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CNN Live At Daybreak
Saddam Hussein Addresses Iraqi People
Aired March 24, 2003 - 05:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And you are looking at a live picture of Baghdad, where just about two hours ago Saddam Hussein addressed the Iraqi people. We will tell you what he had to say, and let me tell you, he had a lot to say, and it will be of great interest to our American viewing audience.
Good morning to you.
It's 1:00 p.m. in Baghdad, 5:00 a.m. on the East Coast today.
It's Monday, March 24th.
From CNN global headquarters in Atlanta, I'm Carol Costello.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Anderson Cooper.
Thanks very much for joining us.
Let's get a quick check of where coalition forces are right now.
COSTELLO: Yes, sir. The 3rd Army 7th Cavalry is pushing ahead in South Central Iraq. Our Walter Rodgers tells us the lead unit came under small arms and rocket fire earlier today. U.S. Marines have been battling Iraqis near Nasiriya, while in the West, the U.S. has control of one air base.
Joint Chiefs Chairman General Richard Meyers says forces were flown into Northern Iraq last night.
We're going to toss it to Bill Hemmer now, live in Kuwait City, is that right? All right, let's go to Bill Hemmer right now.
And, Bill Hemmer, I'm sure you've been watching those dramatic pictures from Ramstein Air Base of wounded soldiers being loaded onto ambulances and taken to a hospital in Germany.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Watching that, Carol. Also watching and gathering reaction to this speech that was said to be given on national television throughout Iraq by Saddam Hussein. He appeared stronger. He appeared more robust. The first time we have seen him in a national television address since Thursday, four days ago.
We've seen snippets of videotape every day. The Iraqis say that the Iraqi leader is in charge and is OK despite reports that say he was wounded or killed in the opening air strikes last Wednesday night. More on that in a moment.
But Alessio Vinci now in Nasiriya with the U.S. Marines.
Yesterday, also was one of the first to report the casualties that the U.S. Marines took after being hit by a rocket propelled grenade.
News again today -- also, what do you have?
ALESSIO VINCI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Bill.
Well, I'm reporting to you from the, one of the front lines around Nasiriya here in Southwestern Iraq and therefore the commander of our unit has agreed to allow us to report live from here provided that we do not show any of the surrounding, any of the landscape around here that would tell the ifs our exact location. And therefore we chose the background one of the armored vehicles that the Marines are using to transport their military, their Marines.
Ever since early this morning, these units and other units around Nasiriya have come under mortar attack from Iraqi forces. There is a Cobra helicopters also flying overhead. It's been fairly intense here this morning. We have taken several mortar rounds from the Iraqi side and we're also hearing in the distance heavy machine gun fire exchanges between the U.S. Marines and the Iraqi forces.
Occasionally the Marines of this unit have called for air support. They have raids to do that. And we have seen Apache helicopters -- Cobra helicopters, rather, arriving on the scene, arriving on the scene using their heavy machine guns as well as sometimes some of their rockets.
Now, and update about the casualty figure from the incident yesterday, which took about a mile away from where I'm standing right now. According to one of the battalion commanders here, the casualties now stand at 10 killed, 12 wounded and 16 still missing. We are also told by that commander that the number of deaths could rise because some of the wounded are in serious condition, but especially some of the missing remain such as of now -- back to you, Bill.
HEMMER: Alessio, quick things we want to follow-up on now. Do you know on which behalf of the Iraqis fighting, is this the Republican Guard, is it the regular army or are you see units of the Fedayeen, these martyrs of Saddam that apparently number in the thousands and are roaming and trying to cut off the back side of the advancing U.S. military?
VINCI: Well, those Fedayeens were a major concern to the U.S. military planners throughout the weeks that we've been spending with the U.S. Marines before the war began and those fundamentalists, indeed, came out several times in their intelligence briefing. Right now I would say that the forces here are, the U.S. forces are challenged by regular army units, several battalions, several brigades around the city of Nasiriya. One of the commanders here also telling me that while they were ready for resistance, they are quite surprised that the Iraqi forces are still today, more than 24 hours after our arrival in the area, still putting up some stiff resistance, again, using several mortar rounds, including some that landed very, very close to our position here. We also took some light fire from machine guns, which means that we are within sight of the Iraqi forces right now -- Bill.
HEMMER: Alessio, since yesterday have you advanced any?
VINCI: You know, Bill, the -- we cannot go too much into the specifics about where we are and how much we go further or how much we retreat.
HEMMER: Understood.
VINCI: All I can tell you is that one of the things, you know, one of the things that are happening here is that they're trying to organize a supply route and that supply route, of course, needs to be secured. And they just happened to be near that supply route. That's all I can tell you for now -- back to you, Bill.
HEMMER: All right, then maybe you can answer this again. Just to get a clarification, Alessio, you say 10 killed, 12 wounded as a result of this conflict from yesterday. How many missing again?
VINCI: Sixteen, 1-6, 16 missing as of a couple of hours ago when I had a chance to speak with one of the senior commanders here around Nasiriya.
HEMMER: All right, Alessio Vinci with the U.S. Marines around the town of Nasiriya in Southern Iraq.
Meanwhile here in Kuwait City, just a few seconds ago we heard the air raid sirens blast off in downtown Kuwait. The fire alarm is sounding, also, in our hotel, as well. Last night around o'clock local time there was a missile fired, aimed at northern Kuwait, apparently aimed at the U.S. military outpost camped out in the northern Kuwaiti desert. We don't have much information as to what type of missile this was or what happened, but we do know there's no reports of casualties and no reports of injuries.
We are told the anti-Patriot missile batteries have been very successful. In fact, they say last night this missile was shot down, knocked out of the sky, again, by the Kuwaiti military, which would mean, in essence, that's the second time the Kuwaiti military has knocked out incoming Iraqi missiles from the skies.
The alarms died down in the hotel. I hear some air raid sirens in the city still. Not quite sure what this means right now but oftentimes when we hear these air raid sirens, a short time after that, the all clear is given.
While we wait for more news on that, I want to get to Baghdad quickly and show you videotape of Saddam Hussein addressing his country just about 60 minutes ago. He was defiant yet again. Some describe his speech and his demeanor as stronger, more robust than the past five days we've seen him, urging the Iraqis to continue the military battle.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRES. SADDAM HUSSEIN, IRAQ: We have tried to show good will to the extent to where that some might have blamed us or found it strange that we showed so much patience and how we responded to what we responded to despite the fact that it did not show weakness and to show that the motives of the two administrations, the British and the American, aided by the Zionist administration, presenting new pretexts every day since the cease-fire in 1991 until the war that started today.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: In that speech, Saddam Hussein specifically made reference to the battles taking place in Umm Qasr over the past weekend, also referring to commanders of the 51st, 11th and 18th Divisions -- they're all posted in Basra -- lending credence in some circles to believe that some time that that speech was either taped either today or possibly within the past 24 hours.
Widespread speculation that Saddam Hussein may have been killed or even wounded on Wednesday night of last week. Absolutely unconfirmed from this perspective.
But Rym Brahimi has been tracking the movements of the Iraqi president for months now. She is out of Iraq now live in Amman, Jordan.
And, Rym, you saw this tape. You listened to the Iraqi president. Your take on what you heard and saw today?
RYM BRAHIMI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Bill, this definitely seems to be a message for a whole series of different audiences. First, to the international community, saying we have tried what we could, we have been patient, but we are being invaded. Clearly, Iraq trying to put itself within the norms of international law, pointing out to the invader, saying we followed the inspections, we followed the international law, we didn't go anywhere to invade someone.
Clearly, this has been one of Iraq's strategies for the past few months, constantly pointing to what they see as their being in their right and not having gone out of their Democrats.
Secondly, to the region, the Arab world and the Muslim world at large, the president calling on everyone to fight, calling on Iraqis to fight, calling for this fight to be done in the name of god, saying believers will be victorious. Again, appealing to a very strong religious sentiment in the region.
And then, of course, above and foremost to the Iraqi people themselves, clearly, Bill, a signal here saying I'm on Iraqi TV, I'm talking to you, I'm still in charge. And I think this is probably the most important thing we can deduce from, you know, that speech. This was, the president also appeared on Iraqi television the first night of the bombing, or the morning before very early in the morning, again, a way of responding to rumors or reports that he may have been either injured or killed. Again, this is President Saddam Hussein saying I'm still in charge and I'm here -- back to you, Bill.
HEMMER: Rym, thank you.
Rym Brahimi again in the Jordanian capital of Amman after being posted in Baghdad going back to November, about five months within the Iraqi borders, out safe, as we reported over the weekend.
We do anticipate a 9:00 a.m. Eastern Time, a little less than four hours from now, we'll hear from Central Command down in Qatar and we should get the very latest from the U.S. and British position, anyway, as to what's happening on the ground and in the air over Iraq.
More from Kuwait when we get it. I want to note, Anderson and Carol, one more time here, the sirens have died out. We have not given the all clear just yet, but there are no sirens right now, at least, in the background here in Kuwait City -- back to you now at the CNN Center.
COSTELLO: Yes, I certainly hope that is a positive sign.
Bill Hemmer, thanks very much to you.
We want to bring you now to where the fighting is or was, to Southern Iraq and Walter Rodgers, who's with the 7th Cavalry -- Walter, I understand your unit's getting mighty frustrated because of all of the tricks that the Iraqi Army has played.
WALTER RODGERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Carol.
The Iraqi Army so far has been reasonably successful at slowing the advance of the U.S. Army's 7th Cavalry northward toward Baghdad. They did use human shields yesterday, according to Army sources. They had to, the Army had to cancel an air strike. Additionally, we saw more evidence of the Iraqi forces taking positions today in civilian areas in actually a civilian agricultural area.
The problem is, of course, that the Calvary's role is to probe northward, to try to find the hostile forces, and when it does, it's discovering time and time again that the Iraqis are embedded civilians, Iraqi civilians, in amongst the troops, that is, the battle lines. And, of course, the U.S. Army is under strict instructions to minimize and do as little to incur civilian casualties as possible.
So what the Calvary is trying to do is probe northward, find a way around this major population center, which lies in its path, and then push on through in the race towards Baghdad.
We were out on a scouting patrol with the Army this morning, again, 7th Cavalry. We were just a few feet away from a tank when an enormous rocket propelled grenade came crashing through. It missed the tank and missed us. There was another one. We dived for our vehicle and retreated very quickly because we didn't have armor around us. The Army stayed there and fired back in the direction in which the Iraqis were firing the rocket propelled grenades and they cut down four of the Iraqis who were hiding in that civilian population.
Here again, the Iraqis, the Iraqi soldiers were walking up through a civilian, a nice verdant pastoral farmland and suddenly they started firing on the U.S. soldiers. I don't think that's going to deter the Army much longer, but it has been frustrating -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Walter, you told us a chilling story about an hour ago about how some Iraqi citizens were waving to American troops and then all of a sudden they came under fire.
RODGERS: That's true. You know, I was right beside the tanks in the area where all of this shooting took place and what happens is you're standing there and the American soldiers will wave to the Iraqi farmers or the Iraqi civilians. There was an interesting incident, a young Iraqi man came up to me and wanted to chat me up and so I spoke to him a few phrases of Arabic that I know. And he said, "Don't worry, I speak English." And I said well, that's interesting. It was broken English.
I chatted with him a few seconds. He looked very friendly. He said, "Saddam is terrible, Saddam must go." He bad-mouthed Saddam Hussein terribly and then suddenly he decided he was going to walk over to a Bradley fighting vehicle about 30 feet away. Well, of course, that could have gotten him killed.
The interesting thing is here you never know, in this kind of situation, where you have soldiers intermixed with the civilian population who's friendly and who's not. And that fellow who was very friendly to me and wanted to go over to the Bradley fighting vehicle, I restrained him because I knew the soldiers were under orders to shoot him so I tried to prevent the guy from getting too close. That was a real nasty situation. But we still don't know if perhaps he was one of the Iraqi soldiers in civilian uniform. We just don't know. And it is a dodgy proposition when the Iraqis are using civilians as shields -- Carol.
COSTELLO: It must be so difficult to get a way around that. We have heard reports that the American military is going to try to avoid towns and cities altogether and try to actually cut a path around them to go into Baghdad.
RODGERS: That's true, Carol. But sometimes it's not possible. In the Mesopotamian Delta, for example, there are many canals which have to be bridged and the bridges are around cities so you would have to go through a city. And there are other topographical obstacles which prevent you from always flanking a town.
Sometimes you simply have to go through a town or on the outskirts of a town and the Iraqis are using those as choke points to try to slow the advance of the 7th Cavalry and the rest of the Third Infantry Division.
It has been successful. This army hasn't moved in 24 hours, although it's anticipated they'll try to move again -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Walter Rodgers reporting live from Southern Iraq.
Many thanks to you.
COOPER: Well, Carol, we, earlier this morning had been watching some images that we got off Iraqi television that came in really in the last hour or so. The image showed an Apache helicopter, it appears to be a U.S. Apache helicopter, but that's not clear at this point. It has the markings, I believe, of the 5th Calvary, and in the video, which we'll show shortly -- there it is -- it seems to have landed in a grassy area. It didn't look like necessarily a hard landing. It doesn't look like there's too much damage to the Apache helicopter itself. We're trying to get as much information on this as we can so we're going to check in right now at the Pentagon and our own Chris Plante -- Chris, what can you tell us?
CHRIS PLANTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Anderson.
Still not a lot in the way of detail coming from the Pentagon here. But what we can tell from the videotape and what we do know is that it is a U.S. Army Apache helicopter Longbow helicopter. It does have the markings of a Calvary unit on the front of the aircraft. From what we can see, it doesn't appear that the helicopter suffered from any ground fire or from any surface to air missile which would create obvious damage, or a rocket propelled grenade. We see no scarring or any bullet holes of any kind, in fact, on the helicopter from what we've seen, although we have not seen the right side of the helicopter.
One would have to assume, I suppose, that if there was visible damage to the helicopter that Iraqi TV would like to show that since they are claiming that they shot down this helicopter. In fact, they are claiming that they have shot down two helicopters in the recent hours.
The U.S. is denying that there were two helicopters shot down. They're denying that there are two helicopters down at all or two missing, acknowledging now that this, after a fashion, at least, that this one is down.
What we can tell from this, from the tape that we have seen from Iraqi TV, that has been airing on Iraqi TV is that the helicopter is down approximately 50 miles south of Baghdad. No apparent damage and no evidence that the Iraqis have taken custody of the two crewmen in this situation. We can see their helmets laid on the ground there, but no evidence otherwise that they've been taken captive.
Again, as you observed there is, it doesn't appear that the helicopter went down in a very hard fashion, although if you're sitting in the helicopter even a slightly hard landing is very uncomfortable and can cause problems.
The Longbow is the most advanced of the U.S. military attack helicopters. It, you see the object on top of the rotors is an advanced radar system. It has a computer, computerized battle management system inside the cockpit of the helicopter that allows the pilots to see a digital battlefield that identifies friendly aircraft from enemy aircraft, friendly vehicles on the ground from enemy vehicles. It cuts down substantially on the threat of friendly fire or fratricide incidents. It is significantly more advanced, actually, than the Marine Corps equivalent, which is the Super Cobra.
It's not clear where the two crewmen are. Again, if the Iraqis had them in custody, presumably they would be making a show of that. So I think at this point, knowing that this was hours ago at this point, just building in the drive time from the site to Iraqi TV and the fact that it aired there some time ago, it's quite possible that the tomorrow crewmen were picked up by combat search and rescue units that fly special operations helicopters alongside of ongoing operations in the event that aircraft do go down.
These search and rescue teams are very, very clever, very sneaky, also have very advanced helicopters and they're very good at what they do. Typically in situations like this, if crew members are rescued, they don't make any announcements until everybody is back at home safe and sound having a cup of coffee -- Anderson.
COOPER: And we certainly hope that is the case now.
Chris Plante at the Pentagon, thanks very much.
We're also joined by our military analyst, Gen. David Grange, and we are pleased he joins us this morning.
As you look at those pictures from Iraqi TV of that Apache helicopter, what do you see? I mean you're familiar with, you know, you have a trained eye. What do you see?
BRIG. GEN. DAVID GRANGE, U.S. ARMY (RET.): Well, the Apache helicopter is very survivable, the older modem the new model, the Longbow, which you're talking about right here. It must have had an emergency landing. There is very little damage that's apparent from the video and -- but, you know, it could be a transmission seize up, something with the engine and that. And I can assure you they wouldn't have landed unless it was an emergency and required.
COSTELLO: And it's still armed, too. I mean there are...
GRANGE: There are some armaments still on it, yes. Some armaments still on it. So it's not sure, you know, it's hard to tell how much has been expended on targets or whatever. I'm very surprised that it's still there, but keep in mind this is an old video and I would not be surprised if it was now a pile of dust.
COSTELLO: Why are you surprised that it's still there?
GRANGE: I mean it, I would think that the military would destroy it at the earliest possible moment.
COSTELLO: The U.S. military?
GRANGE: Yes. COSTELLO: Understand.
About the pilots, I don't even know if you can answer this, but, you know, many Americans worry about them. How likely is it that they could have escaped from this?
GRANGE: Well, there's a terrific chance of evading capture. They may have been picked up immediately or at a later date. And so a lot of planning goes into that and a lot of resources are applied to support rescue, a lot of resources.
And as I stated before, most of them are very classified, but very efficient. And I would be very, I would think positively that they would have been picked up.
COSTELLO: Well, we heard the Iraqi information minister talk not long ago that, he said two Apache helicopters were downed and they had the pilots in captivity and maybe at some point, maybe we would show you their pictures.
GRANGE: It could be. It's always that possibility. These attack helicopters go deep. They destroy a lot. They're very efficient. And a lot of other helicopters were hit in this attack and they all made it back, from what we hear.
COOPER: And from what we hear -- and we don't know that the image that we are seeing is a helicopter from the attack that we heard about earlier from Karl Penhaul -- it would seem to be in the same general vicinity, but we simply don't know that for sure. But let's talk a little bit about that attack, as much as we know about it. What does it tell you about the difficulties that the U.S. is facing in terms of the tactics that they are going to have to go up against?
I'm we're hearing that, you know, this is a civilian area and the Iraqis seem to be using that fact to their advantage.
GRANGE: Actually, the tactics are no surprise. You know, this report stunned and shocked from the intensive fire, anti-aircraft fire from the Iraqis back on these Apache helicopters. These, I can assure you that the units involved in this operation have war game practice against these specific units. This is the Medina Republican Guard unit. Elements of that probably were the ones that had the supporting fire and other units that support the Medina Republican Guard division, and the coalition forces know those tactics quite well.
It's just that it's, they have a lot of tough weapons.
COSTELLO: Going back to the pictures, many probably would call this appalling. You can see, I don't know if they're Iraqi military people, Iraqi citizens, but they're actually dancing in jubilation around this helicopter. And what a contrast between that and how the U.S. military is reacting to the taking of POWs and the shooting down of Iraqi targets.
GRANGE: Well, yes, that's exactly right, and there's very few coalition forces in that predicament. So when it happens, I guess there's a lot of dancing and exuberance from the results of getting a U.S. target.
COOPER: It's also obvious just judging from the video, it's also being sort of motivated by the Iraqi "reporter" who is on the scene. You know, he's clearly sort of whipping the locals to sort of dance in front of the cameras. Obviously this, you know, has a lot of propaganda uses, no doubt, for the Iraqi government.
GRANGE: Oh, yes. Very similar to the political officers that used to, who are -- in the communist military you always have a political officer and they always nudge those to be more happy and joyous and just like what we see here. Exactly.
COSTELLO: Well, it's such a frightening contrast to see that and then to hear the Iraqi information minister talk about the POWs and say that they're adhering to Geneva Convention standards as it applies to their treatment.
What does that tell you?
GRANGE: Well, it's a bit twisted, obviously, and they're taking advantage of that. They're grasping for anything they can use to encourage continual fighting with their forces. There's a -- it's hard to stay motivated with that kind of power coming down on you day and night from the coalition forces. So they're scrapping for things.
COOPER: Do you think their tactics are, the Iraqi tactics are working? Do you think they will work?
GRANGE: Well, they'll work to an extent. But there's so many ways to go about countering those tactics that the units will do well. There's no, the coalition units will do well against them. There's...
COSTELLO: It'll just take more time perhaps.
GRANGE: It'll take more time. I mean this, some of these units, it was expected there'd be very tough resistance. They have some very good equipment, still. I would think after that particular Apache helicopter raid, a lot of that stuff is now destroyed.
COOPER: Well, it's also interesting because we heard from Iraqi information minister yesterday, who said that the reports that the U.S. coalition and that the coalition forces were so deep inside Iraq were simply not true. We suddenly see a helicopter that's suddenly shown up 60 miles south of Baghdad. It would seem to indicate, you know, his information, to say the least, was inaccurate, if that.
GRANGE: Sure, and a lot of times in reporting, when a unit name is given, let's say the Third Infantry Division has gone this far, well, that may be the main body. You have deep attacks, they call them, going on constantly all over the country, just like the air, fighter jets and bombers, they're all over the country. So you can expect a lot of the calvary units, a lot of the Apaches, those things are doing things quite far forward from the main bodies and destroying things, prepping the battlefield for the advancing forces.
COSTELLO: I want to talk more about the POWs because many people were frightened by those images on Iraqi television of the Iraqis questioning and showing the POWs on television. And I know you've had much experience with POWs.
Your impression of how they might be being treated?
GRANGE: Well...
COOPER: Wait, I'm sorry. Before we answer that, I'm just being told in my ear we want to go to a picture that we've just received from Al Jazeera TV. I'm told it shows oil trenches on fire near Basra. That's the, really, the only information I have. This is something we have seen before. There have been reports of this outside Baghdad. I'm told this is, these images are from Al Jazeera and I'm told they show Basra. It's hard to sort of make out but it is...
COSTELLO: There are oil fields down there.
COOPER: Yes, but I'm told that these are, I'm told, this is a live picture. I'm told these are oil trenches, which we would assume would be some sort of defensive position, a trench filled with oil.
General Grange, any comment?
GRANGE: Yes, what they're trying to do is any measures they can to obscure the ability of us to engage U.S. and British forces to engage Iraqi positions. It'll have some effect, but not a lot.
COOPER: All right.
GRANGE: But that's what they're trying.
COSTELLO: General Grange, we're going to wrap things up.
But you're going to stick around, we're going to stick around.
We've hit the half hour. We're going to take a short break.
When we come back, we'll talk to Dr. Sanjay Gupta, who's also in the field of battle.
We'll be right back.
COMMERCIAL
COOPER: ... happening at this hour in Operation Iraqi Freedom and there has been a lot going on all morning long.
Iraqi TV today showed video -- this is the video right here -- what appeared to be a downed U.S. Apache helicopter intact and upright. The Apache helicopter reportedly had been downed about 50 miles south of Baghdad. You're seeing two helmets there on the screen. Iraqi TV did not report on the fate of the pilots, despite seeing those pictures of the helmets.
But Iraq's information minister hints that the two U.S. helicopter pilots may be prisoners of war. That is a hint. When that Apache helicopter was shown on Iraqi TV two helmets were at the scene. We've just saw those. The Iraqi official implied the pilots' pictures might be made public. We'll see.
Iraqi TV also aired a speech from Saddam -- President Saddam Hussein. He praised his troops for "causing the enemy to suffer." U.S. authorities are analyzing the tape to verify it was given by Saddam Hussein and not a double.
Update now from the tip of the spear, so to speak.
CNN's Walter Rodgers embedded with the 3rd Squadron of the 7th Cavalry says the Army unit is encountering hostile fire as it makes its way northward toward Baghdad. Rogers says the unit came under fire from rocket grenades not long ago and a tank returned fire.
Those are actually old pictures from about 24 hours ago.
The U.S. Marines intense firefighting in Southern Iraq stretches into a second day. The Marines are battling to establish control of a north-south route near Nasiriya, Nasiriya. I don't know why I can't say that.
Cobra attack helicopters with heavy machine guns and rocket launchers have been called in. Yesterday 10 Marines were killed, 12 wounded and 16 others still missing.
The Syrian government says a Syrian passenger bus inside Iraq was struck by a U.S. missile, killing five people. Now, a spokesman with U.S. Central Command says, "We have heard the report," but he could not confirm its voracity.
COSTELLO: And still ahead in CNN's coverage of the war in Iraq, with aircraft flying low over Baghdad, the U.S. led bombardment of the Iraqi capital is the heaviest in a few days. In the south, coalition forces advanced their tenuous hold near the vital port city of Basra. And in Hollywood, back here in the States...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL MOORE: This is a fictitious president. We, we live in a time where we have a man sending us to war...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: Michael Moore, documentary maker, booed soundly. This is the Academy Awards show as it unfolded as scheduled. And as you saw, not without some war time commentary, not met with happiness.
COMMERCIAL
COSTELLO: Good morning to you.
It's 5:34 Eastern time.
I'm Carol Costello. COOPER: And I'm Anderson Cooper.
We are going to meet up right now with Bill Hemmer, who is live in Kuwait City with an update -- Bill.
HEMMER: Hey, Anderson, just as you're tossing to me, I hear the air raid sirens yet again. Last time we talked, 20 minutes ago, we did hear the sirens here. The alarm goes off in the hotel. It was only about two minutes later, right when I tossed it back to you in Atlanta, that we were given the all clear.
No indication on the previous one as to what was happening. Sometimes, yesterday, in fact, we did have a false alarm. There was no missile fired into Kuwaiti air space. But late last night, about 1:30 in the morning, there was one fired. It fell into the desert, northern stretches of Kuwait. This is the second alarm we've heard now, the second air raid siren now in the past 25 minutes or so.
And, again, oftentimes we get the all clear shortly after -- OK, Steve, thanks for checking up on us.
We have used our own discretion here, Anderson and Carol, as to whether or not we stay on the air, whether or not we go downstairs in the parking garage with the rest of our colleagues. We have a system in place here. There's a group of us and we confer, as you can anticipate right now, 24-7 right now as to whether or not we should take cover and get off the air or continue with our reports.
Part of the reason why we have a fairly high rate of confidence to stay on the air and report to you is because to this date all the missiles directed at Kuwait have been directed out in the desert, the northern part of the country, at U.S. military posts. And a good number of them already, we know, five have been knocked out of the sky by either U.S. or Kuwait Patriot missile batteries, knocking them from the sky and falling into the desert.
Also to this point, no reports of injuries, no reports of casualties and no reports of damage, as well.
So as we await word on what's happening in downtown Kuwait, let's take you to Baghdad. Saddam Hussein back on television today. It is described as his first nationally televised address to the Iraqi people since Thursday of last week, which is four days ago.
He was stronger, appearing somewhat robust. Some people say he was relaxed, dressed in full military uniform and saying that victory will be ours soon.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HUSSEIN: The victory is soon. These decisive days all you Iraqis are in, you are in with what god has ordered you to cut their throats and those who are the believers will be victorious.
(END VIDEO CLIP) HEMMER: That address from Saddam Hussein issued about 90 minutes ago. It lasted about 10 minutes in length. If you contrast the image we saw last Thursday in a split screen image here showing Saddam Hussein today, much stronger, and, again more relaxed, if, indeed, that was taped today. And the image we saw last Thursday night with those big wire frame glasses, many people watching that have been led to believe that perhaps this was a double of Saddam Hussein. Widespread speculation as to whether or not he was killed or injured in the first attacks of last Thursday -- excuse me, last Wednesday. No way, again, for us to verify any of this information, only we know the words and the message delivered earlier today.
He also referenced a few recent attacks, Umm Qasr, the attacks that took place last Friday and Saturday of this past weekend. And also urging his commanders in Basra to continue what he called the good fight.
No alarms right now. No sirens either. Whether or not we get the all clear in a moment, we'll let you know, Anderson and Carol.
CENTCOM, 9:00 a.m., a brief in Qatar. We'll have it for you live when that happens.
Back to you now at the CNN Center.
COSTELLO: All right, Bill. One more word about Saddam Hussein and his videotaped or live message, we don't know which. The Pentagon is examining that to see if that was, indeed, Saddam Hussein.
Of course, we're following a number of developments in the war with Iraq. Here's an update on how the past few hours has unfolded from CNN's Miles O'Brien.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): 7:08 a.m. Eastern, CNN's Barbara Starr says the Pentagon confirms a British Tornado aircraft was accidentally shot down Saturday by a U.S. Patriot missile as it returned from a mission over Iraq. 8:09 Eastern, CNN's Walt Rodgers, embedded with the 3rd Squadron, 7th Cavalry, reports soldiers are telling him Iraqis are using women and children as human shields around military installations. An hour later, he reports his unit has taken heavy fire that injured one soldier as the squadron continues moving toward Baghdad.
10:06 Eastern, CNN's Allessio Vinci, with a Marine unit in Southern Iraq, reports heavy fighting and some casualties near Nasiriya. 11:03 a.m., Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr reports the military has begun contacting families of up to 10 members of an Army maintenance unit, some of whom were captured, some of whom killed near Nasiriya. 11:33 a.m., Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld
CNN's Wolf Blitzer, following the airing of interviews of American POWs on Iraqi TV, that Iraq is violating the Geneva conventions with that video.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired March 24, 2003 - 05:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And you are looking at a live picture of Baghdad, where just about two hours ago Saddam Hussein addressed the Iraqi people. We will tell you what he had to say, and let me tell you, he had a lot to say, and it will be of great interest to our American viewing audience.
Good morning to you.
It's 1:00 p.m. in Baghdad, 5:00 a.m. on the East Coast today.
It's Monday, March 24th.
From CNN global headquarters in Atlanta, I'm Carol Costello.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Anderson Cooper.
Thanks very much for joining us.
Let's get a quick check of where coalition forces are right now.
COSTELLO: Yes, sir. The 3rd Army 7th Cavalry is pushing ahead in South Central Iraq. Our Walter Rodgers tells us the lead unit came under small arms and rocket fire earlier today. U.S. Marines have been battling Iraqis near Nasiriya, while in the West, the U.S. has control of one air base.
Joint Chiefs Chairman General Richard Meyers says forces were flown into Northern Iraq last night.
We're going to toss it to Bill Hemmer now, live in Kuwait City, is that right? All right, let's go to Bill Hemmer right now.
And, Bill Hemmer, I'm sure you've been watching those dramatic pictures from Ramstein Air Base of wounded soldiers being loaded onto ambulances and taken to a hospital in Germany.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Watching that, Carol. Also watching and gathering reaction to this speech that was said to be given on national television throughout Iraq by Saddam Hussein. He appeared stronger. He appeared more robust. The first time we have seen him in a national television address since Thursday, four days ago.
We've seen snippets of videotape every day. The Iraqis say that the Iraqi leader is in charge and is OK despite reports that say he was wounded or killed in the opening air strikes last Wednesday night. More on that in a moment.
But Alessio Vinci now in Nasiriya with the U.S. Marines.
Yesterday, also was one of the first to report the casualties that the U.S. Marines took after being hit by a rocket propelled grenade.
News again today -- also, what do you have?
ALESSIO VINCI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Bill.
Well, I'm reporting to you from the, one of the front lines around Nasiriya here in Southwestern Iraq and therefore the commander of our unit has agreed to allow us to report live from here provided that we do not show any of the surrounding, any of the landscape around here that would tell the ifs our exact location. And therefore we chose the background one of the armored vehicles that the Marines are using to transport their military, their Marines.
Ever since early this morning, these units and other units around Nasiriya have come under mortar attack from Iraqi forces. There is a Cobra helicopters also flying overhead. It's been fairly intense here this morning. We have taken several mortar rounds from the Iraqi side and we're also hearing in the distance heavy machine gun fire exchanges between the U.S. Marines and the Iraqi forces.
Occasionally the Marines of this unit have called for air support. They have raids to do that. And we have seen Apache helicopters -- Cobra helicopters, rather, arriving on the scene, arriving on the scene using their heavy machine guns as well as sometimes some of their rockets.
Now, and update about the casualty figure from the incident yesterday, which took about a mile away from where I'm standing right now. According to one of the battalion commanders here, the casualties now stand at 10 killed, 12 wounded and 16 still missing. We are also told by that commander that the number of deaths could rise because some of the wounded are in serious condition, but especially some of the missing remain such as of now -- back to you, Bill.
HEMMER: Alessio, quick things we want to follow-up on now. Do you know on which behalf of the Iraqis fighting, is this the Republican Guard, is it the regular army or are you see units of the Fedayeen, these martyrs of Saddam that apparently number in the thousands and are roaming and trying to cut off the back side of the advancing U.S. military?
VINCI: Well, those Fedayeens were a major concern to the U.S. military planners throughout the weeks that we've been spending with the U.S. Marines before the war began and those fundamentalists, indeed, came out several times in their intelligence briefing. Right now I would say that the forces here are, the U.S. forces are challenged by regular army units, several battalions, several brigades around the city of Nasiriya. One of the commanders here also telling me that while they were ready for resistance, they are quite surprised that the Iraqi forces are still today, more than 24 hours after our arrival in the area, still putting up some stiff resistance, again, using several mortar rounds, including some that landed very, very close to our position here. We also took some light fire from machine guns, which means that we are within sight of the Iraqi forces right now -- Bill.
HEMMER: Alessio, since yesterday have you advanced any?
VINCI: You know, Bill, the -- we cannot go too much into the specifics about where we are and how much we go further or how much we retreat.
HEMMER: Understood.
VINCI: All I can tell you is that one of the things, you know, one of the things that are happening here is that they're trying to organize a supply route and that supply route, of course, needs to be secured. And they just happened to be near that supply route. That's all I can tell you for now -- back to you, Bill.
HEMMER: All right, then maybe you can answer this again. Just to get a clarification, Alessio, you say 10 killed, 12 wounded as a result of this conflict from yesterday. How many missing again?
VINCI: Sixteen, 1-6, 16 missing as of a couple of hours ago when I had a chance to speak with one of the senior commanders here around Nasiriya.
HEMMER: All right, Alessio Vinci with the U.S. Marines around the town of Nasiriya in Southern Iraq.
Meanwhile here in Kuwait City, just a few seconds ago we heard the air raid sirens blast off in downtown Kuwait. The fire alarm is sounding, also, in our hotel, as well. Last night around o'clock local time there was a missile fired, aimed at northern Kuwait, apparently aimed at the U.S. military outpost camped out in the northern Kuwaiti desert. We don't have much information as to what type of missile this was or what happened, but we do know there's no reports of casualties and no reports of injuries.
We are told the anti-Patriot missile batteries have been very successful. In fact, they say last night this missile was shot down, knocked out of the sky, again, by the Kuwaiti military, which would mean, in essence, that's the second time the Kuwaiti military has knocked out incoming Iraqi missiles from the skies.
The alarms died down in the hotel. I hear some air raid sirens in the city still. Not quite sure what this means right now but oftentimes when we hear these air raid sirens, a short time after that, the all clear is given.
While we wait for more news on that, I want to get to Baghdad quickly and show you videotape of Saddam Hussein addressing his country just about 60 minutes ago. He was defiant yet again. Some describe his speech and his demeanor as stronger, more robust than the past five days we've seen him, urging the Iraqis to continue the military battle.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRES. SADDAM HUSSEIN, IRAQ: We have tried to show good will to the extent to where that some might have blamed us or found it strange that we showed so much patience and how we responded to what we responded to despite the fact that it did not show weakness and to show that the motives of the two administrations, the British and the American, aided by the Zionist administration, presenting new pretexts every day since the cease-fire in 1991 until the war that started today.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEMMER: In that speech, Saddam Hussein specifically made reference to the battles taking place in Umm Qasr over the past weekend, also referring to commanders of the 51st, 11th and 18th Divisions -- they're all posted in Basra -- lending credence in some circles to believe that some time that that speech was either taped either today or possibly within the past 24 hours.
Widespread speculation that Saddam Hussein may have been killed or even wounded on Wednesday night of last week. Absolutely unconfirmed from this perspective.
But Rym Brahimi has been tracking the movements of the Iraqi president for months now. She is out of Iraq now live in Amman, Jordan.
And, Rym, you saw this tape. You listened to the Iraqi president. Your take on what you heard and saw today?
RYM BRAHIMI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Bill, this definitely seems to be a message for a whole series of different audiences. First, to the international community, saying we have tried what we could, we have been patient, but we are being invaded. Clearly, Iraq trying to put itself within the norms of international law, pointing out to the invader, saying we followed the inspections, we followed the international law, we didn't go anywhere to invade someone.
Clearly, this has been one of Iraq's strategies for the past few months, constantly pointing to what they see as their being in their right and not having gone out of their Democrats.
Secondly, to the region, the Arab world and the Muslim world at large, the president calling on everyone to fight, calling on Iraqis to fight, calling for this fight to be done in the name of god, saying believers will be victorious. Again, appealing to a very strong religious sentiment in the region.
And then, of course, above and foremost to the Iraqi people themselves, clearly, Bill, a signal here saying I'm on Iraqi TV, I'm talking to you, I'm still in charge. And I think this is probably the most important thing we can deduce from, you know, that speech. This was, the president also appeared on Iraqi television the first night of the bombing, or the morning before very early in the morning, again, a way of responding to rumors or reports that he may have been either injured or killed. Again, this is President Saddam Hussein saying I'm still in charge and I'm here -- back to you, Bill.
HEMMER: Rym, thank you.
Rym Brahimi again in the Jordanian capital of Amman after being posted in Baghdad going back to November, about five months within the Iraqi borders, out safe, as we reported over the weekend.
We do anticipate a 9:00 a.m. Eastern Time, a little less than four hours from now, we'll hear from Central Command down in Qatar and we should get the very latest from the U.S. and British position, anyway, as to what's happening on the ground and in the air over Iraq.
More from Kuwait when we get it. I want to note, Anderson and Carol, one more time here, the sirens have died out. We have not given the all clear just yet, but there are no sirens right now, at least, in the background here in Kuwait City -- back to you now at the CNN Center.
COSTELLO: Yes, I certainly hope that is a positive sign.
Bill Hemmer, thanks very much to you.
We want to bring you now to where the fighting is or was, to Southern Iraq and Walter Rodgers, who's with the 7th Cavalry -- Walter, I understand your unit's getting mighty frustrated because of all of the tricks that the Iraqi Army has played.
WALTER RODGERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Carol.
The Iraqi Army so far has been reasonably successful at slowing the advance of the U.S. Army's 7th Cavalry northward toward Baghdad. They did use human shields yesterday, according to Army sources. They had to, the Army had to cancel an air strike. Additionally, we saw more evidence of the Iraqi forces taking positions today in civilian areas in actually a civilian agricultural area.
The problem is, of course, that the Calvary's role is to probe northward, to try to find the hostile forces, and when it does, it's discovering time and time again that the Iraqis are embedded civilians, Iraqi civilians, in amongst the troops, that is, the battle lines. And, of course, the U.S. Army is under strict instructions to minimize and do as little to incur civilian casualties as possible.
So what the Calvary is trying to do is probe northward, find a way around this major population center, which lies in its path, and then push on through in the race towards Baghdad.
We were out on a scouting patrol with the Army this morning, again, 7th Cavalry. We were just a few feet away from a tank when an enormous rocket propelled grenade came crashing through. It missed the tank and missed us. There was another one. We dived for our vehicle and retreated very quickly because we didn't have armor around us. The Army stayed there and fired back in the direction in which the Iraqis were firing the rocket propelled grenades and they cut down four of the Iraqis who were hiding in that civilian population.
Here again, the Iraqis, the Iraqi soldiers were walking up through a civilian, a nice verdant pastoral farmland and suddenly they started firing on the U.S. soldiers. I don't think that's going to deter the Army much longer, but it has been frustrating -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Walter, you told us a chilling story about an hour ago about how some Iraqi citizens were waving to American troops and then all of a sudden they came under fire.
RODGERS: That's true. You know, I was right beside the tanks in the area where all of this shooting took place and what happens is you're standing there and the American soldiers will wave to the Iraqi farmers or the Iraqi civilians. There was an interesting incident, a young Iraqi man came up to me and wanted to chat me up and so I spoke to him a few phrases of Arabic that I know. And he said, "Don't worry, I speak English." And I said well, that's interesting. It was broken English.
I chatted with him a few seconds. He looked very friendly. He said, "Saddam is terrible, Saddam must go." He bad-mouthed Saddam Hussein terribly and then suddenly he decided he was going to walk over to a Bradley fighting vehicle about 30 feet away. Well, of course, that could have gotten him killed.
The interesting thing is here you never know, in this kind of situation, where you have soldiers intermixed with the civilian population who's friendly and who's not. And that fellow who was very friendly to me and wanted to go over to the Bradley fighting vehicle, I restrained him because I knew the soldiers were under orders to shoot him so I tried to prevent the guy from getting too close. That was a real nasty situation. But we still don't know if perhaps he was one of the Iraqi soldiers in civilian uniform. We just don't know. And it is a dodgy proposition when the Iraqis are using civilians as shields -- Carol.
COSTELLO: It must be so difficult to get a way around that. We have heard reports that the American military is going to try to avoid towns and cities altogether and try to actually cut a path around them to go into Baghdad.
RODGERS: That's true, Carol. But sometimes it's not possible. In the Mesopotamian Delta, for example, there are many canals which have to be bridged and the bridges are around cities so you would have to go through a city. And there are other topographical obstacles which prevent you from always flanking a town.
Sometimes you simply have to go through a town or on the outskirts of a town and the Iraqis are using those as choke points to try to slow the advance of the 7th Cavalry and the rest of the Third Infantry Division.
It has been successful. This army hasn't moved in 24 hours, although it's anticipated they'll try to move again -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Walter Rodgers reporting live from Southern Iraq.
Many thanks to you.
COOPER: Well, Carol, we, earlier this morning had been watching some images that we got off Iraqi television that came in really in the last hour or so. The image showed an Apache helicopter, it appears to be a U.S. Apache helicopter, but that's not clear at this point. It has the markings, I believe, of the 5th Calvary, and in the video, which we'll show shortly -- there it is -- it seems to have landed in a grassy area. It didn't look like necessarily a hard landing. It doesn't look like there's too much damage to the Apache helicopter itself. We're trying to get as much information on this as we can so we're going to check in right now at the Pentagon and our own Chris Plante -- Chris, what can you tell us?
CHRIS PLANTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Anderson.
Still not a lot in the way of detail coming from the Pentagon here. But what we can tell from the videotape and what we do know is that it is a U.S. Army Apache helicopter Longbow helicopter. It does have the markings of a Calvary unit on the front of the aircraft. From what we can see, it doesn't appear that the helicopter suffered from any ground fire or from any surface to air missile which would create obvious damage, or a rocket propelled grenade. We see no scarring or any bullet holes of any kind, in fact, on the helicopter from what we've seen, although we have not seen the right side of the helicopter.
One would have to assume, I suppose, that if there was visible damage to the helicopter that Iraqi TV would like to show that since they are claiming that they shot down this helicopter. In fact, they are claiming that they have shot down two helicopters in the recent hours.
The U.S. is denying that there were two helicopters shot down. They're denying that there are two helicopters down at all or two missing, acknowledging now that this, after a fashion, at least, that this one is down.
What we can tell from this, from the tape that we have seen from Iraqi TV, that has been airing on Iraqi TV is that the helicopter is down approximately 50 miles south of Baghdad. No apparent damage and no evidence that the Iraqis have taken custody of the two crewmen in this situation. We can see their helmets laid on the ground there, but no evidence otherwise that they've been taken captive.
Again, as you observed there is, it doesn't appear that the helicopter went down in a very hard fashion, although if you're sitting in the helicopter even a slightly hard landing is very uncomfortable and can cause problems.
The Longbow is the most advanced of the U.S. military attack helicopters. It, you see the object on top of the rotors is an advanced radar system. It has a computer, computerized battle management system inside the cockpit of the helicopter that allows the pilots to see a digital battlefield that identifies friendly aircraft from enemy aircraft, friendly vehicles on the ground from enemy vehicles. It cuts down substantially on the threat of friendly fire or fratricide incidents. It is significantly more advanced, actually, than the Marine Corps equivalent, which is the Super Cobra.
It's not clear where the two crewmen are. Again, if the Iraqis had them in custody, presumably they would be making a show of that. So I think at this point, knowing that this was hours ago at this point, just building in the drive time from the site to Iraqi TV and the fact that it aired there some time ago, it's quite possible that the tomorrow crewmen were picked up by combat search and rescue units that fly special operations helicopters alongside of ongoing operations in the event that aircraft do go down.
These search and rescue teams are very, very clever, very sneaky, also have very advanced helicopters and they're very good at what they do. Typically in situations like this, if crew members are rescued, they don't make any announcements until everybody is back at home safe and sound having a cup of coffee -- Anderson.
COOPER: And we certainly hope that is the case now.
Chris Plante at the Pentagon, thanks very much.
We're also joined by our military analyst, Gen. David Grange, and we are pleased he joins us this morning.
As you look at those pictures from Iraqi TV of that Apache helicopter, what do you see? I mean you're familiar with, you know, you have a trained eye. What do you see?
BRIG. GEN. DAVID GRANGE, U.S. ARMY (RET.): Well, the Apache helicopter is very survivable, the older modem the new model, the Longbow, which you're talking about right here. It must have had an emergency landing. There is very little damage that's apparent from the video and -- but, you know, it could be a transmission seize up, something with the engine and that. And I can assure you they wouldn't have landed unless it was an emergency and required.
COSTELLO: And it's still armed, too. I mean there are...
GRANGE: There are some armaments still on it, yes. Some armaments still on it. So it's not sure, you know, it's hard to tell how much has been expended on targets or whatever. I'm very surprised that it's still there, but keep in mind this is an old video and I would not be surprised if it was now a pile of dust.
COSTELLO: Why are you surprised that it's still there?
GRANGE: I mean it, I would think that the military would destroy it at the earliest possible moment.
COSTELLO: The U.S. military?
GRANGE: Yes. COSTELLO: Understand.
About the pilots, I don't even know if you can answer this, but, you know, many Americans worry about them. How likely is it that they could have escaped from this?
GRANGE: Well, there's a terrific chance of evading capture. They may have been picked up immediately or at a later date. And so a lot of planning goes into that and a lot of resources are applied to support rescue, a lot of resources.
And as I stated before, most of them are very classified, but very efficient. And I would be very, I would think positively that they would have been picked up.
COSTELLO: Well, we heard the Iraqi information minister talk not long ago that, he said two Apache helicopters were downed and they had the pilots in captivity and maybe at some point, maybe we would show you their pictures.
GRANGE: It could be. It's always that possibility. These attack helicopters go deep. They destroy a lot. They're very efficient. And a lot of other helicopters were hit in this attack and they all made it back, from what we hear.
COOPER: And from what we hear -- and we don't know that the image that we are seeing is a helicopter from the attack that we heard about earlier from Karl Penhaul -- it would seem to be in the same general vicinity, but we simply don't know that for sure. But let's talk a little bit about that attack, as much as we know about it. What does it tell you about the difficulties that the U.S. is facing in terms of the tactics that they are going to have to go up against?
I'm we're hearing that, you know, this is a civilian area and the Iraqis seem to be using that fact to their advantage.
GRANGE: Actually, the tactics are no surprise. You know, this report stunned and shocked from the intensive fire, anti-aircraft fire from the Iraqis back on these Apache helicopters. These, I can assure you that the units involved in this operation have war game practice against these specific units. This is the Medina Republican Guard unit. Elements of that probably were the ones that had the supporting fire and other units that support the Medina Republican Guard division, and the coalition forces know those tactics quite well.
It's just that it's, they have a lot of tough weapons.
COSTELLO: Going back to the pictures, many probably would call this appalling. You can see, I don't know if they're Iraqi military people, Iraqi citizens, but they're actually dancing in jubilation around this helicopter. And what a contrast between that and how the U.S. military is reacting to the taking of POWs and the shooting down of Iraqi targets.
GRANGE: Well, yes, that's exactly right, and there's very few coalition forces in that predicament. So when it happens, I guess there's a lot of dancing and exuberance from the results of getting a U.S. target.
COOPER: It's also obvious just judging from the video, it's also being sort of motivated by the Iraqi "reporter" who is on the scene. You know, he's clearly sort of whipping the locals to sort of dance in front of the cameras. Obviously this, you know, has a lot of propaganda uses, no doubt, for the Iraqi government.
GRANGE: Oh, yes. Very similar to the political officers that used to, who are -- in the communist military you always have a political officer and they always nudge those to be more happy and joyous and just like what we see here. Exactly.
COSTELLO: Well, it's such a frightening contrast to see that and then to hear the Iraqi information minister talk about the POWs and say that they're adhering to Geneva Convention standards as it applies to their treatment.
What does that tell you?
GRANGE: Well, it's a bit twisted, obviously, and they're taking advantage of that. They're grasping for anything they can use to encourage continual fighting with their forces. There's a -- it's hard to stay motivated with that kind of power coming down on you day and night from the coalition forces. So they're scrapping for things.
COOPER: Do you think their tactics are, the Iraqi tactics are working? Do you think they will work?
GRANGE: Well, they'll work to an extent. But there's so many ways to go about countering those tactics that the units will do well. There's no, the coalition units will do well against them. There's...
COSTELLO: It'll just take more time perhaps.
GRANGE: It'll take more time. I mean this, some of these units, it was expected there'd be very tough resistance. They have some very good equipment, still. I would think after that particular Apache helicopter raid, a lot of that stuff is now destroyed.
COOPER: Well, it's also interesting because we heard from Iraqi information minister yesterday, who said that the reports that the U.S. coalition and that the coalition forces were so deep inside Iraq were simply not true. We suddenly see a helicopter that's suddenly shown up 60 miles south of Baghdad. It would seem to indicate, you know, his information, to say the least, was inaccurate, if that.
GRANGE: Sure, and a lot of times in reporting, when a unit name is given, let's say the Third Infantry Division has gone this far, well, that may be the main body. You have deep attacks, they call them, going on constantly all over the country, just like the air, fighter jets and bombers, they're all over the country. So you can expect a lot of the calvary units, a lot of the Apaches, those things are doing things quite far forward from the main bodies and destroying things, prepping the battlefield for the advancing forces.
COSTELLO: I want to talk more about the POWs because many people were frightened by those images on Iraqi television of the Iraqis questioning and showing the POWs on television. And I know you've had much experience with POWs.
Your impression of how they might be being treated?
GRANGE: Well...
COOPER: Wait, I'm sorry. Before we answer that, I'm just being told in my ear we want to go to a picture that we've just received from Al Jazeera TV. I'm told it shows oil trenches on fire near Basra. That's the, really, the only information I have. This is something we have seen before. There have been reports of this outside Baghdad. I'm told this is, these images are from Al Jazeera and I'm told they show Basra. It's hard to sort of make out but it is...
COSTELLO: There are oil fields down there.
COOPER: Yes, but I'm told that these are, I'm told, this is a live picture. I'm told these are oil trenches, which we would assume would be some sort of defensive position, a trench filled with oil.
General Grange, any comment?
GRANGE: Yes, what they're trying to do is any measures they can to obscure the ability of us to engage U.S. and British forces to engage Iraqi positions. It'll have some effect, but not a lot.
COOPER: All right.
GRANGE: But that's what they're trying.
COSTELLO: General Grange, we're going to wrap things up.
But you're going to stick around, we're going to stick around.
We've hit the half hour. We're going to take a short break.
When we come back, we'll talk to Dr. Sanjay Gupta, who's also in the field of battle.
We'll be right back.
COMMERCIAL
COOPER: ... happening at this hour in Operation Iraqi Freedom and there has been a lot going on all morning long.
Iraqi TV today showed video -- this is the video right here -- what appeared to be a downed U.S. Apache helicopter intact and upright. The Apache helicopter reportedly had been downed about 50 miles south of Baghdad. You're seeing two helmets there on the screen. Iraqi TV did not report on the fate of the pilots, despite seeing those pictures of the helmets.
But Iraq's information minister hints that the two U.S. helicopter pilots may be prisoners of war. That is a hint. When that Apache helicopter was shown on Iraqi TV two helmets were at the scene. We've just saw those. The Iraqi official implied the pilots' pictures might be made public. We'll see.
Iraqi TV also aired a speech from Saddam -- President Saddam Hussein. He praised his troops for "causing the enemy to suffer." U.S. authorities are analyzing the tape to verify it was given by Saddam Hussein and not a double.
Update now from the tip of the spear, so to speak.
CNN's Walter Rodgers embedded with the 3rd Squadron of the 7th Cavalry says the Army unit is encountering hostile fire as it makes its way northward toward Baghdad. Rogers says the unit came under fire from rocket grenades not long ago and a tank returned fire.
Those are actually old pictures from about 24 hours ago.
The U.S. Marines intense firefighting in Southern Iraq stretches into a second day. The Marines are battling to establish control of a north-south route near Nasiriya, Nasiriya. I don't know why I can't say that.
Cobra attack helicopters with heavy machine guns and rocket launchers have been called in. Yesterday 10 Marines were killed, 12 wounded and 16 others still missing.
The Syrian government says a Syrian passenger bus inside Iraq was struck by a U.S. missile, killing five people. Now, a spokesman with U.S. Central Command says, "We have heard the report," but he could not confirm its voracity.
COSTELLO: And still ahead in CNN's coverage of the war in Iraq, with aircraft flying low over Baghdad, the U.S. led bombardment of the Iraqi capital is the heaviest in a few days. In the south, coalition forces advanced their tenuous hold near the vital port city of Basra. And in Hollywood, back here in the States...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL MOORE: This is a fictitious president. We, we live in a time where we have a man sending us to war...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: Michael Moore, documentary maker, booed soundly. This is the Academy Awards show as it unfolded as scheduled. And as you saw, not without some war time commentary, not met with happiness.
COMMERCIAL
COSTELLO: Good morning to you.
It's 5:34 Eastern time.
I'm Carol Costello. COOPER: And I'm Anderson Cooper.
We are going to meet up right now with Bill Hemmer, who is live in Kuwait City with an update -- Bill.
HEMMER: Hey, Anderson, just as you're tossing to me, I hear the air raid sirens yet again. Last time we talked, 20 minutes ago, we did hear the sirens here. The alarm goes off in the hotel. It was only about two minutes later, right when I tossed it back to you in Atlanta, that we were given the all clear.
No indication on the previous one as to what was happening. Sometimes, yesterday, in fact, we did have a false alarm. There was no missile fired into Kuwaiti air space. But late last night, about 1:30 in the morning, there was one fired. It fell into the desert, northern stretches of Kuwait. This is the second alarm we've heard now, the second air raid siren now in the past 25 minutes or so.
And, again, oftentimes we get the all clear shortly after -- OK, Steve, thanks for checking up on us.
We have used our own discretion here, Anderson and Carol, as to whether or not we stay on the air, whether or not we go downstairs in the parking garage with the rest of our colleagues. We have a system in place here. There's a group of us and we confer, as you can anticipate right now, 24-7 right now as to whether or not we should take cover and get off the air or continue with our reports.
Part of the reason why we have a fairly high rate of confidence to stay on the air and report to you is because to this date all the missiles directed at Kuwait have been directed out in the desert, the northern part of the country, at U.S. military posts. And a good number of them already, we know, five have been knocked out of the sky by either U.S. or Kuwait Patriot missile batteries, knocking them from the sky and falling into the desert.
Also to this point, no reports of injuries, no reports of casualties and no reports of damage, as well.
So as we await word on what's happening in downtown Kuwait, let's take you to Baghdad. Saddam Hussein back on television today. It is described as his first nationally televised address to the Iraqi people since Thursday of last week, which is four days ago.
He was stronger, appearing somewhat robust. Some people say he was relaxed, dressed in full military uniform and saying that victory will be ours soon.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HUSSEIN: The victory is soon. These decisive days all you Iraqis are in, you are in with what god has ordered you to cut their throats and those who are the believers will be victorious.
(END VIDEO CLIP) HEMMER: That address from Saddam Hussein issued about 90 minutes ago. It lasted about 10 minutes in length. If you contrast the image we saw last Thursday in a split screen image here showing Saddam Hussein today, much stronger, and, again more relaxed, if, indeed, that was taped today. And the image we saw last Thursday night with those big wire frame glasses, many people watching that have been led to believe that perhaps this was a double of Saddam Hussein. Widespread speculation as to whether or not he was killed or injured in the first attacks of last Thursday -- excuse me, last Wednesday. No way, again, for us to verify any of this information, only we know the words and the message delivered earlier today.
He also referenced a few recent attacks, Umm Qasr, the attacks that took place last Friday and Saturday of this past weekend. And also urging his commanders in Basra to continue what he called the good fight.
No alarms right now. No sirens either. Whether or not we get the all clear in a moment, we'll let you know, Anderson and Carol.
CENTCOM, 9:00 a.m., a brief in Qatar. We'll have it for you live when that happens.
Back to you now at the CNN Center.
COSTELLO: All right, Bill. One more word about Saddam Hussein and his videotaped or live message, we don't know which. The Pentagon is examining that to see if that was, indeed, Saddam Hussein.
Of course, we're following a number of developments in the war with Iraq. Here's an update on how the past few hours has unfolded from CNN's Miles O'Brien.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): 7:08 a.m. Eastern, CNN's Barbara Starr says the Pentagon confirms a British Tornado aircraft was accidentally shot down Saturday by a U.S. Patriot missile as it returned from a mission over Iraq. 8:09 Eastern, CNN's Walt Rodgers, embedded with the 3rd Squadron, 7th Cavalry, reports soldiers are telling him Iraqis are using women and children as human shields around military installations. An hour later, he reports his unit has taken heavy fire that injured one soldier as the squadron continues moving toward Baghdad.
10:06 Eastern, CNN's Allessio Vinci, with a Marine unit in Southern Iraq, reports heavy fighting and some casualties near Nasiriya. 11:03 a.m., Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr reports the military has begun contacting families of up to 10 members of an Army maintenance unit, some of whom were captured, some of whom killed near Nasiriya. 11:33 a.m., Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld
CNN's Wolf Blitzer, following the airing of interviews of American POWs on Iraqi TV, that Iraq is violating the Geneva conventions with that video.
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