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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports
Kobe Bryant charged in Colorado
Aired July 18, 2003 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much guys.
We're standing by for a dramatic announcement. In just seconds, one of pro basketball's brightest stars will learn what he's up against. Will Kobe Bryant face sexual assault charges? We're having full coverage this hour.
WOLF BLITZER REPORTS starts right now.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER (voice-over): Kobe Bryant's hour or reckoning, the alleged incident at a Colorado resort, the accounts conflicting, the evidence crucial.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The prosecutor should have everything that he needs in order to make this decision himself. It would not be a good idea to punt.
BLITZER: Two young lives in the balance, a 24-year-old star with a cultivated role model image, a 19-year-old woman with a reputation of her own at stake.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When you have a possible he-said she-said situation that gets problematic.
BLITZER: Reaction from the Lakers who stood by their teammate.
Did it happen again? Department store cameras zoom in on the convicted sexual predator.
He hunted for Saddam's weapons of mass destruction, now a mystery surrounding this British scientist's surprising death; and President Bush on the defensive; a tumultuous week in Iraq; a provocative discussion with Cokie Roberts of ABC News.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CNN live this hour WOLF BLITZER REPORTS live from the nation's capital with correspondents from around the world. WOLF BLITZER REPORTS starts now.
BLITZER: You're looking at a live picture at Eagle County in Colorado. We're standing by for a news conference by the District Attorney. It's expected to begin any second now. He'll be announcing whether or not he will go forward with charges against the Los Angeles Laker star Kobe Bryant who's been accused of sexual assault. We have reporters covering the story. CNN's Brian Cabell is in Eagle. He's on the scene for us where the announcement is expected to begin any minute now.
CNN National Correspondent Frank Buckley is at the Staples Center in Los Angeles. That's the home, of course, of the Los Angeles Lakers.
Brian any indication when this will begin?
BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: About one minute ago or so, Wolf, we got the two-minute warning which would mean if my arithmetic is right we will see Mark Hurlbert, the D.A., come out of the door any minute now to make that announcement.
We're expecting him to come out with an announcement. Alongside him, we're told the Sheriff Joe Hoy will also be there for support and also have a brief announcement.
You might recall that just about two weeks ago these two had a bit of a rift over the timing of the Kobe Bryant arrest but they will be appearing together here any moment at the Justice Center for Eagle County.
The decision will be basically this. File charges against Kobe Bryant or don't file charges against him. The prosecutors had two weeks to pour over the evidence, the latest evidence that's come from the Colorado Bureau of Investigation, and now finally he feels he does have a decision.
He informed the alleged victim's family of his decision yesterday. What you can conclude from that we're not quite sure. But, again, the rest of us in just a matter of minutes, perhaps seconds, we are going to learn exactly what this prosecutor has decided - Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, we're looking at these live pictures. It looks like they're walking out right now. Mark Hurlbert, there he is with the red tie going to the microphones. Let's listen in right now to hear about Kobe Bryant.
(BREAKING NEWS)
MARK HURLBERT, EAGLE CO. DISTRICT ATTY.: Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen. For those of you that don't know, I'm Mark Hurlbert. I'm the district attorney here in the Fifth Judicial District. That's Clear Creek Lake, Summit, and Eagle Counties, and I want to thank you all for coming.
First of all, I'd like to, as we did last time, talk about a few of the parameters here, what this is all about and what I can and can't say. First of all, as I told you in our press release, this is about the announcement on whether I'm filing charges or not. Also, I cannot comment on the facts of this case and I will not comment on the facts of this case. Earlier today after much deliberation charges were filed about Kobe Bean Bryant of Newport Beach, California. There should be a copy of the complaint. We'll provide you each with a copy of the complaint in this case.
The defendant was charged with one count of sexual assault, a class 3 felony. Penalties on this class 3 felony are that if it's a prison term it's from four years to life imprisonment. If it's a probation term, it's from 20 years to life.
As in any sex assault case, ladies and gentlemen, this did not come easily. This decision came only after reviewing all the evidence, testimonial evidence and physical evidence, after reviewing the relevant statutes, after reviewing the relevant case law, and after conferring with prosecutors from around the state. Then, and only then, did I make my decision.
This case, the standards are the same in this case as in any case, the rules are the same in this case as in any other case. The defendant's next court date is August 6, 2003 at one o'clock. At that time, it is expected that he will be advised of the charges against him and be advised of his rights. It is also a bond appearance day so he will be required to appear at that time.
Finally, ladies and gentlemen of the media, I ask you to respect the victim's privacy in this matter. It's been very difficult for her making it more difficult with all the media attention and I ask you to respect her privacy in this.
She is not going to - has indicated she is not going to talk to any people of the media and is going to refer all questions to my office, and actually in my office we have hired a person to handle the press, a spokesperson Christa Flannigan (ph) who is back in there will be handling all of the press contacts from now on. If before you leave here you would give her your cards and she will be able to get a hold of you and be able to deal with any press contacts.
And, finally, again I urge you to please respect the victim's privacy in this case. This is extremely difficult. I ask you to respect her privacy.
Are there any questions?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How difficult was this decision for you and your office?
HURLBERT: Well, with any sex assault, with any felony really, it is a serious decision. My office takes it seriously. I take it seriously and it is difficult. It is very difficult.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you told the victim's family about this, what did the victim's family say to you when you told them you were going to charge Kobe Bryant?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to talk about anything that happened between me and the victim's family or anything that may have been said.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Hurlbert, under class 3 felony under Colorado does that mean - what is under that category? Does that mean it is only rape or what could fall into that category?
HURLBERT: When we hand out the complaints it will make it more - it will make it more - it will make it more clear but, basically, it is alleged that he caused sexual penetration or intrusion and he caused submission of the victim through actual physical force and that is contained in the complaint.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, do you consider the strength of your case the physical evidence or the testimonials?
HURLBERT: I'm sorry?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you consider the strength of your case the physical evidence or the testimonials?
HURLBERT: You know in any felony case, in any case and this was no exception, you look at everything and you make your decisions based upon all the evidence not just one piece of evidence or not just one part of the evidence and that's what I did in this case. I've relied on everything testimonial, physical, everything in the code.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Hurlbert, Manny Magrano (ph) of KNBC, sir. Obviously, the celebrity hood of the defendant here is well know. In your view was the evidence able to be evaluated fairly and objectively before you made your critical decision today?
HURLBERT: I believe it was. I believe that we were able to look at all the evidence and with the consultation of other prosecutors I believe we were able to look at it fairly. As I said, we're treating this case like any other case. I understand as I'm saying that as I'm looking at about 20 cameras here but surely when you're evaluating whether to file charges or not that doesn't come into play. We evaluate this like any other case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there evidence of tearing or marks on the body, sir?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to comment to anything on the facts.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Apparently you have done sexual assault cases before and if you have how do you prepare young victims like this for what could lie ahead for her? This isn't going to be an easy few months.
HURLBERT: Well, as far as doing any sexual assault cases before, yes, I have done several sexual assault cases and, frankly, being honest and up front is the best way to handle it. To deal with any - actually a victim in any case and that's what my office does and that's what we will continue to do. I heard some over here.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You're talking about how difficult it is. Can you expand a little bit on this? I imagine this has been a rough couple of weeks on her.
HURLBERT: It has been rough. She's holding out OK but I'll just leave it at it's been difficult - to you in the blue shirt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you talk about the strength of your case?
HURLBERT: Well, I believe that we can - I have an ethical burden not to prosecute a case unless I can prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. I feel that after reviewing the evidence, after looking at the evidence that I can prove this case beyond a reasonable doubt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Unintelligible). We've got a well known defendant. Will the victim come forward?
HURLBERT: Will she talk to the media, is that what you're asking?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And expand on her charges as a person with a name?
HURLBERT: Well, she does not want to talk with the media at this time and will refer everything to my office and to Christa Flannigan.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Hurlbert, it may be premature but clearly this is coming down the road assuming there is no plea disposition. Do you anticipate a change of venue for this high profile case?
HURLBERT: Well, and again I don't really want to comment on the procedures that may happen but I would certainly hope to try this case in Eagle County. It is a crime that happened here in Eagle County and citizens of Eagle County deserve to hear it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Hurlbert, based on sort of fast track laws in Colorado, when do you anticipate this actually going to trial? Kind of walk us through a typical case.
HURLBERT: You know I don't really want to - each case is different and each case is - I don't even want to comment on that because there are so many things that can change the length of the case and I don't want to give you something that could be wildly different.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mark, did the other prosecutors advise you to proceed with this or are you bucking the trend of advice that they said not to file charges here? What was the advice from the other prosecutors?
HURLBERT: I'll just say that I have reviewed everything with other prosecutors around the state and I don't really want to get into those discussions either. I think it's prudent to say that I have reviewed everything with them - you in the white shirt in the back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You had mentioned a difficulty in arriving at a decision. Was the difficulty in arriving at a decision whether or not to file charges or the difficulty in arriving at a class 3 felony? HURLBERT: Really in any felony case it's a difficulty in really deciding to file charges. In this case it was, and I suppose the difficulty is reviewing all the evidence. The difficult is reviewing that, making sure that you have all the evidence and, as I said, reviewing the physical evidence and the testimonial evidence.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mark, obviously you probably may not think this is important but a lot of people hearing this would realize that an NBA season is coming up this fall. Do you think Kobe Bryant will be playing for the Lakers this fall or will the trial be at that particular time?
HURLBERT: I can't comment on what will happen with him and the Lakers. My job is this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mark, how fully do you think you know what went on in that room that night?
HURLBERT: How, I'm sorry?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How fully do you think you know what happened in that room that night?
HURLBERT: Well, as I said, after reviewing the evidence, after looking at the testimonial evidence, the physical evidence, et cetera, it appears that I have a - can prove my case beyond a reasonable doubt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there a person that might have heard screams?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to comment on the facts.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Hurlbert, how much - obviously this will be an expensive case to try. Will you ask for additional funds from the state and how are you going to (unintelligible) with that?
HURLBERT: Well, right now my - everything up to this point was in reviewing the evidence and deciding whether to file charges or not. I will sit down in the next couple of weeks and make any decision on if we need any more money in this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, I know you...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Has Kobe Bryant been cooperative? Has he been cooperative? Has Kobe Bryant been cooperative with you?
HURLBERT: I don't really want to comment to anything on what's going on with Mr. Bryant or his attorneys in this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know you can't comment on the facts but can you tell us do you actually have witness testimony as to what happened that evening?
HURLBERT: I have witness testimony. I have physical evidence. I have various things in this case. I mean it's the full case. I guess I'm misunderstanding your question.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there someone other than this alleged victim who has been giving you testimony as to what happened?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to comment to anything on the facts of this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Again, Manny Madrano, KNBC. Under the glare of the national spotlight was this a difficult case for you to evaluate and ultimately make your decision?
HURLBERT: As I said before any sex assault case frankly is a - is very, very difficult and I take it seriously. I take every case that I prosecute seriously and really the overriding goal in all of this is justice for the victim, justice for the people of Eagle County and I apologize.
I have to get going but - and I think we've said that I'm not going to be doing any interviews for the rest of the day. It's been a rather trying couple of weeks but if anybody would want to contact our office, I will be doing interviews tomorrow and on Monday. Thank you very much.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.
BLITZER: And there he is Mark Hurlbert. He's the district attorney for Eagle County in Colorado announcing he is going forward. He has indeed filed charges against Kobe Bryant, one count sexual assault, what he described as a class 3 felony, possible penalty four years to life in prison, possible probation 20 years to life in prison.
We are now getting a statement from Kobe Bryant via his attorney in Orange County, California, a very important statement suggesting what Kobe Bryant's defense is going to be. Let me read Kobe Bryant's statement to you our viewers in full.
Kobe Bryant says: "I am innocent of the charges filed today. I did not assault the woman who is accusing me. I made the mistake of adultery. I have to answer to my wife and my God for my actions that night and I pray that both will forgive me."
He goes on to say: "Nothing that happened June 30th was against the will of the woman who now falsely accuses me. These false allegations" he says "have hurt my family. I will fight against these allegations with all my strength. My wife is the strongest person I know. She is willing to stand by me despite any mistake. That means everything to me."
Finally, Kobe Bryant in his statement says this: "I have so much to live for and by that I do not mean the contracts or the money or the fame. I mean my family. I will fight for them. I appreciate all those who have supported me. Thank you for believing in me. My family and I are going to need your support and prayers now more than ever."
And this, a statement from Kobe Bryant's wife, Vanessa Bryant saying this: "I know that my husband has made a mistake the mistake of adultery. He and I will have to deal with that within our marriage and we will do so. He is not a criminal."
Vanessa Bryant goes on to say: "I know that he did not commit a crime. He did not assault anyone. He is a loving and kind husband and father. I believe in his innocence. Because I know him to be innocent I will stand by him and we will face this together.
I will give him all the strength and support he needs to face these false accusations. I will not let him face these accusations alone. I know Kobe better than anyone" she says. "The great person you see on the court and in the public is a far greater person off the court," statements from Kobe Bryant and his wife Vanessa.
Let's bring in Jeffrey Toobin our legal analyst who knows a great deal about the law and these kinds of cases. Jeffrey, we see obviously what his defense is going to be. It's going to be that she consented.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: These are often the most difficult cases to prove for the prosecution because they tend to be one person's word against another. The physical evidence, which can be so important, becomes much less important when the defenses consent because obviously the defendant concedes that sexual relations took place.
What becomes crucial, what becomes the entire focus of the case is the issue of corroboration. How does the prosecution corroborate the victim's story of whether the sex was consensual or non- consensual? Were there injuries? Did she report them immediately?
Was there any prior relationship between the two that would indicate some level of consent? Those are the issues that will come to the fore immediately and they will be played out on very much a national stage it looks like.
BLITZER: And, the kind of physical evidence that this prosecutor, this district attorney needs in order to convince a grand jury - a jury that is beyond a reasonable doubt is what, beyond the DNA, because the DNA could suggest it would be consensual? They need more than just DNA.
TOOBIN: Absolutely. The DNA, I mean the one thing about a consent defense is that the DNA becomes essentially irrelevant because both sides agree that sex took place. What he is likely to need, and I truthfully don't know whether he has it, is evidence for example of some injury to the woman.
It is far better for the prosecution if there is some sort of evidence or photograph or some indication that the sex was non- consensual. That becomes a very big issue any sort of immediate statements by either party, admissions by Kobe Bryant. I mean one of the important things to remember here is Kobe Bryant was with some other people during this period. Did he make any admissions? Did he show any consciousness of guilt to them or to others in the immediate period after that? That's going to become very important all the surrounding circumstances. Those will be the central disputed facts in this case.
BLITZER: How important is it that his wife has now come forward and given this extraordinary statement of support for her husband?
TOOBIN: I think it's awfully helpful. It's not helpful in the sense of it probably isn't even admissible in a court of law but when you deal with these high profile cases the jury pool is watching you, is watching all the coverage of this case and defendant who is - whose family stands by him tends to stand in much better stead than one who has been abandoned and, you know, even though it's not a legally admissible fact, I think it's helpful.
BLITZER: One thing that's obviously going to happen assuming this goes to trial, Jeffrey, is that this woman is going to be smeared, is going to be slammed by the defense attorneys representing Kobe Bryant. She's 19 years old, a recent high school grad. She's now in college.
I assume the prosecution, the district attorney, have gone through and warned her what she can expect and I want you to give us your thoughts on that in just a second.
But I want to go to our Brian Cabell. He's on the scene for us in Eagle County. He's got some additional information and then I want to get back to you Jeffrey on that question. Go ahead, Brian.
CABELL: Yes, Wolf, we just got a copy of the complaint that was just filed. Essentially it says count 1, and that is the only count: "That on or about the 30th day of June, 2003, in the said County of Eagle, State of Colorado, Kobe Bean Bryant unlawfully, feloniously, and knowingly inflicted sexual intrusion or sexual penetration on causing submission of the victim by means of sufficient consequence reasonably calculated to cause submission against victim's will.
Further, the defendant caused submission of the victim through the actual application of physical force or physical violence in violation of Section 18.3" - et cetera, et cetera. Penalty four years to live in the Department of Corrections, 20 years up to life if probation imposed pursuant to 18.13 and possible fine of $3,000 to $750,000.
Again, this was the complaint that was just filed apparently in the last hour - Wolf.
BLITZER: All right stand by, Brian, because we're going to be getting back to you.
I want to bring Jeffrey back in. Jeffrey, first of all, before we get to my question when you just heard the actual words of the charges what did it say to you? TOOBIN: Well, it says that this is a rape case. I mean there's nothing - it's sexual assault but I mean the claim is that Kobe Bryant raped this woman and that is, you know, it's a truly, truly awful crime, one that even though theoretically the sentence could be as low as four years it's very rarely that little if someone is convicted. So, Kobe Bryant is looking at going to jail for quite a long time.
BLITZER: The alleged victim in this case what can she expect now?
TOOBIN: Well, you know, this is usually the prime legal battleground between prosecution and defense in a rape case where the defenses consent. Colorado, like most states, has what's called a rape shield law which protects victims from having their sexual history bared in public to a certain extent.
But, if the defense can show that there is some history of false allegations of rape or can show some sort of pattern of behavior that this is consistent with, a rape shield law can be overcome. Those kind of legal arguments are often very heated and very critical in determining whether someone is convicted or not.
BLITZER: Jeffrey, I want you to stand by because we have a lot more to talk about including the next steps for Kobe Bryant as this legal process moves forward. Stand by.
I want to take a quick break. I also want to alert our viewers that they have a chance to weigh in on this story. Our web question of the day is this. "Do you think Kobe Bryant is being treated fairly?" We'll have the results later this h our. You can vote at cnn.com/wolf.
While you're there send me your comments. I'll try to read some of them on the air each day at the end of this program. That's also where you can read my daily online column, cnn.com/wolf, much more coverage coming up.
How do the prosecutors handle this Kobe Bryant case? What do they do now? Where should they go? We'll hear from a prominent defense attorney as well as a former federal prosecutor who teaches sex crime law in a law school.
And, we'll also go live to our Frank Buckley. He's at the Staples Center in Los Angeles to hear how the decision to file charges against Kobe Bryant is being received in California. Stay with us. We have extensive coverage of this for the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: If you're just tuning in, Kobe Bryant, the Los Angeles Lakers basketball star has been charged one count sexual assault, a class 3 felony, in Colorado, could face four years to life in prison.
Let's get some reaction now on what's going on in Los Angeles. For that our National Correspondent Frank Buckley is standing by at the Staples Center. That's the home, of course, of the Lakers any immediate reaction from there Frank?
FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Wolf, we've already started talking to some folks.
I'd like to introduce you right now to Chris Chambers. He is a coach for a junior team of young girls. They are here to play in Staples Center. We told you what the announcement was regarding Kobe Bryant, just your immediate reaction?
CHRIS CHAMBERS, COACH: Just like I said, I don't - it's not Kobe's character and I hope they find him innocent, you know. He's a tremendous person and I really love him as a fan, you know.
BUCKLEY: And you coach a team of girls, teenage girls. What do you tell them now about this kind of an announcement?
CHAMBERS: I tell them to watch where they're at and as a team, you know, they have to stick together and just watch where they're at and watch the people that's around them, you know, because anything can happen, you know.
BUCKLEY: Okay, Mr. Chambers, thank you very much for the fan reaction.
I'd also like to bring in our friend John Ireland here from KCAL (ph) TV. John, you are the sideline reporter for the Los Angeles Lakers. You've traveled with Kobe extensively. You've been around him quite a bit, your reaction to the announcement today?
JOHN IRELAND, LAKERS COMMENTATOR: I'm not shocked that they charged him. I think that over the past week that's where it's been going, Frank. We've kind of been able to piece together that the charges were coming. But if you were to come to me and tell me the story but not include the name of the person, Kobe would have been the last guy on the roster who I would have thought would have been accused of this.
And, frankly, I'm sure you heard the reaction from the coach, the people in Los Angeles still don't believe it. I mean if you talk to people that are walking around here, we talked to people all day today here in L.A. People won't believe it unless this guy can actually prove it to them.
You know he says he's got to prove it to a jury. He's going to have to prove it to Los Angeles because he's built up, Kobe has, that much good will over seven years that nobody will believe it unless this guy comes through with evidence that's just impossible not to believe.
BUCKLEY: And you and I were talking about this a few days ago. You've observed him, this idea that yes he now says he was involved in a consensual relationship with this woman on this particular occasion. What about that and does that jive with whatever you've seen when you were on the road with him?
IRELAND: It's out of character, Frank. As a matter of fact, Kobe is the hardest Laker to get to when the Lakers are on the road. He travels with two bodyguards full time. These were guys that were with him when he was in Colorado. He doesn't - you can't call him at the hotel. He checks in under an alias. He's very difficult to get to because there are a lot of girls and he knows there are a lot of girls that will be trying to get to him.
And, this NBA lifestyle I've noticed, you know, traveling with these guys for the past few years that it's a common thing. I mean a lot of girls wait in the lobby. A lot of women hang out trying to get at these guys and Kobe knew it and put up a defense against it. So, it's ironic that he's being accused of something like this.
BUCKLEY: All right, John Ireland from KCAL thanks very much for your insight. We appreciate it and that's the perspective from someone who is traveling with the Lakers on a regular basis and someone who has been around Kobe Bryant quite a bit - Wolf.
BLITZER: Thanks very much Frank Buckley in Los Angeles.
This important reminder to our viewers, at 9:00 p.m. Easter, 6:00 p.m. Pacific, we'll be hearing directly from Kobe Bryant's attorney. She'll be speaking live here on CNN. We'll carry that live. Remember 9:00 p.m. Eastern right around the time of "LARRY KING LIVE." You'll want to stick with CNN throughout the night for that kind of information.
CNN Sports Larry Smith is standing by. Larry, a lot at stake for Kobe Bryant, obviously first and foremost possibly going to jail but, certainly in terms of his athletic career as a basketball superstar, there's enormous at stake as well.
LARRY SMITH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, not just for Kobe, not just for the Los Angeles Lakers but for the country. Keep in mind that Kobe Bryant said earlier this year that he would play on the U.S. Olympic Team. We did not fare well in last year's Olympics so Kobe is going to be on the team, which has to play in the qualifying, Olympic qualifying tournament.
SMITH: Not just for Kobe, not just for Los Angeles Lakers, but for the country. Keep in mind that Kobe Bryant said earlier this year that he would play on the U.S. Olympic team. We did not fare well in last year's Olympics, so Kobe is going to be on the team, which has to play in the qualifying -- Olympic qualifying tournament in San Juan, Puerto Rico beginning August 20, two weeks after he is scheduled to appear in court in Eagle County, Colorado. That's about a 10-day tournament in Puerto Rico. The success of the team in that tournament hinges upon -- will decide whether or not the USA basketball team will play in next summer's Olympic in Athens, Greece. Kobe also a member of that team as well.
The Lakers, as for them -- their training camp begins in early October. NBA regular season begins later that month, beginning of November. So there is much at stake in terms of just the court case itself and not even including what the verdict may be.
BLITZER: You've been around the league a long time, Larry. Can you buttress -- can you back up what was said by the radio reporter that we just had on CNN, that Kobe's reputation was anything but of a rapist, as he's alleged -- as he's being accused of being right now?
SMITH: Right now, he was right on the money ,that certainly if you did -- that as he said, if you took these circumstances and said name the player, Kobe would be one of the last players you would come up with, not assigning any guilt to anyone, but this scene does happen outside of arenas, outside of hotels. You can stick around an arena for 20 minutes and watch the ladies line up. Not to say it's case in this certain instance, but it does happen in many occasion, and something obviously, that every athlete, regardless of sport, regardless of level of sport, is aware of.
BLITZER: All right. Larry Smith from CNN Sports. Larry, thanks very much.
Much more coverage of this dramatic development, Kobe Bryant charged with sexual assault. We're going to continue our live coverage.
When we come back, we'll speak with a former prosecutor as well as a criminal defense attorney -- get their thoughts, where this moves next. What's next involving Kobe Bryant and the alleged victim?
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARK HURLBERT, EAGLE CO. DISTRICT ATTY: After much deliberation, charges were filed against Kobe Dean Bryant of Newport Beach, California.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Mark Hurlbert, he's the district attorney of Eagle County, California, announcing that Kobe Bryant has been charged with sexual assault, a class three felony, four years to life, possible penalty, according to Colorado law. He's accused of penetration or intrusion, submission of the victim through force. Next court date, October 6. Kobe Bryant denying flatly the allegation in a formal statement. Excuse me --August 6 is the next court date.
Kobe Bryant issuing the following statement through his attorney. I'll read it. "I am innocent of the charges filed today. I did not assault the woman who is accusing me. I made the mistake of adultery. I have to answer to my wife and my God for my actions that night and I pray that both will forgive me. Nothing that happened June 30 was against the will of the woman, who now falsely accuses me. These false allegations have hurt my family. I will fight against these allegations with all my strength. My wife is the strongest person I know. She is willing to stand by me despite my mistake. That means everything to me. I have so much to live for. By that I do not mean the contracts, the money or the fame. I mean my family. I will fight for them." Kobe Bryant goes on to say, "I appreciate all of those who have supported me. Thank you for believing in me. My family and I have going to need your support and prayers now more than ever."
A then in a statement -- a brief from his wife, Vanessa Bryant, also through the attorney. She says, "I know that my husband has made a mistake, the mistake of adultery. He and I will have to deal with that within our marriage and we will do so. He is not a criminal. I know that he did not commit a crime. He did not assault anyone." Vanessa Bryan going on to say she strongly will stand by her husband.
Let's get some more analysis now what this will mean in the decision with the Kobe Bryant case to go forward with this prosecution. Joining us now, two special guest. In Denver, the defense attorney, Larry Pozner. And in Boston, Wendy Murphy. She's a former federal prosecutor who teaches a sex crime course at the New England School of Law.
Wendy, thanks very much for joining us and Larry, thanks to you as well.
Wendy, let me get your thoughts first of all, on where this case is headed.
PROF. WENDY MURPHY, NEW ENGLAND SCHOOL OF LAW: Well, at this point, Wolf, it's going to be treated just like any other felony prosecution of a sex crimes case in that county. I mean, he's been indicted on a single charge. It was quite clear at this point that there is apparently some DNA proof that there was penetration and that a sexual assault occurred. And really, what's clear at this point is the only issue is consent or the absence of the consent, from the defense perspective.
You know, I really think this prosecutor was quite brave to do this. Prosecutors are elected officials. They sometimes worry about whether, if they do something unpopular, even though correct as a matter of law, that might hurt them at the next election. And that's what I worry about when I hear about high-profile cases with popular, potential defendants. I worry they won't be charged for all the wrong reasons. So I give this guy a great deal of credit.
Now, you know, apparently both sides are going to agree that a certain kind of sexual act occurred. Kobe's position will be that she wanted it, that was consensual. She's going to have to participate in a trial where she's going to have to persuade the in jury that it was forcible and without her consent. And what we've heard thus far is consistent with that. I mean, we don't know all the facts but we know there was a ruckus in the room, that she left crying and disheveled, that she immediately reported it as a sexual assault. Generally speaking, if I had a case like that, I would be quite happy because that's not what happens in most legitimate rape cases.
BLITZER: Larry, what do you think?
LARRY POZNER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: To say we haven't heard any of the facts is a gross overstatement. We haven't heard any of the facts.
You can't begin to find him guilty. We haven't heard whether there really was a commotion. We haven't heard the lab evidence. If there was a struggle and this woman was overcome by this enormously powerful man, are there bruises? Is there ripped clothing? Are there scratch marks? We need to know the facts. Right now, we know that the DNA evidence is of no value. She says they had sex. He says they had sex. So proof that there was sex doesn't advance the prosecution case one iota.
So, you know, was there yelling? What did the people downstairs hear? What did the people on either side hear? If there is no outcry, if there is no evidence supporting this, then it's going to be credibility and Kobe Bryant's credibility is completely different than Mike Tyson's credibility.
BLITZER: Wendy, go ahead.
MURPHY: Well, that may be, but, you know -- look, Kobe Bryant is charged with a crime in a very small town in Colorado where people may well take the position that he is an entitled, wealthy athlete who came to town expecting to get whatever he wanted, including access to this woman. So they may not see him as the kind of credible person who couldn't possibly do anything wrong and if he says he didn't do it, then that must be true.
I think he comes to this case on equal footing with the victim, as it should be in every rape case. And this is somebody that the community knows in terms of her identity and her reputation as well. And thus far, for all the nice things we've heard about Kobe, which may well be true, we've heard equally nice things about this young woman. So yes, proving credibility can be difficult because you're really asking jurors to look in the eyes of each of them and look at their demeanor and when they describe what happened, you have to kind of assess whether you buy it and not only buy it, but for the prosecution's perspective, buy it beyond a reasonable doubt, which is a very, very high standard.
But, look, that's what most rape cases involve. And I heard somebody say earlier we have to look for corroboration and I heard Larry describe how he would be concerned if there wasn't corroboration for the victim's story. We haven't required corroboration in rape cases in 30 years in this country. Thankfully, we evolved. The word of a woman, the word of any person in this country who reports crime and is credible enough to persuade a jury beyond a reasonable doubt that the crime occurred is sufficient without corroboration to sustain a conviction beyond a reasonable doubt. If the jury believes her, he will be convicted.
BLITZER: And a lot of people. Larry, I want you to respond to that, but a lot of people in that jury is going to say, this is a 19- year-old girl, she was well known in the community, she was a cheerleader, she was in college, very likable, no previous accusations of rape, no indication she had a problem going on. Won't they normally tend to be sympathetic toward her?
POZNER: I think that they may well be sympathetic towards her, but juries take the oath. And I believe jurors abide by the oath. We start with this presumption, it's not that he's rich that matters. It's not that he's powerful. That shouldn't make a difference. We're not asking people to say that's a plus for him, but it ought not be a minus. We ought not start with this nonsense of a rich man came to town and demanded anything he wanted. Where is the evidence?
The standard in this case will be the standard as it has been in America for 200 years. For the rich and the poor. Which is, can the prosecution prove its allegation beyond a reasonable doubt? Now, in doing that, this woman, like any witness, will be put on trial in the sense that a jury's going to have to judge her credibility. We ought not rewrite the law to say if somebody says they're a victim, somebody else is automatically guilty.
BLITZER: Alright, standby, Wendy, standby, Larry, standby Jeffrey Toobin, too, our legal analyst. He's in New York. Jeffrey, the next step presumably in this case, August 6, that's when Kobe Bryant, according to Mark Hulbert the district attorney, will be required to appear at a court proceeding. What's going to happen at that proceeding?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, Wolf, I don't have a great expertise in Colorado criminal procedure. What usually happens in criminal cases at this stage is the judge will start to set a schedule. He'll set a schedule for motions, motions to suppress evidence, motions for change of venue. He or she will set a schedule for how the case will proceed. And ultimately, it will go to trial. We'll certainly get a better sense on August 6 of how quickly the case will proceed.
BLITZER: And based on what you're hearing right now, as far as the whole question of evidence, the evidence is going to be critical presumably in determining Kobe Bryant's fate right now. How important is the corroborating evidence, the contemporaneous evidence that there was a commotion, there may have been noise, she may have been in tears, she may have been crying or whatever, that's obviously going to be very important?
TOOBIN: Critical. And Wendy makes a good point, in the old days there used to be a legal requirement. You could not get a rape conviction unless there was corroboration and that legal requirement is long gone. However prosecutors, attempting to prove their case, always look for corroboration.
Corroboration is the key to these cases. Are there bruises. Are there other witnesses, did people hear something, how long did it take for her to complain that she was attacked. These sorts of things are always critical in a case where there are only two people in the room when the crime itself took place -- alleged crime.
BLITZER: All right. Jeffrey, stand by. I want to read to our viewers a statement we've just received from David Stern, the commissioner of the NBA. "As with all allegations of a criminal nature," he says, "the NBA's policy is to await the outcome of a judicial proceeding before taking any action. We do not anticipate making further comments during the pendency of the judicial process." Wendy Murphy, you're a former federal prosecutor, as you look at this case, the fact that Kobe Bryant, by almost everyone's account, has a sterling reputation as a really likable, nice guy, not one of these mean spirited kinds of athletes who got carried away with himself, how important is that that almost everyone who knows him says this is totally, totally out of character.
MURPHY: Well it matters, Wolf. It really does. It matters more in the court of public opinion, I think, than ultimately it will matter to the jury. And the secret there is the prosecutor has to be careful when screening the jurors that jurors don't sit down with a sort of celebrity glaze in their eyes when they look at him. You don't want them not paying attention to the evidence because he's their hero. You want them to think of him as just any other person. Similarly with the victim, you want people to come to this case stripped of any kind of bias or prejudice and that means not think he must be innocent just because he's a good ball player.
Look, how many Catholic priests were really nice guys and then what did we hear they were doing behind closed doors? I don't think you get any extra points just because you've never done this before. There are lots of very, very nice people in this country who do very bad things.
BLITZER: What about that, Larry?
POZNER: Well, you know, that misses the point. The jury is going to look at two human beings. Forget that he plays basketball. His entire persona, his character is that he's a respected gentleman. Now, how does a prosecutor start with a person with no blemishes, a person thought to be kind and gentle and say that one night he checked into a lodge at Cordillera at 10:00 at night, there's no alcohol involved, there's no drugs involved and he became a sex-crazed maniac raping strangers. That is an enormous leap of faith. And the prosecutor can only get there with cold, hard facts. Wolf, we simply don't know the facts yet.
BLITZER: We certain don't know the facts yet. Jeffrey Toobin, this whole issue of Kobe Bryant's background, all of us who have watched basketball over the years, knows that he's such a great ballplayer but he's also comes across as such a wonderful nice young man. How important will it be if the prosecution has no prior evidence of anything that's consistent with an allegation of rape?
TOOBIN: Well, certainly going into a trial like this in a rape case you want to -- if the government is allowed to put on that kind of evidence, you'd like to have the opportunity to put it on. But let's remember something, the same people who are saying today, you know, Kobe Bryant is, you know, not a rapist, he's a great guy, it's completely inconsistent with everything we know. Yesterday they were all saying, well, he would never cheat on his wife. He's not that kind of person. He's very loyal to his wife, well we know part of that is out the window.
So this idea that we somehow know the personality of celebrities, I think, you know, we often just don't know. And the idea that we have the sense that Kobe Bryant is a nice guy or on some other celebrity is a nice guy. The fact is we may simply be wrong. We were at least wrong about half of the equation here. BLITZER: Jeffrey, I have to remind you, because most of the viewers will remember that you covered the O.J. Simpson trial in Los Angeles and those of us who grew up in Buffalo and were Buffalo Bills fans know that O.J. Simpson had a wonderful reputation as such a nice guy as well.
PORZEN: Wolf, I was waiting for you to say that name first. I wasn't going to be the first but certainly was thinking about it. Absolutely. O.J. Simpson, nice guy, big smile, everybody thought he was terrific. But in fairness, there was, coming into the Simpson case, he had already been convicted of domestic violence. So there was a chink in the public armor already and there's certainly nothing that we know about that regarding Kobe Bryant.
But the idea that because a public figure has a reputation of a nice guy, I really would not put a lot of stock in that. I'm not saying he isn't a nice guy but the reputation I don't think really matters in terms of the actual truth of what kind of person they really are.
BLITZER: Let me have Wendy go and then I'll let Larry have the last word. But Wendy, you know there's going to be a lot of comparisons made to O.J. Simpson and Kobe Bryant.
MURPHY: Oh absolutely. I mean, people are -- there's no question, they're star struck. These are, you know, role models. My son adores Kobe Bryant and thinks he's a wonderful ballplayer and a very nice person. The fact is, as Jeffrey said, that may be true on one level and entirely false on another.
You know, it's important to remember what the criminal justice system wants people to do when they sit as jurors. And I hope what the public will do as well. You don't necessarily decide the truth of a case based on what happened last year or two years ago in terms of Kobe Bryant's life or reputation. Similarly, with the victim. She may somewhere done something horrible two years ago. That doesn't elucidate the truth in this case.
And I would make the same argument if you told me Kobe Bryant, you know, assaulted somebody five years ago. I'd say that doesn't tell us anything, either, and it's not fair to judge him today based on something bad he did five years ago. We don't do that in the criminal justice system. We're supposed to limit our scope to the facts, attendant to the exact case in terms of time and subject matter parameters. It's extremely important to be fair to both sides by keeping our focus very, very narrow.
BLITZER: And Larry I'll give you the last word, but I'll throw out this thought to you. You know the comparisons are going to be made with O.J. Simpson. How badly will this damage Kobe Bryant?
PORZEN: If there is one piece of advice I could give you in the media, it is understand the O.J. case stands for nothing but O.J. It is not symptomatic of America. It is one case and it is unfortunate when we change American jurisprudence because of that verdict. This man should go to trial on this charge on the facts in this case. And whatever happened to another person on another day is irrelevant.
Every time we bring up O.J. we bring up something of no value. We need to hear what happened here and what evidence supports her allegation that not only was there sexual penetration or intrusion, but it was by force, by this very, very powerful man. Are there bruises, are there torn clothes, what is the evidence that supports it because that's what a jury is going to want to know. Who heard what?
MURPHY: It's not necessary.
BLITZER: Larry -- Larry Pozner, Wendy -- Wendy Murphy, unfortunately, we have to leave it right there. Jeffrey Toobin, thanks to you as well.
We'll continue our coverage. This is a story that's only obviously just beginning. Once again, we're expecting to hear from Kobe Bryant's attorney in just a few hours. You can see her live at a news conference here on CNN. We'll get more on the latest information on the case. That will be right at the beginning of CNN's "LARRY KING LIVE," 9:00 p.m. Eastern, 6:00 Pacific, only here on CNN.
Just ahead, the president's troubles in the Iraq weapons controversy, pressure on Tony Blair. More political infighting here in Washington. No one, I repeat, no one is better qualified to talk about all of these things than the lady you're looking at right now. Cokie Roberts, she'll join us live next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Welcome back.
Turning now to the volatile, volatile situation in Iraq, a soldier in the 3rd Infantry Division was killed today in an explosion near the city of Fallujah. Officials say it happened when the victim's vehicle drove over an improvised explosive device. The soldier was the 23rd American serviceman killed in Iraq this month alone. Eighty-nine American troops have been killed in Iraq since President Bush declared an end of major combat operations on May 1.
British police say they found a body matching the description of David Kelly. He's the former U.N. weapons inspector who never came back from a walk yesterday afternoon. Kelly was accused by the British government of being the source for a controversial BBC report claiming the government hyped pre-war intelligence on Iraq's weapons.
By next guest has covered wars, Washington, everything else in between over a span of more than 30 years in journalism. For the last 15, Cokie Roberts have been with ABC News. She's also a senior analyst, of course, for NPR, National Public Radio.
Cokie, thanks very much for joining us. In the scheme of -- let's say, of over the past 30 years, this current...
COKIE ROBERTS, ABC NEWS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) really old.
BLITZER: The current uproar right now -- I've been here 30 years, too. The current uproar here in Washington over what the president knew about the intelligence going into the war -- how big of a deal is this?
ROBERTS: It's a big deal, and the Democrats are going to keep it alive as long as they humanly can and turn it into a bigger deal.
But the question is how does the American people feel about it? And at the moment, there's some hesitation, but the polls are not showing that people are furious about it.
BLITZER: The whole nature of the Democrats thinking that this is an opportunity for them to score points -- is it?
ROBERTS: Maybe. I think the Democrats have to be very careful when they try to score points on questions of national security because they do so poorly on it in the polls, including some of their own polls, showing them at 30 points behind the Republicans on national security questions, which is a terrible place to be. So they have been searching for ways to have a voice on the issue. But if their voice sounds like it's one that is saying, "Well, we shouldn't have really been in Iraq to begin with," I'm not sure that's going to work for them.
BLITZER: They might do better just sticking to the economy, let's say?
ROBERTS: Sticking to the economy, sticking to healthcare, sticking to things that are in their purview where they do very well.
BLITZER: Prescription drug benefits, things like that.
ROBERTS: Today they have a big brouhaha on the floor of the House over -- well, over the way they had been treated in committee, but it was over a pension bill. They bring things like that out. People trust the Democrats on those issues.
BLITZER: Tony Blair was in Washington yesterday.
ROBERTS: And he was terrific.
BLITZER: He got a tremendous reception at Capitol Hill, a lot better than he does in the House of Commons.
ROBERTS: As he said.
BLITZER: As all of us know. Is this a big boost for President Bush to have that kind of ally like Tony Blair?
ROBERTS: Certainly helps to have an ally like tony Blair. And Tony Blair, having the support of all of those Republicans must amuse him somewhat. But as you recall, George Bush's father somewhat supported Tony Blair's opponent when he was running for prime minister.
But Blair's speech was really eloquent and it did give you a moment of pride as an American. I don't think there's any question about that, when he talked about this is the land of freedom for people of all colors, all fades. And he did it beautifully.
Unfortunately for the president, a lot of that was never seen by anybody. It was seen here on CNN in the middle of the afternoon.
BLITZER: It was seen in primetime in London, though.
ROBERTS: Primetime in London, so it worked for Tony Blair. I don't know how well it worked for George Bush.
BLITZER: What does the president and his advisers in the White House, need to do -- what do they need to do right now to get this flap behind them?
ROBERTS: They need to just stop doing all of this Clintonesque parsing of what is the meaning of is is. You know -- well, it might -- it just didn't rise to the level of a presidential address. What does that mean? Nobody know what's that means. And was it true or was it not true? Sure, the statement that the British said it was accurate but, you know, that's like I'm saying you told me Kobe Bryant did it.
BLITZER: Yes.
ROBERTS: You know, that might be accurate, you told me that but it's not accurate that he did it.
BLITZER: I didn't tell you that.
ROBERTS: And you didn't tell me that. Let's get that clear.
BLITZER: Before I let you go, quick thought on this whole Kobe Bryant allegation. He's accused of raping this 19-year-old girl.
ROBERTS: Look, I have -- obviously, neither does anybody else, by the way, have any idea whether it's true or not except the two of them. I have to tell you that with a name like Cokie, anybody named Kobe is in trouble, it's always a problem because you think that it might be you.
BLITZER: I'm sure that's the first thing that went through your mind, Kobe, Cokie. Cokie, how you feel...
(CROSSTALK)
ROBERTS: I have the same problem with Kofi Annan.
BLITZER: Tell our viewers, because they all want to know, how are you feeling? How are you doing?
ROBERTS: I feel great, thank you, and I've gotten a very clean bill of health.
BLITZER: Thank God.
ROBERTS: Yes.
BLITZER: Good. Cokie, Roberts, a great friend of ours. Thanks for joining us.
ROBERTS: And you're a good friend, Wolf. Thank you.
BLITZER: Thank you very much.
Our "Web Question of the Day" is this -- we want to remind you -- "Do you think that Kobe Bryant is being treated fairly?" You can vote right now, cnn.com/wolf. We'll have the results when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Here's how you're weighing in on our "Web Question of the Day." We've been asking you this: "Do you think Kobe Bryant is being treated fairly?" Look at this: 51 percent of you say yes, 49 percent of you say no. As always, we remind you, this is not a scientific poll.
That's all the time I have.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired July 18, 2003 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much guys.
We're standing by for a dramatic announcement. In just seconds, one of pro basketball's brightest stars will learn what he's up against. Will Kobe Bryant face sexual assault charges? We're having full coverage this hour.
WOLF BLITZER REPORTS starts right now.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER (voice-over): Kobe Bryant's hour or reckoning, the alleged incident at a Colorado resort, the accounts conflicting, the evidence crucial.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The prosecutor should have everything that he needs in order to make this decision himself. It would not be a good idea to punt.
BLITZER: Two young lives in the balance, a 24-year-old star with a cultivated role model image, a 19-year-old woman with a reputation of her own at stake.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When you have a possible he-said she-said situation that gets problematic.
BLITZER: Reaction from the Lakers who stood by their teammate.
Did it happen again? Department store cameras zoom in on the convicted sexual predator.
He hunted for Saddam's weapons of mass destruction, now a mystery surrounding this British scientist's surprising death; and President Bush on the defensive; a tumultuous week in Iraq; a provocative discussion with Cokie Roberts of ABC News.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CNN live this hour WOLF BLITZER REPORTS live from the nation's capital with correspondents from around the world. WOLF BLITZER REPORTS starts now.
BLITZER: You're looking at a live picture at Eagle County in Colorado. We're standing by for a news conference by the District Attorney. It's expected to begin any second now. He'll be announcing whether or not he will go forward with charges against the Los Angeles Laker star Kobe Bryant who's been accused of sexual assault. We have reporters covering the story. CNN's Brian Cabell is in Eagle. He's on the scene for us where the announcement is expected to begin any minute now.
CNN National Correspondent Frank Buckley is at the Staples Center in Los Angeles. That's the home, of course, of the Los Angeles Lakers.
Brian any indication when this will begin?
BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: About one minute ago or so, Wolf, we got the two-minute warning which would mean if my arithmetic is right we will see Mark Hurlbert, the D.A., come out of the door any minute now to make that announcement.
We're expecting him to come out with an announcement. Alongside him, we're told the Sheriff Joe Hoy will also be there for support and also have a brief announcement.
You might recall that just about two weeks ago these two had a bit of a rift over the timing of the Kobe Bryant arrest but they will be appearing together here any moment at the Justice Center for Eagle County.
The decision will be basically this. File charges against Kobe Bryant or don't file charges against him. The prosecutors had two weeks to pour over the evidence, the latest evidence that's come from the Colorado Bureau of Investigation, and now finally he feels he does have a decision.
He informed the alleged victim's family of his decision yesterday. What you can conclude from that we're not quite sure. But, again, the rest of us in just a matter of minutes, perhaps seconds, we are going to learn exactly what this prosecutor has decided - Wolf.
BLITZER: All right, we're looking at these live pictures. It looks like they're walking out right now. Mark Hurlbert, there he is with the red tie going to the microphones. Let's listen in right now to hear about Kobe Bryant.
(BREAKING NEWS)
MARK HURLBERT, EAGLE CO. DISTRICT ATTY.: Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen. For those of you that don't know, I'm Mark Hurlbert. I'm the district attorney here in the Fifth Judicial District. That's Clear Creek Lake, Summit, and Eagle Counties, and I want to thank you all for coming.
First of all, I'd like to, as we did last time, talk about a few of the parameters here, what this is all about and what I can and can't say. First of all, as I told you in our press release, this is about the announcement on whether I'm filing charges or not. Also, I cannot comment on the facts of this case and I will not comment on the facts of this case. Earlier today after much deliberation charges were filed about Kobe Bean Bryant of Newport Beach, California. There should be a copy of the complaint. We'll provide you each with a copy of the complaint in this case.
The defendant was charged with one count of sexual assault, a class 3 felony. Penalties on this class 3 felony are that if it's a prison term it's from four years to life imprisonment. If it's a probation term, it's from 20 years to life.
As in any sex assault case, ladies and gentlemen, this did not come easily. This decision came only after reviewing all the evidence, testimonial evidence and physical evidence, after reviewing the relevant statutes, after reviewing the relevant case law, and after conferring with prosecutors from around the state. Then, and only then, did I make my decision.
This case, the standards are the same in this case as in any case, the rules are the same in this case as in any other case. The defendant's next court date is August 6, 2003 at one o'clock. At that time, it is expected that he will be advised of the charges against him and be advised of his rights. It is also a bond appearance day so he will be required to appear at that time.
Finally, ladies and gentlemen of the media, I ask you to respect the victim's privacy in this matter. It's been very difficult for her making it more difficult with all the media attention and I ask you to respect her privacy in this.
She is not going to - has indicated she is not going to talk to any people of the media and is going to refer all questions to my office, and actually in my office we have hired a person to handle the press, a spokesperson Christa Flannigan (ph) who is back in there will be handling all of the press contacts from now on. If before you leave here you would give her your cards and she will be able to get a hold of you and be able to deal with any press contacts.
And, finally, again I urge you to please respect the victim's privacy in this case. This is extremely difficult. I ask you to respect her privacy.
Are there any questions?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How difficult was this decision for you and your office?
HURLBERT: Well, with any sex assault, with any felony really, it is a serious decision. My office takes it seriously. I take it seriously and it is difficult. It is very difficult.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you told the victim's family about this, what did the victim's family say to you when you told them you were going to charge Kobe Bryant?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to talk about anything that happened between me and the victim's family or anything that may have been said.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Hurlbert, under class 3 felony under Colorado does that mean - what is under that category? Does that mean it is only rape or what could fall into that category?
HURLBERT: When we hand out the complaints it will make it more - it will make it more - it will make it more clear but, basically, it is alleged that he caused sexual penetration or intrusion and he caused submission of the victim through actual physical force and that is contained in the complaint.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, do you consider the strength of your case the physical evidence or the testimonials?
HURLBERT: I'm sorry?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you consider the strength of your case the physical evidence or the testimonials?
HURLBERT: You know in any felony case, in any case and this was no exception, you look at everything and you make your decisions based upon all the evidence not just one piece of evidence or not just one part of the evidence and that's what I did in this case. I've relied on everything testimonial, physical, everything in the code.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Hurlbert, Manny Magrano (ph) of KNBC, sir. Obviously, the celebrity hood of the defendant here is well know. In your view was the evidence able to be evaluated fairly and objectively before you made your critical decision today?
HURLBERT: I believe it was. I believe that we were able to look at all the evidence and with the consultation of other prosecutors I believe we were able to look at it fairly. As I said, we're treating this case like any other case. I understand as I'm saying that as I'm looking at about 20 cameras here but surely when you're evaluating whether to file charges or not that doesn't come into play. We evaluate this like any other case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there evidence of tearing or marks on the body, sir?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to comment to anything on the facts.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Apparently you have done sexual assault cases before and if you have how do you prepare young victims like this for what could lie ahead for her? This isn't going to be an easy few months.
HURLBERT: Well, as far as doing any sexual assault cases before, yes, I have done several sexual assault cases and, frankly, being honest and up front is the best way to handle it. To deal with any - actually a victim in any case and that's what my office does and that's what we will continue to do. I heard some over here.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You're talking about how difficult it is. Can you expand a little bit on this? I imagine this has been a rough couple of weeks on her.
HURLBERT: It has been rough. She's holding out OK but I'll just leave it at it's been difficult - to you in the blue shirt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you talk about the strength of your case?
HURLBERT: Well, I believe that we can - I have an ethical burden not to prosecute a case unless I can prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. I feel that after reviewing the evidence, after looking at the evidence that I can prove this case beyond a reasonable doubt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Unintelligible). We've got a well known defendant. Will the victim come forward?
HURLBERT: Will she talk to the media, is that what you're asking?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And expand on her charges as a person with a name?
HURLBERT: Well, she does not want to talk with the media at this time and will refer everything to my office and to Christa Flannigan.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Hurlbert, it may be premature but clearly this is coming down the road assuming there is no plea disposition. Do you anticipate a change of venue for this high profile case?
HURLBERT: Well, and again I don't really want to comment on the procedures that may happen but I would certainly hope to try this case in Eagle County. It is a crime that happened here in Eagle County and citizens of Eagle County deserve to hear it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Hurlbert, based on sort of fast track laws in Colorado, when do you anticipate this actually going to trial? Kind of walk us through a typical case.
HURLBERT: You know I don't really want to - each case is different and each case is - I don't even want to comment on that because there are so many things that can change the length of the case and I don't want to give you something that could be wildly different.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mark, did the other prosecutors advise you to proceed with this or are you bucking the trend of advice that they said not to file charges here? What was the advice from the other prosecutors?
HURLBERT: I'll just say that I have reviewed everything with other prosecutors around the state and I don't really want to get into those discussions either. I think it's prudent to say that I have reviewed everything with them - you in the white shirt in the back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You had mentioned a difficulty in arriving at a decision. Was the difficulty in arriving at a decision whether or not to file charges or the difficulty in arriving at a class 3 felony? HURLBERT: Really in any felony case it's a difficulty in really deciding to file charges. In this case it was, and I suppose the difficulty is reviewing all the evidence. The difficult is reviewing that, making sure that you have all the evidence and, as I said, reviewing the physical evidence and the testimonial evidence.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mark, obviously you probably may not think this is important but a lot of people hearing this would realize that an NBA season is coming up this fall. Do you think Kobe Bryant will be playing for the Lakers this fall or will the trial be at that particular time?
HURLBERT: I can't comment on what will happen with him and the Lakers. My job is this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mark, how fully do you think you know what went on in that room that night?
HURLBERT: How, I'm sorry?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How fully do you think you know what happened in that room that night?
HURLBERT: Well, as I said, after reviewing the evidence, after looking at the testimonial evidence, the physical evidence, et cetera, it appears that I have a - can prove my case beyond a reasonable doubt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there a person that might have heard screams?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to comment on the facts.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Hurlbert, how much - obviously this will be an expensive case to try. Will you ask for additional funds from the state and how are you going to (unintelligible) with that?
HURLBERT: Well, right now my - everything up to this point was in reviewing the evidence and deciding whether to file charges or not. I will sit down in the next couple of weeks and make any decision on if we need any more money in this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, I know you...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Has Kobe Bryant been cooperative? Has he been cooperative? Has Kobe Bryant been cooperative with you?
HURLBERT: I don't really want to comment to anything on what's going on with Mr. Bryant or his attorneys in this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know you can't comment on the facts but can you tell us do you actually have witness testimony as to what happened that evening?
HURLBERT: I have witness testimony. I have physical evidence. I have various things in this case. I mean it's the full case. I guess I'm misunderstanding your question.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there someone other than this alleged victim who has been giving you testimony as to what happened?
HURLBERT: I'm not going to comment to anything on the facts of this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Again, Manny Madrano, KNBC. Under the glare of the national spotlight was this a difficult case for you to evaluate and ultimately make your decision?
HURLBERT: As I said before any sex assault case frankly is a - is very, very difficult and I take it seriously. I take every case that I prosecute seriously and really the overriding goal in all of this is justice for the victim, justice for the people of Eagle County and I apologize.
I have to get going but - and I think we've said that I'm not going to be doing any interviews for the rest of the day. It's been a rather trying couple of weeks but if anybody would want to contact our office, I will be doing interviews tomorrow and on Monday. Thank you very much.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.
BLITZER: And there he is Mark Hurlbert. He's the district attorney for Eagle County in Colorado announcing he is going forward. He has indeed filed charges against Kobe Bryant, one count sexual assault, what he described as a class 3 felony, possible penalty four years to life in prison, possible probation 20 years to life in prison.
We are now getting a statement from Kobe Bryant via his attorney in Orange County, California, a very important statement suggesting what Kobe Bryant's defense is going to be. Let me read Kobe Bryant's statement to you our viewers in full.
Kobe Bryant says: "I am innocent of the charges filed today. I did not assault the woman who is accusing me. I made the mistake of adultery. I have to answer to my wife and my God for my actions that night and I pray that both will forgive me."
He goes on to say: "Nothing that happened June 30th was against the will of the woman who now falsely accuses me. These false allegations" he says "have hurt my family. I will fight against these allegations with all my strength. My wife is the strongest person I know. She is willing to stand by me despite any mistake. That means everything to me."
Finally, Kobe Bryant in his statement says this: "I have so much to live for and by that I do not mean the contracts or the money or the fame. I mean my family. I will fight for them. I appreciate all those who have supported me. Thank you for believing in me. My family and I are going to need your support and prayers now more than ever."
And this, a statement from Kobe Bryant's wife, Vanessa Bryant saying this: "I know that my husband has made a mistake the mistake of adultery. He and I will have to deal with that within our marriage and we will do so. He is not a criminal."
Vanessa Bryant goes on to say: "I know that he did not commit a crime. He did not assault anyone. He is a loving and kind husband and father. I believe in his innocence. Because I know him to be innocent I will stand by him and we will face this together.
I will give him all the strength and support he needs to face these false accusations. I will not let him face these accusations alone. I know Kobe better than anyone" she says. "The great person you see on the court and in the public is a far greater person off the court," statements from Kobe Bryant and his wife Vanessa.
Let's bring in Jeffrey Toobin our legal analyst who knows a great deal about the law and these kinds of cases. Jeffrey, we see obviously what his defense is going to be. It's going to be that she consented.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: These are often the most difficult cases to prove for the prosecution because they tend to be one person's word against another. The physical evidence, which can be so important, becomes much less important when the defenses consent because obviously the defendant concedes that sexual relations took place.
What becomes crucial, what becomes the entire focus of the case is the issue of corroboration. How does the prosecution corroborate the victim's story of whether the sex was consensual or non- consensual? Were there injuries? Did she report them immediately?
Was there any prior relationship between the two that would indicate some level of consent? Those are the issues that will come to the fore immediately and they will be played out on very much a national stage it looks like.
BLITZER: And, the kind of physical evidence that this prosecutor, this district attorney needs in order to convince a grand jury - a jury that is beyond a reasonable doubt is what, beyond the DNA, because the DNA could suggest it would be consensual? They need more than just DNA.
TOOBIN: Absolutely. The DNA, I mean the one thing about a consent defense is that the DNA becomes essentially irrelevant because both sides agree that sex took place. What he is likely to need, and I truthfully don't know whether he has it, is evidence for example of some injury to the woman.
It is far better for the prosecution if there is some sort of evidence or photograph or some indication that the sex was non- consensual. That becomes a very big issue any sort of immediate statements by either party, admissions by Kobe Bryant. I mean one of the important things to remember here is Kobe Bryant was with some other people during this period. Did he make any admissions? Did he show any consciousness of guilt to them or to others in the immediate period after that? That's going to become very important all the surrounding circumstances. Those will be the central disputed facts in this case.
BLITZER: How important is it that his wife has now come forward and given this extraordinary statement of support for her husband?
TOOBIN: I think it's awfully helpful. It's not helpful in the sense of it probably isn't even admissible in a court of law but when you deal with these high profile cases the jury pool is watching you, is watching all the coverage of this case and defendant who is - whose family stands by him tends to stand in much better stead than one who has been abandoned and, you know, even though it's not a legally admissible fact, I think it's helpful.
BLITZER: One thing that's obviously going to happen assuming this goes to trial, Jeffrey, is that this woman is going to be smeared, is going to be slammed by the defense attorneys representing Kobe Bryant. She's 19 years old, a recent high school grad. She's now in college.
I assume the prosecution, the district attorney, have gone through and warned her what she can expect and I want you to give us your thoughts on that in just a second.
But I want to go to our Brian Cabell. He's on the scene for us in Eagle County. He's got some additional information and then I want to get back to you Jeffrey on that question. Go ahead, Brian.
CABELL: Yes, Wolf, we just got a copy of the complaint that was just filed. Essentially it says count 1, and that is the only count: "That on or about the 30th day of June, 2003, in the said County of Eagle, State of Colorado, Kobe Bean Bryant unlawfully, feloniously, and knowingly inflicted sexual intrusion or sexual penetration on causing submission of the victim by means of sufficient consequence reasonably calculated to cause submission against victim's will.
Further, the defendant caused submission of the victim through the actual application of physical force or physical violence in violation of Section 18.3" - et cetera, et cetera. Penalty four years to live in the Department of Corrections, 20 years up to life if probation imposed pursuant to 18.13 and possible fine of $3,000 to $750,000.
Again, this was the complaint that was just filed apparently in the last hour - Wolf.
BLITZER: All right stand by, Brian, because we're going to be getting back to you.
I want to bring Jeffrey back in. Jeffrey, first of all, before we get to my question when you just heard the actual words of the charges what did it say to you? TOOBIN: Well, it says that this is a rape case. I mean there's nothing - it's sexual assault but I mean the claim is that Kobe Bryant raped this woman and that is, you know, it's a truly, truly awful crime, one that even though theoretically the sentence could be as low as four years it's very rarely that little if someone is convicted. So, Kobe Bryant is looking at going to jail for quite a long time.
BLITZER: The alleged victim in this case what can she expect now?
TOOBIN: Well, you know, this is usually the prime legal battleground between prosecution and defense in a rape case where the defenses consent. Colorado, like most states, has what's called a rape shield law which protects victims from having their sexual history bared in public to a certain extent.
But, if the defense can show that there is some history of false allegations of rape or can show some sort of pattern of behavior that this is consistent with, a rape shield law can be overcome. Those kind of legal arguments are often very heated and very critical in determining whether someone is convicted or not.
BLITZER: Jeffrey, I want you to stand by because we have a lot more to talk about including the next steps for Kobe Bryant as this legal process moves forward. Stand by.
I want to take a quick break. I also want to alert our viewers that they have a chance to weigh in on this story. Our web question of the day is this. "Do you think Kobe Bryant is being treated fairly?" We'll have the results later this h our. You can vote at cnn.com/wolf.
While you're there send me your comments. I'll try to read some of them on the air each day at the end of this program. That's also where you can read my daily online column, cnn.com/wolf, much more coverage coming up.
How do the prosecutors handle this Kobe Bryant case? What do they do now? Where should they go? We'll hear from a prominent defense attorney as well as a former federal prosecutor who teaches sex crime law in a law school.
And, we'll also go live to our Frank Buckley. He's at the Staples Center in Los Angeles to hear how the decision to file charges against Kobe Bryant is being received in California. Stay with us. We have extensive coverage of this for the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: If you're just tuning in, Kobe Bryant, the Los Angeles Lakers basketball star has been charged one count sexual assault, a class 3 felony, in Colorado, could face four years to life in prison.
Let's get some reaction now on what's going on in Los Angeles. For that our National Correspondent Frank Buckley is standing by at the Staples Center. That's the home, of course, of the Lakers any immediate reaction from there Frank?
FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Wolf, we've already started talking to some folks.
I'd like to introduce you right now to Chris Chambers. He is a coach for a junior team of young girls. They are here to play in Staples Center. We told you what the announcement was regarding Kobe Bryant, just your immediate reaction?
CHRIS CHAMBERS, COACH: Just like I said, I don't - it's not Kobe's character and I hope they find him innocent, you know. He's a tremendous person and I really love him as a fan, you know.
BUCKLEY: And you coach a team of girls, teenage girls. What do you tell them now about this kind of an announcement?
CHAMBERS: I tell them to watch where they're at and as a team, you know, they have to stick together and just watch where they're at and watch the people that's around them, you know, because anything can happen, you know.
BUCKLEY: Okay, Mr. Chambers, thank you very much for the fan reaction.
I'd also like to bring in our friend John Ireland here from KCAL (ph) TV. John, you are the sideline reporter for the Los Angeles Lakers. You've traveled with Kobe extensively. You've been around him quite a bit, your reaction to the announcement today?
JOHN IRELAND, LAKERS COMMENTATOR: I'm not shocked that they charged him. I think that over the past week that's where it's been going, Frank. We've kind of been able to piece together that the charges were coming. But if you were to come to me and tell me the story but not include the name of the person, Kobe would have been the last guy on the roster who I would have thought would have been accused of this.
And, frankly, I'm sure you heard the reaction from the coach, the people in Los Angeles still don't believe it. I mean if you talk to people that are walking around here, we talked to people all day today here in L.A. People won't believe it unless this guy can actually prove it to them.
You know he says he's got to prove it to a jury. He's going to have to prove it to Los Angeles because he's built up, Kobe has, that much good will over seven years that nobody will believe it unless this guy comes through with evidence that's just impossible not to believe.
BUCKLEY: And you and I were talking about this a few days ago. You've observed him, this idea that yes he now says he was involved in a consensual relationship with this woman on this particular occasion. What about that and does that jive with whatever you've seen when you were on the road with him?
IRELAND: It's out of character, Frank. As a matter of fact, Kobe is the hardest Laker to get to when the Lakers are on the road. He travels with two bodyguards full time. These were guys that were with him when he was in Colorado. He doesn't - you can't call him at the hotel. He checks in under an alias. He's very difficult to get to because there are a lot of girls and he knows there are a lot of girls that will be trying to get to him.
And, this NBA lifestyle I've noticed, you know, traveling with these guys for the past few years that it's a common thing. I mean a lot of girls wait in the lobby. A lot of women hang out trying to get at these guys and Kobe knew it and put up a defense against it. So, it's ironic that he's being accused of something like this.
BUCKLEY: All right, John Ireland from KCAL thanks very much for your insight. We appreciate it and that's the perspective from someone who is traveling with the Lakers on a regular basis and someone who has been around Kobe Bryant quite a bit - Wolf.
BLITZER: Thanks very much Frank Buckley in Los Angeles.
This important reminder to our viewers, at 9:00 p.m. Easter, 6:00 p.m. Pacific, we'll be hearing directly from Kobe Bryant's attorney. She'll be speaking live here on CNN. We'll carry that live. Remember 9:00 p.m. Eastern right around the time of "LARRY KING LIVE." You'll want to stick with CNN throughout the night for that kind of information.
CNN Sports Larry Smith is standing by. Larry, a lot at stake for Kobe Bryant, obviously first and foremost possibly going to jail but, certainly in terms of his athletic career as a basketball superstar, there's enormous at stake as well.
LARRY SMITH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, not just for Kobe, not just for the Los Angeles Lakers but for the country. Keep in mind that Kobe Bryant said earlier this year that he would play on the U.S. Olympic Team. We did not fare well in last year's Olympics so Kobe is going to be on the team, which has to play in the qualifying, Olympic qualifying tournament.
SMITH: Not just for Kobe, not just for Los Angeles Lakers, but for the country. Keep in mind that Kobe Bryant said earlier this year that he would play on the U.S. Olympic team. We did not fare well in last year's Olympics, so Kobe is going to be on the team, which has to play in the qualifying -- Olympic qualifying tournament in San Juan, Puerto Rico beginning August 20, two weeks after he is scheduled to appear in court in Eagle County, Colorado. That's about a 10-day tournament in Puerto Rico. The success of the team in that tournament hinges upon -- will decide whether or not the USA basketball team will play in next summer's Olympic in Athens, Greece. Kobe also a member of that team as well.
The Lakers, as for them -- their training camp begins in early October. NBA regular season begins later that month, beginning of November. So there is much at stake in terms of just the court case itself and not even including what the verdict may be.
BLITZER: You've been around the league a long time, Larry. Can you buttress -- can you back up what was said by the radio reporter that we just had on CNN, that Kobe's reputation was anything but of a rapist, as he's alleged -- as he's being accused of being right now?
SMITH: Right now, he was right on the money ,that certainly if you did -- that as he said, if you took these circumstances and said name the player, Kobe would be one of the last players you would come up with, not assigning any guilt to anyone, but this scene does happen outside of arenas, outside of hotels. You can stick around an arena for 20 minutes and watch the ladies line up. Not to say it's case in this certain instance, but it does happen in many occasion, and something obviously, that every athlete, regardless of sport, regardless of level of sport, is aware of.
BLITZER: All right. Larry Smith from CNN Sports. Larry, thanks very much.
Much more coverage of this dramatic development, Kobe Bryant charged with sexual assault. We're going to continue our live coverage.
When we come back, we'll speak with a former prosecutor as well as a criminal defense attorney -- get their thoughts, where this moves next. What's next involving Kobe Bryant and the alleged victim?
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARK HURLBERT, EAGLE CO. DISTRICT ATTY: After much deliberation, charges were filed against Kobe Dean Bryant of Newport Beach, California.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Mark Hurlbert, he's the district attorney of Eagle County, California, announcing that Kobe Bryant has been charged with sexual assault, a class three felony, four years to life, possible penalty, according to Colorado law. He's accused of penetration or intrusion, submission of the victim through force. Next court date, October 6. Kobe Bryant denying flatly the allegation in a formal statement. Excuse me --August 6 is the next court date.
Kobe Bryant issuing the following statement through his attorney. I'll read it. "I am innocent of the charges filed today. I did not assault the woman who is accusing me. I made the mistake of adultery. I have to answer to my wife and my God for my actions that night and I pray that both will forgive me. Nothing that happened June 30 was against the will of the woman, who now falsely accuses me. These false allegations have hurt my family. I will fight against these allegations with all my strength. My wife is the strongest person I know. She is willing to stand by me despite my mistake. That means everything to me. I have so much to live for. By that I do not mean the contracts, the money or the fame. I mean my family. I will fight for them." Kobe Bryant goes on to say, "I appreciate all of those who have supported me. Thank you for believing in me. My family and I have going to need your support and prayers now more than ever."
A then in a statement -- a brief from his wife, Vanessa Bryant, also through the attorney. She says, "I know that my husband has made a mistake, the mistake of adultery. He and I will have to deal with that within our marriage and we will do so. He is not a criminal. I know that he did not commit a crime. He did not assault anyone." Vanessa Bryan going on to say she strongly will stand by her husband.
Let's get some more analysis now what this will mean in the decision with the Kobe Bryant case to go forward with this prosecution. Joining us now, two special guest. In Denver, the defense attorney, Larry Pozner. And in Boston, Wendy Murphy. She's a former federal prosecutor who teaches a sex crime course at the New England School of Law.
Wendy, thanks very much for joining us and Larry, thanks to you as well.
Wendy, let me get your thoughts first of all, on where this case is headed.
PROF. WENDY MURPHY, NEW ENGLAND SCHOOL OF LAW: Well, at this point, Wolf, it's going to be treated just like any other felony prosecution of a sex crimes case in that county. I mean, he's been indicted on a single charge. It was quite clear at this point that there is apparently some DNA proof that there was penetration and that a sexual assault occurred. And really, what's clear at this point is the only issue is consent or the absence of the consent, from the defense perspective.
You know, I really think this prosecutor was quite brave to do this. Prosecutors are elected officials. They sometimes worry about whether, if they do something unpopular, even though correct as a matter of law, that might hurt them at the next election. And that's what I worry about when I hear about high-profile cases with popular, potential defendants. I worry they won't be charged for all the wrong reasons. So I give this guy a great deal of credit.
Now, you know, apparently both sides are going to agree that a certain kind of sexual act occurred. Kobe's position will be that she wanted it, that was consensual. She's going to have to participate in a trial where she's going to have to persuade the in jury that it was forcible and without her consent. And what we've heard thus far is consistent with that. I mean, we don't know all the facts but we know there was a ruckus in the room, that she left crying and disheveled, that she immediately reported it as a sexual assault. Generally speaking, if I had a case like that, I would be quite happy because that's not what happens in most legitimate rape cases.
BLITZER: Larry, what do you think?
LARRY POZNER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: To say we haven't heard any of the facts is a gross overstatement. We haven't heard any of the facts.
You can't begin to find him guilty. We haven't heard whether there really was a commotion. We haven't heard the lab evidence. If there was a struggle and this woman was overcome by this enormously powerful man, are there bruises? Is there ripped clothing? Are there scratch marks? We need to know the facts. Right now, we know that the DNA evidence is of no value. She says they had sex. He says they had sex. So proof that there was sex doesn't advance the prosecution case one iota.
So, you know, was there yelling? What did the people downstairs hear? What did the people on either side hear? If there is no outcry, if there is no evidence supporting this, then it's going to be credibility and Kobe Bryant's credibility is completely different than Mike Tyson's credibility.
BLITZER: Wendy, go ahead.
MURPHY: Well, that may be, but, you know -- look, Kobe Bryant is charged with a crime in a very small town in Colorado where people may well take the position that he is an entitled, wealthy athlete who came to town expecting to get whatever he wanted, including access to this woman. So they may not see him as the kind of credible person who couldn't possibly do anything wrong and if he says he didn't do it, then that must be true.
I think he comes to this case on equal footing with the victim, as it should be in every rape case. And this is somebody that the community knows in terms of her identity and her reputation as well. And thus far, for all the nice things we've heard about Kobe, which may well be true, we've heard equally nice things about this young woman. So yes, proving credibility can be difficult because you're really asking jurors to look in the eyes of each of them and look at their demeanor and when they describe what happened, you have to kind of assess whether you buy it and not only buy it, but for the prosecution's perspective, buy it beyond a reasonable doubt, which is a very, very high standard.
But, look, that's what most rape cases involve. And I heard somebody say earlier we have to look for corroboration and I heard Larry describe how he would be concerned if there wasn't corroboration for the victim's story. We haven't required corroboration in rape cases in 30 years in this country. Thankfully, we evolved. The word of a woman, the word of any person in this country who reports crime and is credible enough to persuade a jury beyond a reasonable doubt that the crime occurred is sufficient without corroboration to sustain a conviction beyond a reasonable doubt. If the jury believes her, he will be convicted.
BLITZER: And a lot of people. Larry, I want you to respond to that, but a lot of people in that jury is going to say, this is a 19- year-old girl, she was well known in the community, she was a cheerleader, she was in college, very likable, no previous accusations of rape, no indication she had a problem going on. Won't they normally tend to be sympathetic toward her?
POZNER: I think that they may well be sympathetic towards her, but juries take the oath. And I believe jurors abide by the oath. We start with this presumption, it's not that he's rich that matters. It's not that he's powerful. That shouldn't make a difference. We're not asking people to say that's a plus for him, but it ought not be a minus. We ought not start with this nonsense of a rich man came to town and demanded anything he wanted. Where is the evidence?
The standard in this case will be the standard as it has been in America for 200 years. For the rich and the poor. Which is, can the prosecution prove its allegation beyond a reasonable doubt? Now, in doing that, this woman, like any witness, will be put on trial in the sense that a jury's going to have to judge her credibility. We ought not rewrite the law to say if somebody says they're a victim, somebody else is automatically guilty.
BLITZER: Alright, standby, Wendy, standby, Larry, standby Jeffrey Toobin, too, our legal analyst. He's in New York. Jeffrey, the next step presumably in this case, August 6, that's when Kobe Bryant, according to Mark Hulbert the district attorney, will be required to appear at a court proceeding. What's going to happen at that proceeding?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, Wolf, I don't have a great expertise in Colorado criminal procedure. What usually happens in criminal cases at this stage is the judge will start to set a schedule. He'll set a schedule for motions, motions to suppress evidence, motions for change of venue. He or she will set a schedule for how the case will proceed. And ultimately, it will go to trial. We'll certainly get a better sense on August 6 of how quickly the case will proceed.
BLITZER: And based on what you're hearing right now, as far as the whole question of evidence, the evidence is going to be critical presumably in determining Kobe Bryant's fate right now. How important is the corroborating evidence, the contemporaneous evidence that there was a commotion, there may have been noise, she may have been in tears, she may have been crying or whatever, that's obviously going to be very important?
TOOBIN: Critical. And Wendy makes a good point, in the old days there used to be a legal requirement. You could not get a rape conviction unless there was corroboration and that legal requirement is long gone. However prosecutors, attempting to prove their case, always look for corroboration.
Corroboration is the key to these cases. Are there bruises. Are there other witnesses, did people hear something, how long did it take for her to complain that she was attacked. These sorts of things are always critical in a case where there are only two people in the room when the crime itself took place -- alleged crime.
BLITZER: All right. Jeffrey, stand by. I want to read to our viewers a statement we've just received from David Stern, the commissioner of the NBA. "As with all allegations of a criminal nature," he says, "the NBA's policy is to await the outcome of a judicial proceeding before taking any action. We do not anticipate making further comments during the pendency of the judicial process." Wendy Murphy, you're a former federal prosecutor, as you look at this case, the fact that Kobe Bryant, by almost everyone's account, has a sterling reputation as a really likable, nice guy, not one of these mean spirited kinds of athletes who got carried away with himself, how important is that that almost everyone who knows him says this is totally, totally out of character.
MURPHY: Well it matters, Wolf. It really does. It matters more in the court of public opinion, I think, than ultimately it will matter to the jury. And the secret there is the prosecutor has to be careful when screening the jurors that jurors don't sit down with a sort of celebrity glaze in their eyes when they look at him. You don't want them not paying attention to the evidence because he's their hero. You want them to think of him as just any other person. Similarly with the victim, you want people to come to this case stripped of any kind of bias or prejudice and that means not think he must be innocent just because he's a good ball player.
Look, how many Catholic priests were really nice guys and then what did we hear they were doing behind closed doors? I don't think you get any extra points just because you've never done this before. There are lots of very, very nice people in this country who do very bad things.
BLITZER: What about that, Larry?
POZNER: Well, you know, that misses the point. The jury is going to look at two human beings. Forget that he plays basketball. His entire persona, his character is that he's a respected gentleman. Now, how does a prosecutor start with a person with no blemishes, a person thought to be kind and gentle and say that one night he checked into a lodge at Cordillera at 10:00 at night, there's no alcohol involved, there's no drugs involved and he became a sex-crazed maniac raping strangers. That is an enormous leap of faith. And the prosecutor can only get there with cold, hard facts. Wolf, we simply don't know the facts yet.
BLITZER: We certain don't know the facts yet. Jeffrey Toobin, this whole issue of Kobe Bryant's background, all of us who have watched basketball over the years, knows that he's such a great ballplayer but he's also comes across as such a wonderful nice young man. How important will it be if the prosecution has no prior evidence of anything that's consistent with an allegation of rape?
TOOBIN: Well, certainly going into a trial like this in a rape case you want to -- if the government is allowed to put on that kind of evidence, you'd like to have the opportunity to put it on. But let's remember something, the same people who are saying today, you know, Kobe Bryant is, you know, not a rapist, he's a great guy, it's completely inconsistent with everything we know. Yesterday they were all saying, well, he would never cheat on his wife. He's not that kind of person. He's very loyal to his wife, well we know part of that is out the window.
So this idea that we somehow know the personality of celebrities, I think, you know, we often just don't know. And the idea that we have the sense that Kobe Bryant is a nice guy or on some other celebrity is a nice guy. The fact is we may simply be wrong. We were at least wrong about half of the equation here. BLITZER: Jeffrey, I have to remind you, because most of the viewers will remember that you covered the O.J. Simpson trial in Los Angeles and those of us who grew up in Buffalo and were Buffalo Bills fans know that O.J. Simpson had a wonderful reputation as such a nice guy as well.
PORZEN: Wolf, I was waiting for you to say that name first. I wasn't going to be the first but certainly was thinking about it. Absolutely. O.J. Simpson, nice guy, big smile, everybody thought he was terrific. But in fairness, there was, coming into the Simpson case, he had already been convicted of domestic violence. So there was a chink in the public armor already and there's certainly nothing that we know about that regarding Kobe Bryant.
But the idea that because a public figure has a reputation of a nice guy, I really would not put a lot of stock in that. I'm not saying he isn't a nice guy but the reputation I don't think really matters in terms of the actual truth of what kind of person they really are.
BLITZER: Let me have Wendy go and then I'll let Larry have the last word. But Wendy, you know there's going to be a lot of comparisons made to O.J. Simpson and Kobe Bryant.
MURPHY: Oh absolutely. I mean, people are -- there's no question, they're star struck. These are, you know, role models. My son adores Kobe Bryant and thinks he's a wonderful ballplayer and a very nice person. The fact is, as Jeffrey said, that may be true on one level and entirely false on another.
You know, it's important to remember what the criminal justice system wants people to do when they sit as jurors. And I hope what the public will do as well. You don't necessarily decide the truth of a case based on what happened last year or two years ago in terms of Kobe Bryant's life or reputation. Similarly, with the victim. She may somewhere done something horrible two years ago. That doesn't elucidate the truth in this case.
And I would make the same argument if you told me Kobe Bryant, you know, assaulted somebody five years ago. I'd say that doesn't tell us anything, either, and it's not fair to judge him today based on something bad he did five years ago. We don't do that in the criminal justice system. We're supposed to limit our scope to the facts, attendant to the exact case in terms of time and subject matter parameters. It's extremely important to be fair to both sides by keeping our focus very, very narrow.
BLITZER: And Larry I'll give you the last word, but I'll throw out this thought to you. You know the comparisons are going to be made with O.J. Simpson. How badly will this damage Kobe Bryant?
PORZEN: If there is one piece of advice I could give you in the media, it is understand the O.J. case stands for nothing but O.J. It is not symptomatic of America. It is one case and it is unfortunate when we change American jurisprudence because of that verdict. This man should go to trial on this charge on the facts in this case. And whatever happened to another person on another day is irrelevant.
Every time we bring up O.J. we bring up something of no value. We need to hear what happened here and what evidence supports her allegation that not only was there sexual penetration or intrusion, but it was by force, by this very, very powerful man. Are there bruises, are there torn clothes, what is the evidence that supports it because that's what a jury is going to want to know. Who heard what?
MURPHY: It's not necessary.
BLITZER: Larry -- Larry Pozner, Wendy -- Wendy Murphy, unfortunately, we have to leave it right there. Jeffrey Toobin, thanks to you as well.
We'll continue our coverage. This is a story that's only obviously just beginning. Once again, we're expecting to hear from Kobe Bryant's attorney in just a few hours. You can see her live at a news conference here on CNN. We'll get more on the latest information on the case. That will be right at the beginning of CNN's "LARRY KING LIVE," 9:00 p.m. Eastern, 6:00 Pacific, only here on CNN.
Just ahead, the president's troubles in the Iraq weapons controversy, pressure on Tony Blair. More political infighting here in Washington. No one, I repeat, no one is better qualified to talk about all of these things than the lady you're looking at right now. Cokie Roberts, she'll join us live next.
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BLITZER: Welcome back.
Turning now to the volatile, volatile situation in Iraq, a soldier in the 3rd Infantry Division was killed today in an explosion near the city of Fallujah. Officials say it happened when the victim's vehicle drove over an improvised explosive device. The soldier was the 23rd American serviceman killed in Iraq this month alone. Eighty-nine American troops have been killed in Iraq since President Bush declared an end of major combat operations on May 1.
British police say they found a body matching the description of David Kelly. He's the former U.N. weapons inspector who never came back from a walk yesterday afternoon. Kelly was accused by the British government of being the source for a controversial BBC report claiming the government hyped pre-war intelligence on Iraq's weapons.
By next guest has covered wars, Washington, everything else in between over a span of more than 30 years in journalism. For the last 15, Cokie Roberts have been with ABC News. She's also a senior analyst, of course, for NPR, National Public Radio.
Cokie, thanks very much for joining us. In the scheme of -- let's say, of over the past 30 years, this current...
COKIE ROBERTS, ABC NEWS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) really old.
BLITZER: The current uproar right now -- I've been here 30 years, too. The current uproar here in Washington over what the president knew about the intelligence going into the war -- how big of a deal is this?
ROBERTS: It's a big deal, and the Democrats are going to keep it alive as long as they humanly can and turn it into a bigger deal.
But the question is how does the American people feel about it? And at the moment, there's some hesitation, but the polls are not showing that people are furious about it.
BLITZER: The whole nature of the Democrats thinking that this is an opportunity for them to score points -- is it?
ROBERTS: Maybe. I think the Democrats have to be very careful when they try to score points on questions of national security because they do so poorly on it in the polls, including some of their own polls, showing them at 30 points behind the Republicans on national security questions, which is a terrible place to be. So they have been searching for ways to have a voice on the issue. But if their voice sounds like it's one that is saying, "Well, we shouldn't have really been in Iraq to begin with," I'm not sure that's going to work for them.
BLITZER: They might do better just sticking to the economy, let's say?
ROBERTS: Sticking to the economy, sticking to healthcare, sticking to things that are in their purview where they do very well.
BLITZER: Prescription drug benefits, things like that.
ROBERTS: Today they have a big brouhaha on the floor of the House over -- well, over the way they had been treated in committee, but it was over a pension bill. They bring things like that out. People trust the Democrats on those issues.
BLITZER: Tony Blair was in Washington yesterday.
ROBERTS: And he was terrific.
BLITZER: He got a tremendous reception at Capitol Hill, a lot better than he does in the House of Commons.
ROBERTS: As he said.
BLITZER: As all of us know. Is this a big boost for President Bush to have that kind of ally like Tony Blair?
ROBERTS: Certainly helps to have an ally like tony Blair. And Tony Blair, having the support of all of those Republicans must amuse him somewhat. But as you recall, George Bush's father somewhat supported Tony Blair's opponent when he was running for prime minister.
But Blair's speech was really eloquent and it did give you a moment of pride as an American. I don't think there's any question about that, when he talked about this is the land of freedom for people of all colors, all fades. And he did it beautifully.
Unfortunately for the president, a lot of that was never seen by anybody. It was seen here on CNN in the middle of the afternoon.
BLITZER: It was seen in primetime in London, though.
ROBERTS: Primetime in London, so it worked for Tony Blair. I don't know how well it worked for George Bush.
BLITZER: What does the president and his advisers in the White House, need to do -- what do they need to do right now to get this flap behind them?
ROBERTS: They need to just stop doing all of this Clintonesque parsing of what is the meaning of is is. You know -- well, it might -- it just didn't rise to the level of a presidential address. What does that mean? Nobody know what's that means. And was it true or was it not true? Sure, the statement that the British said it was accurate but, you know, that's like I'm saying you told me Kobe Bryant did it.
BLITZER: Yes.
ROBERTS: You know, that might be accurate, you told me that but it's not accurate that he did it.
BLITZER: I didn't tell you that.
ROBERTS: And you didn't tell me that. Let's get that clear.
BLITZER: Before I let you go, quick thought on this whole Kobe Bryant allegation. He's accused of raping this 19-year-old girl.
ROBERTS: Look, I have -- obviously, neither does anybody else, by the way, have any idea whether it's true or not except the two of them. I have to tell you that with a name like Cokie, anybody named Kobe is in trouble, it's always a problem because you think that it might be you.
BLITZER: I'm sure that's the first thing that went through your mind, Kobe, Cokie. Cokie, how you feel...
(CROSSTALK)
ROBERTS: I have the same problem with Kofi Annan.
BLITZER: Tell our viewers, because they all want to know, how are you feeling? How are you doing?
ROBERTS: I feel great, thank you, and I've gotten a very clean bill of health.
BLITZER: Thank God.
ROBERTS: Yes.
BLITZER: Good. Cokie, Roberts, a great friend of ours. Thanks for joining us.
ROBERTS: And you're a good friend, Wolf. Thank you.
BLITZER: Thank you very much.
Our "Web Question of the Day" is this -- we want to remind you -- "Do you think that Kobe Bryant is being treated fairly?" You can vote right now, cnn.com/wolf. We'll have the results when we come back.
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BLITZER: Here's how you're weighing in on our "Web Question of the Day." We've been asking you this: "Do you think Kobe Bryant is being treated fairly?" Look at this: 51 percent of you say yes, 49 percent of you say no. As always, we remind you, this is not a scientific poll.
That's all the time I have.
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