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CNN Sunday Morning

Israeli Pledge to Pull Out has not Materialized

Aired April 07, 2002 - 11:02   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Israel's pledge to pull out of Palestinian areas has yet to materialize. Instead, military sweeps continue and expand in the West Bank and Gaza. This comes as Secretary of State Colin Powell prepares to head to the region on a ceasefire mission. CNN's Jerrold Kessel joins us live from Jerusalem with more.

JERROLD KESSEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fredricka, just as the intensification of the Israeli military campaign into those Palestinian towns, Palestinian areas of the West Bank continues, the operation which the Israelis have all along said was designed to root out the sources of Palestinian terror, so there's been an intensification of the protests around the world, particularly in the Arab world against the Israeli actions and against what's seen as the United States not stepping in quickly enough or firmly enough to turn back those Israeli actions here.

One of the biggest demonstrations today, tens of thousands of people in the Moroccan capitol of Rabat (ph), but Israel while watching those demonstrations and protests with concern is, of course, most interested in what the Unites States position is with regard to the ongoing activity and in wake of that telephone call in which President Bush yesterday made no bones about it, that he expected, in his words, "the Israeli action to end without delay."

Prime Minister Sharon has, this morning, been talking to his cabinet, but he pointedly didn't relate to the fact in any way of any time frame for the end of the Israeli operation, or indeed when the beginning of the end might start, although he did say according to his statement that he would expedite that military offensive against the -- into the Palestinian towns.

And that offensive has been continuing, and one of the places where there has been the fiercest of fighting has been in the northern most Palestinian town of the West Bank, Jenin, and particularly in the nearby refugee camp of Jenin.

And outside there, CNN's Rula Amin has been watching the developments from afar, because the Israeli Army has not permitted reporters into the area, and a short while ago, she filed this report from outside Jenin.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) RULA AMIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We're standing here on the outskirts of Jenin, just about three to four miles away from Jenin Refugee camp, which has witnessed some of the fiercest gun battles between Israeli soldiers and Palestinian gunmen.

Across the field, you will be able to see a row of houses. That is Jenin Refugee Camp. It spreads over less than a mile square area. It's the home for 15,000 Palestinian refugees.

Now Israel says its operation is aimed at hunting down Palestinian militants involved in carrying out attacks and plotting for suicide attacks against Israeli civilians, and that it is determined to carry out these attacks.

Those Apache helicopters have been hovering over the refugee camp since the morning. Sometimes they are firing missiles onto the camp, and other times, they're just hovering there it seems for observation.

According to Palestinian residents inside the camp, there has been a lot of destruction, a lot of damage happening there. They say the Israeli army has brought in bulldozers. They're knocking down houses, and that at some point the Israeli soldiers are moving from one house to another by knocking down the walls in between the houses, instead of going through the very narrow allies in this crowded refugee camp.

The Israel army is saying they're trying hard not to hurt civilians, that they're trying hard to minimize any kind of damage inflicted on the civilian life there, but it's a fierce battle and it's very hard to confirm what's happening there since the journalists are not allowed in. Also ambulances have not been allowed to go into this camp.

(on camera): Also we are told by resident that there has been a lot of damage, a lot of houses have been knocked down, bulldozed by Israeli bulldozers. The latest figure we have heard on casualties, according to Palestinian authority officials, the number is rising. It's about 70 Palestinians, many of them civilians. The Israeli army is confirming seven Israeli soldiers have been killed in the battles raging here. Rula Amin, CNN, on the outskirts of Jenin.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KESSEL: Well, that report there from Rula outside Jenin, and we're joined now here in Jerusalem by Major General Don Harel the head of the Israeli Army's Operation Branch. Thanks very much for joining us, general.

Just referring to what Rula Amin was reporting from outside and what the Palestinians are saying inside the refugee camp, that one of the tactics being used by the troops was blowing, bulldozing or blowing the way through one house to another in order to get to, in what you say is the search for the militants, for the gunmen. Is that the modus operandi, and in that way aren't you actually damaging, not only the civilian infrastructure, not only going after the gunmen? MAJOR GENERAL DAN HAREL, ISRAELI DEFENSE FORCES: Yes, well the cynical way of the terrorists is to use the arena of refugee camp as a hideout. We have to go in and dig them out really, and one of the tactics is going through walls.

This tactic was -- we found this tactic very efficient when we talk about not hitting civilians, meaning move from house to house in order to go there very safely, without using too much fire producing ahead, and just try to move very slowly, very securely, and hit only the gunmen that shoot us from the other side.

KESSEL: Prime Minister Sharon was saying that one of the reasons the operation may be taking longer was because you are trying to avoid civilian casualties. The chief of staff, the army chief of staff in the cabinet today was talking about 200 Palestinians killed in the ten-day operation. That's a high number. Have you got any breakdown of how many might be what you described as gunmen or civilians?

HAREL: Well, in fact, I don't have the true numbers because we don't know them yet. They are on the Palestinian side, those who got into hospitals. But I can assume that around 90 percent of them are gunmen, are terrorists, certified terrorists and gunmen that have been killed with weapons in their hand or maybe the grenade in their hands.

KESSEL: What about the accusation that Israel isn't allowing medical relief to get through quickly enough, people bleeding to death in the streets, other acts of inhumanity, some have been charging war crimes, that the troops have engaged in by not allowing treatment of people who have been wounded in the battles?

HAREL: This is a war zone and fire is being shot from both sides. We called for a truce several times in the Jenin area really, and we asked the civilians to go out and the medical crews to go in. Civilians did went out and we got them and helped them. But the Palestinians wouldn't negotiate with us about the ambulances that they need. In fact, they don't want to negotiate with us at all.

KESSEL: What about the time frame? No secret, President Bush has said it must end without delay. Are you feeling the tock of the clock ticking down?

HAREL: We're working by a preplanned campaign against this terror in order to dismantle the terror infrastructure. But yet, we are relating to each day as if it was the last day of the operation, meaning making new priorities every day, in order to make our effort the most beneficial and the most effective that we can.

KESSEL: So any time frame for, for instance, the operation in Jenin or in Nablus, when it might end? We heard maybe even today or tomorrow.

HAREL: Yes, I expect it to end today or tomorrow. It depends on the amount of civilians that are within the area. We don't want to hurt them, so we are working very slowly in order not to hurt too many civilians, or not to hurt civilians at all.

KESSEL: Today or tomorrow in both those towns?

HAREL: I expect it to be like it.

KESSEL: OK, thank you very much.

HAREL: Thank you.

KESSEL: General Dan Harel of the Israeli Army's operation, head of the Israeli Army's Operations Branch. Well there you have it, some kind of commitment there that perhaps those operations in those two towns would end by tomorrow he said. That might explain what Ariel Sharon had to say to the President yesterday when he said "expedite" though Mr. Sharon himself, as I said, not putting any time frame yet on the whole Israeli military offensive into those Palestinian towns. Now back to you, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: All right, thanks very much, Jerrold Kessel from Jerusalem this morning.

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