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NEWS FROM CNN
Fat Fight
Aired July 2, 2003 - 12:32 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN ANCHOR: And Kraft Foods is not the only company that is taking steps to fight fat. Are they doing it, though, for our health or for their financial well-being?
Sounding off from Washington, Todd Buchholz who conducted the chamber study, and Margo Wootan, who is with the Center for the Science in the Public Interest.
Thank you both for being with us today.
Let's start the food fight.
Todd, I look at study and I'm curious, it says that suing the industry isn't going to help things, but does it clear the fast food industry of being involved with making us all fatter?
TODD BUCHHOLZ, ECONOMIST: Well, American life has become more fattening. What we serve at home, what we serve in schools? The fast food industry meals are no more fattening than what's served in school cafeterias, and that's, of course, overseen by PTAs, by school nurses, by dietitians. Why not sue all the schools and the PTAs. Fast food is a part of American life, but it's not what's causing obesity.
SAVIDGE: OK. Margo, your group has always been infamous in finding the fat in many of our foods. What do you think on this?
MARGO WOOTAN, CTR. FOR SCIENCE IN THE PUBLIC INTEREST: Well, in stark contrast to what Kraft did yesterday, which was to acknowledge their role and their contribution to obesity, today the fast food industry in the chamber of commerce said, it's not out fault, don't blame us, it's everybody else's fault.
When clear eating out is...
BUCHHOLZ: That's not -- did you read the report? I don't think Margo read the report.
WOOTAN: I did read the report.
BUCHHOLZ: Well, then that's not what it said.
SAVIDGE: Let's let Margo at least get an opening line, OK, and then we'll go.
BUCHHOLZ: OK. All right.
WOOTAN: Eating out is clearly one of the major contributors to obesity, certainly not the only one, but a very important one. People are eating out more than ever. When they eat out, studies show that they don't eat as well. They eat more calories, more saturated fat, less calcium, less fiber than when they eat at home. The portion sizes are huge. They very aggressively market unhealthy foods to children. But there practices and products are big contributors to obesity. No one is disagreeing that they are the only contributor, but they are a major contributor.
SAVIDGE: All right, Todd, take it away.
BUCHHOLZ: Well, just the fact is if you look at what people eat at home, and if you look at what they eat at fast food restaurants or at restaurants, it's not the meals that are getting bigger. In fact, it's the in between eating, and that's part of our lifestyle.
You know, 50 years ago, when people were working on factories, they were paid to exert themselves. They were paid to lug thing on a factory floor. They burn calories, they take snack breaks. Now let's face it, people telecommute from home, they sit in front of computer terminals, and they're eating the entire day. That's what causes it.
WOOTAN: No one's disagreeing that physical activity isn't very important to maintaining a healthy weight and to preventing heart disease and cancer. But physical activity is not the major fuel for the rising obesity rate.
Since 1980, there's no data to so that physical activity rates have gone down, but most of us believe they have. But it's very clear that Americans are eating out more, eating more calories, snacking more, drinking more sodas, and that portion sizes are totally out of control.
BUCHHOLZ: And portion sizes.
WOOTAN: Even a typical McDonald's meal in McDonald's opened had about 600 calories. Today, a popular meal at McDonald's, a quarter pounder with cheese, supersize fry, supersize Coke has a thousand more calories.
BUCHHOLZ: You know, the people on Margo's side always focus on the fast food. Did you know that pasta sizes are three times as large, not served in McDonald's by the way. The size of a muffin in the morning is five times the size of what it used to be.
Now McDonald's and the tort lawyers love to parade ill-educated people in front of the judges, and say, these poor people didn't realize what they were eating. I don't know whether Margo's aware of this, because I'm not convinced she read the study, but the increase in obesity is not among ill-educated people. It is among those with college educations, it is people voluntarily reaching for more food, more calories; it's not a matter of dumb people being duped by the fast food industry, but that's the way the lawyers want to portray it.
WOOTAN: You don't have to be dumb. I have a doctorate in nutrition, I work in this field. And when I go to a restaurant, I can't guess what they're serving. Who would know a tuna salad sandwich has 50 percent more calories than the roast beef, or that the porter house steak has twice as many calories as the sirloin. What we need is fast food and chain restaurants to provide calorie labelings on the menu.
(CROSSTALK)
SAVIDGE: OK, wait a minute, we're all talking.
Hold on Todd, hold on.
WOOTAN: That's not true. That's not true.
SAVIDGE: I want to bring in some of our view, because, obviously, they're very involved in this as well, and some e-mail.
This is from C.J. in Georgia, and it read: "For the life of me, I can't see how a person can hold a restaurant liable for their own stupidity. Can't people tell the difference between fast food and healthy food. People can't expect to have their calories counted for them. It is up to them to find the food and the diet that is healthy for you."
And I somewhat agree with this, because it comes down to a personal choice. Where is the individual responsibility? Why do I blame McDonald's? Why do I blame Kraft, when in fact, I'm the one eating the food?
WOOTAN: It's ultimately up to the individual to decide what they eat and what they feed their family, but industry practices make those choices more difficult, because they don't provide good nutrition information in the restaurants. The portion size are very big. No one would guess than a shake has a thousand calories more than the Big Mac, and they very aggressively market unhealthy foods to our children, offering them toys and other giveaways, tying it into our movies. That means that our kids are pestering us for this junk food and making our job more difficult as parents to feed our children well, and to feed ourselves well. It's not that they're solely to blame, but they need to take their share of the blame and change some of their practices, make it easier. They could make it easier for children to eat well, instead of aggressively marketing all this junk food on television, and schools and everywhere else that children are.
BUCHHOLZ: Look, look, the truth of the matter is, every fast food restaurant you go into that's part of a chain will within 20 seconds hand you a brochure and tell you the fat, the calories, the sodium content.
WOOTAN: That's not true.
BUCHHOLZ: Well, it is true, Margo.
WOOTAN: Two-thirds of the largest chain restaurants provide no nutritional fast food information at all. And when they do provide information, oftentimes it's on a Web site, or it's on a brochure or a pamphlet that's hard to find and hard to read.
BUCHHOLZ: And you know, McDonald's only did that.
WOOTAN: Do you need a lawyer to open up a brochure? I think that's where we're headed. Margo wants a lawyer to accompany to you a restaurant.
SAVIDGE: OK, OK, let me try to bring in a little more food for thought here in the e-mail. The obesity epidemic -- this is from John in Scotsboro, Alabama, excuse me -- "The obesity epidemic in the country is getting more attention from people, but it is also getting worse. Most people who eat fast food, eat at fast food places regularly, have no idea of the extent of the horrendous fat and calorie content of the items they eat there, or anywhere else for that matter. Fast food is dangerous, and more needs to be done."
Let me raise this issue, because we talk about menu changes. Some of these restaurants, fast food, have gone to salads. I was shocked to find out that what I thought was eating healthy was a salad, that actually there's a huge fat content, even though I thought I was eating healthy?
WOOTAN: There's no way to guess what the calorie content of these foods are. The only way you know is if the company lists it in an easy to use, easy to find way right on the menu board, so that when you go in, you can you find out that the shake has 1,000 calories, or compare what the difference is between a regular hamburger and a chicken sandwich.
We found in a study that we did with New York University that even trained dietitians couldn't estimate the calorie content of popular restaurant meals. If they really want to do something about obesity, why not just tell the customers how many calories in a Big Mac right on the menu board so people can make their own choice. No one's talking about limiting people's choice, taking any of their foods away. But just tell us what's in there in an easy to use, easy to find manner.
SAVIDGE: Todd, shouldn't we be telling to get out there, and instead so much about what their eating, get off their butts and start exercising, and you know, walk more and do all this?
BUCHHOLZ: I agree completely. I think -- you know, what's going to happen, if Margo and her team have her way, we're going to be suing not just fast food companies, not just restaurants, but schools and PTAs are going to be sued for serving fat, and hamburgers and fries in the cafeterias. We need to get kids exercising -- everybody ought to be exercising. But you shouldn't need a doctor's prescription to buy a cheeseburger.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHHOLZ: Excuse me, Margo, you consume not calories, but a lot of airtime. Let me have a moment. You shouldn't need a tort lawyer to open a brochure, and I assure and your viewers walk into any McDonald's in this country, and you will receive a brochure that will tell you immediately how many calories are in a Big Mac. If you can't read, that's another problem. But that's not what we're here to talk about today.
SAVIDGE: All right, Margo, we started with Todd, I'll let you have the last word -- Go ahead.
WOOTAN: Go to Taco Bell and many other restaurant us and you won't find that nutrition information. Nobody is talking about taking away choice. We're talking about providing better information, providing healthier foods, and reducing the amount of marketing of unhealthy foods to our kids. Those are very reasonable things that could make it easier for American families to eat better.
SAVIDGE: All right, I want to thank you, both. Todd Buchholz, who is economist and author of "Burgers, Fries and Lawyers," and Margo Wootan, who is from the Center for Science in Public Interest. You've given us a lot on our plates. Thank you both for joining me in this spirited debate. We appreciate it.
BUCHHOLZ: Thank you very much. We're offering dessert.
SAVIDGE: OK, right, double helping.
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