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CNN Live Today
Former U.S. Attorney Discusses Walker Lindh Case
Aired July 15, 2002 - 10:02 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: An American whisked from an Afghan firefight now pinned down in a legal battle. Defense attorneys and federal prosecutors will debate whether John Walker Lindh's own words can be used against him.
Lindhs lawyers say his statements in a CNN interview should not be admissible because the 21-year-old Californian was drugged and suffering from wounds he got during a prison uprising.
Up first this hour, echoes of words, first heard on this network eight months ago. That's when captured Taliban fighter, John Walker Lindh, spoke to a CNN freelancer and revealed his personal odyssey that led him to take up arms with the Taliban. His hearing this hour may ultimately decide the rest of his life. CNN national correspondent Bob Franken explains.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): By most accounts the statements by John Walker Lindh while in military custody could be vital evidence for the governments most serious charge, conspiracy to murder U.S. nationals. If convicted, Lindh could face a life sentence.
But his attorneys will try to convince the judge that those statements should be suppressed. The reason? Lindh was interrogated under what they call torturous conditions, held for 55 days when they contend he should have gone before a magistrate in 48 hours and, according defense motions, interrogated without access to a lawyer in violation of his constitutional rights. This, the defense argues, while Lindh was completely intimidated, broken mentally and physically and while top U.S. officials considered whether to prosecute.
DONALD RUMSFELD, DEFENSE SECRETARY: I don't know quite how we are going to handle him yet. Were thinking about that.
LARRY KING, LARRY KING LIVE ANCHOR: Do you think he might be brought to trial?
RUMSFELD: I'm trying to think precisely what I should say.
FRANKEN: Of course, Lindh has been brought back for trial, but government lawyers contend before he was returned he was treated with exceptional regard for his health, his safety and his security. Disputing defense claims an FBI agent coerced an alleged confession, prosecutors argue: Lindh never expressed a reluctance to speak with the agent, never requested counsel, voluntarily waived his Miranda rights, and did so in a knowing and intelligent manner.
ROBERT PELTON, FREELANCE REPORTER: How long have you been in Afghanistan?
JOHN WALKER LINDH: About six months.
FRANKEN: The hearing might also include testimony about the CNN taped interview with the just-captured Lindh. The judge on Friday refused to block a subpoena of the freelance journalist who did the interview, Robert Pelton, brushing aside claims a court appearance would threaten the safety and journalistic independence of all war correspondents. Defense attorneys claim the reporter acted essentially as an agent of the U.S. government since Lindh was in military custody at the time.
(on camera): The chaos of combat has been replaced by the rigid order of the courtroom and the question is whether actions taken around the battlefield, where there are few rules, can withstand the test of the legal system where rules are everything. Bob Franken, CNN, Alexandria, Virginia.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LIN: So let's get some legal perspective. Kendall Coffey is a former U.S. attorney now in private practice. His more recent high profile clients include Elian Gonzalez Miami relatives and Vice President Al Gore during the Florida election debacle.
Good morning, Mr. Coffey, thanks for joining us.
KENDALL COFFEY, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Good morning, Carol.
LIN: What is going to be key, do you think, in John Walker Lindh's defense attorneys arguments in this case.
COFFEY: Well, the starting point is that this entire case may be decided based on what happens in the hearings that are beginning today because John Walker Lindh essentially wrote his own indictment with the statements he made first to the CNN correspondent, then to military interrogators and ultimately to the FBI.
If all of those statements come in, the jury is going to want to have him locked up and throw away the key. So even before jury selection begins at the end of next month, this case may, in large part, be decided in the coming days.
LIN: Well he did make some damaging statements. He said he met with Osama bin Laden that he knew that he was fighting against the United States that he was fighting against Americans. But isn't it still incumbent on the prosecutors to prove that case?
COFFEY: Well they have, of course, to prove it and what they are relying on here is the statements that John Walker Lindh made. And, it breaks down into three parts because you have statements that he made to CNN, statements that he made to military interrogators while he was in a sense in military custody. And then, a more traditional criminal investigation where the FBI interrogated him and, of course, he signed a written waiver of his Miranda rights. So, in a sense, the defense has three different pieces of the puzzle to attack and the judge has three different rulings, three different issues to consider.
LIN: But at the same time, didnt John Walker Lindh sign a piece of paper waiving his rights to an attorney and doesn't that hurt the defense's argument?
COFFEY: Well, that's going to be key because at the end of the day, he signed a written waiver, and if a judge is hearing all kinds of conflicting evidence, obviously John Walker Lindh has his version, and by the way, the FBI has their version and they say, he did not ask for a lawyer during the FBI interview. But at the end of it, the judge has the signed, written waiver and a detailed confession with facts, very specific facts that could have only been known to John Walker Lindh.
So, even apart from the fact that a signed written waiver was done, this isn't a case where the government hands a witness and says this is our version. You agree to it. This is where they got the details from the suspect's own recollection.
LIN: How much do you think that actual videotape of him in his condition, he was dirty, his hands and feet were bound, he was hardly wearing any clothing at the time of this taped interview with the CNN freelancer, how much do you think that is going to influence the judge's decision here?
COFFEY: Well, the defense is going to get some traction from that but I don't think its going to be enough to carry the day for a lot of reasons. The government's response is the conditions are exaggerated and, of course, they also say that he was not as badly treated as he said he was.
And by the way, this was a war. These were battlefield conditions in which John Walker Lindh chose to be a participant. He was the one that signed on for jihad with the Taliban. Nobody made him do it. But even beyond that, there is a history of cases where suspects are questioned after they have been wounded, right before or even immediately after surgery.
And the final analysis, even if somebody is feeling badly, even if somebody is tired and hungry, if it's voluntary, if they decide to confess, that's go be to accepted and their case is involving people who were medicated, people who were shot up, who give confessions and it's been held admissible, based upon the fact that government gave them their Miranda rights and they choose to waive them.
LIN: So, if his statements are left in this case, then what is the defense going to have to prove to save John Walker's life?
COFFEY: If all of those statements come in, it is very, very uphill, and what hes got to seriously consider at that point is getting on the stand to tell his side of it, and defense counsel dont like to put, obviously, defendants on the stand.
But at that point, hes got to relay why he had this harrowing experience, why he thought jihad was not war against his own country, and hope that the details of his tale, which include some fairly harrowing moments and a lot of near death fairly tough conditions, get some kind of jury sympathy so at least the most serious of the charges, including those bearing a life sentence, are things that the jury might not convict on.
LIN: Well, Kendall Coffey, just adding to the mystery here and the suspense of the day in this hearing, we are just hearing from the courthouse that John Walker Lindh has made some sort of a plea. I dont have any more details than that. As you know, CNNs Bob Franken is out there, and as soon as we learn more, were going to bring that live report in, possibly getting your reaction as well.
COFFEY: Its going to some interesting couple of days.
LIN: Yes, I wonder what he actually pled to. Well find out shortly.
Thank you very much, Kendall Coffey joining us live.
COFFEY: Thank you.
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