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Former Weapons Inspector Discusses Iraqi Pledge for Access

Aired August 02, 2002 - 13:21   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: The White House now today dismissed an offer by Iraq to start talks on readmitting weapons inspectors. The Iraqi offer arrived in the midst of another surge of reports about possible U.S. action to topple Saddam Hussein. In its reaction today, the White House said that removing the Iraqi leader remains the U.S. ultimate goal.
Joining us now from Washington, Charles Duelfer. He is a former UN weapons inspector, and he appeared this week as a witness at the Senate hearings on the Iraqi threat.

It's a pleasure to have you with us, sir.

CHARLES DUELFER, FORMER WEAPONS INSPECTOR: Thank you for having me.

PHILLIPS: First reaction: How do we describe "dismissed" -- the Bush administration dismissed Iraq's off. How do you read that?

DUELFER: Well, I think their interpretation is that this is a political ploy on the part of the government in Baghdad to try to isolate the United States from other countries, notably in Europe, in its objective of replacing the regime in Baghdad. The discussions were begun early in the spring this year between Baghdad and the UN, largely in reaction to the first credible stories about the United States preparing military action. So I think it's recognized that this is a political strategy by Baghdad and not necessarily one where they're seriously interested in addressing the weapons issue.

PHILLIPS: Is that how you feel about it? Do you think this is a joke, as Richard Butler has put it?

DUELFER: I wouldn't put it in those terms. I think the Iraqis have done a very good job in terms of their political strategy over the past year. They've got a new foreign minister who has been doing a very good job in consultations with Arab countries and countries in Europe. They've managed to present themselves as the victim.

But I think ultimately what this is is a political strategy. If these discussions took place, whether Iraq is seeking to do is negotiate under the terms under which inspectors would be able to do their work. And ultimately, if they were serious, they would just allow the inspectors in and the inspectors would be able to do what they need to in a very invasive and intrusive way, and, in effect, in perpetuity.

PHILLIPS: Isn't this just sort of a phony response to heading up a war? Do you see this as a signal that they know -- Saddam Hussein knows the U.S. is getting ready to attack his regime, and therefore they're going to keep pushing and pushing and pushing and throwing out any invitation as possible just to stall and get some more time?

DUELFER: I think you're exactly right. I think this is a direct measure of the seriousness with which Saddam takes the messages coming out of the White House. I think it's also an indication that he is detecting that there's potentially a division between the United States and other countries.

The United States, quite frankly, hasn't done as good a job in presenting its case to the international community. I think a case can be made and should be made and will be made once there is more strong consensus developed in Washington. And I think the hearings which took place this week were a step in that direction.

PHILLIPS: I want Talk about the hearings real quickly. But I want to ask you this, Charles. Let's say that Saddam Hussein said OK, inspectors can come in anytime, anywhere -- I'm opening up my door, go for it. I mean, this is someone that is known to put these weapons in areas that couldn't be detected, couldn't be found. I remember reading that he had a large amount of weapons underneath a hospital. Can you tell me about this? Can you expand on this a little bit?

DUELFER: First of all, the weapons are a vital interest to the regime. They saved the regime on two occasions: in the war with Iran and subsequently in the war in 1991. The Iraqis made the case that they believe that these weapons deterred the United States from going to Baghdad. So they're a high priority in whatever state they are in.

Also, the time during which UNSCOM and the inspectors worked in Iraq really provided them a lot of training, a lot of practice, in how to hide things. We would be seeking to make very short-notice inspections, and they would watch our behavior, and they would figure how to move things around or how to put them, in some cases, underground. You were referring to a case under a hospital. I think they've learned one thing, and that is to entwine civilian and military targets. If we do go to war, we are going to have a tough problem how to segregate civilian and military targets. No matter how smart the weapon, if we target it on a school, we are going to pay a heavy political price for that.

PHILLIPS: Charles, yes or no: Do you think we're going to war?

DUELFER: I think we're on a path where we really want to change the regime. We need to create the conditions so that the Iraqi people can do that. It those be backed up with the potential of war to be serious.

PHILLIPS: Charles Duelfer, former UN weapons inspector, Thank you much.

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