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American Morning

Interview with Bill Richardson

Aired December 06, 2002 - 09:05   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush says Saddam Hussein has a clear choice to make, it is war or it is peace. And as the world waits for Iraq to come clean about its arsenal, the White House insisting it can prove that Iraq does indeed have weapons of mass destruction.
Back to the White House again, here is Frank Buckley on that story -- Frank, good morning.

FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Bill. And military action certainly being considered as an option by administration officials as they go over their options, continue to engage in a series of discussions over the options after December 8, when the declaration is filed.

White House officials are skeptical that Saddam Hussein and Iraq will provide, in their view, a truthful declaration, and they say if military action is necessary, that there is a growing coalition willing to participate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Nations have stepped up and committed specific levels of support, I won't get into what those may be, whether it is troops, whether it is equipment, whether it is overflight, whether it is landing bases. As I indicated, that is for each nation to do on its own, but you can assume all of the above in various regions of the world.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BUCKLEY: The declaration is said to be some 4,000 pages, several thousand pages of supporting documents as well. It could be some time, Bill, before the White House has an official reaction to the declaration.

HEMMER: Frank, thanks. Frank Buckley at the White House.

Bill Richardson is a former U.S. ambassador to the U.N. Now he is governor-elect of New Mexico. He joins us this morning live in D.C. Good to see you again, welcome back.

BILL RICHARDSON, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO U.N.: Thank you, Bill. Nice to be with you.

HEMMER: What do we call you, Mr. Ambassador or Governor -- what is it right now? RICHARDSON: Well, I think you call me governor-elect now, but Bill -- Bill to you, Bill because we are friends.

HEMMER: Hey, listen, when the U.N. gets this list, we know the White House has already assembled what it believes are the areas where inspectors should look on the ground. What does the White House do? Does it go immediately looking for the omissions that it believes may or may not be contained on that list?

RICHARDSON: I think the White House has to be very careful, Bill, that it not overly criticize the inspectors. I think in the last week, they've been overdoing that. These are professionals. These are international specialists. They have got good equipment. So far, I believe, they have been doing a good job.

I think what the White House has to do is be careful about saying Well, look, we have this intelligence, inspectors, that you don't have. I think if the White House has it, they should be ready to provide it, but do it in a way that it appears that we are not pressuring these inspectors, because the inspectors can come back and bite us. They are the ones that will determine, whether in the spot- checks or the presidential palaces or whether in intrusive inspections that they are going to have to continue doing. They haven't started doing the real tough inspections, that they come out basically saying what everybody knows, that Saddam does have some of these weapons. Past weapons inspectors, Richard Butler and others, have said that Iraq has them. So I would urge the White House not to be a little -- a little bit too testy right here.

HEMMER: Herein, I think, lies the catch, and you know there is a war of words publicly, there is a PR campaign fired up in D.C., there is a PR campaign fired up in Baghdad right now.

They are competing for the public interest. How does the White House then lay back and allow Saddam Hussein to dictate that game?

RICHARDSON: Well, Saddam Hussein, you can never predict what he is going to do, but it is obvious that in this report that he is going to put forward, he is going to say, We have no illegal weapons. He is going to say, in the last five years, when inspectors were not allowed in, we have done very little. We have all of these other chemical plants, and in the 4,000 pages, he will detail them, and say that we don't have any illegal weapons.

Now, to disprove that, I think it's important that we recognize the only ones with strong international credibility are the weapons inspectors who then present their evidence, not to the United States, but to the U.N. Security Council, where we have to deal with France and Russia and China who have not been entirely with us.

The best weapon for the United States here is to get international support for our objectives to disarm Saddam, so he is playing a very masterful chess game, and we just have to be careful that we are not boxed in.

I think the administration has played this issue well. They have gotten support from the Congress, from the Security Council, 15-0 vote. They've backed the inspectors. But let's not overdo pushing the inspectors in a direction that they feel they publicly have to respond and say, Look, the United States is making these claims that they have this extra intelligence, where is it? They haven't given it to us.

So we have got to be a little more careful, in my judgment.

HEMMER: To take that last point a step further, your dealings with the U.N., if the U.S. does have the intelligence and they are ready to offer it to the inspectors, but Hans Blix says no, that would be a conflict of interest. The Iraqis would not see that as fair, but if you have the evidence, why not pursue it, why not turn it over, why not force the inspectors to go in and have a good look at it?

RICHARDSON; Well, see, the inspectors so far, Bill, have not basically said there are no violations. They have just done some spot-checks, they have been in one presidential palace. They have a lot more work to do.

My recommendation is let them continue their work. Let them beef up their inspection team. I think the steps we are taking to lure defectors from Iraq's weapons scientists labs makes sense, but if we have any evidence from that, give it to the inspectors. Let's not over rush here, and appear to be the arbiters of whether Saddam has the weapons or not.

Look, he does have them. Past inspectors have said that, but let us not fall into his PR game of making us the bully rather than building a international coalition and letting the inspectors and the U.N. Security Council have a shot at determining whether there are violations.

We can go and take Saddam Hussein militarily on at any time. There is no dramatic urgency to do that. I think it's a chess game that I would hope we continue to play a little bit more effectively than we have in the last week.

HEMMER: I have about 15 seconds left here. I think a lot of what our viewers only want to know, they really don't follow the ABC's of what is happening on the ground with the inspectors -- they want to know whether or not there is going to be war. Where are we in a week from now, where are we in a month from now? Can you gauge that?

RICHARDSON: I'd say in a month from now, we will know the success or failure of the inspections. In a week, we won't know. I say that if the inspections don't produce what everybody knows, then I think the administration is going to move forward with plans for military conflict and I, for one, would support them.

HEMMER: Thank you, Bill.

RICHARDSON: Thank you, Bill.

HEMMER: The governor-elect of New Mexico. That is the only time I can get away with that, by the way, because you gave me permission. Bill Richardson in D.C. Great to see you again.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired December 6, 2002 - 09:05   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush says Saddam Hussein has a clear choice to make, it is war or it is peace. And as the world waits for Iraq to come clean about its arsenal, the White House insisting it can prove that Iraq does indeed have weapons of mass destruction.
Back to the White House again, here is Frank Buckley on that story -- Frank, good morning.

FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Bill. And military action certainly being considered as an option by administration officials as they go over their options, continue to engage in a series of discussions over the options after December 8, when the declaration is filed.

White House officials are skeptical that Saddam Hussein and Iraq will provide, in their view, a truthful declaration, and they say if military action is necessary, that there is a growing coalition willing to participate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Nations have stepped up and committed specific levels of support, I won't get into what those may be, whether it is troops, whether it is equipment, whether it is overflight, whether it is landing bases. As I indicated, that is for each nation to do on its own, but you can assume all of the above in various regions of the world.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BUCKLEY: The declaration is said to be some 4,000 pages, several thousand pages of supporting documents as well. It could be some time, Bill, before the White House has an official reaction to the declaration.

HEMMER: Frank, thanks. Frank Buckley at the White House.

Bill Richardson is a former U.S. ambassador to the U.N. Now he is governor-elect of New Mexico. He joins us this morning live in D.C. Good to see you again, welcome back.

BILL RICHARDSON, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO U.N.: Thank you, Bill. Nice to be with you.

HEMMER: What do we call you, Mr. Ambassador or Governor -- what is it right now? RICHARDSON: Well, I think you call me governor-elect now, but Bill -- Bill to you, Bill because we are friends.

HEMMER: Hey, listen, when the U.N. gets this list, we know the White House has already assembled what it believes are the areas where inspectors should look on the ground. What does the White House do? Does it go immediately looking for the omissions that it believes may or may not be contained on that list?

RICHARDSON: I think the White House has to be very careful, Bill, that it not overly criticize the inspectors. I think in the last week, they've been overdoing that. These are professionals. These are international specialists. They have got good equipment. So far, I believe, they have been doing a good job.

I think what the White House has to do is be careful about saying Well, look, we have this intelligence, inspectors, that you don't have. I think if the White House has it, they should be ready to provide it, but do it in a way that it appears that we are not pressuring these inspectors, because the inspectors can come back and bite us. They are the ones that will determine, whether in the spot- checks or the presidential palaces or whether in intrusive inspections that they are going to have to continue doing. They haven't started doing the real tough inspections, that they come out basically saying what everybody knows, that Saddam does have some of these weapons. Past weapons inspectors, Richard Butler and others, have said that Iraq has them. So I would urge the White House not to be a little -- a little bit too testy right here.

HEMMER: Herein, I think, lies the catch, and you know there is a war of words publicly, there is a PR campaign fired up in D.C., there is a PR campaign fired up in Baghdad right now.

They are competing for the public interest. How does the White House then lay back and allow Saddam Hussein to dictate that game?

RICHARDSON: Well, Saddam Hussein, you can never predict what he is going to do, but it is obvious that in this report that he is going to put forward, he is going to say, We have no illegal weapons. He is going to say, in the last five years, when inspectors were not allowed in, we have done very little. We have all of these other chemical plants, and in the 4,000 pages, he will detail them, and say that we don't have any illegal weapons.

Now, to disprove that, I think it's important that we recognize the only ones with strong international credibility are the weapons inspectors who then present their evidence, not to the United States, but to the U.N. Security Council, where we have to deal with France and Russia and China who have not been entirely with us.

The best weapon for the United States here is to get international support for our objectives to disarm Saddam, so he is playing a very masterful chess game, and we just have to be careful that we are not boxed in.

I think the administration has played this issue well. They have gotten support from the Congress, from the Security Council, 15-0 vote. They've backed the inspectors. But let's not overdo pushing the inspectors in a direction that they feel they publicly have to respond and say, Look, the United States is making these claims that they have this extra intelligence, where is it? They haven't given it to us.

So we have got to be a little more careful, in my judgment.

HEMMER: To take that last point a step further, your dealings with the U.N., if the U.S. does have the intelligence and they are ready to offer it to the inspectors, but Hans Blix says no, that would be a conflict of interest. The Iraqis would not see that as fair, but if you have the evidence, why not pursue it, why not turn it over, why not force the inspectors to go in and have a good look at it?

RICHARDSON; Well, see, the inspectors so far, Bill, have not basically said there are no violations. They have just done some spot-checks, they have been in one presidential palace. They have a lot more work to do.

My recommendation is let them continue their work. Let them beef up their inspection team. I think the steps we are taking to lure defectors from Iraq's weapons scientists labs makes sense, but if we have any evidence from that, give it to the inspectors. Let's not over rush here, and appear to be the arbiters of whether Saddam has the weapons or not.

Look, he does have them. Past inspectors have said that, but let us not fall into his PR game of making us the bully rather than building a international coalition and letting the inspectors and the U.N. Security Council have a shot at determining whether there are violations.

We can go and take Saddam Hussein militarily on at any time. There is no dramatic urgency to do that. I think it's a chess game that I would hope we continue to play a little bit more effectively than we have in the last week.

HEMMER: I have about 15 seconds left here. I think a lot of what our viewers only want to know, they really don't follow the ABC's of what is happening on the ground with the inspectors -- they want to know whether or not there is going to be war. Where are we in a week from now, where are we in a month from now? Can you gauge that?

RICHARDSON: I'd say in a month from now, we will know the success or failure of the inspections. In a week, we won't know. I say that if the inspections don't produce what everybody knows, then I think the administration is going to move forward with plans for military conflict and I, for one, would support them.

HEMMER: Thank you, Bill.

RICHARDSON: Thank you, Bill.

HEMMER: The governor-elect of New Mexico. That is the only time I can get away with that, by the way, because you gave me permission. Bill Richardson in D.C. Great to see you again.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com