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Israeli Prime Minister, Defense Minister At Odds Over Reoccupation

Aired June 20, 2002 - 10:15   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: We are going to move on now to the Middle East where two bombings in two days have left that region shaken. The attacks killed 26 people, and that prompted Israel to begin reentering -- and actually reoccupying Palestinian territory, and it also produced condemnation from Yasser Arafat.

Our chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour is keeping a close eye on developments there. She joins us now live from Jerusalem -- hello, Christiane.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Leon, police here saying that parts of Israel, particularly coastal areas and central Israel are on high alert because of these suicide bombings, and because they feared there may be more in store. This despite Yasser Arafat's call for a halt in suicide bombings.

Just a few hours ago, there came word from Hamas and Islamic Jihad in the Gaza area that they would not heed Yasser Arafat's call to stop suicide bombings, and that they would continue them, they said, because they consider that legitimate response to resistance. This despite what Arafat had said, that suicide bombings, killing civilians, does not constitute legitimate resistance to occupation.

In the meantime, Israel is trying to respond how it can, and what it has done is send in more troops, more armor to more towns and cities and areas in the West Bank. Those cities and areas that are under nominal control of the Palestinian Authority. The latest incursions have been in and around Bethlehem, refugee camp near there, also on the outskirts of Ramallah and in Tulkarem and other such towns.

Now, the Israeli defense minister seems to be at odds with the Israeli prime minister, defense minister saying that he opposes any kind of notion of permanent reoccupation of Palestinian land.

The prime minister yesterday had announced a tough new policy, that he said signaled a major new shift in Israeli policy, and that was to go in and reoccupy Palestinian land as a response to these suicide bombing attacks. So, despite the fact that they have sent in more troops and armor, it remains to be seen whether this does constitute a new reoccupation and a permanent reoccupation of this land. In the meantime, the prime minister at a speech in Jerusalem today was harshly critical again of Yasser Arafat. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARIEL SHARON, PRIME MINISTER OF ISRAEL (through translator): At this time, we are dealing with a terror organization which is allied with the Axis of Evil, which comprises Baghdad, Damascus, Tehran, and bin Laden, but the state of Israel will continue to seek peace in spite of this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: Now, there have, as we said, have been two suicide bombings in the last two days, a total of about 26 people -- 26 Israelis have been killed, including youngsters, including some, in some instances, babies. There have been funerals today as Israel continues to bury its dead.

One funeral today for a 43-year-old mother of three, who was killed in Tuesday's suicide bombing attack in Jerusalem, and there is another funeral this afternoon for two of the victims of yesterday's suicide bombing, and that is a double funeral, a 59-year-old grandmother and had her 5-year-old granddaughter who were killed when that suicide bomber detonated explosives at a bus stop in Jerusalem last night -- Leon.

HARRIS: Christiane, I have to ask you whether or not there has been any reaction there in Israel to reports that I have seen here coming from the United States, from Washington specifically, where Palestinian negotiators actually said something that many people never expected to hear them say.

They said yesterday that they would be willing to drop the issue of the right of return for Palestinian refugees. Now, normally, that would be something that would actually lead most news reports if we heard a development like that, but I have heard almost no reaction here stateside on that. Any reaction there in Israel?

AMANPOUR: Well, Leon, this is a story, as you point out, is quite significant. The problem is, it comes at a time when the suicide bombings and the blood and the destruction is obscuring the diplomatic track. You see that it has already put any notion of a speech by President Bush somewhat on hold, and it is obscuring these -- what amount to concessions by the Palestinians.

The question, of course, is -- well, first of all, the Palestinians do confirm to CNN, and we reported this yesterday, that they have proposed an outline for a peace initiative, anything that may be considered that does drop that very contentious language, calling for the right of return of refugees. Instead calling for a just and agreed solution to the refugee problem.

So this would be, in normal circumstances, a very major breakthrough from the Palestinian side. And the question worth asking is, if they are willing to do that now, why did they not do that in Camp David nearly two years ago and avoid all of this intifada and bloodshed. On the Israeli side, this current Israeli prime minister is not interested in the kind of Palestinian state and peace agreement that, for instance, was envisioned under Oslo or the others. So even these concessions have been sort of dismissed by the Israeli government as just more words, and doesn't amount to very much.

But Palestinians saying that that does represent quite a significant step forward from their positions over the last couple of years.

HARRIS: Interesting, very interesting. Christiane Amanpour in Jerusalem, thank you very much. We sure appreciate that report.

Now, some say the only way to stopping these suicide attacks is giving the Palestinians their own state. We have heard that idea floated this week. And right now, let's talk some more about this with our senior political analyst, Bill Schneider, who is in Washington this morning -- hello, Bill.

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Hi, Leon.

HARRIS: Let's talk about this idea that has been floated about, some sort of a limited state, or some sort of interim state being offered to the Palestinians. That has raised a lot of questions among people who think that it would be a bad idea to give the Palestinians right now -- before peace is achieved -- giving them access to an airport or someplace where they could import arms, or invite other tanks from another country, say Syria or Iraq to come in.

SCHNEIDER: Well, that may be the only way to break the impasse. The impasse right now is that the Palestinians want hope. Their view is, If you promise us a state, that's the only way, the only way we are going to end the terrorism. The Israelis want security. And their view is, We will never promise a state or enter any political negotiations until the terrorism stops. That's why the United States is trying to step forward with some sort of innovative, unusual proposal, and the one you mentioned is being discussed, although I should add it's historically unprecedented, the idea of a provisional state.

HARRIS: But, doesn't it amount to, like, almost a no win situation? A no win, risk-reward type situation? Big risk for the U.S. to step out and say this, and it looks as though they are rewarding the terrorists, and rewarding those who have been waging this campaign of violence.

SCHNEIDER: That's exactly what the Israelis' complaint is. It is a reward for terrorism, it says we'll bribe you to stop terrorism by giving you a state.

The other way to look at it is, that it is a way to end terrorism, and it's been done, of course, by many countries. The British in Northern Ireland, it has been done in various places where terrorism has broken out.

But, the United States must have assurances that if it proposes any kind of Palestinian state, that that state can control the violence.

That's the most important kind of reform the Bush White House is looking for. A state has to have a monopoly on the legitimate use of force. It's not clear that the Palestinian Authority under Yasser Arafat does, wants to, or can control the violence.

Before the United States can take the risk of endorsing that kind of state, it has to have those kinds of reforms and assurances because the one most awful outcome in this is that the United States, and particularly the Bush administration, becomes the chief sponsor of a new terrorist state.

HARRIS: All right. Real quickly, Bill. What's the bottom line here then?

SCHNEIDER: The bottom line is that nothing else has worked, and the status quo is unacceptable, so that's why the United States is under pressure to do something.

HARRIS: Boy. Very interesting. Bill Schneider in Washington. Thanks. Appreciate it as always. Have a good one.

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