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CNN Live Today
Deepening Crisis in Middle East
Aired June 12, 2003 - 10:03 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: But up first this hour here on CNN, the escalating violence and the deepening crisis in the Middle East; within the last hour another deadly strike. This one an Israeli missile attack on a Gaza neighborhood viewed as a Hamas stronghold. More people were killed in this the latest of several strikes, and within the previous 24 hours more than two dozen Israelis and Palestinians have been killed, more than 100 wounded.
Let's begin our coverage this morning in Jerusalem. Checking in now is our Jerusalem Bureau Chief Mike Hanna - Mike.
MIKE HANNA, CNN JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF: Well, Leon, ongoing violence as Israel continues its operations it says are directed at members of the extremist Hamas organization. There has been an Israeli helicopter strike in Gaza City in the course of the afternoon in which at least seven people were killed, well over 30 people wounded according to Palestinian medical sources.
We are also told by a Palestinian source that there are at least two known Hamas militants among the seven killed, one of them Yasser Tahad (ph) killed, along with him his wife and his two children.
Israel has pledged that it will wipe out the Hamas movement. It has carried out a number of operations in recent days against them. Hamas itself has pledged that it will continue attacks against Israeli targets such as that suicide bombing in Jerusalem Wednesday in which 16 people were killed, well over 70 injured. In that bombing, Hamas said it was retaliation for the attempted Israeli assassination of a Hamas leader on Tuesday.
So, here we have a vortex of violence erupting, Israel absolutely adamant that it is going to do everything possible to completely wipe out the Hamas organization, Hamas for its part saying that it will continue to strike back at Israeli targets, all of this against a backdrop of attempts to implement a peace plan in the region, these attempts apparently stillborn at the moment as Israeli and the militant Hamas movement come face-to-face - Leon.
HARRIS: Thank you very much, Mike, Mike Hanna reporting live for us this morning from Jerusalem. Mike has been on this story since it broke almost 24 hours ago, thanks, Mike.
Now, this past day of violence has at the very least imperiled the White House-led peace initiative so the question now is President Bush's so-called roadmap to peace, is it doomed to a dead end?
Well joining us now to lend us some perspective is CNN Senior White House Correspondent John King. John, what are you hearing this morning? Has there been any reaction to the latest strike which happened just about maybe half an hour ago?
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No official reaction as yet, Leon. Behind the scenes officials say obviously it is not helpful in the sense that the president is hoping for a break in the violence so that he can appeal to the parties to get back on the roadmap to peace, on the road to peace.
But no official reaction at all, no characterization from the administration as to whether it thinks this is an overstep by Israel, as the president said a few days ago when there was that assassination attempt.
Here at the White House they say, as one official put it, we are on a dangerous turn in the road, but this official insisting that both the Israelis and the Palestinians are still telling the White House they are committed to implementing the early benchmarks in the so- called roadmap for peace.
Many also asking why isn't the president personally getting involved in the diplomacy as he suggested after last week's Mid East summit that he might at key points? Officials say they do not believe it is at that level yet. They say senior officials at both the White House and the State Department are appealing to the Israelis and the Palestinians to try to find a way to break this cycle of violence.
And, Leon, the president's special envoy will be in the region soon, and as all this plays out there is a domestic political element as well. Both Democrats and Republicans on Capitol Hill saying how could the president criticize Israel the other day when the Israeli government is going after Hamas? Many saying it is much like the Bush administration going after al Qaeda. How can the president criticize Israel?
Here at the White House, Leon, they say the president will call it as he sees it and that he considered that one attack, the assassination attempt on the key Hamas leader, to be out of bounds, out of step with the commitment Prime Minister Sharon made at last week's Mid East summit - Leon.
HARRIS: Well, John, since you mentioned that, that summit, there is a quote that's attributed to Ariel Sharon in "The New York Times" this morning where he says, in effect, that he never made a promise not to go after militants there. He never made a promise to stop this campaign to put out these terror strikes against Israel and that would seem to strike at the very heart of what was agreed to there in Aqaba.
What are you hearing about that? Do you know whether or not at the White House there is a consensus that Ariel Sharon was never asked to make a promise not to do this?
KING: Well, remember the very first sentence or two of Ariel Sharon's statement in the public statements after the Aqaba summit. He started off with a very strong, blunt statement that Israel will never give up its right to fight terrorism. Now, he then went on to say that Israeli would implement the early benchmarks in the roadmap for peace, but Prime Minister Sharon made clear in public and private that Israel's security was the paramount issue to him, no ifs, ands, or buts about it.
Now, we are told at the White House that the president said he agreed as well and that he believed implementing the roadmap was the best step for Israel's security. What the White House had hoped for was that there would then be a climate in which both sides implemented the early steps they had promised to take and that that would build trust and good will.
Instead, of course, you have an escalating cycle of violence, very hard to see how you create an atmosphere for peace, an atmosphere to make the much tougher decisions that are down the road in this roadmap for peace with the violence and the mistrust and the deaths and bloodshed at the current moment.
HARRIS: All right, the situation gets more and more complicated day by day it seems. Thanks, John, John King at the White House.
KING: Thank you.
HARRIS: All right, now as John mentioned that summit in Aqaba happened about a week ago and after that there was a surge of optimism throughout the region, throughout the world, as Israelis and Palestinians were beginning, we thought, to embark on a new plan for peace but now, the fanfare has faded and there are questions in the air about whether or not the peace plan can survive the latest round of violence.
Middle East analyst Rob Sobhani joins us now to talk about what may happen next and Mr. Sobhani is also an adjunct professor at Georgetown University. Good to see you again, professor.
ROB SOBHANI, MIDDLE EAST ANALYST: Good morning, Leon.
HARRIS: What a difference a week makes, you know. It seems like just a week ago I talked with you and you seemed to be somewhat optimistic because of the signs that were coming out of that summit in Aqaba. What now?
SOBHANI: Leon, I am still optimistic simply because I think the United States has made a commitment. The president has made a commitment to the roadmap, but as we discussed also last week, there are rotten apples who are going to pull the rug from underneath the roadmap and we've seen this over the last week.
Terrorist organizations and countries that support them do not want this to happen and I think it's very important that we start focusing on cutting off funding to these terror organizations first and foremost.
HARRIS: But you know what it seems as though what we've seen here this morning is a bit of a difference. We saw here the last two events that have happened have been Israeli strikes. It has not just been a tit-for-tat. We've now got a tit-for-tat-tat.
And, when you look at that and you hear about Ariel Sharon saying, as I just mentioned moments ago as he was quoted in "The New York Times" this morning as saying, I never said that I was not going to strike against Hamas or against any terror groups. Doesn't that seem to complicate the issue perhaps unnecessarily, perhaps dangerously?
SOBHANI: Well, it certainly does because as President Bush indicated as well he feels that he got a commitment from Prime Minister Sharon to work with the Bush administration.
But I think, Leon, we may be coming to a point where there may be a need for international peacekeepers, possibly U.S. troops, and maybe the inclusion of some Turkish military presence in this situation because the Turks are respected by both sides and, of course, the United States is trusted by Israel.
HARRIS: Is respect what's needed here or is more, I should say maybe, fear needed? Because it appears that Hamas doesn't necessarily fear any of the consequences it's been facing thus far.
SOBHANI: But to the extent, Leon, that the United States can bring in not only its diplomacy and its financial muscle but its military muscle into the picture and we go into Gaza maybe and into the West Bank with some U.N. sanction and make it clear that we're going to be there to protect the peace and then gradually have the Israelis who are in the West Bank and Gaza maybe move out. This may be, may be a solution to start contemplating about.
HARRIS: One last thing I would like to ask you. I want to advise you we're also watching another event in Washington. Ahmed Chalabi, who is vying to become the leader in Iraq is about to be speaking to the press or speaking to the public and we want to make sure that we get those comments.
Before we go to that, I want to ask you this final question. So much has been made of President Bush as a delegator here, we understand now that the man tapped to be the envoy to the Middle East to secure, or at least oversee this process, John Wolf from the State Department, last week I asked you about that. His name first surfaced then. I asked you then if you thought his name was of a high enough stature to actually be effective here. Do you think that to be the case now?
SOBHANI: I think, Leon, unfortunately we're dealing with such a delicate situation that it's important to have a person like maybe George Tenet, the head of the CIA, or Condoleezza Rice oversee this because it brings a stature that no one else can bring really, and I think it's important we have a very high profile, very powerful person that has the president's trust involved in this process.
HARRIS: Bob Sobhani, thank you very much, appreciate it as always. Take care.
SOBHANI: Thanks a lot. HARRIS: Talk to you soon.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired June 12, 2003 - 10:03 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: But up first this hour here on CNN, the escalating violence and the deepening crisis in the Middle East; within the last hour another deadly strike. This one an Israeli missile attack on a Gaza neighborhood viewed as a Hamas stronghold. More people were killed in this the latest of several strikes, and within the previous 24 hours more than two dozen Israelis and Palestinians have been killed, more than 100 wounded.
Let's begin our coverage this morning in Jerusalem. Checking in now is our Jerusalem Bureau Chief Mike Hanna - Mike.
MIKE HANNA, CNN JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF: Well, Leon, ongoing violence as Israel continues its operations it says are directed at members of the extremist Hamas organization. There has been an Israeli helicopter strike in Gaza City in the course of the afternoon in which at least seven people were killed, well over 30 people wounded according to Palestinian medical sources.
We are also told by a Palestinian source that there are at least two known Hamas militants among the seven killed, one of them Yasser Tahad (ph) killed, along with him his wife and his two children.
Israel has pledged that it will wipe out the Hamas movement. It has carried out a number of operations in recent days against them. Hamas itself has pledged that it will continue attacks against Israeli targets such as that suicide bombing in Jerusalem Wednesday in which 16 people were killed, well over 70 injured. In that bombing, Hamas said it was retaliation for the attempted Israeli assassination of a Hamas leader on Tuesday.
So, here we have a vortex of violence erupting, Israel absolutely adamant that it is going to do everything possible to completely wipe out the Hamas organization, Hamas for its part saying that it will continue to strike back at Israeli targets, all of this against a backdrop of attempts to implement a peace plan in the region, these attempts apparently stillborn at the moment as Israeli and the militant Hamas movement come face-to-face - Leon.
HARRIS: Thank you very much, Mike, Mike Hanna reporting live for us this morning from Jerusalem. Mike has been on this story since it broke almost 24 hours ago, thanks, Mike.
Now, this past day of violence has at the very least imperiled the White House-led peace initiative so the question now is President Bush's so-called roadmap to peace, is it doomed to a dead end?
Well joining us now to lend us some perspective is CNN Senior White House Correspondent John King. John, what are you hearing this morning? Has there been any reaction to the latest strike which happened just about maybe half an hour ago?
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No official reaction as yet, Leon. Behind the scenes officials say obviously it is not helpful in the sense that the president is hoping for a break in the violence so that he can appeal to the parties to get back on the roadmap to peace, on the road to peace.
But no official reaction at all, no characterization from the administration as to whether it thinks this is an overstep by Israel, as the president said a few days ago when there was that assassination attempt.
Here at the White House they say, as one official put it, we are on a dangerous turn in the road, but this official insisting that both the Israelis and the Palestinians are still telling the White House they are committed to implementing the early benchmarks in the so- called roadmap for peace.
Many also asking why isn't the president personally getting involved in the diplomacy as he suggested after last week's Mid East summit that he might at key points? Officials say they do not believe it is at that level yet. They say senior officials at both the White House and the State Department are appealing to the Israelis and the Palestinians to try to find a way to break this cycle of violence.
And, Leon, the president's special envoy will be in the region soon, and as all this plays out there is a domestic political element as well. Both Democrats and Republicans on Capitol Hill saying how could the president criticize Israel the other day when the Israeli government is going after Hamas? Many saying it is much like the Bush administration going after al Qaeda. How can the president criticize Israel?
Here at the White House, Leon, they say the president will call it as he sees it and that he considered that one attack, the assassination attempt on the key Hamas leader, to be out of bounds, out of step with the commitment Prime Minister Sharon made at last week's Mid East summit - Leon.
HARRIS: Well, John, since you mentioned that, that summit, there is a quote that's attributed to Ariel Sharon in "The New York Times" this morning where he says, in effect, that he never made a promise not to go after militants there. He never made a promise to stop this campaign to put out these terror strikes against Israel and that would seem to strike at the very heart of what was agreed to there in Aqaba.
What are you hearing about that? Do you know whether or not at the White House there is a consensus that Ariel Sharon was never asked to make a promise not to do this?
KING: Well, remember the very first sentence or two of Ariel Sharon's statement in the public statements after the Aqaba summit. He started off with a very strong, blunt statement that Israel will never give up its right to fight terrorism. Now, he then went on to say that Israeli would implement the early benchmarks in the roadmap for peace, but Prime Minister Sharon made clear in public and private that Israel's security was the paramount issue to him, no ifs, ands, or buts about it.
Now, we are told at the White House that the president said he agreed as well and that he believed implementing the roadmap was the best step for Israel's security. What the White House had hoped for was that there would then be a climate in which both sides implemented the early steps they had promised to take and that that would build trust and good will.
Instead, of course, you have an escalating cycle of violence, very hard to see how you create an atmosphere for peace, an atmosphere to make the much tougher decisions that are down the road in this roadmap for peace with the violence and the mistrust and the deaths and bloodshed at the current moment.
HARRIS: All right, the situation gets more and more complicated day by day it seems. Thanks, John, John King at the White House.
KING: Thank you.
HARRIS: All right, now as John mentioned that summit in Aqaba happened about a week ago and after that there was a surge of optimism throughout the region, throughout the world, as Israelis and Palestinians were beginning, we thought, to embark on a new plan for peace but now, the fanfare has faded and there are questions in the air about whether or not the peace plan can survive the latest round of violence.
Middle East analyst Rob Sobhani joins us now to talk about what may happen next and Mr. Sobhani is also an adjunct professor at Georgetown University. Good to see you again, professor.
ROB SOBHANI, MIDDLE EAST ANALYST: Good morning, Leon.
HARRIS: What a difference a week makes, you know. It seems like just a week ago I talked with you and you seemed to be somewhat optimistic because of the signs that were coming out of that summit in Aqaba. What now?
SOBHANI: Leon, I am still optimistic simply because I think the United States has made a commitment. The president has made a commitment to the roadmap, but as we discussed also last week, there are rotten apples who are going to pull the rug from underneath the roadmap and we've seen this over the last week.
Terrorist organizations and countries that support them do not want this to happen and I think it's very important that we start focusing on cutting off funding to these terror organizations first and foremost.
HARRIS: But you know what it seems as though what we've seen here this morning is a bit of a difference. We saw here the last two events that have happened have been Israeli strikes. It has not just been a tit-for-tat. We've now got a tit-for-tat-tat.
And, when you look at that and you hear about Ariel Sharon saying, as I just mentioned moments ago as he was quoted in "The New York Times" this morning as saying, I never said that I was not going to strike against Hamas or against any terror groups. Doesn't that seem to complicate the issue perhaps unnecessarily, perhaps dangerously?
SOBHANI: Well, it certainly does because as President Bush indicated as well he feels that he got a commitment from Prime Minister Sharon to work with the Bush administration.
But I think, Leon, we may be coming to a point where there may be a need for international peacekeepers, possibly U.S. troops, and maybe the inclusion of some Turkish military presence in this situation because the Turks are respected by both sides and, of course, the United States is trusted by Israel.
HARRIS: Is respect what's needed here or is more, I should say maybe, fear needed? Because it appears that Hamas doesn't necessarily fear any of the consequences it's been facing thus far.
SOBHANI: But to the extent, Leon, that the United States can bring in not only its diplomacy and its financial muscle but its military muscle into the picture and we go into Gaza maybe and into the West Bank with some U.N. sanction and make it clear that we're going to be there to protect the peace and then gradually have the Israelis who are in the West Bank and Gaza maybe move out. This may be, may be a solution to start contemplating about.
HARRIS: One last thing I would like to ask you. I want to advise you we're also watching another event in Washington. Ahmed Chalabi, who is vying to become the leader in Iraq is about to be speaking to the press or speaking to the public and we want to make sure that we get those comments.
Before we go to that, I want to ask you this final question. So much has been made of President Bush as a delegator here, we understand now that the man tapped to be the envoy to the Middle East to secure, or at least oversee this process, John Wolf from the State Department, last week I asked you about that. His name first surfaced then. I asked you then if you thought his name was of a high enough stature to actually be effective here. Do you think that to be the case now?
SOBHANI: I think, Leon, unfortunately we're dealing with such a delicate situation that it's important to have a person like maybe George Tenet, the head of the CIA, or Condoleezza Rice oversee this because it brings a stature that no one else can bring really, and I think it's important we have a very high profile, very powerful person that has the president's trust involved in this process.
HARRIS: Bob Sobhani, thank you very much, appreciate it as always. Take care.
SOBHANI: Thanks a lot. HARRIS: Talk to you soon.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
