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CNN TALKBACK LIVE
Bill Frist Elected New Senate Majority Leader; "TIME" Chooses Persons of the Year
Aired December 23, 2002 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, HOST: Today on TALKBACK LIVE: Republicans take a whipping over the Lott affair, but waste no time in moving on. Was Trent Lott the victim of a right-wing conspiracy?
Also, "TIME"'s person of the year times three. Whistle-blowers get their due. Would they have been your choice?
And why are your tax dollars being spent to study if women like pornography? Does the Bush administration know what's going on at the NIH?
TALKBACK LIVE begins right now.
(APPLAUSE)
COSTELLO: Oh, what a great audience we have today. Welcome, everyone, to TALKBACK LIVE. I'm Carol Costello, in for Arthel Neville.
We are waiting to hear from Bill Frist, a Nashville surgeon who has just been notified he will take over as the Senate majority leader from the embattled Trent Lott. While we wait, we want to find out more about this unprecedented appointment from CNN political anchor Judy Woodruff.
Good afternoon, Judy.
JUDY WOODRUFF, CNN ANCHOR: Hello there, Carol.
COSTELLO: This is truly historic. This has never happened before, has it?
WOODRUFF: Well, never have we seen anything like it in terms of a Senate leader deposed the way Trent Lott was. And there's also history being made in that they've never selected a new majority leader with a cross-country, 42-senator -- we think it's at least 42 senators voting -- conference call. So, we know that the phones were evidently working.
So, history being made on several fronts. But Bill Frist is coming in, putting a moderate face on the Senate leadership in the United States Senate. And we've been talking all day, Carol -- and I know you and your audience there will want to be discussing this -- is the role of the White House. We know that President Bush has considered Bill Frist a real favorite.
There's been speculation, before this all came about, about whether Bill Frist might be thinking about running for president one day, so all sorts of interesting threads to this story.
COSTELLO: Judy, I wanted to ask you something else.
Bill Frist is supposed to come out and say something to the public at 3:15 this afternoon, in about 14 minutes. And I wondered if you could guess at what he has to say and why he is accepting no reporters' questions afterwards.
WOODRUFF: Well, my assumption is that they want to keep a tight lid on how they handle the story and what they emphasize.
What is he going to say? My strong belief is that he will do everything he can to put the controversy involving Trent Lott behind the Republican Party. They want that to be part of the past. I'm sure he will talk about what his agenda, the Republican agenda will be going into this next 108th Congress.
He'll talk, I'm sure, about what the president wants. But my expectation is that we won't hear a great deal about the president because of the fact that it is believed, it's known, in fact, that the White House very much wanted this change to happen, despite their public statements to the contrary that they were involved.
And I think that he will try to strike an independent course. I think that's why you see him today in his home state of Tennessee rather than here in Washington.
COSTELLO: Yes, in fact, we're looking at pictures now of his office, I suppose, from Nashville, Tennessee.
We want to bring in John King now, our White House correspondent, to talk more about this.
What do you think Bill Frist will say?
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Carol, let me first tell you we have a one-paragraph reaction from the president of the United States. He's up at Camp David.
In a statement just released by the White House -- and I'll quote from it in its entirety -- quote -- "I congratulate Senator Bill Frist on his election to Majority Leader of the United States Senate. Senator Frist has earned the trust and respect of his colleagues on both sides of the aisle. I look forward to working with him and all members of the Senate and House to advance our agenda for a safer, stronger, and better America."
So the president keeping it quite simple, a very simple, straightforward reaction here at the White House. One of the subplots to all of this is, Carol, of course, is, as Judy was discussing, the perception and some resentment in the Senate that perhaps the White House, at least behind the scenes, was trying to push Senator Lott out and ease the way for Senator Frist to come in.
The White House is quite sensitive to that. It says that it had nothing to do with all this, but there are a great number of suspicions. And some senior administration officials certainly made clear to us in the past few weeks that they believed Senator Lott had become a problem.
As for what Senator Frist will say, I would echo Judy. I think what you'll hear him say is that he wants to work for all Americans. He wants to send a very inclusive message right now. He understands he is now in a spotlight that he has never experienced before.
COSTELLO: Well, John, isn't there even more drama to this? Because some people say that Senator Frist is very close to President Bush and will push President Bush's agenda and some senators may not like that.
KING: Well, it certainly is his job as the chief Republican in the Senate. He's the majority leader, but he's the Republican leader first. The speaker of the House in a very similar position.
Sure, they will push the president's agenda, although some believe there's a great deal of pressure on Senator Frist to find at least one issue at which he can distance himself or pick a fight with the White House just to prove he's independent. But the president's top priorities in the new Congress will be the economy first, health care second. Health care is Senator Frist's big issue.
He is a trained surgeon. He has worked with Democrats on the issue, whether it is a Medicare prescription drug benefit or a so- called HMO reform, the patient's bill of rights that we have been talking about in Washington for four or five years now. The White House believes Senator Frist is someone who can negotiate the compromises with the Democrats to get those big goals done: the prescription drug benefit and HMO reform. Those are top priorities of the president. They have long been a priority of Senator Frist.
COSTELLO: OK, having said all of that, I want to go back to Judy for just a second.
The Republicans are going to act on all of those things that John King just told us. But won't they do something to make black America happy after this?
WOODRUFF: Well, make black America happy. I think it's a good question, because, clearly, lot of people were very unhappy about what Trent Lott said.
I think it's safe to say, Carol, that Republicans are going to be very sensitive going forward in the weeks to come in showing that they do care about the support of African-Americans and indeed all minorities. There has already been talk that they'll be looking at legislation, whether it's school choice or other legislation, that will make the point that they do care about poor Americans, they do care about the disadvantaged, they do care about African-Americans.
I think it remains to be seen, though, what they'll be able to agree on.
COSTELLO: You're right about that.
Judy, thank you very much. My thanks to Judy and to John King for joining us.
We will be bringing you Senator Frist's first appearance as majority leader in just a few minutes, about 3:15 Eastern time.
In the meantime, we want to talk about this some more with Gareth Schweitzer, the White House correspondent for Talk Radio News Service; and Tammy Bruce, a political commentator.
Tammy, welcome to you, too.
Let's talk with you first, though, Gareth. Do you think this is a good choice and do you think it will mean change?
GARETH SCHWEITZER, TALK RADIO NEWS SERVICE: Well, I do think it's a good choice for the Republican Party, but I certainly don't think it will mean any change.
I think the biggest problem with Senator Lott was, he screwed up the president's plan of increasing the rhetorical appeal to minority Americans without actually changing the legislative agenda. There's still nothing in the Republican platform to appeal to minorities. If they wanted to, they could target tax cuts to the middle class. They could fully fund the education plan.
There's a number of different tactics they could take. But those have never been Republican components. And they still won't be after this change. They'll just put a better face on the party. And I think it's naive of them to expect minority Americans not to recognize that.
COSTELLO: Tammy, let's bring you in right now. Would you agree with that?
TAMMY BRUCE, NEWSMAX.COM: You know, what's good for Americans as a whole is good for minorities in this country. And what's good for blacks, consequently, is good for all Americans.
The reality is that the biggest issue I saw with the Lott problem were the Clintons coming out and saying Republicans are racist and always have been and Lott was just saying what all of them are thinking. And it makes me wonder if they think people like John Warner and Elizabeth Dole and John McCain and Mr. Frist are actually racists.
That's the kind of demagoguery and exploitation that affects, negatively, black Americans and all of us who have an interest in progress.
SCHWEITZER: I'm very hesitant to turn this back to the Democratic Party, though. And I think I have heard a number of conservative commentators try to do that. Again, we're not talking about Bob Byrd. We're not talking about how the Democrats responded to this. We're talking about how the Republicans deal with a member of their own party. I think it's important to realize that, until the president -- who I commend for doing this -- came out and spoke out against what Senator Lott had said, you did not hear one word from one Republican member of the Senate speaking out against what Trent Lott had said.
It only became when it was politically expedient and they saw the job open up and they saw a change coming.
BRUCE: Listen, here's the reality about whose these people are.
I agree with you. And the reality is, we're dealing with politicians. And even Mr. Lott said he was being attacked because he's a Christian. No, he wasn't. He was being attacked because he was the incoming majority leader.
SCHWEITZER: Because he said a stupid thing.
BRUCE: And you know what? When you speak that much, inevitably -- and it depends on who's going to exploit it and what the interests are. But this is politics in this country. And the problem is, is, when you've got Democrats -- and I'm a registered Democrat. I'm a gay woman. I'm a feminist. The problem is, is, when you see these issues like race being exploited to a degree where the divisions get bigger, we all lose.
COSTELLO: OK, we want to bring in...
SCHWEITZER: Well, I...
COSTELLO: One moment, panelists.
We want to bring in Tara Setmayer, who is a GOP political consultant, to get her viewpoint on all of this.
We keep switching pictures there. It's confusing even me.
But let's talk to Tara right now.
Tara, do you think Bill Frist is a good choice? And will he heal the wounds that have been made to the Republican Party?
TARA SETMAYER, GOP POLITICAL CONSULTANT: Well, I think that Bill Frist will definitely represent a breath of fresh air for the GOP.
This is an issue that's been very frustrating for me as a minority conservative Republican in Washington, D.C. for many years, trying to push the Republican agenda in the minority communities and effectively communicating our messages there. I think that the party as a whole has not gotten -- hasn't gotten it yet.
And I think this issue finally brought to the table what the Republican Party needs to do to articulate our message in the minority community. COSTELLO: Well, let's talk about articulating the message and put up a graphic that we have from Senator James Inhofe, a Republican from Oklahoma.
This is what he said on "Face The Nation" in talking about Trent Lott's comments. He said: "He reacted improperly and that he was trying to be compassionate, instead of just saying: Look, you guys are wrong. There's nothing racist about what I said. We're talking about a great man. Instead, of that, he started going sideways and disavowing some of those things that distinguish Democrats from Republicans. That was very confusing to a lot of people."
So, in other words, Senator Inhofe is saying Trent Lott was just trying to be compassionate. And by jumping on the bandwagon of affirmative action, he just confused people.
SETMAYER: With all due respect to Senator Inhofe, who I have worked with and I think -- he is a wonderful senator -- I think that we need not to make excuses for what Senator Lott said.
His apologies, the numerous apologies he made were clearly disingenuous. I think there was still a level of arrogance on his behalf. And the American people recognized that. And the conservatives within the party who are morally sound and who recognize that there was no way this man could continue in a leadership role based on the way he reacted to his comments.
And the best things that the Republican Party could have done was to make sure that Senator Lott did not represent us. He was doing a disservice to us. And by stepping aside and allowing Senator Frist to come in and take that and be the voice of the party now I think was a very positive move in the right direction.
COSTELLO: But wouldn't you say there's still a lot of Republican support for Trent Lott?
SCHWEITZER: I think there is.
I think there's also a real moral ambiguity in the Republican Party in their response to Mr. Lott's comments. Again, I have to say, everybody was quiet until they saw the ability or the opportunity to take Mr. Lott's job from him. Now, on the one hand, it is correct to say, he had a job to do and he did it poorly. And, therefore, he should lose. That's what the majority leader is. It is a job. He did it poorly.
But, on the other side, there is a real moral issue here that should have been spoken out against. And it's not opportunism on the Democrats to put that out. What it is, it's the reality, is that no one said anything until it benefited them or they were sure it wouldn't hurt them.
COSTELLO: OK, on that note, we have to take a break right now.
What you're looking at, by the way, is Senator Frist's office in Nashville, Tennessee. He's soon to come out and make a statement about his new role as Senate majority leader.
We're going to take a break. TALKBACK LIVE will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COSTELLO: Why is the government using your money to pay women to watch porn videos? We'll tell you what's behind a new study and what it's going to be used for later on TALKBACK LIVE.
You stick around.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COSTELLO: Well, welcome back to TALKBACK LIVE. We're having a happening time today.
We're awaiting Bill Frist's press conference, which was due to take place at 3:15. But, of course, it's 3:16 now. You know, we can't control the time element here. But we are awaiting a live press conference from him, because his fellow Republicans in the Senate have elected him new majority leader.
I want to bring in Callie Crossley right now, who is a commentator for National Public Radio and a regular panelist on "Beat the Press."
Welcome to you, too.
CALLIE CROSSLEY, NPR: Thank you.
COSTELLO: Give me your thoughts on all of this. What do you want to hear Senator Frist say?
CROSSLEY: Well, I'm not sure it's what I want to hear Senator Frist say. I think it's a matter of what the American people would like to hear Senator Frist say.
COSTELLO: And what's that?
CROSSLEY: That it's time to move past the former leader's record and go forward with the agenda for the party -- and that's his main concern now as the new leader -- and also that race and the way that it was exploited, as one of your speakers said, really has no business being on the agenda as it was.
(CROSSTALK)
COSTELLO: Well, let's talk about Bill Frist's voting record and if he can manage to do that. He has a very conservative record, much like Trent Lott's, if you take a look at the way he's voted in the Senate. Is that a problem?
CROSSLEY: Well, I can't say if it's a problem or not. It's maybe a problem for him.
I think, right now, what was paramount for the Republican Party -- and I'm not a consultant for them -- is that they wanted to do damage control and image repair. And so, to that end, he's very much the man for the job. And then, as people look more closely at his record, you have to determine whether image repair is enough.
What is the platform saying? What does the platform say specifically to minorities in this country and where the Republican Party wants to go in terms of its relationship with persons of color?
COSTELLO: So, Gareth, is image repair enough?
SCHWEITZER: I don't think it is.
I think, eventually, there has to be some policy changes. For example, there's very simple things I think the Republican Party could do, could acquiesce to, that would appeal to minority voters. For example, I think, as minority unemployment grew before the holidays, there was talk of extending unemployment benefits. It didn't happen. The Senate proposed a much larger -- the then Democratically controlled Senate proposed a much larger extension than the Republican-controlled House did.
And the president didn't say anything about it until after Congress had already left town. I think it's not enough to all of the sudden change the face of the party and say that all of the sudden now this is going to be representative of a more expansive group of Americans. There has to be some fundamental policy changes here if they're going to get the votes that they want for the next presidential election.
COSTELLO: OK, so, Tara, will there be fundamental policy changes?
SETMAYER: Well, I think we need to stay focused on what our president has done and what constitutes fundamental policy changes.
The Republican Party as a whole has supported school reform, school voucher programs, which is an issue that resonates highly within minority communities. There's over a 70 percent acceptance rate of this policy, where we want to give minority children who are trapped in urban -- failing urban schools the opportunity to get a quality education, which should be No. 1 in any minority area as far as what we -- as a policy change or something that we need to put forth.
That's not a change for the Republicans. That's something that we've held steadfast for many terms now.
COSTELLO: Spoken like a true GOP'er.
(CROSSTALK)
SETMAYER: No. As a minority, I'm in the communities. And I have worked in these areas. And I see where we need to put for the most effort. And school voucher programs, in my book, education is No. 1.
BRUCE: Can I add to that, too?
COSTELLO: Go right ahead. Go right ahead.
BRUCE: Yes, I completely agree with that.
For Americans to say that poor children or children in the inner city should not have the same options that children who live in another social class is anathema to us, and should be. And, also, the other thing that President Bush has done which affects all of us as Americans, especially minority communities with the target, is the faith-based initiatives.
It's giving more power and more governmental support to those communities and faith-based initiatives that will make a difference for the inner city.
COSTELLO: On that, we're going to have to take another break, because we are awaiting Senator Frist to come out of his Nashville office.
And I'm going to get to our audience members, too.
So, TALKBACK LIVE will be back right after this. You stick around.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COSTELLO: Welcome back to TALKBACK LIVE.
We're talking about Trent Lott stepping down as the majority leader, Bill Frist being voted in as the new majority leader. We are still awaiting his press conference. It's supposed to happen at any time out of Nashville, Tennessee. You're looking at the doors right now. We're just waiting for Senator Frist to go through those doors. And when he does, of course, we'll hit that live.
I want to talk about something Trent Lott said. I believe it was yesterday. He said: "When you're from Mississippi and you're a conservative and you're a Christian, there are a lot of people that don't like that. I fell into their trap and so I have only myself to blame."
Callie, I want to ask you about this comment. Who is he talking about?
CROSSLEY: I have no idea who he's talking about. And that is not a comment that makes any sense.
I think there is always some criticism about being from Mississippi, because it has that kind of reputation as far as race is concerned and persons of color. But the bottom line was that he, his enemies took advantage of a moment in time after he made the mistake.
This is a pattern that he's had for years. He's been saying this stuff and nobody's really picked up on it. It never caught fire. But I think, coming right out of the election, where people are very sensitive about majority, minority leadership, absolutely, and minorities in general showing their displeasure with the system the voting system and who got voted in, I think Democrats were very vulnerable in not having given a message to minorities that they could embrace.
And so you had a moment in time where the Republicans were able to -- if you will, Trent Lott fell into a moment that probably would have been ignored...
COSTELLO: He fell into his own trap, in a manner of speaking.
CROSSLEY: Exactly. He would have been ignored about a year ago, if that had happened.
COSTELLO: I want to ask Tara this, though, being the Republican strategist.
Who do you think that Trent Lott was talking about?
SETMAYER: I think that he was obviously talking about the liberal media or anyone that spoke out against him, because I don't really believe he felt his comments were as horrible as they were.
I never got the impression that he was contrite enough, which was a problem for me. We need to stay -- we need to also realize that this is a sensitive time. And with the type of president and leadership that we have in the administration, we cannot afford to have such gratuitous pandering, which is what Trent Lott did going on BET. And his actions after this story came to light, to me, were even more troubling.
(CROSSTALK)
COSTELLO: I keep hearing that it's such a sensitive time about race, but, Gareth, isn't it time that we all grow up?
SCHWEITZER: Well, I don't know how you mean by grow up.
COSTELLO: I mean, should we be talking about race in this way in the year 2002?
SCHWEITZER: Well, should Mr. Lott? Certainly not. That's why he's out.
(CROSSTALK)
COSTELLO: But we're all continuing to be so sensitive about this.
SCHWEITZER: Well, honestly, I think people harking back to a segregationist presidential candidate and saying that the country would not have had -- quote, unquote -- all of these problems since then if Mr. Thurmond had gotten elected back then, I don't think that's being overly sensitive. I think that's an incredibly inappropriate thing to say. And I think it gave a lot of people a reason to get rid of Mr. Lott. But let's remember, also, the president had his issues with Trent Lott before this. This was a guy who it was on his watch that Jim Jeffords left the Republican Party. And it was also the Homeland Security Bill. A day after the president had said, listen, let's get this done in a lame-duck session, Trent Lott went and said on national television that nothing gets done for the American people in a lame- duck session.
The president really didn't like that very much either. So, I think there was some actual governing issues that this brought to light, as well as a pretty sordid past for Mr. Lott.
(CROSSTALK)
SETMAYER: Let's also be fair about who created this sensitive political correctness concerning race.
It's Democrats who are famous for demagoguing this issue and race-baiting, as in 1998, when they suggested, if anyone votes in the South for a Republican, black churches are going to burn.
(CROSSTALK)
SETMAYER: ... or dragging James Byrd behind -- the James Byrd issue was exploited in Texas. Those were Democrats doing that.
SCHWEITZER: Who are they famous amongst, the 90 percent of African-Americans who vote for the Democratic Party?
BRUCE: Because they've been exploiting it for so long.
(CROSSTALK)
SETMAYER: That's right.
(CROSSTALK)
SCHWEITZER: And so minorities don't know any better? They don't know the difference between exploitation and policy?
(CROSSTALK)
CROSSLEY: Carol?
COSTELLO: OK. We need to get Callie in here.
Go ahead, Callie.
CROSSLEY: If I may, this was absolutely the junction of race and politics. And so what Gareth has said is absolutely correct, in terms that there was some governing issues. There was also some just blatant racial issues going on.
At the same time, Tara, I'm sorry. I have to disagree with you.
SETMAYER: I'm not surprised.
CROSSLEY: The problem is that, as a nation, we have not really had the conversation about race. It's not about one party baiting the other, really.
It's about the fact that most Americans do not feel comfortable talking about race. They've never addressed what the issues are around race in this country. And so these kinds of things are going to continue to happen.
BRUCE: Do you know why? Can I make a suggestion as to why?
COSTELLO: Oh, make it short.
BRUCE: Because it's too dangerous. Because of political correctness, people presume that they know what's in your head and your heart. And if you say something that might be perceived as being different or dangerous or out of the status quo, you're labeled a racist. And that's the problem.
COSTELLO: OK, on that note, we have to break. We have to break, panel.
We're waiting for Senator Frist to come out for the first time as majority leader. And we'll bring that to you live right after this break.
We'll also talk about this: nuclear threats, as North Korea sounds a red alarm around the world. And then later, find out why the government is paying women to watch porn and you're footing the bill.
It's all ahead as TALKBACK LIVE continues.
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(NEWS BREAK)
COSTELLO: And welcome back to TALKBACK LIVE. In a move that's set off a worldwide alarm, North Korea is removing seals and cameras from a frozen nuclear reactor. It says it needs the facility to produce electricity. However, the reactor is also capable of producing weapons-grade plutonium. The facility stores some 8,000 spent fuel rods, and, according to the State Department, those rods are not used for producing electricity. The International Atomic Energy Agency says it's worried.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a rapidly deteriorating situation. Not only that they have taken cameras and surveillance, our verification monitoring equipment, from the power reactor where they supposedly want to produce electricity, but yesterday and today continue to take all the equipment from the spent fuel and the repossessing plant, which would enable them, if they restart the program, to make plutonium in a few months. And that's a pretty disturbing trend.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: Yeah. He said it was a pretty disturbing trend. Is that the understatement of the year, Tara?
SETMAYER: One hundred percent. This is the direct result of a failed diplomatic approach to a despot. This is a totalitarian nation, and obviously you're dealing with thugs who do not think rationally, starving their own people. And they're looking for power at all costs.
And here we go and negotiate a deal, thinking that we're supposed to base this compliance on their word. They lie for a living. We gave them the ability and the tools to create the situation we have now.
COSTELLO: My, this is sounding so very, very fallfamiliar.
SETMAYER: And also, received the Nobel Peace Prize as a result of that.
COSTELLO: This is sounding so familiar, Gareth. Isn't it?
SCHWEITZER: Well, it does sound a lot like Iraq, although there are some noticeable differences. I think a lot of people, when they try to make the case for war here against Iraq, they say that Iraq is a threat to regional security there. Although the interesting thing is, when the Gulf War ended, we didn't leave one troop on the Kuwaiti border because we didn't feel like they were a threat to invade again. We knew their military was weak.
Yet for the last 40 years, we have now had 40,000 or more troops on the North and South Korean border because we are that concerned and have been for that long about the threat that North Korea poses. I think this is where the attention needs to go from our administration. And it needs to go there as soon as possible.
COSTELLO: As far as military might is concerned?
SCHWEITZER: Well, as far as military might is concerned and as far as the threat to the United States. They're doing all of the things we're merely talking about with Iraq. They're exporting weapons; we know they have weapons grade plutonium. And they're deliberately and in our face essentially telling us all of this stuff while we focus on something else.
COSTELLO: So, Callie -- I want to hear from Callie now. Why do you think the United States isn't changing its tactics with North Korea?
CROSSLEY: Because unfortunately we tend to be a one focus diplomacy. I don't understand why we haven't figured out that this is a global situation. That we have to take our eye off Iraq in order to look at the rest of the world because it's all connected. And so while we're focusing totally on Iraq, then here's another country just moving along in the same way that we say that we are afraid of what could happen in Iraq. So Gareth is absolutely right on this. We're not paying attention.
BRUCE: Just one little reminder though. As the CIA showed US in Yemen, there's a lot of things that are going on and that we're doing that the general public isn't aware of. But the reality is everyone's right. These problems don't come up conveniently in one pocket. The reality is we've got to deal with North Korea like we would a House that's burning down right next to us. We've got to take care of it before it gets out of control.
COSTELLO: But can we do that when we're preoccupied with Iraq and with Afghanistan and al Qaeda, wherever they may be?
BRUCE: Absolutely. Last year was the first year that I paid my taxes with glee. We are the richest country on earth. We are the most powerful, and there's a reason for that. It's because we know what we're doing. And with unity, with our allies, we're not alone out there.
You remember it was a Spanish ship that stopped the ship that was coming out of North Korea to Yemen. We've got allies. People are unified. Russia, China is upset about North Korea. Everyone else is as worried as we are. We're not alone.
COSTELLO: OK. Let's go to an audience member before we get to the rest of our panel. Step right up, sir. Do you think that we should do something more with North Korea? Do you think that we should have a policy similar to what we're doing with Iraq?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. I think that if we're giving Iraq a deadline, and North Korea forms part of the axis of evil, like the president said, I think they should do the same thing. They should be under the same sanctions. They should go there, monitor them, or else they're going to do, like she said, in your face.
They're just sort of just telling you, you can't do anything to us. We have the right to do this. So I think the president should do something about it.
COSTELLO: So Tara, why isn't the president? You know many people say he's just obsessed with Saddam Hussein because of his father.
SETMAYER: Well, that's ridiculous. I mean, who's to say that this administration isn't doing or taking the necessary steps to prepare for a preemption-type approach.
BRUCE: Exactly.
SETMAYER: We are -- just like Tammy said, we, as regular American citizens, are not privy to the type of information that our National Security Council, that our individuals in the Pentagon, people that we entrust are experts that know how to handle this. Donald Rumsfeld today addressed the question of whether the US is prepared to fight two-fold war. And we are, clearly.
And we don't spend billions of dollars a year to only be focused on one world problem. We are well aware of North Korea. And the policies of appeasement have failed us miserably in the past. And there is going -- I am confident that this administration will take the necessary steps to...
COSTELLO: But Tara, right now the Bush White House is handling this diplomatically, not militarily, unlike it's doing in Afghanistan and in Iraq.
SETMAYER: Well there's also -- there's politics involved in this year. There's a lot more stigma attached to what's going on in Iraq because of its ties to terrorism directly and because...
COSTELLO: There's no core evidence of that, is there?
SETMAYER: There's been enough evidence. And in this world perception is reality.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Powell says there is.
SETMAYER: And if you were to survey the average American person, do they believe that Saddam Hussein...
COSTELLO: I'm sorry, Tara. I must interrupt. Tara, I'm sorry, because I believe Senator Frist is about to leave his office in Nashville, Tennessee. We've been awaiting this, oh, for about 40 minutes now. Let's go to Jason Carroll to see what's up in Nashville.
JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Just want to give you a quick update. The spokeswoman for Senator Frist's office just came out and said that the vote is over and that the vote was unanimous. So it is official now. Senator Frist is the new Senate Majority Leader.
That vote taking place on a conference call behind closed doors. I believe we also have a live picture of what's happening behind closed doors right now. Senator Frist allowed some cameras to come inside his office just before that vote took place. We are told that the vote began with the opening of a prayer, followed by a nomination speech. Then the vote, now closing comments.
That's what's happening right now. We're expecting Senator Frist to come out in just a few moments -- probably in about 15-20 minutes -- to give some sort of statement. We're also hearing that -- we didn't get a final count in terms of how many senators took part in the vote, but we are being told Senator Trent Lott did, in fact, take place -- take part in this vote.
Senator Frist arriving with his wife and his children here at his offices shortly before the vote actually took place. I had just a quick opportunity, Carol, to ask him how he felt before the vote took place. And he said, "I feel great." He said, "My life is about to change."
Yesterday, I also had a brief opportunity to talk to the senator out at his home. And he said as soon as this vote is over what he wants to happen is all of us, meaning people like me and the media to go away -- he said jokingly -- so he could then go on ahead and enjoy the holiday with his family. So at this point we're waiting to hear from Senator Frist. He should be coming into the room in about 15-20 minutes to make what we've already told you official -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Yeah. I don't think Trent Lott was joking, Jason. And did he tell you how he voted? Did he vote for Bill Frist?
CARROLL: Yesterday, when I was out at the senator's house, I was out at Senator Frist's house, not with Senator Trent Lott. But Senator Lott has already indicated, Carol, in the past that he would support Senator Frist.
COSTELLO: All right. So we are still awaiting Senator Frist to walk up to that podium, to say some words to the American public. And that brings us to a break.
Coming up next on TALKBACK LIVE: "TIME" magazine's triple play. This year's person of the year is a tale of three women. Find out what these cover girls did to earn them the top spot. Would they have been your choice? We'll be right back.
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STEPHEN KOEPP, "TIME" MAGAZINE: I think that they show people that, even in their ordinary regular jobs as cogs in the giant enterprises of private industry and in government agencies, that everybody's got their role. And it's not just world leaders who count.
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COSTELLO: That's right. It's everyone. Welcome back to TALKBACK LIVE.
After letting us all speculate over who would be the "TIME" magazine's person of the year, publishers pulled a triple whammy and produced three women for the honor.
Let's go to Washington and listen in to what's happening there.
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