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American Morning

President Going to Create Homeland Security Department

Aired November 25, 2002 - 09:34   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: A sweep of his pen, the president is going to create the Homeland Security Department, signing into law about 1:00 Eastern Time. A senior senator warns that a spectacular attack on America could be ahead. Question today, will the new department make America safer from terror at all.
From Boston, Julia Kayam (ph), director of the Executive Session on Domestic Preparedness at Harvard School of Government.

Julie, good morning to you. Welcome back to us here at AMERICAN MORNING.

JULIE KAYAM (ph): Good morning, Bill.

HEMMER: Bottom line today, with the creation of this department, does it, a, make Americans safer, and, b, do Americans believe it?

KAYAM: Well, it's an important day. The Department of Homeland Security will be a major restructuring of the federal government. Is it making us safer today? Absolutely not. It's a transition that may take, at best, a couple of years. At worst, it may take up to a decade. And so we shouldn't look to today's signing as sort of a cure-all for what still needs to be done to put -- to significantly undermine terrorists and to prevent the next terrorist attack.

HEMMER: So if you think this department is not fully functioning for a couple of years the way they have it in mind, quoting to their heads in the blueprint anyway, what happens in the meantime with security?

KAYAM: Well, a lot of the effort, if I were a Department of Justice official right now in my little office is going to be moved to the Department of Homeland Security, I'm not waking up with any significant changes. I'm still going continue to do my job, if it's investigations, if it's looking into customs or whatever.

My seal may change, I may have a new seal, but that's basically it. So I think on the ground level, there's not going to be a tremendous change. The concern is, over the course of time, as all these offices get moved, basic things like geographically you are changing from one place to another. What's going to happen in the meanwhile. I think it will mean, we will have to rely a lot more on state and local authorities on the ground in a lot of these investigation, and I hate to say it, but cross our fingers a little bit and hope that this transition does not disrupt the sort of ongoing efforts against terrorism.

HEMMER: You think it may, that's a possibility?

KAYAM: I think a lot of people out there sort of think the signing today is really the beginning of the story, not the end of the story. It is -- we've never faced a transition like this in about 50 years in a generation. These are agencies that are completely different. It's not even going to sweep in the FBI and the CIA and the intelligence issues that we need to address. We know that the FBI is still coming to terms with some of its intelligence issues, vis-a- vis its field offices.

HEMMER: You know, Julia, I also think it's a misnomer when we talk about homeland security, because there is no true way to prevent all acts of terrorism at any part in the world. You talk about port security, the thousands and thousands of coastlines up and down the East Coast and the West Coast of the U.S., on a Sunday afternoon, you can see one cop from the Port Authority going up and down the East River.

About 2 percent of the cargo ships, the container ships that come to the U.S., are even inspected. That leaves 98 percent without inspection. When you look at that and add that up, what hits you in terms of trying to relay to the public the need to create this, to develop it and at least try to make things safer.

KAYAM: I think your point is the most important beginning point. There is no such thing as a cure-all for terrorism. I mean, you look at the most aggressive countries like Israel or Great Britain, I mean, terrorism is -- terrorism can fail 99 percent of the time, and you can have 1 percent and it's still going to be devastating.

The thing we need to talk about, minimizing the risk and minimizing the harm after a terrorist event. So you're seeing tremendous changes both on the intelligence and prevention side and then, of course, on the consequence, what we call the consequence management side, after the event -- how do you minimize harm? How do you get people in the hospitals? How do you immunize them in the event of a biological attack.

It will never be perfect. I think, politically, we have to stop talking that way.

HEMMER: You got to get out there and try, though, certainly.

KAYAM: Right.

HEMMER: You got to give yourself a fighting chance.

Quickly here, Senator Shelby is warning for a spectacular attack sometime very soon. Doesn't know if it will arrive on the events of 9/11. How do you measure that right now, the comments you're hearing regarding the possibility for that to come?

KAYAM: I mean, talking to people in the government, I have to tell you, given both the sort of events that have occurred abroad, Bali, Kuwait, even the assassinations both in Jordan and this missionary recently in Lebanon, suggest that there's a lot more of sort of low-level activity. Bin Laden's appearance last week, I think, makes people nervous they're planning something big, may not be spectacular, but they're planning something.

HEMMER: Thanks Juliette. Juliette Kayam again, up there in Boston, good to see you again.

KAYAM: Thanks, Bill.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired November 25, 2002 - 09:34   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: A sweep of his pen, the president is going to create the Homeland Security Department, signing into law about 1:00 Eastern Time. A senior senator warns that a spectacular attack on America could be ahead. Question today, will the new department make America safer from terror at all.
From Boston, Julia Kayam (ph), director of the Executive Session on Domestic Preparedness at Harvard School of Government.

Julie, good morning to you. Welcome back to us here at AMERICAN MORNING.

JULIE KAYAM (ph): Good morning, Bill.

HEMMER: Bottom line today, with the creation of this department, does it, a, make Americans safer, and, b, do Americans believe it?

KAYAM: Well, it's an important day. The Department of Homeland Security will be a major restructuring of the federal government. Is it making us safer today? Absolutely not. It's a transition that may take, at best, a couple of years. At worst, it may take up to a decade. And so we shouldn't look to today's signing as sort of a cure-all for what still needs to be done to put -- to significantly undermine terrorists and to prevent the next terrorist attack.

HEMMER: So if you think this department is not fully functioning for a couple of years the way they have it in mind, quoting to their heads in the blueprint anyway, what happens in the meantime with security?

KAYAM: Well, a lot of the effort, if I were a Department of Justice official right now in my little office is going to be moved to the Department of Homeland Security, I'm not waking up with any significant changes. I'm still going continue to do my job, if it's investigations, if it's looking into customs or whatever.

My seal may change, I may have a new seal, but that's basically it. So I think on the ground level, there's not going to be a tremendous change. The concern is, over the course of time, as all these offices get moved, basic things like geographically you are changing from one place to another. What's going to happen in the meanwhile. I think it will mean, we will have to rely a lot more on state and local authorities on the ground in a lot of these investigation, and I hate to say it, but cross our fingers a little bit and hope that this transition does not disrupt the sort of ongoing efforts against terrorism.

HEMMER: You think it may, that's a possibility?

KAYAM: I think a lot of people out there sort of think the signing today is really the beginning of the story, not the end of the story. It is -- we've never faced a transition like this in about 50 years in a generation. These are agencies that are completely different. It's not even going to sweep in the FBI and the CIA and the intelligence issues that we need to address. We know that the FBI is still coming to terms with some of its intelligence issues, vis-a- vis its field offices.

HEMMER: You know, Julia, I also think it's a misnomer when we talk about homeland security, because there is no true way to prevent all acts of terrorism at any part in the world. You talk about port security, the thousands and thousands of coastlines up and down the East Coast and the West Coast of the U.S., on a Sunday afternoon, you can see one cop from the Port Authority going up and down the East River.

About 2 percent of the cargo ships, the container ships that come to the U.S., are even inspected. That leaves 98 percent without inspection. When you look at that and add that up, what hits you in terms of trying to relay to the public the need to create this, to develop it and at least try to make things safer.

KAYAM: I think your point is the most important beginning point. There is no such thing as a cure-all for terrorism. I mean, you look at the most aggressive countries like Israel or Great Britain, I mean, terrorism is -- terrorism can fail 99 percent of the time, and you can have 1 percent and it's still going to be devastating.

The thing we need to talk about, minimizing the risk and minimizing the harm after a terrorist event. So you're seeing tremendous changes both on the intelligence and prevention side and then, of course, on the consequence, what we call the consequence management side, after the event -- how do you minimize harm? How do you get people in the hospitals? How do you immunize them in the event of a biological attack.

It will never be perfect. I think, politically, we have to stop talking that way.

HEMMER: You got to get out there and try, though, certainly.

KAYAM: Right.

HEMMER: You got to give yourself a fighting chance.

Quickly here, Senator Shelby is warning for a spectacular attack sometime very soon. Doesn't know if it will arrive on the events of 9/11. How do you measure that right now, the comments you're hearing regarding the possibility for that to come?

KAYAM: I mean, talking to people in the government, I have to tell you, given both the sort of events that have occurred abroad, Bali, Kuwait, even the assassinations both in Jordan and this missionary recently in Lebanon, suggest that there's a lot more of sort of low-level activity. Bin Laden's appearance last week, I think, makes people nervous they're planning something big, may not be spectacular, but they're planning something.

HEMMER: Thanks Juliette. Juliette Kayam again, up there in Boston, good to see you again.

KAYAM: Thanks, Bill.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com