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American Morning

Interview with Terrence Taylor

Aired December 02, 2002 - 07:32   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Let's get back to the story that Christiane Amanpour broke out of London today.
Christiane reports that Iraq has admitted now to trying to buy these specialized aluminum tubes. You may remember the story from about a month ago.

The Iraqis say the tubes are for building rockets and not nuclear weapons. Even so, though, is this a violation of the current U.N. sanctions? The U.N. weapons team now in its fifth day of inspections. Nothing turned up so far. So far relatively smooth.

Let's talk more about the searches now.

The former U.N. weapons inspector Terrence Taylor, assistant director now of the International Institute for Strategic Studies and president of its U.S. office. That's one heck of a lead-in for you.

Good morning to you.

Good to see you again.

TERRENCE TAYLOR, FORMER WEAPONS INSPECTOR: OK, good morning, and thank you for that.

HEMMER: What do, what should we know right now, the implications of these aluminum tubes?

TAYLOR: Well, I think there needs to be, obviously, more investigation. No doubt the U.N. inspectors, that is, the International Atomic Energy Agency, in this particular case, and maybe also some of Dr. Hans Blix's people, will probably call on the companies that were involved in this export, if they can get to them, I mean if they can find them.

HEMMER: Yes, but if they admit it already, isn't the gig up? Isn't this a violation? Or not?

TAYLOR: Well, if it was, yes, indeed, it is, even if it was destined for the legal missile program. They're allowed to have missiles with a range of up to 150 kilometers. But that's all. And, but even any kind of military equipment is forbidden under the U.N. sanctions.

HEMMER: Listen, five days have come and gone right now. Inspections seem to be going rather smoothly. We want to know what your gauge is right now from half a world away in terms of not only cooperation, but what happens when more inspectors start to flood into Iraq and we reach that 100 mark for the inspection team?

TAYLOR: Well, I don't think that either side have been really tested yet, and I'm not surprised by the cooperation that's being shown by the Iraqis at the moment. We encountered a lot of that in the 1990s until we got near somewhere nearly sensitive. But also the Iraqis need to be challenged by more inspectors on the ground, a number of simultaneous inspections in different places. So there's a long way to go yet, I believe.

HEMMER: So you think it's been pretty easy so far, don't you?

TAYLOR: Well, it's hard to tell, but I don't think the Iraqis have been seriously challenged yet. I think there is an important milestone ahead of us next Sunday when the Iraqis are due to declare their, make their full, final and complete declaration, so-called, of any weapons, illegal programs that they might have had or might still have.

HEMMER: Now relative to that, Mr. Taylor, I head read where you said that Saddam Hussein may present something new as of this weekend, December 8. What new contained in there do you believe?

TAYLOR: Well, I think they will realize that if they say they have no programs of this kind and no new information, this will not be credible and will not be acceptable in Washington, London and in other places, too. So I think he will decide that I have to declare something and give over new information. There were a number of unresolved issues, as they were called, when the inspectors were forced to leave in 1998 and I think it's generally accepted by the U.N. Security Council that the Iraqis have a lot to explain. So maybe there will be some new information in this declaration.

HEMMER: That's really interesting. How does it change the complexion of the argument right now, if that's the case, this weekend?

TAYLOR: Well, I don't think it changes it at all, because -- unless really the Iraqis do deliver up complete information on their nuclear, biological, chemical and illegal missile programs. Unless it's complete and it's verifiable, we're still stuck in the same rut that we've been in for the past 11 years or so.

HEMMER: Listen, I want to talk about the inspectors here, quite specifically, the report that came out at the end of the week about some American inspector who had yet to leave for Iraq, apparently tied to some sort of sex club that he was a member of or started. Does this do anything in terms of possibly putting a different light on the inspection teams, not only from the Western point of view, but also from the Iraqis?

TAYLOR: Well, I can't comment on this particular case or this individual's personal particulars. But it does show that it's a particular challenge for the U.N. to recruit directly people without the ability to fully investigate their background. I realize, of course, that people's personal lives are somewhat separate from their teach capabilities required for the inspections. But even...

HEMMER: Why would -- I'm sure he's qualified. I've heard from a number of experts who say that that's the case. Why wouldn't the U.N. conduct a background check? I mean essentially, if you're applying for any job in the country you're going to get a background check. Why not here?

TAYLOR: Well, it's very difficult for the U.N. as an international organization to go into a very large number of countries, let alone the United States, to find out the backgrounds of individuals. I think they need to be interviewed. This individual, like the others, went on a training course. This is a time when you find out about people's backgrounds. These are people that could be faced with arduous conditions under stress and so on. So I think you need to know something a bit more about them than obviously they knew in this particular case.

HEMMER: Listen, I want to end on a different note here. John King, our senior White House correspondent, has said throughout the week last week that the White House firmly believes the area that contains these illegal weapons that are hidden underground near or in these presidential palaces located in various parts of Central Iraq.

Do you agree with that same position?

TAYLOR: Well, I don't think I could come out concretely on that. I think it'll be more subtle than that, if I know the Iraqis. We've heard about mobile laboratories. I think these so-called presidential sites or compounds have been so well advertised that I'd be surprised if we would find anything there. But they have to be visited, of course, by the inspectors.

HEMMER: Nice to talk with you.

Terrence Taylor again in D.C.

TAYLOR: My pleasure.

HEMMER: We appreciate it.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired December 2, 2002 - 07:32   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Let's get back to the story that Christiane Amanpour broke out of London today.
Christiane reports that Iraq has admitted now to trying to buy these specialized aluminum tubes. You may remember the story from about a month ago.

The Iraqis say the tubes are for building rockets and not nuclear weapons. Even so, though, is this a violation of the current U.N. sanctions? The U.N. weapons team now in its fifth day of inspections. Nothing turned up so far. So far relatively smooth.

Let's talk more about the searches now.

The former U.N. weapons inspector Terrence Taylor, assistant director now of the International Institute for Strategic Studies and president of its U.S. office. That's one heck of a lead-in for you.

Good morning to you.

Good to see you again.

TERRENCE TAYLOR, FORMER WEAPONS INSPECTOR: OK, good morning, and thank you for that.

HEMMER: What do, what should we know right now, the implications of these aluminum tubes?

TAYLOR: Well, I think there needs to be, obviously, more investigation. No doubt the U.N. inspectors, that is, the International Atomic Energy Agency, in this particular case, and maybe also some of Dr. Hans Blix's people, will probably call on the companies that were involved in this export, if they can get to them, I mean if they can find them.

HEMMER: Yes, but if they admit it already, isn't the gig up? Isn't this a violation? Or not?

TAYLOR: Well, if it was, yes, indeed, it is, even if it was destined for the legal missile program. They're allowed to have missiles with a range of up to 150 kilometers. But that's all. And, but even any kind of military equipment is forbidden under the U.N. sanctions.

HEMMER: Listen, five days have come and gone right now. Inspections seem to be going rather smoothly. We want to know what your gauge is right now from half a world away in terms of not only cooperation, but what happens when more inspectors start to flood into Iraq and we reach that 100 mark for the inspection team?

TAYLOR: Well, I don't think that either side have been really tested yet, and I'm not surprised by the cooperation that's being shown by the Iraqis at the moment. We encountered a lot of that in the 1990s until we got near somewhere nearly sensitive. But also the Iraqis need to be challenged by more inspectors on the ground, a number of simultaneous inspections in different places. So there's a long way to go yet, I believe.

HEMMER: So you think it's been pretty easy so far, don't you?

TAYLOR: Well, it's hard to tell, but I don't think the Iraqis have been seriously challenged yet. I think there is an important milestone ahead of us next Sunday when the Iraqis are due to declare their, make their full, final and complete declaration, so-called, of any weapons, illegal programs that they might have had or might still have.

HEMMER: Now relative to that, Mr. Taylor, I head read where you said that Saddam Hussein may present something new as of this weekend, December 8. What new contained in there do you believe?

TAYLOR: Well, I think they will realize that if they say they have no programs of this kind and no new information, this will not be credible and will not be acceptable in Washington, London and in other places, too. So I think he will decide that I have to declare something and give over new information. There were a number of unresolved issues, as they were called, when the inspectors were forced to leave in 1998 and I think it's generally accepted by the U.N. Security Council that the Iraqis have a lot to explain. So maybe there will be some new information in this declaration.

HEMMER: That's really interesting. How does it change the complexion of the argument right now, if that's the case, this weekend?

TAYLOR: Well, I don't think it changes it at all, because -- unless really the Iraqis do deliver up complete information on their nuclear, biological, chemical and illegal missile programs. Unless it's complete and it's verifiable, we're still stuck in the same rut that we've been in for the past 11 years or so.

HEMMER: Listen, I want to talk about the inspectors here, quite specifically, the report that came out at the end of the week about some American inspector who had yet to leave for Iraq, apparently tied to some sort of sex club that he was a member of or started. Does this do anything in terms of possibly putting a different light on the inspection teams, not only from the Western point of view, but also from the Iraqis?

TAYLOR: Well, I can't comment on this particular case or this individual's personal particulars. But it does show that it's a particular challenge for the U.N. to recruit directly people without the ability to fully investigate their background. I realize, of course, that people's personal lives are somewhat separate from their teach capabilities required for the inspections. But even...

HEMMER: Why would -- I'm sure he's qualified. I've heard from a number of experts who say that that's the case. Why wouldn't the U.N. conduct a background check? I mean essentially, if you're applying for any job in the country you're going to get a background check. Why not here?

TAYLOR: Well, it's very difficult for the U.N. as an international organization to go into a very large number of countries, let alone the United States, to find out the backgrounds of individuals. I think they need to be interviewed. This individual, like the others, went on a training course. This is a time when you find out about people's backgrounds. These are people that could be faced with arduous conditions under stress and so on. So I think you need to know something a bit more about them than obviously they knew in this particular case.

HEMMER: Listen, I want to end on a different note here. John King, our senior White House correspondent, has said throughout the week last week that the White House firmly believes the area that contains these illegal weapons that are hidden underground near or in these presidential palaces located in various parts of Central Iraq.

Do you agree with that same position?

TAYLOR: Well, I don't think I could come out concretely on that. I think it'll be more subtle than that, if I know the Iraqis. We've heard about mobile laboratories. I think these so-called presidential sites or compounds have been so well advertised that I'd be surprised if we would find anything there. But they have to be visited, of course, by the inspectors.

HEMMER: Nice to talk with you.

Terrence Taylor again in D.C.

TAYLOR: My pleasure.

HEMMER: We appreciate it.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com