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CNN Live Saturday
Interview With Julia Sweig
Aired April 26, 2003 - 15:21 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: We want to talk more about what is going on in Cuba. We're joined by Julia Sweig. She is with the Council on Foreign Relations. She is joining us now from Washington. Julia, thanks for being with us. What is going on in Cuba right now? Why is Fidel Castro cracking down on these 75 dissidents, some of whom are just independent reporters who went to a journalism seminar given by U.S. officials?
JULIA SWEIG, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: Well, there's no justification for these crackdowns. They and the executions are copletely appalling. I think the crackdowns are largely designed to send a signal to the United States, to the opposition on the island, and also to those in Congress and in the state of Florida who might be looking at the presidential election season that we're entering into as a potential time to drum up a Cuba crisis.
Of course, a Cuba crisis has now been started, escalated by the Cuban government, and that, as Senator Harkin said, the real question is what is the proper response now from the United States and the rest of the international community.
COOPER: So wait, so Castro believes -- your opinion is Castro believes he can avoid a Cuba crisis by cracking down on dissent. But as you just said, it's caused a crisis of sorts.
SWEIG: Well, it's caused a crisis, but it's also elevated a discussion, a public policy discussion here in the United States about the nature of our policy toward the country. If you can remember, when is the last time that anybody was having a major discussion about Cuba policy? Now we're having one, and the discussion is, what is the effectiveness of isolation? What is the effectiveness of sanctions? What is the United States doing on Cuba? Is Cuba up next for regime change? What is the nature of the Cuban regime?
All of those questions are now on the table. The crackdown is appalling, but we're having that discussion, and I think it's valid, given the fact that in the Congress, in Florida, in some parts of the U.S. government, I think there really is an interest in seeing regime change, and given the fact that those that handle the Cuba policy in the administration are intensely and viscerally opposed to the Castro regime, that the top people in American foreign policy pay no attention to Cuba policy, in fact, the relationship is vulnerable to escalation from either side, and that's got to be put to rest now, before the election season makes it so much more appealing to the Republican Party or the Democrats to look at Cuba as a potential domestic political goal to opportunistically take advantage of, if I could say.
COOPER: Castro spoke for four hours last night. I don't know if you watched all four hours, but it's rambling. His speeches are interesting to watch, to say the least, but he calls these dissidents "mercenaries." Do people in Cuba buy this?
SWEIG: Oh, I don't think people in Cuba buy it particularly. Look, for as long as I can remember and certainly since the very beginning years of the revolution, the United States has been trying to support those on or off the island who are opposed to the government. People I think don't buy that those 75 people posed a serious national security threat to the Cuban government. But surely, the Cuban government felt that the United States was probing its defenses a little bit too aggressively, and did this dust-up now to make a very clear point that it won't tolerate it.
Of course, what's interesting is that the Cuban government security forces have penetrated the dissident movements, as they always have, even creating some of the opposition movements that have now been wiped up. So I think we're at a bit of a stalemate in terms of what's possible, given the level of non-engagement that the two countries really do have.
COOPER: All right, well, it certainly seems like an international outcry is growing against the crackdown on dissent. We'll see what happens. Julia Sweig, with the Council on Foreign Relations, thanks for being with us. Appreciate it.
SWEIG: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired April 26, 2003 - 15:21 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: We want to talk more about what is going on in Cuba. We're joined by Julia Sweig. She is with the Council on Foreign Relations. She is joining us now from Washington. Julia, thanks for being with us. What is going on in Cuba right now? Why is Fidel Castro cracking down on these 75 dissidents, some of whom are just independent reporters who went to a journalism seminar given by U.S. officials?
JULIA SWEIG, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: Well, there's no justification for these crackdowns. They and the executions are copletely appalling. I think the crackdowns are largely designed to send a signal to the United States, to the opposition on the island, and also to those in Congress and in the state of Florida who might be looking at the presidential election season that we're entering into as a potential time to drum up a Cuba crisis.
Of course, a Cuba crisis has now been started, escalated by the Cuban government, and that, as Senator Harkin said, the real question is what is the proper response now from the United States and the rest of the international community.
COOPER: So wait, so Castro believes -- your opinion is Castro believes he can avoid a Cuba crisis by cracking down on dissent. But as you just said, it's caused a crisis of sorts.
SWEIG: Well, it's caused a crisis, but it's also elevated a discussion, a public policy discussion here in the United States about the nature of our policy toward the country. If you can remember, when is the last time that anybody was having a major discussion about Cuba policy? Now we're having one, and the discussion is, what is the effectiveness of isolation? What is the effectiveness of sanctions? What is the United States doing on Cuba? Is Cuba up next for regime change? What is the nature of the Cuban regime?
All of those questions are now on the table. The crackdown is appalling, but we're having that discussion, and I think it's valid, given the fact that in the Congress, in Florida, in some parts of the U.S. government, I think there really is an interest in seeing regime change, and given the fact that those that handle the Cuba policy in the administration are intensely and viscerally opposed to the Castro regime, that the top people in American foreign policy pay no attention to Cuba policy, in fact, the relationship is vulnerable to escalation from either side, and that's got to be put to rest now, before the election season makes it so much more appealing to the Republican Party or the Democrats to look at Cuba as a potential domestic political goal to opportunistically take advantage of, if I could say.
COOPER: Castro spoke for four hours last night. I don't know if you watched all four hours, but it's rambling. His speeches are interesting to watch, to say the least, but he calls these dissidents "mercenaries." Do people in Cuba buy this?
SWEIG: Oh, I don't think people in Cuba buy it particularly. Look, for as long as I can remember and certainly since the very beginning years of the revolution, the United States has been trying to support those on or off the island who are opposed to the government. People I think don't buy that those 75 people posed a serious national security threat to the Cuban government. But surely, the Cuban government felt that the United States was probing its defenses a little bit too aggressively, and did this dust-up now to make a very clear point that it won't tolerate it.
Of course, what's interesting is that the Cuban government security forces have penetrated the dissident movements, as they always have, even creating some of the opposition movements that have now been wiped up. So I think we're at a bit of a stalemate in terms of what's possible, given the level of non-engagement that the two countries really do have.
COOPER: All right, well, it certainly seems like an international outcry is growing against the crackdown on dissent. We'll see what happens. Julia Sweig, with the Council on Foreign Relations, thanks for being with us. Appreciate it.
SWEIG: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
