Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Live Today

Interview with Robert Pelton

Aired July 15, 2002 - 12:10   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: A stunning development in the case of John Walker Lindh, the American who fought alongside the Taliban. He will not be going to trial. Instead, a deal has been reached that spares him a .lifetime in prison. For details, we go to CNN national correspondent Bob Franken, who's at the courthouse in Alexandria, Virginia -- Bob, hello.

BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hello, this is a plea bargain that actually has been in preliminary stages for about six weeks and it began in earnest last week, when President Bush was notified that there were serious discussions going on that didn't wrap up until last night.

The deal -- instead of going on trial August 26, facing life in prison for a 10-count indictment, John Walker Lindh, the so-called American Taliban, captured in late November in Afghanistan, will be facing instead a 20-year sentence in jail, pleading guilty to two charges -- one, providing services to the Taliban, which is a violation of U.S. law, and carrying explosive devices namely hand grenades in the process of doing so.

Now, he's going to be sentenced on October 4, but the sentence will not be life. There will never be a trial. The judge will now decide if, in fact, he's going to impose the full sentence although that is part of the deal. And it's a deal, said the U.S. attorney here, that was a good deal for the government.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL MCNULTY, U.S. ATTORNEY: We stand strongly behind the original indictment. And again, if we were to have gone to trial, we are confident that we would have prevailed on all counts. This plea agreement represents an opportunity for the government to get a very tough sentence, to get cooperation, and to conserve precious resources for the future challenges we face in the war against terrorism.

This was a good opportunity for the government to get a very good result not in any way a sign of any weakness in our case. Our case is very strong. I think that's why the defendant was willing to agree to such a long sentence.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FRANKEN: So the U.S. attorney also told reporters that John Walker Lindh in agreeing to this plea bargain was -- quote -- "essentially agreeing to the heart of the case against them," that he was a member of the Taliban. The charge that he will not have to face is the one where he conspired to kill U.S. nationals.

Now, the government, of course, had its interests in coming up with a plea bargain, as we heard there from the U.S. attorney, but so did defense attorneys. And after the U.S. attorney was through talking to reporters, it was time then for the chief defense attorney, James Brosnahan.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES BROSNAHAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think most of you were in the courtroom this morning when the charge of terrorism was removed from John, when any suggestion that the overt act about Mr. Spann was removed from his case. We negotiated with the government and I would commend them for being cooperative, and reasonable, and professional over the last -- especially the 48 hours. The settlement was approved at the highest levels of the American government.

For John Lindh, who accepts this, it represents a clearing of his situation. He forthrightly, this morning, described what he did to the judge. He was a soldier in the Taliban. He did it for religious reasons. He did it as a Muslim.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FRANKEN: Now, the defense attorneys that all along have been contemptuous almost of case that the U.S. government had put out, but why did they agree to something? "Well," said the defense attorney, "Because with the environment, people are somewhat frightened. They were upset. It would have been difficult." And of course, it has been difficult for the family of John Walker Lindh, but the members were here in court today, and they came out to speak to reporters, first starting with his mother Marilyn Walker.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARILYN WALKER, MOTHER OF JOHN WALKER LINDH: This decision today will give him a opportunity to give back what he has so much to offer to the people and for the people and the world.

CONNELL LINDH, BROTHER OF JOHN WALKER LINDH: I know my brother. I love him. I've always been proud of him. I'm still proud of hi. He's behaved with total integrity, total grace. It pains me that he is going to be away for so long, but I'm grateful still for this decision.

NAOMI LINDH, SISTER OF JOHN WALKER LINDH: All I can say is that I love my brother very much. I just want him to come home, but I know that's not going to happen. But he's been so strong, and we had to be strong for him. And I just love him very much.

FRANK LINDH, FATHER OF JOHN WALKER LINDH: He has never expressed the slightest bitterness about any of the treatment that he suffered. He never, in all of the interrogations that were going to be the subject of the suppression hearing, never once, did John ever say anything against the United States, never once, not one word. John loves America and we love America. God bless America.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FRANKEN: Now, another part of the deal is that John Walker Lindh will cooperate fully with government interrogators, including taking a polygraph and being available to testify in trials, and there is also the Timothy McVeigh Clause, as it's called. He will not be able to profit from this case, no books. Quoting the U.S. attorney, "Anything he says belongs to the U.S. government" -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Bob, we obviously heard reaction from the family there. What about John Walker Lindh? You were -- you talked about seeing him in the courtroom, and for the first time, you actually saw him smile at his family.

FRANKEN: Well, that's what happened when he walked in. It wasn't the first time he smiled at his family, but it was certainly the most demonstrative he's been. His sister -- you saw her just a moment ago, 13-year-old Naomi Lindh -- she waved vigorously as he walked into the courtroom. He smiled at her. They are supposed to have a close relationship. You also heard from his brother. There was that brief exchange. Lindh, himself, spoke in the courtroom, answering questions from the judge and then it was over. As he left, he did not turn and talk to his family.

PHILLIPS: All right, Bob Franken, just outside the courthouse there. Thanks, Bob.

Now, another player, affected by this decision, of course, is Robert Pelton. He was working as a freelancer for CNN when he interviewed John Walker Lindh just after he was captured in Afghanistan. Walker Lindh's attorneys were trying to keep a videotape of that interview from being admitted into evidence. And they subpoenaed Pelton to appear in court today. Well, obviously, he didn't have to talk. Robert Pelton joins us by phone now -- get reaction from him for the first time.

Robert, are you feeling a bit relieved? What's going through your mind?

ROBERT PELTON, CNN FREELANCER: Well, I'm not worried about how I feel. I think John Walker Lindh has done the right thing, which I suggested back when I first did interviews. He's got a moral issue to deal with. You know, he has to answer to a higher authority than us or the courts. And I think he felt uncomfortable about the many charades his defense had put up. But secondly, I think we have better things to do with the government and our prosecution. He wasn't a big fish. And I think there's much more important work to be done.

PHILLIPS: Take -- well, let's talk about that. What more important work -- type of important work are you are talking about?

PELTON: Well, we need to unravel the events of September 11. We need go out and apprehend people who threaten violence to the country and to our citizens. John Walker was one of thousands of people who went over to fight, to support the Taliban, not necessarily to attack America.

PHILLIPS: Do you think that John Walker Lindh has additional information, more different types of intelligence to offer up than what he told you on tape?

PELTON: What he told me was the truth. But unfortunately, there are a number of things surrounding his actions that haven't come to light yet and they will come out in a variety of programs and documentaries, even on CNN. So I think there was another problem in that there was going to be a wealth of information offered up that would not be helpful to his court case.

PHILLIPS: What do you think will not be helpful?

PELTON: Well, just the situation around his being in Mazar and all the events that led up to his capture and of course, the death of Mike Spann. I don't want to say one thing or the other, but I'll just say that it was not flattering to his legal position.

PHILLIPS: When you talked to him, did you, at any time -- I'm sure you've been asked this a million times -- at any time, did you feel that he was being tortured or forced to say anything or was not comfortable with what he was telling you or wasn't coherent?

PELTON: No, it was just the opposite. I mean obviously, I went there for humanitarian reasons. I offered him some food. The Green Berets went with me to offer medical care. And the people who took custody with him were very delicate and took care of his wounds. You know he looked pretty rough because that was the way he was when he arrived. He got steadily better after that. So that's a fallacy and I think it insults the average viewers' intelligence.

PHILLIPS: Robert, do you feel sorry for John Walker Lindh?

PELTON: No, he's a man who made his own decisions. He chose to do what he did, and his goal was to die. He was defeated in that purpose, but maybe he'll serve as a lesson to anybody else that wants to go over and wage violence against other people.

PHILLIPS: Robert Pelton, thanks for joining us at the last minute there. We appreciate your feedback on the decision today.

PELTON: My pleasure.

PHILLIPS: You'll remember that it all started in Afghanistan where Walker Lindh was fighting alongside the Taliban. He was among the Taliban holed up in an abandoned prison near Mazar-e-Sharif, as Robert just mentioned, and arrested just days after Thanksgiving last year. Well, a few days after that, Walker Lindh was transferred into U.S. custody. It took almost two months for authorities to bring him back to the U.S. where he initially pleaded not guilty to charges, including conspiracy to murder U.S. citizens.

For some legal perspective, let's bring in former U.S. attorney Kendall Coffey.

Kendall, good to see you. You've been with us all morning. We appreciate your time.

KENDALL COFFEY, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY: Good to see you.

PHILLIPS: So let's go back a little bit here. First of all, are you surprised with the decision today?

COFFEY: I'm not surprised at all that the defense at some point was going to come to the prosecution and need to make a plea deal. I'm surprised by the timing, in part, because there had been so much secrecy. Very often, these kinds of prearrangements happen shortly before trial. But I think it's fair. If you're sitting with the defense was sitting, everything was so uphill in this case. The judge was very likely to rule against them on all their challenges to extremely incriminating statements not only to CNN, but to military interrogators and to the FBI. And the likelihood was they were going to go to trial, get convicted on most of the charges and very possibly, a life sentence. So from the defense standpoint, this makes plenty of sense.

PHILLIPS: We've been hearing all day this has been an important victory for the American people. Do you agree with that? Why? Why not?

COFFEY: I think it is fair. And frankly, it's always easy for an administration to be absolutely as tough, tough, tough as possible, but sometimes moderation makes some sense.

Interestingly, for the U.S. Attorney's Office, the most difficult question is always -- well, if you thought the conspiracy to kill U.S. nationals was justified and if you thought you were going to get a conviction on it, then why, in the final analysis, did you agree to a plea on lesser charges? That's always the tough question for the U.S. Attorney's Office. And they always, of course, say, well, it concerned resources.

But in addition to that, he had several other considerations here. There were a couple of elements of the government's case that just weren't all that pretty. We know, for example, that when the FBI interrogated John Walker Lindh, his family retained a lawyer for him. In fact, his father went on CNN to say that he had a lawyer ready for his son and the FBI didn't tell John Walker Lindh about it, didn't have to. But they didn't tell him and that's something that might have bothered a jury a little bit. And we also saw the photograph of the John Walker Lindh blindfolded, taped, basically unclothed, to a bin and apparently, held in an unheated metal container in the Afghan winter. There are a number of other circumstances, which may tell most people that the guy doesn't deserve sympathy, but could have created some backlash with the jury. So there was at least some element of risk for the government, another reason why this was a fair deal.

PHILLIPS: Former U.S. attorney, Kendall Coffey. Thanks, Kendall. COFFEY: Thank you, Kyra.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEAS CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.