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American Morning

Discussion About William Bennett

Aired May 06, 2003 - 08:17   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Iowa State University and its head basketball coach, Larry Eustachy, have agreed to part ways now. The coach's resignation comes a week after photos surface of him drinking with students at a party. Eustachy had vowed not to quit, but now says he holds himself responsible and that it's time to move on.
The school apparently agrees with that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GREGORY GEOFFROY, IOWA STATE PRESIDENT: We believe accepting his resignation will bring resolution to a very difficult issue. This decision is in the best interests of the university, of Mr. Eustachy and the entire Iowa State University family.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: A pretty good record. Eustachy won 101 games for Iowa State in five different seasons. He was the state's highest paid employee, made about $1.1 million per year. He'll be paid a lump sum just shy of that in January of 2004.

Across the room, here's Heidi.

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: For years, William Bennett has been preaching morality and personal responsibility. He is the author of "The Book of Virtues." But some are calling the conservative activist a hypocrite after he admitted to high stakes gambling. Bennett now says his gambling days are over.

Senior analyst Jeff Greenfield is here now with his take on Bennett's behavior -- Jeff, tell us, why is this any of our business?

JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it wouldn't be. It was legal activity, an adult, a private citizen, except that, as you point out, Bennett has been, for years, one of America's most prominent virtue-crats. He's one of the best known advocates of the notion that personal behavior can often have dangerous social consequences, whether drug use when he was drug czar; Clinton's misbehavior. He helped create the Index of Leading Cultural Indicators, which tried to measure the social health of America, in part, by how we behave. And compulsive gambling was one of his measurements.

In fact, when you consider the cost of compulsive gambling to individuals and to society, it raises an eyebrow, Heidi.

COLLINS: But Bennett never criticized gambling in particular. So can we really call this hypocrisy?

GREENFIELD: Well, his organization, Empower America, has opposed the spread of legalized gambling. But the tricky question here is whether Bennett exempted gambling because he liked to do it. You know, it may not be hypocrisy, but if you're measuring social ills and you say but the one that I like I'm not counting, you know, look, millions of people -- let's be blunt about this -- use recreational drugs. They use soft drugs. The argument against legalizing them is that they can do great harm to some people. And that's why as drug czar Bennett never accepted the argument that most people don't go from marijuana to harder stuff.

So I think that's what puts this in play.

COLLINS: But obviously gambling is not illegal and he says, you know, he's done with it.

Do you think that will put an end to the controversy?

GREENFIELD: Well, I think what Bennett did was a straight up recognition that he was undercutting his own professed concerns by indulging in so expensive a habit. I think for his political foes, who've always bristled at the notion that he and his supporters represent virtue, this is going to be a source of some pleasure, what the Germans call schadenfreud.

Take a look at this "Washington Post" cartoon that ran today, which I think we have, and you'll see, there's Bennett at a slot machine that -- you can't quite see it, but the two windows say "holier than thou" and the other says "whoops, you've got a problem."

You know, whenever people, political opponents say I'm deeply saddened by the behavior of my enemy, I don't ever believe that. I think that there's some delight on an embarrassment that has befallen a political enemy. But I also think it raises a larger question than Bennett, and that is the whole issue of whether it is a good idea to be going down the road of more and more legalized gambling.

People will do it no matter what, but the more available it is, the more we do seem to have a problem with people getting in over their heads. We've got a big gambling lobby. It's head is the former Republican national chair. States are facing huge crushing deficits. They're looking for ways to make money. They're looking at everything from slot machines to increased video poker to keno games. And I think maybe this will be the trigger for a real national debate, how much do we want to rely on legalized gambling?

COLLINS: But, yes, right, this is true. I'm also wondering your take on, you know, does he say that he has a problem or is he just admitting to partaking in this high stakes gambling?

GREENFIELD: No, I think what he said yesterday was, you know, this is probably not a good idea and I'm not going to do it anymore. His wife, you know, look -- and this is literally Northeast of our business...

COLLINS: Right.

GREENFIELD: But you wonder what the conversation is like in any household if one spouse learns that the other may have had a gambling hobby that was a little more costly than they thought.

But to me the real issue is not Mr. Bennett, but, you know, we have got -- when I was a kid, there was no legal gambling outside of Nevada. My dad used to play the Irish sweepstakes. Now, only three states don't have it.

COLLINS: That's true.

GREENFIELD: And it is a hobby that the poorest of people indulge in because they're desperately hoping for a chance at the big payoff and it's led to some very serious consequences.

COLLINS: It can be dangerous, indeed.

GREENFIELD: Yes.

COLLINS: All right, Jeff Greenfield, thank you so much for your take on all of that this morning.

GREENFIELD: Sure.

COLLINS: We want to let you know, too, Bennett is the topic of Jack's e-mail question this morning. The question is, "Has your view of Bill Bennett changed?" The address, am@cnn.com.

And Jack will have more of your responses coming up a little bit later on this hour.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired May 6, 2003 - 08:17   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Iowa State University and its head basketball coach, Larry Eustachy, have agreed to part ways now. The coach's resignation comes a week after photos surface of him drinking with students at a party. Eustachy had vowed not to quit, but now says he holds himself responsible and that it's time to move on.
The school apparently agrees with that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GREGORY GEOFFROY, IOWA STATE PRESIDENT: We believe accepting his resignation will bring resolution to a very difficult issue. This decision is in the best interests of the university, of Mr. Eustachy and the entire Iowa State University family.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: A pretty good record. Eustachy won 101 games for Iowa State in five different seasons. He was the state's highest paid employee, made about $1.1 million per year. He'll be paid a lump sum just shy of that in January of 2004.

Across the room, here's Heidi.

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: For years, William Bennett has been preaching morality and personal responsibility. He is the author of "The Book of Virtues." But some are calling the conservative activist a hypocrite after he admitted to high stakes gambling. Bennett now says his gambling days are over.

Senior analyst Jeff Greenfield is here now with his take on Bennett's behavior -- Jeff, tell us, why is this any of our business?

JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it wouldn't be. It was legal activity, an adult, a private citizen, except that, as you point out, Bennett has been, for years, one of America's most prominent virtue-crats. He's one of the best known advocates of the notion that personal behavior can often have dangerous social consequences, whether drug use when he was drug czar; Clinton's misbehavior. He helped create the Index of Leading Cultural Indicators, which tried to measure the social health of America, in part, by how we behave. And compulsive gambling was one of his measurements.

In fact, when you consider the cost of compulsive gambling to individuals and to society, it raises an eyebrow, Heidi.

COLLINS: But Bennett never criticized gambling in particular. So can we really call this hypocrisy?

GREENFIELD: Well, his organization, Empower America, has opposed the spread of legalized gambling. But the tricky question here is whether Bennett exempted gambling because he liked to do it. You know, it may not be hypocrisy, but if you're measuring social ills and you say but the one that I like I'm not counting, you know, look, millions of people -- let's be blunt about this -- use recreational drugs. They use soft drugs. The argument against legalizing them is that they can do great harm to some people. And that's why as drug czar Bennett never accepted the argument that most people don't go from marijuana to harder stuff.

So I think that's what puts this in play.

COLLINS: But obviously gambling is not illegal and he says, you know, he's done with it.

Do you think that will put an end to the controversy?

GREENFIELD: Well, I think what Bennett did was a straight up recognition that he was undercutting his own professed concerns by indulging in so expensive a habit. I think for his political foes, who've always bristled at the notion that he and his supporters represent virtue, this is going to be a source of some pleasure, what the Germans call schadenfreud.

Take a look at this "Washington Post" cartoon that ran today, which I think we have, and you'll see, there's Bennett at a slot machine that -- you can't quite see it, but the two windows say "holier than thou" and the other says "whoops, you've got a problem."

You know, whenever people, political opponents say I'm deeply saddened by the behavior of my enemy, I don't ever believe that. I think that there's some delight on an embarrassment that has befallen a political enemy. But I also think it raises a larger question than Bennett, and that is the whole issue of whether it is a good idea to be going down the road of more and more legalized gambling.

People will do it no matter what, but the more available it is, the more we do seem to have a problem with people getting in over their heads. We've got a big gambling lobby. It's head is the former Republican national chair. States are facing huge crushing deficits. They're looking for ways to make money. They're looking at everything from slot machines to increased video poker to keno games. And I think maybe this will be the trigger for a real national debate, how much do we want to rely on legalized gambling?

COLLINS: But, yes, right, this is true. I'm also wondering your take on, you know, does he say that he has a problem or is he just admitting to partaking in this high stakes gambling?

GREENFIELD: No, I think what he said yesterday was, you know, this is probably not a good idea and I'm not going to do it anymore. His wife, you know, look -- and this is literally Northeast of our business...

COLLINS: Right.

GREENFIELD: But you wonder what the conversation is like in any household if one spouse learns that the other may have had a gambling hobby that was a little more costly than they thought.

But to me the real issue is not Mr. Bennett, but, you know, we have got -- when I was a kid, there was no legal gambling outside of Nevada. My dad used to play the Irish sweepstakes. Now, only three states don't have it.

COLLINS: That's true.

GREENFIELD: And it is a hobby that the poorest of people indulge in because they're desperately hoping for a chance at the big payoff and it's led to some very serious consequences.

COLLINS: It can be dangerous, indeed.

GREENFIELD: Yes.

COLLINS: All right, Jeff Greenfield, thank you so much for your take on all of that this morning.

GREENFIELD: Sure.

COLLINS: We want to let you know, too, Bennett is the topic of Jack's e-mail question this morning. The question is, "Has your view of Bill Bennett changed?" The address, am@cnn.com.

And Jack will have more of your responses coming up a little bit later on this hour.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com