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CNN Live At Daybreak

Israel Resisting International Pressure to Withdraw

Aired April 04, 2002 - 05:02   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And we want to go live right now to the Middle East for details on the latest unrest. Our Jerrold Kessel joins us live from Jerusalem -- good morning, Jerrold.

JERROLD KESSEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol.

And defying, really, this international pressure that's beginning to build on it, Israel seeming to insist that Yasser Arafat, the Palestinian leader, will remain in that splendid or perhaps not so splendid isolation that he is in in his West Bank headquarters in Ramallah. This as the Israeli military deepens its offensive and broadens it against Palestinian, previously Palestinian controlled areas of the West Bank.

The Israeli tanks and other military vehicles report they were on the ready late yesterday and during last night they moved into the biggest West Bank town, the biggest Palestinian town on the West Bank, Nablus, and amidst some what were reported to be very heavy firing -- there is no independent assessment of what's been happening inside Nablus -- but the Israelis say they now have control of their tanks and other military vehicles, of the streets of that West Bank town, just like four other towns, the major Palestinian towns on the West Bank, leaving only two where they have not, again, taken over control in the last week of this military offensive, which Israel says was undertaken to root out what it calls the bases of terror in the Palestinian community on the West Bank.

And the other focus of interest has been that stand-off in Bethlehem around the Church of the Nativity, one of the holy places of Christianity, where more than 200 Palestinians, many of them armed and many of them very much on Israel's wanted list, had taken up positions inside the Church of the Nativity and for the last two and a half days there's been very much a stand-off there, the Israelis insisting that they come out and give themselves up. The Palestinians saying they won't do so. Churchmen and church officials in the middle are trying to mediate a way out of this crisis there, like in neighboring buildings, churches and other buildings, where Palestinian gunmen did come out and were taken into custody by the Israelis and the Israelis insisting that this happen to those also in the Church of the Nativity, although they say they won't go in there and force them out.

The other area which is arousing concern and could become a major flash point up on Israel's northern border with Lebanon, where for two days there have been exchanges of fire between Hezbollah and Israeli forces, the Hezbollah after targeting Israeli positions in the disputed area of the northeastern part of Israel's border with Lebanon on the border with Syria. And there the Israelis warning very bluntly that if the Hezbollah continue the tactics of attacking those Israeli positions, Israel will not stand by but will respond in force. But for now, for the moment, the diplomatic initiatives trying to wind that possible second front down.

And all this comes as the European community trying to step in and saying the United States has not been effective in reeling back the Israelis, getting a cease-fire in place, sending two top flight emissaries to the region and the Spanish foreign minister and their special foreign envoy, Javier Solana, due here shortly, but with a very problematic situation since the Israelis are saying that they won't be allowed to get in to visit Yasser Arafat in his isolation in Ramallah.

And there was then some speculation that they would have to make due with meeting other Palestinian officials. But a short while ago we spoke to, on the telephone to the lead Palestinian negotiator, Saeb Erakat, and he said very bluntly if they're not allowed to meet Yasser Arafat, then no Palestinians will meet with that European delegation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAEB ERAKAT, CHIEF PALESTINIAN NEGOTIATOR: If Europe, if the United States, if Russia, if the Security Council or the United Nations are telling us that the Israelis have been denying them the right to go see Arafat, how do we convince any single Palestinian that these people, who are unable to get the permission to go to Ramallah to see Arafat from the Israelis, will sit with us and get the implementation of Resolution 1402?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KESSEL: So very adamant Palestinian position. The Israelis equally adamant. And another question that might unfold on these diplomatic efforts of whether Ariel Sharon, Israel's prime minister, will allow General Zinni, the U.S. envoy who's still in the region trying to get that cease-fire in place, to go to meet with Yasser Arafat himself.

Mr. Sharon will be meeting with General Zinni later in the day. The big question, whether the Israelis will allow him to travel to Ramallah and meet with Yasser Arafat or he will be kept in that isolation yet -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right, thank you.

Jerrold Kessel reporting live for us from Jerusalem this morning.

We've also been bringing you reports out of Ramallah for several days now and we want to take you to the West Bank city and our Michael Holmes.

He shows us how the Western television media is getting the story out of the besieged city from the Ramadan (ph) Studio. Take a look. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to Ramatan Studios in Ramallah. This is where we stand to do those live shots you see from time to time. We have the window closed. The view over Ramallah isn't there tonight because, quite simply, it's not too safe. There is sniper activity in the area and when that happens we keep it closed.

Look around behind these things, you can see how life is here. We have always at the ready a flak jacket for when we stand in front of those windows. Ashraf (ph) here is sleeping and as we try to get sleep whenever we can. You can see beds all around where we are sleeping on the studio floor.

And the very staff of Ramatan have been keeping us looked after for the last five days. Very primitive conditions, though, when it comes to staying here every day and every night.

This is the studio where we are broadcasting from, the control room, if you like. It's a humble control room compared to most around the world, but at this moment virtually every television network in the world that is represented here in Ramallah is working out of here.

Let's go out into the corridor and just see the layout here. Come with us and I'll show you how we live. This is the kitchen area. You can see here various correspondents from other networks. Also, our friends from Ramatan, who have been cooking and cleaning and feeding us and watering us when there is water. At the moment there is no water and it's a bit of a rough situation. We have no nowhere to shower. We have nowhere to wash. At a moment, the bathroom isn't working.

Small office. Every office is a bedroom. Another office. This is Salsam (ph), one of our producers, working on the phone. At night, you can see mattresses behind here and against the wall there, if Margaret can show you that. At night we have, we just get the mattresses down, they go on the floor, people grabbing some sleep wherever they can. Another one of our friends from Ramatan Studios here.

Come down this corridor and again, every office is a bedroom. This is Kasim (ph). He is running Ramatan Studios. This is the man who's looking after us while we're here and doing a great job getting our pictures out to you under very difficult conditions.

We were standing in here just a moment ago and a tank shell went off and you kind of get used to it, don't you?

KASIM: Yes. It's a wonderful time.

HOLMES: A wonderful time. OK.

That's a bit of a brief look. That's pretty much all there is. As is say, the bathrooms aren't working. There's no water. We're sleeping on the floors. But no one's going anywhere. Everyone has decided to stay put and try to cover this story as best we can.

This is Michael Holmes at the Ramatan Studios in Ramallah.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: And doing an excellent job in all that mess over there.

Former U.S. Senator George Mitchell developed a plan last year aimed at ending all of that violence in the Middle East. As you know, it calls for a cease-fire followed by a cooling off period. But Mitchell says Israel's military actions have thrown diplomatic efforts into disarray.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE MITCHELL, AUTHOR, "THE MITCHELL PEACE PLAN": The stated purpose of their attacks is twofold, to end terrorism, or at least to reduce it, and to marginalize Arafat. And, of course, the result has been precisely the opposite. Terror is increasing and Arafat's stature is higher than it's ever been among his own people and among the Arab nations.

And so the question becomes at what point does the policy take into account the consequences that are occurring and leave open, as the president suggested, a pathway to get back to negotiation?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: And our Christiane Amanpour has talked with a Palestinian representative in Jerusalem about this crisis and the diplomatic efforts. He says both Israel and the Palestinians are caught between the proverbial rock and a hard place.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SARI NUSSEIBEH, PLO JERUSALEM REPRESENTATIVE: This is a fight in which no side can win militarily over the other. We cannot break Israel's will by the use of force of suicide attacks or shootings. And the Israelis cannot break our will, the Palestinian people's will. We cannot break each other's will by the use of force. No way to do this. We have to negotiate if there's going to be a future.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: As you heard Jerrold Kessel report, the European Union is sending a delegation to the region. The E.U. is calling on Israel and the Palestinians to step back from the current conflict.

So how do Americans feel about the mess in the Middle East? We have a Gallup poll for you this morning. Five hundred twenty-seven adults were asked their opinion. Most Americans, 44 percent, say Israeli military actions are justified. Thirty-four percent say the actions are not justified, while nearly a quarter of the respondents are just unsure. The poll for CNN and "USA Today" also asked, "Are Palestinian actions justified?" Sixty-two percent say no. Seventeen percent say yes. And, again, one in five of the respondents replied unsure. The sampling error, by the way, is plus or minus five points.

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