|
CNN CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT
Why Does Former Iraqi Citizen Advocate War Against Her Homeland?
Aired March 11, 2003 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Diplomacy or conflict?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It will not be a war against Iraq. It will be a war to liberate Iraq.
ANNOUNCER: As war looms, passions intensify.
Tim Robbins, a high-profile Hollywood activist, tells Connie why he's taking his antiwar stance to the streets.
TIM ROBBINS, ACTOR: Any movement that connects violence to God loses me.
ANNOUNCER: Her country could be devastated by war. So why does this native Iraqi support military action against her homeland?
ZANAIB AL-SUWAIJ, EXEC. DIR., AMER. ISLAMIC CONGRESS: The Iraqi people are eager for -- to get rid of Saddam. They are asking us all the time, When are you coming to liberate us?
ANNOUNCER: A two-year-old survives a deadly crash, then wandered away from the wreckage for hours.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She had no jacket, no shoes and she was out there for three hours.
ANNOUNCER: Tonight, the heroic troopers who saved the toddler by following her little footprints in the snow.
Madonna is back. This time, in nearly 50 pages of wild photos. We'll meet the photographer who captured the newest look of the material girl.
And, they were once on top of the charts, until they self- destructed. Now, they're rocking again in the Hall of Fame and are our "Persons of the Day."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: This is CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT. From the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, Connie Chung.
CONNIE CHUNG, CNN HOST: Good evening. We begin with two stories involving the U.S. military. The air force tested a powerful new weapon in Florida today. It's nicknamed the "mother of all bombs." A 21,000 pound conventional bomb that may be used in the possible war against Iraq. And officials at Ft. Drum in Upstate New York report one of their Blackhawk helicopters has crashed.
CNN's Jamie McIntyre joins us from the Pentagon with details on both stories. Jamie, under what circumstance would the U.S. use this "mother of all bombs?"
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's not at all clear they would use it, although the Pentagon has a record of pushing weapons into use during wartime that during peacetime would be considered not ready for prime-time. This weapon, because it's so big and so powerful could not be used, for instance, in an urban area where Saddam Hussein's Republican guard or special Republican guard are thought to be, because of the U.S. strategy to minimize civilian casualties. Clearly a bomb like this would maximize the casualties.
But where they could use it as if they were to find an Iraqi unit that was isolated in the desert somewhere. In that case, they could use this kind of bomb to take out virtually an entire unit at one time. And that would send a very strong message to the rest of the Iraqi military to give up.
CHUNG: And Jamie, what can you tell us about the Blackhawk crash?
MCINTYRE: Well, there's not much news at this point. But what we do have isn't that good.
The Blackhawk helicopter was part of a three helicopter formation as part on a routine training mission at Ft. Drum, New York. It crashed this afternoon. The crash site was located. Initial reports indicated that there might be one soldier walking around the crash site, but they weren't clear if that was a survivor or not.
There were nine people on board the helicopter, including the crew of four, all U.S. Army soldiers and at this point it's not clear who, if anyone, survived.
CHUNG: All right. Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon, thank you.
A rescue operation is under way at Ft. Drum in Upstate New York, searching for the survivors of that Blackhawk helicopter crash. CNN's Jason Carroll has details.
JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And Connie, the military investigators are now beginning the process of trying to figure out exactly what caused the crash of that Blackhawk helicopter. Thirteen soldiers were on board, two were injured, and at this point 11 are feared dead.
According to an army spokesperson, the Blackhawk helicopter was on a routine training mission. These types of aircraft are used throughout the military, often as transport planes. We're showing you an example of what one looks like right now. According to the military spokesperson, this training mission was going as scheduled, as planned and then at about 2:00, radio contact was lost. Rescue teams were set out, wreckage was spotted at about 3:30 just north of the base. Shortly after that, early this evening, the commander of the base came out and sent a message to the soldiers and their families.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAJ. GEN. BUSTER RAGENBECK, U.S. ARMY: I would like to extend my condolences to the families of our fallen comrades, and I want to assure you we will fully investigate this terrible accident.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CARROLL: As far as the investigation is concerned, apparently there was no immediate indication before radio contact was lost that something was wrong. This incident surely to have an effect on the morale here at Ft. Drum. All of the members on board the aircraft were members of the tenth mountain division. Ft. Drum, there were some 1, 000 soldiers and reservists who are already deployed to the Middle East for a potential war with Iraq. So you could imagine feelings were tense before this accident happened.
Jason Carroll, CNN, Ft. Drum, New York.
CHUNG: Jason Carroll.
Now let's turn to Iraq. The diplomatic standoff at the United Nations continues. We'll have the latest in just a moment.
At the White House, President Bush has been on the phone lobbying for support from noncommitted nations for a resolution to approve an invasion. And two American U-2 surveillance planes aborted their mission today when challenged by Iraqi fighter jets. Reportedly a technical mistake. The Iraqis were said to be concerned about the safety of two flights operating simultaneously.
A new public opinion poll finds a majority of the Americans, 58 percent, feel the United Nations is doing a poor job in managing the crisis. That's 10 percent higher than last month. And a slightly smaller majority in the "New York Times"/CBS news poll, 55 percent, say U.S.troops should move into disarm Saddam Hussein even if the U.N. votes against a war. Forty-one percent would not support unilateral action.
As the numbers slowly shift more in line with the president, the passion on both sides of the issue remains unfaltering. The woman we're about to meet has been sought out by top officials of the Bush administration for her views on Iraq. She wrote a letter to President Bush supporting his position. He in turn invited her to meet with National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice and Vice President Cheney.
Zainab Al-Suwaij has been an outspoken opponent of the regime of President Saddam Hussein. She's an expatriate who says the vast majority of people in Iraq want him removed from office. She fled to the U.S. after the first Gulf War. Now she's executive director of the American Islamic Congress.
Thank you so much for being with us.
AL-SUWAIJ: Thank you for having me.
CHUNG: You support a potential war with Iraq. Now what's percentage would you say of the Iraqi people support an American invasion?
AL-SUWAIJ: Majority of the Iraqi people are waiting for the minute to be free, to be liberated from Saddam Hussein's regime.
CHUNG: How do you know that?
AL-SUWAIJ: Iraq has suffered enough.
CHUNG: How can you say that?
AL-SUWAIJ: Because we have people inside Iraq we are in close contact with, and we have a lot of people who they are coming out of Iraq that we are talking to and many of them assured us that they are waiting for the minute, even the soldiers from the Iraqi army, are waiting for the minute to be free.
CHUNG: You still have relatives there, correct?
AL-SUWAIJ: Yes, that's correct.
CHUNG: Are you taking any risk by speak out publicly here? Are you concerned about them, and are you concerned about them if there is indeed a war?
AL-SUWAIJ: Sure, I am concerned about them, definitely, and I'm concerned about being public. But it's about time to talk about -- about the suffering of the Iraqi people inside Iraq. For more than 10 years I didn't talk about my experience inside Iraq and how Saddam Hussein brutally killed -- killing the people and keep continuing doing the same thing now.
So it's about time to liberate the Iraqi people. And the Iraqis they are innocent people are going to be dying during the war. Unfortunately, Iraqis have been dying every single day by their own regime. And it's about time to stop that, to liberate the Iraqi people and let them enjoy a democratic country and democratic government.
CHUNG: Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz talked today about the unimaginable consequences that occur to relatives or to family members of people in Iraq if someone speaks out against the Saddam Hussein regime. Are you concerned for the safety of your relatives?
AL-SUWAIJ: Sure. do I am always concerned, but there is no guarantee, even if I'm not talking. If the government wanted to take them and want to torture them, then that will happen immediately whether I talk or not.
But I am risking my life and -- not only my life but probably my relatives as well, because it's about time to talk. We have a big problem inside our country, and it's about time to stop it.
CHUNG: Zainab Al-Suwaij, I thank you so much for being with us.
Al-SUWAIJ: Thank you for having me.
CHUNG: Many celebrities continue pressing their case against going to war. Rock legend Neil Young made some caustic remarks at the Rock'n'Roll Hall of Fame induction ceremony in New York last night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NEIL YOUNG, ROCK MUSICIAN: We're having a good time tonight but we're going to kill a lot of people next week, so let's not forget about that. I don't want to ruin this but it's too real not to mention it.
And music used to be about this and it still is about this, it's a human thing and these are human beings over there, we're making a huge mistake. I feel like I'm in a giant gas-guzzling SUV and the driver is drunk's a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) skunk. He's drunk on power.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUNG: This says leaders of the anti-war coalition delivered a petition with more than 1 million signatures to members of the U.N. Security Council. It urges there be tough inspections, not war against Iraq. Among celebrities backer of the petition effort, Jessica Lange, Ethan Hawke and our next guest, actor/director Tim Robbins.
Robbins has long been an advocate of human rights and abortion rights. And his outspokenness has reportedly gotten him on a black list for this year's Oscar presentations. I'm going to ask you about that in a minute.
But first, you just heard the Iraqi woman I was interviewing just a moment ago. She said a majority of the people in Iraq support a U.S. invasion, and that they want to be liberated.
ROBBINS: It's awfully hard to tell. She's not there. The people that I talk to from church groups and people that i know have been there recently say that there's an incredible fear in the Iraqi population right now.
(CROSSTALK)
CHUNG: ... say about how the Iraqis feel about Saddam Hussein?
ROBBINS: I don't think there's any question that no one wants Saddam Hussein. The question is the method. And that's the question that's been debated over the last six months. The method of going in with, according to a CBS unnamed Pentagon source, was describing this operation shock and awe, which in 48 hours will deliver more cruise missiles than in the entire first Gulf War. And he's quoted as saying, "there will not be a safe place in Baghdad. The sheer size of this has never been seen before." That's a Pentagon source that's saying that.
Now this -- there's ultimately going to be a tragic loss in the amount of people dying from this horrible attack.
CHUNG: But you know that President Saddam Hussein has killed his own people.
ROBBINS: I also know he'll be safe somewhere, and we won't be getting him. And it'll be a matter of rooting him out in a ground war. And that'll be awful for us as well.
CHUNG: Do you support continuing the inspections, is that how you want to get to Saddam Hussein?
ROBBINS: I think that I support continuing the inspections, I support the U.N., I support the U.N. as an organization that is able to keep rogue states from doing whatever they want and we have to listen to that Democratic voice. That is essential for us to continue. We're not getting our way there. But we have to be mature, and we have to realize that the world is not want us to do this.
Two weeks ago, 6 to 10 million people, according to BBC, protested on the same day around the world in over 70 countries, in over 500 cities across this world, unanimously said no to this war. That's the single most protest, the biggest protest ever in the history of the world. And if we can't hear that world voice, there's going to be ramifications for us later down the road.
CHUNG: Number one, President Bush said he that is not going to be swayed by any demonstrations. Number two, isn't it obvious to you -- number two, isn't it obvious to you the only reason why Saddam Hussein is destroying weapons is because he's under this pressure of war, imminent war?
ROBBINS: So something's working, right? He's destroying them.
CHUNG: Well if you didn't have the threat for war, he would be doing nothing.
ROBBINS: It seems like it's working.
CHUNG: So you continue to hold that threat a war for months and months?
ROBBINS: Whatever we're doing seems to be working. We're seeming to find weapons, so let's continue in this route rather than indiscriminately bombing and winding up with a tragic amount people dying.
It's -- it will morally reduce our standing in this world to the point where we won't have much say over whether Pakistan attacks India or India attacks Pakistan or China does whatever it wants with its weapons or North Korea for that matter.
We have to retain a moral high ground here. And we're crossing a line, a very dangerous line. It's un-Christian preemptive strike. I don't know how any church leader in this country or throughout the world is supporting this preemptive strike. From the Pope to Baptist ministers to Presbyterians to Catholics to Protestants all across the world are saying no, this is not the way to solve problems.
CHUNG: When an Iraqi, such as this woman I interviewed, tells you that people there want to be liberated, doesn't that say something to you? Doesn't that say to you that if they want a democracy, they should be able to determine what they want? And if they want to be liberated, then the United States invasion would be valid?
ROBBINS: I think that when you have her on, you should have someone else on from Iraq that is saying the opposite. That would be a balanced way to approach this.
She's one woman. She's got family there who she's talking to. I'm sure there's other Iraqis there talking. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) heard one on the radio the other day. Adamantly opposed to war, Iraqi who went into exile after the first Gulf War. Same situation, but absolutely opposite opinion. Thinks it'll would be tragic for the people of Iraq.
CHUNG: Let's talk about a potential Hollywood black list. Do you know if you have been blacklisted from being an Oscar presenter because of your position on the war?
ROBBINS: You know, the thing about those kinds of things is, you know, to acknowledge them is to, you know, to have some paranoia. I try not to deal with Hollywood in that way. You know, I live in New York City. I try to do my work, do the work that's offered me.
I know I haven't been invited to be a presenter on any awards ceremonies recently except in Britain which I was just over there, did an awards ceremony over there. That's their choice, it's their party. You know?
CHUNG: Would you support any actor or actress who does say something about the war at the Oscars?
ROBBINS: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And as a matter of fact, at the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) in London some did. And at the Spanish academy awards, almost every actor talked about what was going in the world.
I support free speech, and you can't have free speech in a society or even in a club, if it's Hollywood, that is saying you can't talk, you can't talk. That's not a free society. You have to allow it. Democracy's messy sometimes. Sometimes you have people that going on and on and on, talk and talk and talk.
When we did our thing at Oscars we kept it down to 30 seconds. So, you know, we had editing in mind. But, you know, I think it's important that we have, you know, I think also, for me personally, it makes for a more, you know, interesting Oscar ceremony, if you feel that someone might say something rather than just making inappropriate comment about someone's dress, you know?
CHUNG: OK, Tim Robbins, I thank you so much for being with us.
ROBBINS: All right.
CHUNG: Coming up, the push for votes at the United Nations. The man who represented the U.S. during the first Gulf War joins us.
ANNOUNCER: Next, a miraculous rescue after a horrible crash.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They didn't know that there was a little girl out there, until they followed the footprint.
ANNOUNCER: The story of a 2-year-old survivor and the troopers who saved her, when CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: At United Nations today, the U.S. and Britain canceled a vote on the latest Iraq resolution, as the two countries continue to press for support. The U.S. has called for a vote by the end of the week and is giving signals that it might be open to some modifications that could broaden support for the proposal. The current resolution faces a no vote from France and Russia. Also at the U.N. today Iraq's representatives kicked off a debate on his country future for a plea for peace.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MUHAMMED ALDOURI, IRAQI U.N. AMBASSADOR: Iraq reaffirms that peaceful means dialogue and cooperation are the shortest and best means to resolve the current crisis. My delegation through you calls upon the international community to prevent a catastrophe which has now become imminent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUNG: President Bush said the U.S. is ready to invade Iraq with or without the approval of the Security Council.
So why is the diplomatic drum still in play?
Thomas Pickering was U.S. ambassador to the U.N. in 1991 during the first Gulf War, and he joins us from our Washington bureau to discuss diplomacy this time around.
Good evening sir, thanks for being with us.
THOMAS PICKERING, FMR. U.N. AMBASSADOR: Good evening, Connie, nice to be here.
CHUNG: I'd love to be a fly on the wall listening to the back room dealing that is going on in this world. Trying to get the six undecided vote.
Tell me, can the U.S. literally try to buy those votes?
PICKERING: I think probably yes and no. There are a number of things one can do for foreign countries that they want badly that make a difference. But those countries also have to speak to their own people in the world community and it seems as over the day, at least those six that you're talking about have come forward with an idea to have more time to do this. And then it's up to the United States to react to that and see what can be put together. So beginning the negotiation which is sort of where we are is important if you believe as I do that it's very, very significant that the president go into this with the U.N. backing its support as much as he possibly can.
CHUNG: You do?
You believe the U.N. support is critical?
PICKERING: I believe it's extremely important. I think physically and politically we can go in there alone, but the amount of long-term damage, I think, is quite hard to calculate both to the U.N., which I think overtime will come back and to our relationships with friends and allies. I also tend to agree very much with the president that Saddam's an evil man. And I have grave doubts from my long experience in government, that he is capable of being, if I could put it this way, put back in his box in a sufficiently clear and understandable and way through the U.N. process of which I worked very hard to help set up.
So it does seem to me that over the years he has acted in ways that make it very difficult, I think, to avoid in the end the use of force as he continues to weave, dodge, bob, stymie, balk at the U.N. efforts to find that fully sufficient disarmament that would give us the confidence we'll need in the future to make sure that the region is safe and the rest of the world eventually is safe from him.
CHUNG: Ambassador Pickering, I'm taking us back to the question of financial aid.
When you are bringing together the coalition for the Persian Gulf War, were there any example as you were trying to gather votes of money playing a part in whether or not someone would vote one way or the other?
PICKERING: Not while I was engaged. Though as you know, the use of force resolution involved the president and Secretary of State Baker, and there was one famous incident, as you probably know, after the end of the vote when Yemen voted no. It was made clear to Yemen than was probably the most expensive vote that cast in the U.N. and they lost $75 million in U.S. assistant as a result. So, that's a factor. I support interest these countries get increased aid rather than have aid cut off as the way to help them along on the voting trail.
CHUNG: Ambassador, do you think that the Bush administration has played its cards incorrectly during this process? PICKERING: Well, I think, over the period of time, we've both hyped unilateralism and avoided until Secretary Powell made his presentation, the full recitation of all the reasons and all the evidence that we had. And as a result, I think that's made it harder for folks at the U.N. to be supportive of our approach here, particularly when we're getting down to what is likely to be the last resolution before the use of force. And countries that are required to make a very, very important decision.
CHUNG: All right, Ambassador Pickering, I thank you so much for being with us.
Action to ease concerns about one of the side effects of a war with Iraq tops tonight's "World in 60."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(voice-over): Ahead of a possible war with Iraq, OPEC ministers said their countries will pump enough oil to meet world demands. In Vienna the Saudi minister said oil anxieties not output are to blame for high price at the pump.
In a setback to the Bush administration, a judge ordered the government to allow defense lawyers to meet alleged dirty bomber Jose Padilla. Padilla is suspected of plotting to detonate a radio active bomb in the U.S.
The threat of dirty bombs was also discussed in Vienna. The United Nations nuclear watch dogs said stricter security measures are needed to prevent terrorists from getting radio active material.
And ImClone chairman Sam Waksal settling civil charges stemming from his insider trading scandal. Waksal agreed to pay $800,000 in fines and be banned from serving as an executive in a public company.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Next, Madonna reinvents herself again. A behind-the- scenes look at her wild photo shoot. When CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: We've got an incredible story now about a very little girl who's lucky to be alive and well tonight thanks to some quick- thinking police officers. The story begins before dawn last Friday morning on a highway in Wisconsin. There was a horrific crash, a car slamming into a tractor trailer. The roof of the car was sheered off and the two adults in the car were killed instantly. Was there also a baby in the car?
Police searched for hours, then a sunrise found the two year old. She had climbed out of the car and wandered across the highway. Following her tiny footsteps in the snow, police found her huddled under some spruce trees. She is reported in good condition today, with just a small cut. She's now living with relatives in the Twin Cities.
Wisconsin State Patrol troopers Rhonda Waldera and Sean Berkowitch helped rescue the little girl. And they join us this evening from Tomah, Wisconsin.
Thank you both for being with us.
SEAN BERKOWITCH, WISCONSIN STATE TROOPER: Thank you.
RHONDA WALDERA, WISCONSIN STATE TROOPER: Thank you.
CHUNG: Trooper Berkowitch, well, you were the first one on the scene. What did you find?
BERKOWITCH: The first thing I found, along with the deputy that responded with me, is a trailer that was blocking the driving lane of the highway.
CHUNG: And how would you describe the scene?
BERKOWITCH: At the time, we were only aware of the semi. A semi was on the right shoulder, with the trailer blocking about halfway into the driving lane.
CHUNG: When you arrived at the scene, Trooper Berkowitch, did you say to yourself, this is a very, very serious accident? Could you tell that this was a serious, serious accident?
BERKOWITCH: At the time, we only thought the one vehicle was involved. It wasn't until sometime later until we realized that the other car was involved with the crash.
CHUNG: Trooper Waldera, what happened when you arrived at scene? What did you find?
WALDERA: The first thing I did is, I started my accident investigation. And I approached the vehicle. And I started to move around items in the car.
And when I picked up the blanket in the back seat, I noticed that there were some little kid's shoes in there and a sippy cup. And there were some pull-up diapers and a blanket. And there was a coat in there. And I started to think that there was somebody else missing from the vehicle. And that's when we decided to start looking for a possible toddler.
CHUNG: And how, in fact, did you find her?
WALDERA: They eventually found her over by the -- on the shoulder of the highway. A highway supervisor was sitting there and happened to notice her bright coat near the interstate fence.
CHUNG: All right, going back just a little bit, time was passing by and no one had found the baby. But we're told that it was your persistence that caused the investigators to finally ultimately find Anita. What was it that was making you say to yourself, no, I know there's a baby here?
WALDERA: The items in the car just kept telling me there was more, more to the accident. And that's when we really started to search, search the debris area and search the semi unit, because we were unsure at the time how old the child was and if there was possibly a fatal accident that happened to her as well or if she was alive, if she was alive, that we needed to make sure we got some medical attention to her.
CHUNG: I have to believe, Rhonda, it's because you are a mom, too, and you just knew that there was a baby there and you wanted that baby. You were pregnant, weren't you, with your third?
WALDERA: Yes, I'm currently pregnant with my third.
CHUNG: You are still. OK. Couldn't tell.
WALDERA: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
CHUNG: So wasn't it you who just said, I just know there's a baby there? When the baby was finally found, you must have been thrilled.
WALDERA: Yes, we were all very excited and even more excited when we found out that she wasn't injured in any way.
CHUNG: Trooper Berkowitch, why don't you tell me your reaction when you found out that the little girl was found and that she was just fine?
BERKOWITCH: It was such a relief just to find her. You're emotionally at such a low when you find the two fatally injured people in a vehicle. Then you find this little girl that the worst thing she has is a little scratch under her eye. It's just a great feeling.
CHUNG: Rhonda, can you tell me, what were your thoughts when you realized that the baby was found and everything was OK?
WALDERA: It was just overwhelming. It made us feel great about doing our job out there.
CHUNG: Well, you should.
I thank you so much for being with us. Congratulations. It was good work.
WALDERA: Thank you.
BERKOWITCH: Thank you very much.
CHUNG: And coming up: Who's that girl? We've got some brand new photos behind the scenes with Madonna.
Stay with us. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(MADONNA SINGING "RAY OF LIGHT")
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUNG: Madonna in her "Ray of Light" video.
For more than two decades, she's been a pop idle, projecting different images as the times change. Her videos show it well. We've seen her in her early days as pure and chaste. Then Madonna transformed herself into the sex goddess and she morphed into a disco queen. And now the chameleon of rock is reinventing herself yet again.
The April issue of "W" magazine features an unprecedented 44-page photo spread showing the material girl today. They'll be part of a video exhibit at a gallery in New York's Soho later this month.
Photographer Steven Klein shot the pictures all in one day. And he's with us to talk about this photo shoot.
Congratulations for doing that incredible shoot.
STEVEN KLEIN, PHOTOGRAPHER: Thank you, Connie.
CHUNG: Now, she actually approached you about doing this photo shoot.
KLEIN: Yes.
CHUNG: So when she asked you, what did you think? What was your reaction?
KLEIN: Well, my first impression was, what am I going to do? Because I felt that Madonna's has done everything. And I thought, how could I do something different than she's ever done?
But once we started talking and I would send her images and send her pictures that I've done, we kind of starting a dialogue and we evolved the idea together.
CHUNG: Why did she want to do this?
KLEIN: Actually, she didn't really actually want to do -- she's really not into doing fashion pictures or doing photographs. I think maybe she responded to my pictures and wanted to work with me. And that's how this project came about.
CHUNG: I think everybody wants to know what she's like. I sat next to her at a Knicks game and she didn't say boo to me. So tell us, what was Madonna like?
KLEIN: For me, she's been -- it's been one of the great experience of working with somebody. Usually, with a celebrity, they come in for the day. You really don't have any kind of communication before. With her, we talked and e-mailed for like one month about the project, developed the idea together.
So, for me, it's been a great experience to work at this level with her, where, on the premise, she wasn't really so interested in doing this, but then, once she committed, she was like there 100 percent to be totally involved with every aspect of the shoot.
CHUNG: Now, when you actually picked the pictures, you picked them with her, right?
KLEIN: No, I edited the pictures myself.
CHUNG: Oh, you did? But wasn't she involved? She was perfectly happy to choose pictures that weren't flattering.
KLEIN: Yes.
The thing is, what I did is, I sent her a selection. And out of the selection, she probably chose two-thirds of what I sent her. She was less concerned with the pictures where they were more self- conscious or where she looked maybe more perfectly beautiful. She was more interested in the more fascinating, intriguing pictures as photographs.
CHUNG: I had no idea that she was so flexible, you know that? It's incredible. She's in such great shape.
KLEIN: I had no idea either until she did that.
CHUNG: Yes, great shape after two children and everything. It really is amazing.
KLEIN: I think she works. She does yoga every day. And I think she's been a dancer all her life. And I think that's what it is.
CHUNG: When you were developing what you were going to do, how would you describe what it was?
KLEIN: The thing is, I always saw Madonna as a performance artist. And I think what I wanted to portray was the process about how a performer arrives at their work.
And the thing is, what she had talked about as well is that, before a concert, which she finds very interesting is the rehearsals and the straining and the maybe she would like injure herself and have to tape her arm up. And she said the process of making the video or the process of making the concert sometimes becomes more intriguing than the final result.
And like myself, I think, sometimes the final image, to me, the perfect image sometimes isn't as interesting as some of maybe the outtakes or the unfinished pieces.
CHUNG: Now, you have taken pictures of a lot of people, Justin Timberlake, right? Name a few.
KLEIN: Justin Timberlake, Brad Pitt, Julianne Moore.
CHUNG: How do you go about capturing these celebrities in a different way? Because I'm sure they've been shot so many times.
KLEIN: What I do is, I usually reference -- I'll like have painting references or other photo references or journalistic pictures. And what I do is, in my mind, I'll put together a collection of images that -- where I'll kind of build a world where these people can partake in. Like Madonna, I built her the world for her performance.
CHUNG: All right, Steven, thank you so much for being with us.
KLEIN: Thank you as well.
CHUNG: And coming up next: French-bashing points to a change in menus. We'll talk to the man behind it all.
Stay with us.
ANNOUNCER: Still ahead: our "Persons of the Day," a super-group who walked the beat into the Rock 'n' Roll Hall of Fame -- when CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: French resistance to a U.N. vote to invade Iraq has sent off a tempest in a teapot or a furor in a fry pot on Capitol Hill. The restaurants on the House side are dropping the word "french" from their french fries and french toast. From now on, they will be called freedom fries and freedom toast. Congressman Bob Ney, Republican from Ohio, ordered the change. He heads the panel that overseas House operations.
And he joins us now from Washington.
Congressman, thank you for being with us.
REP. BOB NEY (R), OHIO: Thank you.
CHUNG: You know what? I'm going to pull your chain a little bit, because I'm going to say to you, with all due respect, don't you have something better to do?
NEY: Actually, we're working on a lot of issues.
But I'll tell you, I think this is the best thing to do. Congressman Walter Jones of North Carolina had this done at a diner named Cubbie's down in Beaufort, North Carolina. And we here at the Capitol have the fries. And he wrote a letter. And I think it's a good thing to do, because we understand that this is a symbol. We fully understand that.
But what took a few minutes to decide to do sends a clear message to our men and women who are ready to stand in harm's way that we do care, the nation's capital, the Capitol itself. We wouldn't be debating up here if it wasn't for the veterans. And I think it is a great symbolic gesture.
CHUNG: But doesn't it also send a message that we don't respect or we don't listen to people who do not toe our line?
NEY: Well, let me just say, part of my family -- I'm of French descent. And there's a lot of good French people, obviously. And the language is beautiful.
But the government is misdirected. When they needed us, we were there. If what happened to us happened to them, we would be there. And this sends, I believe, a great symbolic message to our troops that we stand firm, whether it's a small symbol or large symbol, to make it clear that we're not happy with the French government. This is our way of doing it. And I think it was totally appropriate. I'm happy that Congressman Walter Jones came up with this idea.
CHUNG: All right, Congressman, I thank you so much for being with us.
NEY: Thank you.
CHUNG: A scandal that's rocking the world of college athletics and one man paying the price tops tonight's "Snapshot."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHUNG (voice-over): Georgia's Bulldogs have withdrawn from post- season basketball play. And head coach Jim Harrick has been suspended with pay after an investigation showed three players took a phony class taught by his son.
Fire investigators are looking at four exit doors from the Station nightclub in West Warwick, Rhode Island, to see if they played a role in the disaster that killed 99 people.
Another week of guest hosts filling in for David Letterman while he recovers from an eye infection: this week, Vince Vaughn, Elvis Costello and Will Ferrell.
HBO is countersuing actor James Gandolfini. "The Sopranos" star filed suit last week for breach of contract, apparently in an effort to get a pay raise.
And the lights on Broadway are shining brightly again tonight. Musicians ended their four-day strike after reaching a tentative contract agreement with producers.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHUNG: All this month, "TIME" magazine, which is owned by our parent company, is marking its 80th anniversary by spotlighting 80 days that change the world. We are profiling some of those days here on CNN. Tonight, we look at a day, June 6, 1944, that will forever be known by a single letter.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN EISENHOWER, SON OF DWIGHT D. EISENHOWER: D-Day was the day in which Operation Overlord was launched, the Anglo-American invasion of Nazi-held Northern Europe in World War II. It was just the beginning of the vast operation that took place later on.
It was a very, very critical thing and had been planned for 2 1/2 years, ever since Pearl Harbor. It was the critical point of the war. June 6 was the day in which 130,000 allied troops made their landings in Normandy. There were five beaches stretched out over about 60 miles. Four of the five beaches I think probably went better than the allies had hoped. Omaha Beach is where they had a terrible time.
My father's role, he was the supreme commander. He was charge of the whole thing. He had the burden on him of calling the shot for the invasion.
D-Day changed the world critically. The best way to look at it is to contemplate what would have happened if D-Day had failed. All our eggs were in one basket there, in that invasion. It worked. Therefore, Europe was freed of Nazi Germany.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: The long-delayed reunion of one of England's top rock bands gives us our "Persons of the Day."
At induction ceremonies British for the Rock 'n' Roll Hall of Fame, British fans made headlines last night. Along with Australia's AC/DC and the Righteous Brothers from the U.S., British inductees were Elvis Costello and The Attractions, The Clash and Police. Sting thanked the crowd in New York for the honor.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STING, MUSICIAN: We haven't played together in 18 years. And we're very keen to do that, so we're not going to make any fancy speeches.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUNG: The band broke up because of personality clashes in the 1980s. Guitarist Andy Summers had a little fun at the band's expense.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDY SUMMERS, MUSICIAN: I'd like to make it very clear that there's absolutely no ego in our band whatsoever.
(END VIDEO CLIP) CHUNG: Then they launched into one of their biggest hits.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STING (singing): Every breath you take, every move that you make, every bond you break, every step you take, I'll be watching you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUNG: Police, the group of onetime schoolteachers, stole the show, rekindling much of the excitement that made them one of the top- selling bands ever. And so, for coming together to celebrate their glorious past, the Police men are our "Persons of the Day."
And tomorrow, one of the most asked questions these days: How will your life change if there's a war?
And coming up next on "LARRY KING LIVE": differing views on war within the Christian community.
Thank you so much for joining us. And for all of us at CNN, good night and we'll see you tomorrow.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Homeland?>
|
