHN: All right, I understand all the points you're making about Yasser Arafat, but I'm not clear on what you think the U.S. needs to do, because there are many countries out there that believe that the United States is the only country that could get both of these parties back to the peace table.

NETANYAHU: You're not going to get anything out of the peace table with Arafat because he received the peace offer for everything that he says he wants in the west, turned it down and started this campaign of terror because he's out destroy Israel. He's not out to have peace with us. He's out to replace us was greater Palestine.

So I think as far as the U.S. is concerned, I think they're actually doing the right thing. I think President Bush outlined two principals, one, that all terror is illegitimate. That includes Palestinian terror, which is now becoming the worst terror in history. And second, that all terror regimes are illegitimate and have to be removed.

I think that from the U.S. point of view, they're doing that part, their part of this war in the Afghanistan and probably very soon in the Gulf with other terrorist regimens, and I think understandably they know that Israel has to follow the exact same principles if terrorists are to be removed. If we start compromising with Arafat, if we start rewarding him for the awful hourly terror that he's waging against us, unlike any that's been waged against any country and any people in history, then I would say that you're going to get more terror, not less of it. And I think many in Washington apparently understand it.

ZAHN: Dr. Henry Kissinger was a guest on our show a little bit earlier this morning and he told me he believes the Israeli government is too obsessed with Yasser Arafat and suggested, and these aren't his words, that but Israel's gone too far in holding Yasser Arafat up in his compound. The guy doesn't have much electricity, he doesn't have much water, he doesn't have much food. What else can the government yield from him from this current situation? NETANYAHU: Well, frankly, I wouldn't have isolated him there. I would have taken him, put him on the Karine-A ship, the terror ship that he got from his friends in Iran, and put him on the high seas and let him go to his friends in Iran or his friends in Baghdad. I would not have holed him up and given him an unbelievable stage, which I know this wasn't the intention, but this became the result.

I do believe that Arafat can be made irrelevant, as Dr. Kissinger suggests, by simply removing him, not killing him, not physically hurting him, but simply taking him, putting him elsewhere so that people realize that his, he has ruled himself out, his turn is over, and other forces can come to the fore.

Of course, they won't as long as he's there. They might not even come out right after he's out. They might wait. They might wait to see that he's not coming back, you know, because there'll always be the fear that he would be reimplanted.

But I think once it's clear that he's not coming back, there are more moderate and more saner and more realistic elements in the Palestinian community and they will have a shot at assuming leadership, I hope through a genuine democratic process, which Arafat has prevented so far.

ZAHN: All right, thank you for joining us this morning.

Benjamin Netanyahu, always glad to have you with us.

NETANYAHU: Good morning.

ZAHN: And within minutes -- thank you.

NETANYAHU: Thank you, Paula.

ZAHN: Within minutes after Ariel Sharon offered Yasser Arafat a one way ticket out of Ramallah earlier this morning, chief Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erakat said no, Arafat would not accept exile.

Saeb Erakat joins us now on the phone from Jericho. Welcome back to you, as well, sir.

First of all, is there any way Arafat's position will ever change on this issue of exile?

SAEB ERAKAT, CHIEF PALESTINIAN NEGOTIATOR: Well, I don't think anybody in his sane mind would accept to be in exile from his country. Actually, the Palestinians have suffered so much being exiled, being in refugee camps, being outside their country and honest to god, when I hear the likes of Bebe Netanyahu or Benjamin Netanyahu, the man who began the destruction of the peace process in 1996, the man who began the planting of the seed of the destruction of the Oslo Accords and all agreements signed with us, when he speaks like this about an elected Palestinian leader, elected directly and freely by the Palestinian people, I think that shows, that reflects what kind of people lead Israel today.

ZAHN: All right...

ERAKAT: There are...

ZAHN: ... well, he's not in the government any longer but what I'd like to move along to...

ERAKAT: Yes, but...

ZAHN: ... is your reaction to the statement by Secretary of State Colin Powell on our show this morning that he will not come to the region any time soon. I know yesterday in our conversation you very much, you didn't demand it, but you very much hoped that he would come to bolster Anthony Zinni's mission. Are you disappointed?

ERAKAT: Well, I am disappointed, because what's the meaning of issuing Resolution 1402 from the Security Council? This resolution mentions three American names. Anthony Zinni, George Mitchell and George Tenet are mentioned in this resolution. What is the United States peacemakers waiting for in order to implement this resolution?

We as Palestinians, President Arafat said we accept this resolution unconditionally and it has the component of the cease-fire, it has the component of the withdrawal of the Israelis, it has the component of implementing Tenet and Mitchell Reports and also the political horizon. What is the United States waiting for?

It's very clear now what's happening on the ground in the West Bank and Gaza are really war crimes. People, 3.3 million people are subjected to the worse situation.

Netanyahu, I heard him in that despicable fashion comparing us to the Taliban. We're people who are living under the last occupation on earth, the Israeli occupation. And we don't seek Israel's destruction. On the contrary, I will tell the whole world we have recognized the state of Israel. We want to live and let live. We want to establish our state next to the state of Israel.

I wish that Netanyahu or Sharon would say one sentence in their life about accepting a Palestinian state to exist next to the state of Israel. But I really believe that the United States government should show, as they said yesterday, a sense of direction, a sense of action. Because they just cannot believe and trust Sharon. Sharon is out there destroying the peace process, destroying the Palestinian Authority. He is burning the offices of the Palestinian police. My ministry, I'm the minister of local government, also. He destroyed...

ZAHN: All right, the United States has made its position quite clear. It would like for Israel to remove its troops from the occupied territories. At the same time it would like for Yasser Arafat to control the violence. Are you telling me this morning that neither one of these things is possible?

ERAKAT: No. It's possible and that's what we need the Americans to come here. That's what, we need to see the president of the United States saying that I'm here to implement the Resolution 1402, because it has both components. You need to have the Israelis withdraw. You need to empower the Palestinians to do all their obligations emanating from agreements signed. And I believe that's the only way out. If they're going to wait for Sharon and Sharon's promises, Sharon, as I said, is destroying the peace process, destroying the Palestinian Authority, he's destroying the infrastructure we built in the last eight years, he is dismantling the Palestinian police force, he's burning the offices, he is destroying the water networks, electricity networks, trees, roads, everything that we built for eight years as a result of the peace process is being destroyed by Sharon.

ZAHN: OK...

ERAKAT: And we need the United States to understand that without a sense of direction, without real action to implement both things you mentioned, Paula, the withdrawal of the Israelis and Palestinians, carrying out of their obligations, we need mechanisms. We need General Zinni to be really empowered with Powell, Secretary Powell being here in order to see this happening. And we want this to happen as Palestinians.

ZAHN: OK. We've got to leave it there this morning.

Saeb Erakat, thank you very much for joining us. And we need to point out that Secretary Powell says that the administration is fully involved and they believe that Anthony Zinni is the man who can get the job done.

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