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CNN Sunday Morning

Interview With Christopher Keenan, Mitchell Fink

Aired August 25, 2002 - 09:14   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: Most of us will never forget where we were, what we were doing when terrorists attacked America on September 11. In a new book, "Never Forget: The Oral History of September 11, 2001", people who survived or witnessed the attacks give their personal stories of what they went through on 9/11.
One woman says, quote, "I thought I was dead because everything went black."

Another person described the scene "as another world". Well, this morning we are joined by the co-authors of the book, Mitchell Fink and Father Christopher Keenan, the new chaplain for the New York Fire Department.

Good morning, gentlemen. Good to see you both.

FATHER CHRISTOPHER KEENAN, CHAPLAIN, FDNY: Morning, Carol.

LIN: Mitchell, what made you think to put this personal account book together?

MITCHELL FINK, CO-AUTHOR, "NEVER FORGET": Well, actually, I was asked by Judith Regan (ph), the publisher, if I would be interested in doing it. When I went home that night, my wife Lois Mathias (ph), said she'd like to do it with me. So, the two of us did it together. I felt that it was the right time to do something different. And this is the story that has galvanized us. It's changed world history. And it was just the right time to do something like this.

LIN: Who did you want to hear from? You have a real variety in the book, from ordinary Joes, to people like Father Chris?

FINK: That's right. I felt that we needed survivors, people who lost loved ones. We needed policemen and firemen and clergy and ground zero workers and trauma care specialists and heroes at the Pentagon and people connected to United 93. So we tried to get a cross section of people. We interviewed probably 110 or 115 people and wound up with 81 personal stories in the book.

LIN: You know, Father Chris, yours is such a compelling personal story because of the very big shoes that you're now filling today. We all remember the passing of Father Mike Judge, the New York City's Fire Department chaplain, who went in so bravely with all the men. And trying to rescue some of the victims inside the World Trade Center. He, giving last rites even at the gateway to the World Trade Center to the firefighters going in. And now you're stepping into this very big role. What was that day like for you?

KEENAN: Well, Carol, I knew that, as I was watching it on television, that I knew that Mychal would not have survived it because he would have been at the center of it, at the command center. And as I watched it with some of my Franciscan brothers at home, a group of us then went down to Saint Vincent's Hospital, which was the nearest to the site to just be present to people who would be coming from the tragedy.

LIN: Very present. Father Chris, I have a passage here from Mitchell's book that I want to read and share, that you share in the book, of your account that day.

It reads: "From late in the morning until 5:30 at night 260 people were treated at St. Vincent's. Then there was a trickle, and then it stopped. I had to come back to St. Francis because I was on duty at six. As I walked out of the hospital I looked back. There were hundreds of doctors and nurses with stretchers standing there, you know, waiting for the people that never came. All throughout New York and New Jersey, everyone was waiting for all the people that never came."

That is a powerful recollection of so much hope, that there would be so many more survivors.

KEENAN: And that was the hope. And we all waited and waited. And the uniformed people of the city dug and dug for days. And there were 12 people recovered that first day, and after that, there was no one else to be found.

LIN: Mitchell, was it hard to ask people for their personal accounts? I think it's still painful for people to remember. You got them fairly fresh after the tragedy.

FINK: Actually, Carol, we didn't start this until January. And I think the fact that it started when it started was to the benefit of how these people shared their experience. Had we talked to them back in September, or even October, it would have been -- the interviews would have been much more chaotic. But because they had little time away from it, they were able to really go back methodically and tell us what had happened to them, and almost as important, was how their lives were today.

LIN: Interesting. Because Father Chris, I matched some of the recollections that you have of that day with what you're going through today. I mean, as you were talking about, you are now filling the shoes of Chaplain Mychal Judge. There's a passage in the book where you talked about, you know, you had lived with him.

And this passage here, it reads, "You've seen the picture of Mychal being carried away from the scene in a chair. It's fascinating, there are two firefighters, two policemen, the person from the Office of Emergency Management and a civilian. It's like Mary at the foot of cross holding Jesus in her arms. "There are all these people that Mychal worked with, carrying his body out. He was the fire department chaplain and they wouldn't leave him. It's kind of awesome how all of that emerged. He's one of the few that were found."

And in a way, that really was a gift for the department, as they took possession of the body and they were able to lay him out.

KEENAN: Yes. I had the wonderful opportunity to meet those six men the other night, and I think summarily, you know, what can be said. Commissioner Fee (ph) and his family had said to me at one point, in New York City, two bullets went into those two buildings. And from that moment on, everything that came out of there was love.

And what was incredible in all of this, beginning with what we saw with that picture of Mychal, which is almost like a modern pieta was all through the nine months that followed the incredible recovery process, where the rescue workers, the operating engineers, the union personnel, it was as if they each day, you know, had journeyed into hell, saw the face of evil, experienced what is the incredible capacity of our inhumanity to one another, and yet in their own life and in their own presence they claimed that sacred space back again, trying to bring reconciliation and healing to the 3,000 families who had lost their loved ones there.

LIN: How have you brought reconciliation and healing for yourself? Initially when you were offered the job for chaplain of the New York Fire Department, you initially said no, but then you recalled a time when Father Mychal had said something to you?

KEENAN: Well, as a matter of fact, it's something really that someone said to Mychal Judge and he repeated the conversation to me several months later. And he said to Mychal, you know, you're your Franciscan Chapter is coming up. And what the Franciscans move you New York City? What will you do?

He said, I would go where they sent me. He said, well then who would take your place as the Fire Department chaplain? And he said, Chris. And that was - I mean, Mychal and I never discussed that, never talked about that. And this was several months after I had been commissioned as one of the seven members of the Fire Department chaplaincy that is Jewish, Muslim and Christian.

LIN: What a blessing. Well, Congratulations. What a blessing indeed to have that memory.

Mitchell, what is it that you want to get across in this book and how has it helped you in putting it together?

FINK: Well, first of all, I'm so honored just to be seated here with Chris Keenan, number one. I feel that way and so does Lois about most, if not all, of the people we spoke to. It's changed me in many, many ways. We don't have the time for me to tell you how it's changed me. But I just hope that people understand that there are thousands of stories of September 11. We're going to be hearing a lot of stories for years to come. The world changed that day. I knew I had to change with it. I'm glad that these people have a chance to be heard.

LIN: Well, Mitchell, thanks. It is not often that an author surrenders the written word to others, so I congratulate you on the project. It is very touching to read these individual stories, and certainly as the anniversary is coming up. Thank you very much for sharing their thoughts.

And Father Christopher Keenan, thank you very much for joining us today.

KEENAN: Thank you, Carol.

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