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CNN Live Today
Interview With Don Clark
Aired August 14, 2003 - 10:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Federal prosecutors have released new information about the alleged black market arms dealer accused of trying to smuggle a shoulder-launched missile into the U.S.
According to information released as part of yesterday's court appearance, Hemant Lakhani allegedly planned to sell more than 50 launchers to FBI agents posing as Muslim extremists. Federal authorities say that Lakhani was told that the missiles would be used in a jihad to bring down a U.S. airliner. The FBI also says the British citizen praised Osama bin Laden and often referred to Americans as "bastards."
The nation's Homeland Security chief says that illegal arms dealers should take not you could be next. Tom Ridge says authorities are focusing on the black market that could put lethal weapons in the hands of terrorists. For more on that, let's turn now to Don Clark. He's 24-year veteran of the FBI and he joins us from Houston as he often does. Good to see you again, Don.
DON CLARK, FMR. FBI LEAD INVESTIGATOR: Leon, good to see you.
HARRIS: Now as I understand it, you have plenty of reason to be proud because the task force at the FBI that actually broke this ring, at least, was one that you actually formed years ago?
CLARK: Yes, Leon. I'm really proud of those people up there. This is a task force that I was fortunate enough to have formed back in the early '80s and started with the FBI and the New Jersey State Police. And I'm glad to see that it's grown and it's been productive all along. But something like this really sheds light on how great those men and women are up there.
HARRIS: But when you put that task force together, I'm assuming you were not looking for this kind of a crime.
CLARK: No, you know, we were looking for the type of terrorists that's going to tell us about the bombs and any type of information because we were not thinking quite as sophisticated.
But I have to tell you this is not a new phenomenon, Leon. Terrorists trying to get this type of a weapon has been going on for quite some time. So it sort of evolved into more sophistication of things that they could look for.
HARRIS: All right. So tell us, if this is something that's been evolving, is it getting easier now to get these sort of weapons? Is it tougher, is it easier to stop this sort of thing happening? CLARK: Well I would like to think that it's getting -- that it's going to get tougher. There are a number of these weapons that are out there and people who are willing to sell them.
But I think what's going to make it easier is that if the law enforcement community has the opportunity to conduct operations such as this, these type of operations, Leon, "stings" as everybody calls them -- not a particularly favorite word of mine. But nonetheless, these type of operations are very difficult and we've seem to have some problems with them in years past.
So it takes a lot to convince people that, yes, these are the people that actually were going to commit a crime.
HARRIS: Well what have we learned from this about the level of cooperation between governments? There were a number of different governments and different government agencies working on this together.
CLARK: Yes, not only just our government, Leon, but governments abroad. And I think what you're seeing is a really manifestation of these organizations really coming together. And I've said in the past, Leon, that there has been a pretty good degree of cooperation.
But you really see it when it ends in an operation like this because you saw overseas people, which means other people overseas working with law enforcement over there, and all the entities here. And I suppose the Homeland Security people had some role in this as well.
HARRIS: Well let me ask you this then. I mean, considering all of that, do you think that if this was taking place, if this was brewing in a different country entirely, different continent, that it would have been stopped?
CLARK: I would like to think so. I would like to think with the number of entities around the world that the FBI has been able to put in place, that they would have developed some relationship with those law enforcement people over there so that the information can be passed.
And everybody has to recognize now, Leon, that terrorism is just not based -- targeted at America. It's targeted at a great portion of the world. So all of these countries really have an obligation to bring in the outside people. So I would think that they would have brought the U.S. in.
HARRIS: All right. So if you happen to be the top guy in charge -- say if you were the president in this case, would you be putting 100 percent of all of your attention and your focus and your expectations here on this kind of process, this information-gathering process versus putting some sort of equipment on planes that can actually, you know, get rid of or evade a bomb of any kind?
CLARK: Leon, I think you've got to look at a number of avenues that you can try and prevent terrorism. The key is to prevent these things from happening. I don't think you can go 100 percent in any area.
And, yes, the technology is there to perhaps prevent an airplane from being brought down, but I don't think in reality speaking that that's going to be the way that it's going to be saved because airports are vulnerable primarily on take-off and landing.
So I think we've got to really establish these systems and the intelligence is going to be the key. Remember, Leon, we talked about it. Prevention is the key and you've got to have intelligence to prevent.
HARRIS: All right, good deal. We sure do appreciate that, Don. Don Clark, former FBI agent and frequent contributor here on CNN. Take care. We'll talk to you down the road.
CLARK: Thanks, Leon. See you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired August 14, 2003 - 10:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Federal prosecutors have released new information about the alleged black market arms dealer accused of trying to smuggle a shoulder-launched missile into the U.S.
According to information released as part of yesterday's court appearance, Hemant Lakhani allegedly planned to sell more than 50 launchers to FBI agents posing as Muslim extremists. Federal authorities say that Lakhani was told that the missiles would be used in a jihad to bring down a U.S. airliner. The FBI also says the British citizen praised Osama bin Laden and often referred to Americans as "bastards."
The nation's Homeland Security chief says that illegal arms dealers should take not you could be next. Tom Ridge says authorities are focusing on the black market that could put lethal weapons in the hands of terrorists. For more on that, let's turn now to Don Clark. He's 24-year veteran of the FBI and he joins us from Houston as he often does. Good to see you again, Don.
DON CLARK, FMR. FBI LEAD INVESTIGATOR: Leon, good to see you.
HARRIS: Now as I understand it, you have plenty of reason to be proud because the task force at the FBI that actually broke this ring, at least, was one that you actually formed years ago?
CLARK: Yes, Leon. I'm really proud of those people up there. This is a task force that I was fortunate enough to have formed back in the early '80s and started with the FBI and the New Jersey State Police. And I'm glad to see that it's grown and it's been productive all along. But something like this really sheds light on how great those men and women are up there.
HARRIS: But when you put that task force together, I'm assuming you were not looking for this kind of a crime.
CLARK: No, you know, we were looking for the type of terrorists that's going to tell us about the bombs and any type of information because we were not thinking quite as sophisticated.
But I have to tell you this is not a new phenomenon, Leon. Terrorists trying to get this type of a weapon has been going on for quite some time. So it sort of evolved into more sophistication of things that they could look for.
HARRIS: All right. So tell us, if this is something that's been evolving, is it getting easier now to get these sort of weapons? Is it tougher, is it easier to stop this sort of thing happening? CLARK: Well I would like to think that it's getting -- that it's going to get tougher. There are a number of these weapons that are out there and people who are willing to sell them.
But I think what's going to make it easier is that if the law enforcement community has the opportunity to conduct operations such as this, these type of operations, Leon, "stings" as everybody calls them -- not a particularly favorite word of mine. But nonetheless, these type of operations are very difficult and we've seem to have some problems with them in years past.
So it takes a lot to convince people that, yes, these are the people that actually were going to commit a crime.
HARRIS: Well what have we learned from this about the level of cooperation between governments? There were a number of different governments and different government agencies working on this together.
CLARK: Yes, not only just our government, Leon, but governments abroad. And I think what you're seeing is a really manifestation of these organizations really coming together. And I've said in the past, Leon, that there has been a pretty good degree of cooperation.
But you really see it when it ends in an operation like this because you saw overseas people, which means other people overseas working with law enforcement over there, and all the entities here. And I suppose the Homeland Security people had some role in this as well.
HARRIS: Well let me ask you this then. I mean, considering all of that, do you think that if this was taking place, if this was brewing in a different country entirely, different continent, that it would have been stopped?
CLARK: I would like to think so. I would like to think with the number of entities around the world that the FBI has been able to put in place, that they would have developed some relationship with those law enforcement people over there so that the information can be passed.
And everybody has to recognize now, Leon, that terrorism is just not based -- targeted at America. It's targeted at a great portion of the world. So all of these countries really have an obligation to bring in the outside people. So I would think that they would have brought the U.S. in.
HARRIS: All right. So if you happen to be the top guy in charge -- say if you were the president in this case, would you be putting 100 percent of all of your attention and your focus and your expectations here on this kind of process, this information-gathering process versus putting some sort of equipment on planes that can actually, you know, get rid of or evade a bomb of any kind?
CLARK: Leon, I think you've got to look at a number of avenues that you can try and prevent terrorism. The key is to prevent these things from happening. I don't think you can go 100 percent in any area.
And, yes, the technology is there to perhaps prevent an airplane from being brought down, but I don't think in reality speaking that that's going to be the way that it's going to be saved because airports are vulnerable primarily on take-off and landing.
So I think we've got to really establish these systems and the intelligence is going to be the key. Remember, Leon, we talked about it. Prevention is the key and you've got to have intelligence to prevent.
HARRIS: All right, good deal. We sure do appreciate that, Don. Don Clark, former FBI agent and frequent contributor here on CNN. Take care. We'll talk to you down the road.
CLARK: Thanks, Leon. See you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
