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CNN Live Today

Interview with Bob Grimes

Aired August 29, 2002 - 12:34   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Let's go to San Diego now, where David Westerfield's family and friends are pleading for his life. The self-employed design engineer was convicted last week of kidnapping and killing a neighbor girl, Danielle van Dam.
Joining us again is defense attorney Bob Grimes, who has been following this case from day to day -- hello, Bob.

BOB GRIMES, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Good morning, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Well, yesterday when you and I talked, we were dipping into bits of this sentencing, and we were hearing from Damon van Dam, the father of Danielle van Dam. How do you think his testimony went?

GRIMES: Well, Damon van Dam's testimony, I think, was pretty effective in rehabilitating him and Brenda because, as you recall, a lot of people have been very critical of them as parents, and yesterday, the DA was trying to deal with that, not only through the van Dams' testimony, but through teachers who described them as volunteers in the school, and good parents, when you step aside from the lifestyle issues that were involved in the guilt phase.

PHILLIPS: Bob, one thing that surprised me. He said such beautiful things about his daughter, and he read letters, he wasn't emotional at all. He was very calm, and very direct. I am not saying that I expected him to cry, but I guess I just expected him to be a little bit more emotional. Do you think that will affect the jury at all? Does that matter?

GRIMES: You know, I agree, that he does seem pretty flat when he testifies. The content of what he says is just very moving, but he shows no emotion, but, then, on the other hand, he was almost stalking Westerfield in the court, and actually had to be thrown out of the trial by Judge Mudd. I don't know if the jury knows about that or not. They probably don't. But they do pay attention to witnesses. They are watching the van Dams very closely to see really how much impact it did have on them, because this is the victim impact testimony, and their emotions are definitely right there on the table.

PHILLIPS: What about the testimony by the van Dam school teacher? What do you think that did for the prosecution?

GRIMES: Well, the prosecution, I think, is worried. They know that Feldman could not make any type of criticism at all of Danielle. She is perfectly blameless, and they won't really argue anything against the parents, I don't think in the guilt phase, but a lot of people -- I mean in the penalty phase -- but a lot of people in the community have been so critical of the van Dams' parenting styles and the choices they made to expose their children to drugs and sex that the DA is worried about that. And so I think that is why they put on the schoolteachers to show that they were involved in school activities, volunteer work, and I thought it was relatively successful.

PHILLIPS: Now we talked about this yesterday. It is a lot of emotional and character-type evidence, nothing scientific or technical. Did you -- did anything surprise you? Anything stick out to you, where you thought, oh wow, that is it?

GRIMES: Well, you know, one thing that surprised me, Kyra, is yesterday when we heard this testimony from Westerfield's niece, Jenny, who testified against this incident 12 to 14 years ago where he rubbed her teeth, there has been all this speculation about bad conduct, bad crimes that Westerfield has committed, we have had all of these closed hearings, and I think Feldman is in the position to tell the jury, that this is strange conduct, this touching of the teeth of his niece 14 years ago, but is that their best shot? Is that all they have? Does that make him the worst of the worst? And so I think the defense is in a better position on Westerfield's prior record than a lot of people had speculated during these closed hearings.

PHILLIPS: I know we don't have degrees in psychology or -- we are not in the field, but I am sure you have dealt with a lot of psychologists when you are handling cases. Rubbing teeth, what did you get from that?

GRIMES: Well, it is absolutely bizarre. Assuming the little girl, who is now a college student, but assuming she recalls it correctly, it did occur -- she testified 12 years ago when she was 7. Feldman got her to admit it could have been 13 or 14 years ago. You know, assuming it happened exactly like she said, it is bizarre behavior, and maybe it shows an unnatural interest in children, perhaps it was repressed, because again, we have no evidence that he has ever been even charged with anything related to children, much less convicted, so I think it is bizarre, but I think Feldman is in a good position to argue it is certainly not -- let me put it this way. Of all of the penalty-phase murder trials, death penalty cases I have seen, it is strange, but it is the most trivial, compared to the rapes, murders, assaults that we usually get in a penalty phase.

PHILLIPS: That is a good point, Bob. We have heard some pretty gruesome things. Bob Grimes, thank you.

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