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CNN Live Today
Hunting for Osama bin Laden and His Lieutenants
Aired May 16, 2003 - 10:08 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: As U.S. suspicions once again fall on Osama bin Laden and his terrorist network we thought that we would update the global manhunt for Osama bin Laden and his top lieutenants. And for that, we turn to CNN national correspondent Mike Boettcher, who has been following the investigative trail around the world for months now.
And it seems as though, Mike, that just a matter of weeks ago, maybe a month or so ago, we were hearing word from the administration that al Qaeda had been crippled, had been at least shackled dramatically, and their efficacy was going to be reduced dramatically. And it appears that that may not be the case.
MIKE BOETTCHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Leon, there have been some major successes. And let's look at the list of people. No. 1, but there has been some major failures as well. For example, Osama bin Laden, still at-large -- it is not known where he is -- the leader of al Qaeda. And no one can find him. He's suspected to be, at last reports, along the border of Pakistan and Afghanistan in those tribal areas where it would be very difficult to get him.
Also at-large, Ayman al-Zawahiri, he is No. 2. And the man who, it is believed, comes up with the ideas and keeps pushing Osama bin Laden; he, as well, at-large.
But there have been some great successes, too. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, who was arrested earlier this year near Rawalpindi, Pakistan, he was the operations chief, and he is thought to be able to provide a great amount of information on al Qaeda. As well, Abu Zubaydah, who was a field commander, another very important get. And also Mohammed Atef, who is -- or was the military commander for al Qaeda. He was killed in Afghanistan in the early stages of the war.
But if you want to measure success, Leon, I don't think you can measure it by the people you have gotten or the people that are still at-large. There has to be another measure of success.
HARRIS: Well, then what should that measure be? Because at some point the public is going to be asking, did we win this war? And at some point you're going to have to have a way to determine whether or not you actually have won this war against terror.
BOETTCHER: Well, I think you really have to set what victory is. If victory for the United States and the coalition against terror is the complete elimination of terrorism, then the coalition will fail, because terrorism will never be completely eliminated. If al Qaeda sets its mark of victory as moving the United States out of all areas of the Middle East, that's not going to happen -- and the elimination of Israel.
So, both sides are going to be fighting, I believe, a low-grade war -- not just me, experts in this field -- a low-grade war for quite some time, but...
HARRIS: How long is "quite some time?"
BOETTCHER: You know, it could be decades, and that is being optimistic, because you're trying to deal with a thought. It's hard to take out a thought with a machine gun or a rocket fired from a jet. This is fundamentalist Islam. The Wahabi sector of Islam inspires this. It's called Selutti (ph) thought, and it's a thought that's near impossible to stamp out, because it's spreading. It' not diminishing in the Islamic world; it's spreading.
HARRIS: That's a very interesting perspective, because I can put it in terms that people in this country can understand, we have been fighting racism in this country, which is an idea. And here we are centuries into that, and we're still fighting it here.
BOETTCHER: Absolutely.
HARRIS: Thanks, Mike. Mike Boettcher, appreciate that.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
Aired May 16, 2003 - 10:08 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: As U.S. suspicions once again fall on Osama bin Laden and his terrorist network we thought that we would update the global manhunt for Osama bin Laden and his top lieutenants. And for that, we turn to CNN national correspondent Mike Boettcher, who has been following the investigative trail around the world for months now.
And it seems as though, Mike, that just a matter of weeks ago, maybe a month or so ago, we were hearing word from the administration that al Qaeda had been crippled, had been at least shackled dramatically, and their efficacy was going to be reduced dramatically. And it appears that that may not be the case.
MIKE BOETTCHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Leon, there have been some major successes. And let's look at the list of people. No. 1, but there has been some major failures as well. For example, Osama bin Laden, still at-large -- it is not known where he is -- the leader of al Qaeda. And no one can find him. He's suspected to be, at last reports, along the border of Pakistan and Afghanistan in those tribal areas where it would be very difficult to get him.
Also at-large, Ayman al-Zawahiri, he is No. 2. And the man who, it is believed, comes up with the ideas and keeps pushing Osama bin Laden; he, as well, at-large.
But there have been some great successes, too. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, who was arrested earlier this year near Rawalpindi, Pakistan, he was the operations chief, and he is thought to be able to provide a great amount of information on al Qaeda. As well, Abu Zubaydah, who was a field commander, another very important get. And also Mohammed Atef, who is -- or was the military commander for al Qaeda. He was killed in Afghanistan in the early stages of the war.
But if you want to measure success, Leon, I don't think you can measure it by the people you have gotten or the people that are still at-large. There has to be another measure of success.
HARRIS: Well, then what should that measure be? Because at some point the public is going to be asking, did we win this war? And at some point you're going to have to have a way to determine whether or not you actually have won this war against terror.
BOETTCHER: Well, I think you really have to set what victory is. If victory for the United States and the coalition against terror is the complete elimination of terrorism, then the coalition will fail, because terrorism will never be completely eliminated. If al Qaeda sets its mark of victory as moving the United States out of all areas of the Middle East, that's not going to happen -- and the elimination of Israel.
So, both sides are going to be fighting, I believe, a low-grade war -- not just me, experts in this field -- a low-grade war for quite some time, but...
HARRIS: How long is "quite some time?"
BOETTCHER: You know, it could be decades, and that is being optimistic, because you're trying to deal with a thought. It's hard to take out a thought with a machine gun or a rocket fired from a jet. This is fundamentalist Islam. The Wahabi sector of Islam inspires this. It's called Selutti (ph) thought, and it's a thought that's near impossible to stamp out, because it's spreading. It' not diminishing in the Islamic world; it's spreading.
HARRIS: That's a very interesting perspective, because I can put it in terms that people in this country can understand, we have been fighting racism in this country, which is an idea. And here we are centuries into that, and we're still fighting it here.
BOETTCHER: Absolutely.
HARRIS: Thanks, Mike. Mike Boettcher, appreciate that.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
