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American Morning
Winona Watch: Will She or Won't She?
Aired November 04, 2002 - 07:41 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: So, will she or won't she? That's the key question as the Winona Ryder trial heads into what's likely to be its last day of testimony.
The defense presented the bulk of its case on Friday, and pundits are wondering if the actress will take the stand today.
Joining us now with the latest on the case is Michael Bryant, who has been reporting on the case for TV's "Extra."
All I know, Michael, there was almost a full-page in "USA Today" analyzing her wardrobe choices during the trial, and what that might signify to a jury. Will she take the stand today? And when she does, what will she be wearing?
MICHAEL BRYANT, "EXTRA" CORRESPONDENT: That's a very important question, Paula. Good morning -- good to see you again.
I think people also wonder what she's going to say, and I've got a little something that might help us answer that question. Instead of guessing, let's just look at some of her words.
This is a transcript I obtained over the weekend from a sealed hearing that took place before the trial.
Now, let me just hit some of the high points here. This was a hearing in which they were talking about a search that took place of Ms. Ryder in the Saks Fifth Avenue security office. The court cleared the public, so it's just the attorneys, Ms. Ryder and the judge.
The judge says to Mr. Geragos, "You've also indicated to the court that your client was sexually abused while in that office." Mr. Geragos says, "Her shirt was lifted up." Ms. Ryder jumps in, "And my skirt." Mr. Geragos says, "And her skirt was lifted up in front of the males who were there."
Ms. Ryder then says, "And I was," the court cuts her off, saying, "OK, ma'am." Ms. Ryder says, "Sorry." And the court says, "You truly need to be quiet." Again, she says, "I'm sorry." The court says, "That's why you have an attorney here." And she says, "I'm sorry, sorry."
It's obvious from this transcript, which I've been sitting on over the weekend in order to share with you today -- that gives you an idea of how exciting my weekend was.
But the importance of this transcript is two-fold. No. 1, it gives us an idea that she wants to talk. No. 2, she is directly contradicting testimony that's already been presented at trial by the security officers, who say she lifted up her own shirt; in effect to say, I don't have anything else on me.
ZAHN: Oh, I thought you were going with some sort of sexual harassment angle there. No.
BRYANT: Well, we're aren't sure where they were going in the pretrial phase, but it's obvious that she wants to talk about this case and say, I don't agree with what the witnesses on the stand have been talking about.
ZAHN: Well, let's talk about who Mr. Geragos put on the stand. I guess there was one witness in particular on Friday that captured your attention, a guy named Michael Shoar.
BRYANT: Right.
ZAHN: What kind of impact do you think he'll have on the jury?
BRYANT: Comic relief maybe. I mean, what he had to say at first was very damaging and sounded very powerful. He claims that Mr. Evans, the chief security officer, was out to get Winona Ryder; that he was going to do what he had to do to nail the woman from Beverly Hills, even if he had to make up evidence.
But when he was cross-examined, it sounded pretty clear that he has a major axe to grind against Saks Fifth Avenue. It sounds like his wife had an affair with another gentleman who worked at Saks. He wanted that gentleman fired. To get him fired, he disrupted the store, and the store ultimately put out a -- had a restraining order in effect issued against him.
And so, his testimony, at the very least, was discredited, and there was laughter going through the jury panel and the courtroom when he was attacked by the D.A. on cross. So, I don't think it's a huge impact.
ZAHN: Yes, well, this one is getting weirder all the time.
BRYANT: Yes.
ZAHN: Let's talk about what a spokeswoman for the L.A. district attorney's office said and a public information officer originally -- I guess this was a PR officer for the police department, that a surveillance video actually showed Winona Ryder cutting the security tags off the merchandise, and then they changed that story.
So, how does that affect the prosecution's case?
BRYANT: This was -- it was the big defense argument, hey, they're making this stuff up, it doesn't show anything on the videotape, but they said it does. And now where is that?
So, because the tape doesn't show her cutting security tags off, will this create the testimony, and have one of the witnesses say that they saw her cutting security tags off?
If you followed the defense arguments here, it really looks more like carelessness on the part of the Saks Fifth Avenue security people, on behalf of the Beverly Hills P.D., on behalf of the L.A. D.A.'s office. They were all careless in the way they documented what they saw. And it became very confusing, which she was talking about seeing -- this is the female security officer -- did she see all of these things that she talked about? Or did she capture them all on videotape?
Because it was worded so poorly, the P.D. picked up those comments and just kind of glumped them all together, saying that everything was caught on videotape, when obviously it was not.
So, they look bad. I think it was careless. I don't think it was a big conspiracy, though.
ZAHN: So, in the end, does she end up going to jail?
BRYANT: Not a chance. I mean, let's face it, even if she is convicted, it's a first offense. She'll do some probation, some restitution, counseling obviously, and probably some community service, but it's very unlikely that a first offender is going to go to jail, even if convicted.
ZAHN: And if you were advising her, because you are a lawyer, would you tell her to be very careful about the way she researched her next project?
BRYANT: I think at the very least...
ZAHN: Sorry, Michael.
BRYANT: ... yes, yes.
ZAHN: Michael Bryant, it's always good to see you. Thanks for getting up in the middle of the night to join us with your insights this morning.
BRYANT: Thanks, Paula.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
Aired November 4, 2002 - 07:41 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: So, will she or won't she? That's the key question as the Winona Ryder trial heads into what's likely to be its last day of testimony.
The defense presented the bulk of its case on Friday, and pundits are wondering if the actress will take the stand today.
Joining us now with the latest on the case is Michael Bryant, who has been reporting on the case for TV's "Extra."
All I know, Michael, there was almost a full-page in "USA Today" analyzing her wardrobe choices during the trial, and what that might signify to a jury. Will she take the stand today? And when she does, what will she be wearing?
MICHAEL BRYANT, "EXTRA" CORRESPONDENT: That's a very important question, Paula. Good morning -- good to see you again.
I think people also wonder what she's going to say, and I've got a little something that might help us answer that question. Instead of guessing, let's just look at some of her words.
This is a transcript I obtained over the weekend from a sealed hearing that took place before the trial.
Now, let me just hit some of the high points here. This was a hearing in which they were talking about a search that took place of Ms. Ryder in the Saks Fifth Avenue security office. The court cleared the public, so it's just the attorneys, Ms. Ryder and the judge.
The judge says to Mr. Geragos, "You've also indicated to the court that your client was sexually abused while in that office." Mr. Geragos says, "Her shirt was lifted up." Ms. Ryder jumps in, "And my skirt." Mr. Geragos says, "And her skirt was lifted up in front of the males who were there."
Ms. Ryder then says, "And I was," the court cuts her off, saying, "OK, ma'am." Ms. Ryder says, "Sorry." And the court says, "You truly need to be quiet." Again, she says, "I'm sorry." The court says, "That's why you have an attorney here." And she says, "I'm sorry, sorry."
It's obvious from this transcript, which I've been sitting on over the weekend in order to share with you today -- that gives you an idea of how exciting my weekend was.
But the importance of this transcript is two-fold. No. 1, it gives us an idea that she wants to talk. No. 2, she is directly contradicting testimony that's already been presented at trial by the security officers, who say she lifted up her own shirt; in effect to say, I don't have anything else on me.
ZAHN: Oh, I thought you were going with some sort of sexual harassment angle there. No.
BRYANT: Well, we're aren't sure where they were going in the pretrial phase, but it's obvious that she wants to talk about this case and say, I don't agree with what the witnesses on the stand have been talking about.
ZAHN: Well, let's talk about who Mr. Geragos put on the stand. I guess there was one witness in particular on Friday that captured your attention, a guy named Michael Shoar.
BRYANT: Right.
ZAHN: What kind of impact do you think he'll have on the jury?
BRYANT: Comic relief maybe. I mean, what he had to say at first was very damaging and sounded very powerful. He claims that Mr. Evans, the chief security officer, was out to get Winona Ryder; that he was going to do what he had to do to nail the woman from Beverly Hills, even if he had to make up evidence.
But when he was cross-examined, it sounded pretty clear that he has a major axe to grind against Saks Fifth Avenue. It sounds like his wife had an affair with another gentleman who worked at Saks. He wanted that gentleman fired. To get him fired, he disrupted the store, and the store ultimately put out a -- had a restraining order in effect issued against him.
And so, his testimony, at the very least, was discredited, and there was laughter going through the jury panel and the courtroom when he was attacked by the D.A. on cross. So, I don't think it's a huge impact.
ZAHN: Yes, well, this one is getting weirder all the time.
BRYANT: Yes.
ZAHN: Let's talk about what a spokeswoman for the L.A. district attorney's office said and a public information officer originally -- I guess this was a PR officer for the police department, that a surveillance video actually showed Winona Ryder cutting the security tags off the merchandise, and then they changed that story.
So, how does that affect the prosecution's case?
BRYANT: This was -- it was the big defense argument, hey, they're making this stuff up, it doesn't show anything on the videotape, but they said it does. And now where is that?
So, because the tape doesn't show her cutting security tags off, will this create the testimony, and have one of the witnesses say that they saw her cutting security tags off?
If you followed the defense arguments here, it really looks more like carelessness on the part of the Saks Fifth Avenue security people, on behalf of the Beverly Hills P.D., on behalf of the L.A. D.A.'s office. They were all careless in the way they documented what they saw. And it became very confusing, which she was talking about seeing -- this is the female security officer -- did she see all of these things that she talked about? Or did she capture them all on videotape?
Because it was worded so poorly, the P.D. picked up those comments and just kind of glumped them all together, saying that everything was caught on videotape, when obviously it was not.
So, they look bad. I think it was careless. I don't think it was a big conspiracy, though.
ZAHN: So, in the end, does she end up going to jail?
BRYANT: Not a chance. I mean, let's face it, even if she is convicted, it's a first offense. She'll do some probation, some restitution, counseling obviously, and probably some community service, but it's very unlikely that a first offender is going to go to jail, even if convicted.
ZAHN: And if you were advising her, because you are a lawyer, would you tell her to be very careful about the way she researched her next project?
BRYANT: I think at the very least...
ZAHN: Sorry, Michael.
BRYANT: ... yes, yes.
ZAHN: Michael Bryant, it's always good to see you. Thanks for getting up in the middle of the night to join us with your insights this morning.
BRYANT: Thanks, Paula.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
