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CNN Live Today
Baghdad Airport Now a Closed Military Area
Aired April 04, 2003 - 10:05 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: We have breaking news from Martin Savidge embedded with the 1st Battalion of the 7th Marines. He joins us now by videophone.
Martin, what's going on?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Paula, we are now about 40 miles, I would say, from the outskirts of Baghdad, heading up in a northwesterly direction. That means, obviously, we're from the southeast right now. We just went by what looked like a large burning oil tank, and we had been told that as the convoy was moving forward here, that we were heading into what they say could have been hotspots. Now we don't know whether that fire was generated as a result of combat in the area, or whether it was set intentionally by someone else with a bad intent. It's unknown. But it was blazing away. We've also seen indications of Iraqi artillery, and also that armored personnel carrier we passed by. We also passed by a T-72 tank. These were destroyed and literally just shattered hulks at the side of the road.
There are indications along this roadway here, there had been fighting at some time. And of course, this is the route that went from Al Kut into Baghdad, which is where there had been suspected forces of the Republican guard. There has not been a lot of opposition from any of the Republican Guard units, so what we have been seeing would reflect only slight opposition.
And then for the most part, those units melted away. Weaponry at the side of the road. And, of course, you see other U.S. military Marine units here as well -- Paula.
ZAHN: So, Martin, when you characterize it as these Republican guard units simply melting away, is the concern that perhaps they've all been asked to come back into Baghdad?
SAVIDGE: Reporter: I don't know for certain. I mean, there are a number of speculations that are out there by Marine commanders. Some say yes, maybe they've fallen back into Baghdad, maybe they've been called in to Baghdad. Or maybe it's something where they just decided that it wasn't worth the fight anymore. You find uniforms and weaponry at the side of the road, sort of an indication, as we've seen all along as we've moved north, that the uniforms are simply dumped, the men get into civilian clothing and figure the best bet is to go home, and maybe leave the war behind them. Those are speculative points, and no proof on either of them.
ZAHN: Martin, can you give us a sense of how the Marines you are traveling with reacted to the news that the Baghdad International Airport, which it's now being called, as in the hands of U.S. forces in control, not in complete control, but in I guess they're saying 75 percent control today?
SAVIDGE: Well, again, the news travels slow out here, especially to Marine units. Some of them might have been aware by listening to various radio shortwaves. They were happy about it, those that I spoke to. They were very pleased.
We were just passing by what appeared to be a number of detainees. We're not allowed to show those to you. But it's clear we're getting into an active area here.
Anyway, the Marines were clearly pleased about that, because they see that as a major objective, as anyone would on a city of size of Baghdad.
And for the Marines right now at this stage, they want to get the war done and they want to get home, and they believe the closer they get to Baghdad and the more objectives like that, which are reached, means they're going to reach their final goal soon.
ZAHN: Martin, you said you think you're coming into a more active area. Do you need to go, or can you handle one more question here?
SAVIDGE: We can handle it fine.
ZAHN: OK, I'll ask it quickly then. There has been so much talk as U.S. forces and British forces get closer to Baghdad about the increased risk, perhaps of weapons of mass destruction being used. I don't want to you betray any information you're not supposed to share, but can you in a general sense tell us what the level of concern is about that possibility?
SAVIDGE: Well, the levels that I've understood at least from talking to commanders here in this unit, the 1st Battalion, 7th Marines, is not specific intelligence. But that general feeling that the Pentagon has, that the closer you got to Baghdad, that there was this sort of invisible red line drawn around the city, and that as a last line of defense, the regime might resort to chemical weapons.
Now that being said, there are probably other reasons why they may not want to. One, feeling that they -- Defense of Baghdad, street to street fighting, could be horrendous enough they wouldn't have to result to them.
ZAHN: And we have just lost that live feed from Martin Savidge. who describes himself as being somewhere in central Iraq southeast of Baghdad.
You have him back? OK, Martin, we've got you back. You can just pick up with what you were talking about before we lost the signal.
SAVIDGE: Well, I was just saying that the concern was in general, based upon the closer you got to Baghdad, it was always felt by military commanders, the more likely in desperation chemical weaponry could be used. I don't think it's based upon specific intelligence that I've been told regarding why we would have a higher level of chemical alert status.
ZAHN: Martin, as you roll by, we're seeing shots of somebody along the roadside. Can you describe to us who you think those people are? We see sometimes just one or two standing by the roadside. Now it seems to be getting denser.
SAVIDGE: Martin, we're coming up into obviously some sort of town or populated area. These are, I guess, the local folks. They come out for any number of reasons. Some of them just seem to come out to stand, wave, some of them shout what limited English they know. A lot of people give the thumbs up, some people are carrying white flags to make sure there is no confusion as to what their intent is. Some of the children on the side of the road you may see holding plastic yellow bags. That is the humanitarian aid that is being given out. All of the Marines and all of the vehicles have a supply of that which when given a chance, they do pass out. The convoy won't stop to do that, but they will hand out sometimes just MREs as well, the food. They know the people here are in need. It's also a sign of friendship, a gesture of the United States trying to put out the hand of friendship, rather than just the aiming side of a gun.
You hear peep shouting now "I love you. I love you," people saying that they are happy. So this is one of the larger crowds we've seen along the side of the road. This is both a good thing and a bad thing. For the Marines, obviously they'd like to hear them, they are welcome. It's also a nervous thing, too, knowing there are many, many military units that have dissolved away and believed sort of intriculated into the civilian population, maybe hiding there, so you look at these as both people you're hoping to liberate, and also have to loose look at them as potential targets if they happen to open fire in any way. hiding amongst the civilians -- Paula.
ZAHN: A very important point to remember. Martin Savidge, thanks so much. We'd love to get back to you a little bit later on this morning.
We'll catch back up with Ken Pollack, our CNN analyst, who's standing by in Washington, to react to more of what the Iraqi information minister had to say just moments ago.
But first, let's get back to Bill in Kuwait City.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Paula, long before the folks got up there back in the U.S., in the middle of the night U.S. time, we were watching yet another incredible report from Walt Rodgers, as he got closer and closer to that airport. Walt is with us live tonight. The sun is now falling there. He is near the airport. I don't know exactly where, with the 7th Cavalry, the lead division of the 3rd ID.
Walt, good evening.
WALT RODGERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Bill. You're looking at pictures of a 7th Cavalry armored personnel carrier about a quarter of a mile from us down the road, not too far from Baghdad International Airport. They've been taking incoming fire, and have been firing back at the Iraqis down in a date palm grove. The Iraqis as nightfall descends upon us, tend to be more active militarily.
And one point we need to make, one thing that should be taken into consideration and considered more than a little credible from the Iraqi information minister, he did say -- and this is very important -- that the Americans may control the airport, and we're a few miles from the airport. But they are also correctly telling you that the area around the airport is hostile territory for the United States Army. There are firefights going on in front of the camera now, a quarter of a mile away. Iraqis trying to move in closer to the American 7th Cavalry. They're trying to get shots at them, again, using the cover of darkness.
This is the way it's been for every 24-hours for the 7th Cavalry, and there have been some very, very serious firefights. There are other aspects of the Iraqi information minister's statements which were not credible, or at least not compatible with what we've seen on the ground. He said units of the American military were trying to push toward the airport and link up with a 3th Infantry Division and the Iraqis were blocking them. That was not at all the case. The 7th Cavalry is in a holding position, protecting the flank of the airport.
But again, between the 7th Cavalry where we are and the Baghdad International Airport, there are pockets of Iraqi resistance. You can see big clouds of black smoke from the firefight that just took place a few minutes ago. One other point I'd like to bring up, in this situation like this where you have the Iraqi information minister delivering this fiery and bellicose rhetoric, often in the Arabic language, there is a gap between the rhetoric, which is often bellicose, and the reality.
So the Iraqis may be fairly impotent militarily, but they use this fiery rhetoric to compensate. Recall one example in 1967 during the Six-Day War, when the Israelis destroyed the entire Egyptian air force virtually on the ground. At that very same time, the Egyptian president of those days, Gammer (ph) Abdul Nasser, was claiming a great Egyptian victory over the Israelis. I think you have to right that gap between Arab rhetoric and Arab reality into what you're hearing from Baghdad at this point -- Bill.
HEMMER: Walt, listen, hang with me a second. Earlier today you were describing pickup trucks, and dump trucks and suicide buses with rifles blazing coming automatic these Bradley Fighting Vehicles. Has that continued, or did that only happen earlier today?
RODGERS: That has pretty much abated, Bill. We did see exactly what you said. Sometimes the Iraqis would come up in company strength with tanks and armored personnel carriers. They'd try to overrun the 7th Cavalry positions, which of course, Iraqi information minister said were trying to reach the airport. That is not in the Army battle plan. Having said that, there were earlier Iraqi soldiers loaded aboard dump trucks with nothing more sizable than 7.62 millimeter rifle. And they would charge the 7th Cavalry positions in these kamikaze attacks. One bus was hit. It was burned out. Again, it was a suicide bus, according to Army officers, because they say that when it caught fire, it exploded in a much larger explosion than just a fuel explosion. They say it was packed with explosives.
By the Army's count, there are over 400 dead Iraqis killed by just the 7th Cavalry today. That again is a bit inconsistent with what you were hearing from the Iraqi information minister -- Bill.
HEMMER: You mentioned 400 dead Iraqis as a result. I think the words you made earlier today was that some of these Iraqis have made a very bad choice. There was one Iraqi soldier that you believed was dead and your crew actually stopped to treat that man. I don't mow what came of it. Did he survive, and perhaps you could tell us in short form what happened with that situation?
RODGERS: It was a remarkable story. We were broadcasting live when our satellite engineer walked up the road with our security guard, and they walked past some -- what we thought were Iraqi corpses. We'd been back and forth half-a-dozen times. And then one of the corpses suddenly sat up. He's been in shock for five hours. He'd been hit rather badly, but he was still alive.
So we began treating this Iraqi soldier by our security officer, the AKE security officer, gave him shots of morphine, also gave him an IV. It turns out the Iraqi soldier was wounded rather badly in the gluteus maximus and shrapnel in his legs. But he was evacuated. By the way, he identified himself as a lieutenant in the Special Republican Guard. But he was later evacuated by the Army medics. He's said to be in stable condition. And we saw nothing to indicate life-threatening wounds on this Iraqi soldier.
Indeed, he may have been part of the elite units, but he was darn glad to see the CNN crew at that particular time giving him treatment, and he waved at them and was, again, more than grateful to be alive, because everyone else in his armored personnel carrier was nothing more than burning flesh at that point -- Bill.
HEMMER: Wow. That is an absolutely amazing story. We watched that live by way of videophone, when you were feeding the pictures in.
On a different story, Walt, I don't know if you're at the airport yet, I don't know if you can tell us if you're at that location or not, if you're allowed by the monitors you have there with the U.S. military, but have you heard what the status right now is of security is at that airport?
RODGERS: I haven't heard that. But what we've been given to believe is that the 3rd Infantry Division has seized the airport and seized the perimeter. But it's very important to stress, the area outside the perimeter of the airport is still in the hands of hostile Iraqis. These are the same forces who have been shuttling back and forth.
We understand that at one point, there was a unit of at least 20 Iraqi tanks beyond the airport perimeter, that is between the airport perimeter and the 7th Cavalry. We got that from Army sources. We can't confirm it independently on our own, but that's one reason you're not seeing flights going in and out of that airport, because the Iraqis have 20-millimeter antiaircraft guns close to the airport.
And any flights going in and out of that airport now would become certain targets of that hostile fire, perhaps even surface-to-air missiles. So the Iraqi information minister was correct, the United States holds the Baghdad International Airport. But much beyond that, that is not the case, there is still substantial Iraqi resistance, but they are armed and they have been fighting for sometime -- Bill.
HEMMER: Walter, listen, that conflicts a little with what CENTCOM was saying about four hours ago. They gave us the indication live here on CNN that they may start flying into that airport within 12 to 36 hours. But we'll just have to wait and see if that indeed unfolds that way.
Back to the information minister, though, a short time ago, with that address, talking about these nonconventional means that they may use right now in their efforts to defend Baghdad. We don't know what that is, we can't define it right now, but maybe you can tell us what the level of readiness is, what the level of security is right now in the event of some sort of chemical or biological attack with the unit you're with.
RODGERS: Well, the current threat is rather low. If you listen closely to the Iraqi information minister, he did say that the Iraqis would not be using weapons of mass destruction.
Now if he is to be believed there, he was talking about other unconventional weapons. There was the suggestion of martyrdom, the implication there that perhaps civilians would be marched in front of the Iraqi army in the direction of the airport.
But again, you can talk about unconventional warfare, and we've been seeing a lot of that over the past week and a half. Unconventional warfare is essentially guerrilla warfare, the Iraqis popping up in ambushes, shooting at U.S. forces ineffectually, but nonetheless, harassing U.S. forces.
So I think we shouldn't get too far ahead of the rhetoric, and remember that the rhetoric is often a substitute for reality in this part of the world, and the reality is that the Iraqis are losing ground constantly. They do not have anything like the military might on the ground that the United States Army does at this point. And perhaps that's one of the reasons we're hearing this bellicose rhetoric, which at times is somewhat less than credible given what we've seen on the ground -- Bill.
HEMMER: All right, now point well taken, Walt. Two more questions here, if I could, while we still have you. Has the word spread with your unit as to this car explosion yesterday in western Iraq, where a pregnant woman got out of a car screaming for help, and the explosion went out killing three coalition soldiers, killed the pregnant woman and killed the driver as well? And knowing that, Walt, if you can take it just a step further for us, is there talk about different rules of engagement when it comes, again, to contact with the Iraqi civilian population?
RODGERS: I think the rules of the engagement are pretty much the same across the theater. I don't believe most of the troops in the Apache company have been alerted to the incident which you just described, simply because they have been engaged in combat for nearly 24 hours. There would be periodic lulls, but all last night -- you can hear in the distance, 120-millimeter mortars going out in the direction of some Iraqi positions. There was a firefight down the road a quarter of a mile away. The Iraqis were trying to creep up on the 7th Cavalry. You can see the smoke rising in the air down there. We believe an Iraqi vehicle was hit. The 7th Cavalry has been so busy fighting, and that includes tanks and armored vehicles coming in. They really haven't had time to listen to the radio. They are keenly aware of these suicide attacks.
As I say, there was what they called a suicide attack by an Iraqi bus last night. They shot it up before it ever got close, and to the best of our knowledge, the only person who would have been killed would have been the driver. But when the bus was shot up, there was a horrendous explosion, according to one army officer who witnessed it, and they are persuaded that was indeed a suicide vehicle coming their way.
So everybody here is on a hair trigger for that sort of event. But we're not seeing many civilians in vehicles today -- Bill.
HEMMER: Walt, thank you.
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Aired April 4, 2003 - 10:05 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: We have breaking news from Martin Savidge embedded with the 1st Battalion of the 7th Marines. He joins us now by videophone.
Martin, what's going on?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Paula, we are now about 40 miles, I would say, from the outskirts of Baghdad, heading up in a northwesterly direction. That means, obviously, we're from the southeast right now. We just went by what looked like a large burning oil tank, and we had been told that as the convoy was moving forward here, that we were heading into what they say could have been hotspots. Now we don't know whether that fire was generated as a result of combat in the area, or whether it was set intentionally by someone else with a bad intent. It's unknown. But it was blazing away. We've also seen indications of Iraqi artillery, and also that armored personnel carrier we passed by. We also passed by a T-72 tank. These were destroyed and literally just shattered hulks at the side of the road.
There are indications along this roadway here, there had been fighting at some time. And of course, this is the route that went from Al Kut into Baghdad, which is where there had been suspected forces of the Republican guard. There has not been a lot of opposition from any of the Republican Guard units, so what we have been seeing would reflect only slight opposition.
And then for the most part, those units melted away. Weaponry at the side of the road. And, of course, you see other U.S. military Marine units here as well -- Paula.
ZAHN: So, Martin, when you characterize it as these Republican guard units simply melting away, is the concern that perhaps they've all been asked to come back into Baghdad?
SAVIDGE: Reporter: I don't know for certain. I mean, there are a number of speculations that are out there by Marine commanders. Some say yes, maybe they've fallen back into Baghdad, maybe they've been called in to Baghdad. Or maybe it's something where they just decided that it wasn't worth the fight anymore. You find uniforms and weaponry at the side of the road, sort of an indication, as we've seen all along as we've moved north, that the uniforms are simply dumped, the men get into civilian clothing and figure the best bet is to go home, and maybe leave the war behind them. Those are speculative points, and no proof on either of them.
ZAHN: Martin, can you give us a sense of how the Marines you are traveling with reacted to the news that the Baghdad International Airport, which it's now being called, as in the hands of U.S. forces in control, not in complete control, but in I guess they're saying 75 percent control today?
SAVIDGE: Well, again, the news travels slow out here, especially to Marine units. Some of them might have been aware by listening to various radio shortwaves. They were happy about it, those that I spoke to. They were very pleased.
We were just passing by what appeared to be a number of detainees. We're not allowed to show those to you. But it's clear we're getting into an active area here.
Anyway, the Marines were clearly pleased about that, because they see that as a major objective, as anyone would on a city of size of Baghdad.
And for the Marines right now at this stage, they want to get the war done and they want to get home, and they believe the closer they get to Baghdad and the more objectives like that, which are reached, means they're going to reach their final goal soon.
ZAHN: Martin, you said you think you're coming into a more active area. Do you need to go, or can you handle one more question here?
SAVIDGE: We can handle it fine.
ZAHN: OK, I'll ask it quickly then. There has been so much talk as U.S. forces and British forces get closer to Baghdad about the increased risk, perhaps of weapons of mass destruction being used. I don't want to you betray any information you're not supposed to share, but can you in a general sense tell us what the level of concern is about that possibility?
SAVIDGE: Well, the levels that I've understood at least from talking to commanders here in this unit, the 1st Battalion, 7th Marines, is not specific intelligence. But that general feeling that the Pentagon has, that the closer you got to Baghdad, that there was this sort of invisible red line drawn around the city, and that as a last line of defense, the regime might resort to chemical weapons.
Now that being said, there are probably other reasons why they may not want to. One, feeling that they -- Defense of Baghdad, street to street fighting, could be horrendous enough they wouldn't have to result to them.
ZAHN: And we have just lost that live feed from Martin Savidge. who describes himself as being somewhere in central Iraq southeast of Baghdad.
You have him back? OK, Martin, we've got you back. You can just pick up with what you were talking about before we lost the signal.
SAVIDGE: Well, I was just saying that the concern was in general, based upon the closer you got to Baghdad, it was always felt by military commanders, the more likely in desperation chemical weaponry could be used. I don't think it's based upon specific intelligence that I've been told regarding why we would have a higher level of chemical alert status.
ZAHN: Martin, as you roll by, we're seeing shots of somebody along the roadside. Can you describe to us who you think those people are? We see sometimes just one or two standing by the roadside. Now it seems to be getting denser.
SAVIDGE: Martin, we're coming up into obviously some sort of town or populated area. These are, I guess, the local folks. They come out for any number of reasons. Some of them just seem to come out to stand, wave, some of them shout what limited English they know. A lot of people give the thumbs up, some people are carrying white flags to make sure there is no confusion as to what their intent is. Some of the children on the side of the road you may see holding plastic yellow bags. That is the humanitarian aid that is being given out. All of the Marines and all of the vehicles have a supply of that which when given a chance, they do pass out. The convoy won't stop to do that, but they will hand out sometimes just MREs as well, the food. They know the people here are in need. It's also a sign of friendship, a gesture of the United States trying to put out the hand of friendship, rather than just the aiming side of a gun.
You hear peep shouting now "I love you. I love you," people saying that they are happy. So this is one of the larger crowds we've seen along the side of the road. This is both a good thing and a bad thing. For the Marines, obviously they'd like to hear them, they are welcome. It's also a nervous thing, too, knowing there are many, many military units that have dissolved away and believed sort of intriculated into the civilian population, maybe hiding there, so you look at these as both people you're hoping to liberate, and also have to loose look at them as potential targets if they happen to open fire in any way. hiding amongst the civilians -- Paula.
ZAHN: A very important point to remember. Martin Savidge, thanks so much. We'd love to get back to you a little bit later on this morning.
We'll catch back up with Ken Pollack, our CNN analyst, who's standing by in Washington, to react to more of what the Iraqi information minister had to say just moments ago.
But first, let's get back to Bill in Kuwait City.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Paula, long before the folks got up there back in the U.S., in the middle of the night U.S. time, we were watching yet another incredible report from Walt Rodgers, as he got closer and closer to that airport. Walt is with us live tonight. The sun is now falling there. He is near the airport. I don't know exactly where, with the 7th Cavalry, the lead division of the 3rd ID.
Walt, good evening.
WALT RODGERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Bill. You're looking at pictures of a 7th Cavalry armored personnel carrier about a quarter of a mile from us down the road, not too far from Baghdad International Airport. They've been taking incoming fire, and have been firing back at the Iraqis down in a date palm grove. The Iraqis as nightfall descends upon us, tend to be more active militarily.
And one point we need to make, one thing that should be taken into consideration and considered more than a little credible from the Iraqi information minister, he did say -- and this is very important -- that the Americans may control the airport, and we're a few miles from the airport. But they are also correctly telling you that the area around the airport is hostile territory for the United States Army. There are firefights going on in front of the camera now, a quarter of a mile away. Iraqis trying to move in closer to the American 7th Cavalry. They're trying to get shots at them, again, using the cover of darkness.
This is the way it's been for every 24-hours for the 7th Cavalry, and there have been some very, very serious firefights. There are other aspects of the Iraqi information minister's statements which were not credible, or at least not compatible with what we've seen on the ground. He said units of the American military were trying to push toward the airport and link up with a 3th Infantry Division and the Iraqis were blocking them. That was not at all the case. The 7th Cavalry is in a holding position, protecting the flank of the airport.
But again, between the 7th Cavalry where we are and the Baghdad International Airport, there are pockets of Iraqi resistance. You can see big clouds of black smoke from the firefight that just took place a few minutes ago. One other point I'd like to bring up, in this situation like this where you have the Iraqi information minister delivering this fiery and bellicose rhetoric, often in the Arabic language, there is a gap between the rhetoric, which is often bellicose, and the reality.
So the Iraqis may be fairly impotent militarily, but they use this fiery rhetoric to compensate. Recall one example in 1967 during the Six-Day War, when the Israelis destroyed the entire Egyptian air force virtually on the ground. At that very same time, the Egyptian president of those days, Gammer (ph) Abdul Nasser, was claiming a great Egyptian victory over the Israelis. I think you have to right that gap between Arab rhetoric and Arab reality into what you're hearing from Baghdad at this point -- Bill.
HEMMER: Walt, listen, hang with me a second. Earlier today you were describing pickup trucks, and dump trucks and suicide buses with rifles blazing coming automatic these Bradley Fighting Vehicles. Has that continued, or did that only happen earlier today?
RODGERS: That has pretty much abated, Bill. We did see exactly what you said. Sometimes the Iraqis would come up in company strength with tanks and armored personnel carriers. They'd try to overrun the 7th Cavalry positions, which of course, Iraqi information minister said were trying to reach the airport. That is not in the Army battle plan. Having said that, there were earlier Iraqi soldiers loaded aboard dump trucks with nothing more sizable than 7.62 millimeter rifle. And they would charge the 7th Cavalry positions in these kamikaze attacks. One bus was hit. It was burned out. Again, it was a suicide bus, according to Army officers, because they say that when it caught fire, it exploded in a much larger explosion than just a fuel explosion. They say it was packed with explosives.
By the Army's count, there are over 400 dead Iraqis killed by just the 7th Cavalry today. That again is a bit inconsistent with what you were hearing from the Iraqi information minister -- Bill.
HEMMER: You mentioned 400 dead Iraqis as a result. I think the words you made earlier today was that some of these Iraqis have made a very bad choice. There was one Iraqi soldier that you believed was dead and your crew actually stopped to treat that man. I don't mow what came of it. Did he survive, and perhaps you could tell us in short form what happened with that situation?
RODGERS: It was a remarkable story. We were broadcasting live when our satellite engineer walked up the road with our security guard, and they walked past some -- what we thought were Iraqi corpses. We'd been back and forth half-a-dozen times. And then one of the corpses suddenly sat up. He's been in shock for five hours. He'd been hit rather badly, but he was still alive.
So we began treating this Iraqi soldier by our security officer, the AKE security officer, gave him shots of morphine, also gave him an IV. It turns out the Iraqi soldier was wounded rather badly in the gluteus maximus and shrapnel in his legs. But he was evacuated. By the way, he identified himself as a lieutenant in the Special Republican Guard. But he was later evacuated by the Army medics. He's said to be in stable condition. And we saw nothing to indicate life-threatening wounds on this Iraqi soldier.
Indeed, he may have been part of the elite units, but he was darn glad to see the CNN crew at that particular time giving him treatment, and he waved at them and was, again, more than grateful to be alive, because everyone else in his armored personnel carrier was nothing more than burning flesh at that point -- Bill.
HEMMER: Wow. That is an absolutely amazing story. We watched that live by way of videophone, when you were feeding the pictures in.
On a different story, Walt, I don't know if you're at the airport yet, I don't know if you can tell us if you're at that location or not, if you're allowed by the monitors you have there with the U.S. military, but have you heard what the status right now is of security is at that airport?
RODGERS: I haven't heard that. But what we've been given to believe is that the 3rd Infantry Division has seized the airport and seized the perimeter. But it's very important to stress, the area outside the perimeter of the airport is still in the hands of hostile Iraqis. These are the same forces who have been shuttling back and forth.
We understand that at one point, there was a unit of at least 20 Iraqi tanks beyond the airport perimeter, that is between the airport perimeter and the 7th Cavalry. We got that from Army sources. We can't confirm it independently on our own, but that's one reason you're not seeing flights going in and out of that airport, because the Iraqis have 20-millimeter antiaircraft guns close to the airport.
And any flights going in and out of that airport now would become certain targets of that hostile fire, perhaps even surface-to-air missiles. So the Iraqi information minister was correct, the United States holds the Baghdad International Airport. But much beyond that, that is not the case, there is still substantial Iraqi resistance, but they are armed and they have been fighting for sometime -- Bill.
HEMMER: Walter, listen, that conflicts a little with what CENTCOM was saying about four hours ago. They gave us the indication live here on CNN that they may start flying into that airport within 12 to 36 hours. But we'll just have to wait and see if that indeed unfolds that way.
Back to the information minister, though, a short time ago, with that address, talking about these nonconventional means that they may use right now in their efforts to defend Baghdad. We don't know what that is, we can't define it right now, but maybe you can tell us what the level of readiness is, what the level of security is right now in the event of some sort of chemical or biological attack with the unit you're with.
RODGERS: Well, the current threat is rather low. If you listen closely to the Iraqi information minister, he did say that the Iraqis would not be using weapons of mass destruction.
Now if he is to be believed there, he was talking about other unconventional weapons. There was the suggestion of martyrdom, the implication there that perhaps civilians would be marched in front of the Iraqi army in the direction of the airport.
But again, you can talk about unconventional warfare, and we've been seeing a lot of that over the past week and a half. Unconventional warfare is essentially guerrilla warfare, the Iraqis popping up in ambushes, shooting at U.S. forces ineffectually, but nonetheless, harassing U.S. forces.
So I think we shouldn't get too far ahead of the rhetoric, and remember that the rhetoric is often a substitute for reality in this part of the world, and the reality is that the Iraqis are losing ground constantly. They do not have anything like the military might on the ground that the United States Army does at this point. And perhaps that's one of the reasons we're hearing this bellicose rhetoric, which at times is somewhat less than credible given what we've seen on the ground -- Bill.
HEMMER: All right, now point well taken, Walt. Two more questions here, if I could, while we still have you. Has the word spread with your unit as to this car explosion yesterday in western Iraq, where a pregnant woman got out of a car screaming for help, and the explosion went out killing three coalition soldiers, killed the pregnant woman and killed the driver as well? And knowing that, Walt, if you can take it just a step further for us, is there talk about different rules of engagement when it comes, again, to contact with the Iraqi civilian population?
RODGERS: I think the rules of the engagement are pretty much the same across the theater. I don't believe most of the troops in the Apache company have been alerted to the incident which you just described, simply because they have been engaged in combat for nearly 24 hours. There would be periodic lulls, but all last night -- you can hear in the distance, 120-millimeter mortars going out in the direction of some Iraqi positions. There was a firefight down the road a quarter of a mile away. The Iraqis were trying to creep up on the 7th Cavalry. You can see the smoke rising in the air down there. We believe an Iraqi vehicle was hit. The 7th Cavalry has been so busy fighting, and that includes tanks and armored vehicles coming in. They really haven't had time to listen to the radio. They are keenly aware of these suicide attacks.
As I say, there was what they called a suicide attack by an Iraqi bus last night. They shot it up before it ever got close, and to the best of our knowledge, the only person who would have been killed would have been the driver. But when the bus was shot up, there was a horrendous explosion, according to one army officer who witnessed it, and they are persuaded that was indeed a suicide vehicle coming their way.
So everybody here is on a hair trigger for that sort of event. But we're not seeing many civilians in vehicles today -- Bill.
HEMMER: Walt, thank you.
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