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American Morning
Both Sides in Peace Process Must Be Absolutely Serious
Aired June 04, 2003 - 07:34 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: We want to get back to Middle East peace right now, what's at stake right now in Jordan? That's why Jeff is stopping by right now, to take a look in depth at this with his take from half a world away.
What are you seeing there in Jordan today?
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think we're seeing two things. One, I'm a pessimist about the Middle East because I think that's the only realistic way to be. But there actually are some signs of optimism here.
We see all the sides in this beginning to move to the positions that everybody has known for years they have to. We think we're seeing the new prime minister, Abu Mazen or Mahmoud Abbas, depending on what you call him, really trying to say to Hamas and Islamic Jihad enough, no more terror. We've heard Ariel Sharon, the most hawkish of the hawks, talk, at least, about a Palestinian Authority and allude to occupation. We saw the Arab leaders apparently committing to a cessation of aid, both moral and financial, to the terrorist groups. And we're seeing the president, who in the 2000 campaign was critical of President Clinton's direct involvement, throwing the aides out of the room and talking one-on-one or one on four with the Arab leaders.
And apparently, in an unguarded moment, or a moment that wasn't supposed to be, there telling the Israelis you have to deal with the settlements and telling the Arab leaders you've got to deal with terrorism. And those are the first steps of the thousand mile journey.
HEMMER: We are getting reports that indicate these Arab leaders were quite taken aback by the aggressiveness of the president yesterday. What does he need to do right now to get parties together and really, well, convince them that he is convinced that he can take this process and move it forward?
GREENFIELD: What he has to do, I think, is to say things that both sides are going to find unpalatable. I mean one of the most remarkable things that apparently is part of the president's thinking was quoted yesterday in the "Washington Post," and even though it was on page one, so it hardly was overlooked, we need to nail this. The president, there was a story in the "Washington Post" yesterday from people who are not happy with where the president is apparently going quoting Mr. Bush as follows.
"The president has told aides that Israelis are wasting their money on expanding settlements in the West Bank because ultimately those projects will become housing developments for Palestinians."
Now that seems to suggest that what the president said to Israel yesterday, you've got to deal with the settlements, is part of his basic thinking. And it seems to suggest that in the long run, the president is saying to the Arab world, you can rely on me to pressure the Israelis to get all or most of the settlements out.
Now, that certainly will go a long way to convince the Arab leaders that the president is serious. What it does to the Israeli government, what it does to the president's constituency here in the United States is very pro-Israeli, a whole other question.
HEMMER: When we look at this issue, Jeff -- I have about 30 seconds left here -- we look at the complexities going back to biblical times and how confused the whole scenario is in that part of the world. Is Bush that plain-spoken and that simple to go there yesterday in Sharm el-Sheikh and say to the Israelis end the settlements, dismantle the outposts and the Palestinians stop the terrorism? Can it be boiled down to simplicity like that?
GREENFIELD: You know, the interesting thing with that question is ultimately it's going go come down to that. But the journey from where we are now to how we get there is incredibly complex. And it's going to require on both sides a fundamental abandonment of some basic notions.
If the Palestinians are not serious about ending terrorism, there's no hope. If the Israelis are not serious about removing outpost settlements, there's probably no hope. And, you know, as I said, as a long-term pessimist, I'm looking at this and thinking maybe this is a point where everybody is tired of all the death and killing. Maybe this is a point where people are abandoning lines that they felt unable to abandon for decade after decade. But this is a very, very long way to go.
HEMMER: And so many times in the past we get three, six months down the road, maybe a year or two, and we spiral right back into the cycle of violence.
GREENFIELD: "U.S. Envoy Hopeful On Mideast." I've seen that headline since I've been five years old.
HEMMER: Hopeful is it.
Thanks, Jeff.
We'll talk again.
GREENFIELD: OK.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired June 4, 2003 - 07:34 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: We want to get back to Middle East peace right now, what's at stake right now in Jordan? That's why Jeff is stopping by right now, to take a look in depth at this with his take from half a world away.
What are you seeing there in Jordan today?
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think we're seeing two things. One, I'm a pessimist about the Middle East because I think that's the only realistic way to be. But there actually are some signs of optimism here.
We see all the sides in this beginning to move to the positions that everybody has known for years they have to. We think we're seeing the new prime minister, Abu Mazen or Mahmoud Abbas, depending on what you call him, really trying to say to Hamas and Islamic Jihad enough, no more terror. We've heard Ariel Sharon, the most hawkish of the hawks, talk, at least, about a Palestinian Authority and allude to occupation. We saw the Arab leaders apparently committing to a cessation of aid, both moral and financial, to the terrorist groups. And we're seeing the president, who in the 2000 campaign was critical of President Clinton's direct involvement, throwing the aides out of the room and talking one-on-one or one on four with the Arab leaders.
And apparently, in an unguarded moment, or a moment that wasn't supposed to be, there telling the Israelis you have to deal with the settlements and telling the Arab leaders you've got to deal with terrorism. And those are the first steps of the thousand mile journey.
HEMMER: We are getting reports that indicate these Arab leaders were quite taken aback by the aggressiveness of the president yesterday. What does he need to do right now to get parties together and really, well, convince them that he is convinced that he can take this process and move it forward?
GREENFIELD: What he has to do, I think, is to say things that both sides are going to find unpalatable. I mean one of the most remarkable things that apparently is part of the president's thinking was quoted yesterday in the "Washington Post," and even though it was on page one, so it hardly was overlooked, we need to nail this. The president, there was a story in the "Washington Post" yesterday from people who are not happy with where the president is apparently going quoting Mr. Bush as follows.
"The president has told aides that Israelis are wasting their money on expanding settlements in the West Bank because ultimately those projects will become housing developments for Palestinians."
Now that seems to suggest that what the president said to Israel yesterday, you've got to deal with the settlements, is part of his basic thinking. And it seems to suggest that in the long run, the president is saying to the Arab world, you can rely on me to pressure the Israelis to get all or most of the settlements out.
Now, that certainly will go a long way to convince the Arab leaders that the president is serious. What it does to the Israeli government, what it does to the president's constituency here in the United States is very pro-Israeli, a whole other question.
HEMMER: When we look at this issue, Jeff -- I have about 30 seconds left here -- we look at the complexities going back to biblical times and how confused the whole scenario is in that part of the world. Is Bush that plain-spoken and that simple to go there yesterday in Sharm el-Sheikh and say to the Israelis end the settlements, dismantle the outposts and the Palestinians stop the terrorism? Can it be boiled down to simplicity like that?
GREENFIELD: You know, the interesting thing with that question is ultimately it's going go come down to that. But the journey from where we are now to how we get there is incredibly complex. And it's going to require on both sides a fundamental abandonment of some basic notions.
If the Palestinians are not serious about ending terrorism, there's no hope. If the Israelis are not serious about removing outpost settlements, there's probably no hope. And, you know, as I said, as a long-term pessimist, I'm looking at this and thinking maybe this is a point where everybody is tired of all the death and killing. Maybe this is a point where people are abandoning lines that they felt unable to abandon for decade after decade. But this is a very, very long way to go.
HEMMER: And so many times in the past we get three, six months down the road, maybe a year or two, and we spiral right back into the cycle of violence.
GREENFIELD: "U.S. Envoy Hopeful On Mideast." I've seen that headline since I've been five years old.
HEMMER: Hopeful is it.
Thanks, Jeff.
We'll talk again.
GREENFIELD: OK.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
