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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Higher Order in Alabama; United States Calls on U.N. Help in Iraq; Unemployment Is Down For The Month Of July
Aired August 21, 2003 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight: The Pentagon says fighters from the Mideast are infiltrating Iraq. General David Grange on the emerging guerrilla war.
The Bush administration is calling on the United Nations to provide more help in Iraq.
Tonight: Amtrak is an icon of this country's infrastructure problems. The head of Amtrak, David Gunn, joins us.
And America's hot wheels, the cars thieves love to steal.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT for Thursday, August 21. Here now, Lou Dobbs.
DOBBS: Good evening.
In God we trust, on the courts, we rely, colliding tonight in Montgomery, Alabama. At the heart of the conflict, a 5,300-pound granite monument of the Ten Commandments sitting in the lobby of a state building. The state's chief justice, who put it there, is now defying a federal court order that it be removed.
David Mattingly joins us from Montgomery with the very latest -- David.
DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Lou, he's been denied once by the U.S. Supreme Court. Today, his fellow justices on the Alabama Supreme Court turned against him. But Judge Roy Moore says that he will continue to fight to keep his monument to the Ten Commandments on public display.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHIEF JUSTICE RAY MOORE, ALABAMA SUPREME COURT: I say enough is enough. And we must dare defend our rights, which is the motto of this great state. No judge or man can dictate in whom we can believe and in whom we trust. The Ninth and 10th Amendment are not a part of the Constitution merely to make the Bill of Rights a round number.
The Ninth Amendment secured our rights as a people. And the 10th Amendment guaranteed our rights as a sovereign state.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MATTINGLY: His fellow justices today, all eight of them, ordered the building manager to take all necessary steps to comply with the federal court order and remove the monument. The deadline for that came and went at midnight last night. State officials are hopeful the move by the justices will be enough to keep the federal court from levying a $5,000 daily fine.
And it was about this time yesterday that 22 people were arrested inside when they refused to leave this building at the end of business hours, choosing instead to stay by the monument there and having to be arrested and charged with trespassing by the officials here. There's no chance of that happening today. The doors have been locked all day long. The only people that have been able to get in there are the ones with businesses with the court.
Now, outside here, dozens of people continue to remain. They are supportive of Justice Moore, some saying, Lou, they will again stay the night to keep watch on the monument. And what you see going on right now is something we've seen a lot today, a prayer vigil going on, people hoping for whatever might come along that would keep the monument here and support their point of view -- Lou.
DOBBS: David, a number of questions.
First, is there any indication as to when, with the order of the other justices, that the effort would be made to remove the monument?
MATTINGLY: There is some special language in that order that they handed out today that gave them some leeway in terms of practicality. This is a 2.5-ton monument. They have to decide where it's going to go and then how they're going to move it there.
The federal court ruling was concerning just the public display of this. So it's possible they could move it to someone's private chambers or out of the building entirely. I don't know if those decisions -- no one here knows if those decisions yet have been made.
DOBBS: And do we know Justice Moore's whereabouts this evening and his plans?
MATTINGLY: His plans are to keep fighting this. He says he's going to go back to the Supreme Court and, hopefully, they will accept his petition now to listen to the arguments in this case and perhaps have some sort of ruling in the future that would allow him to keep that monument on display, on public display, here in this public building.
DOBBS: Obviously, this issue that Justice Moore has provoked by putting that monument in a state building and now moving it all the way to the Supreme Court, it has become far more than a local or state issue. It is now a national issue. Is there any sense, a reading of the public support or opposition to the justice's position?
MATTINGLY: Well, probably the best way to answer that would be to look back at some recent history.
Judge Moore, when he was a circuit judge, did something similar by putting a wooden copy of the Ten Commandments up in his courtroom. There was a similar public outcry about that and considerable public debate. That sort of notoriety helped him actually become elected to the Supreme Court -- Lou.
DOBBS: David Mattingly, from Montgomery, Alabama, thank you very much.
Later in the broadcast, we'll have more on this subject of church and state. We'll be joined by David Novak, who is not an attorney, but rather a professor of Jewish studies and philosophy at the University of Toronto.
There are new developments tonight in the sniper attacks case in Charleston, West Virginia. Moments ago, police said, ballistics tests now confirm that the same gun was used in all three fatal shootings.
Jeanne Meserve is in Charleston and has the story for us -- Jeanne.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Lou, that's right. We're expecting a press conference momentarily with the police chief from the city of Charleston. He will tell us, according to sources, that these three shootings are linked ballistically.
There certainly were similarities. They all took place at convenience stores. They all took place at night. They all involved a single shot to the head or neck. But this is the official word. The ballistics do match.
The question today was, was there a fourth shooting? Last night, a 16-year-old girl was at a convenience store in nearby Dunbar. She told police that a bullet went whizzing by her head and that she saw a maroon truck. Other witnesses on the scene seem to corroborate her story. And a short time later, there was a chase given by a sheriff's deputy to a dark truck. The deputy lost the truck, however.
Today, investigators went back and forth over that area around the convenience store. And according to the sheriff's department, they found no relevant evidence.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PHIL MORRIS, KANAWHA COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT: What occurred at the Go-Mart, Dunbar is following up on. We did send our crime scene van down. We followed up on it. We could find out where nothing -- the building was hit, nor the vehicle was hit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MESERVE: The mayor of Charleston, Danny Jones, said today that the sheriff and his deputy are speaking for their department and only their department. They are not talking for the task force that is investigating these crimes. It's another public indication of the growing disconnection, at least within this investigation, although no one has said to this point that this apparent discord is affecting the quality of the probe. Meanwhile, authorities are still on the lookout for that Ford F- 150 extended cab truck. Today, they distributed yet another animation showing a truck like that near one of the crime scenes, but, still, nothing has shown up -- Lou, back to you.
DOBBS: Jeanne, thank you -- Jeanne Meserve.
Turning now to a nationwide attack of worms and viruses against computers, that virus has hit millions of computers over the past several days. The attacks have put everything from transportation systems to personal information at risk. And the newest of these viruses is spreading at a record rate.
Bill Tucker reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's so big and so fast, it briefly brought freight and commuter traffic in Washington, D.C., to a halt, as CSX computer systems were affected. It forced Air Canada to cancel and delay flights. Computers at Lockheed Martin were slowed, as were the computers at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. Yet, you can't see it. You can only know it was there or wanted to come in. It is the virus appropriately named Sobig.
JOS WHITE, PRESIDENT, MESSAGELABS: This is the most severe e- mail virus that we've ever seen. And, at its peak, one in every 17 e- mails that we were processing was a copy of the Sobig virus. So, certainly, we haven't seen numbers like this before. So it is spreading at a very, very fast rate. And the volumes are very, very high.
TUCKER: Internet service provider AOL says it scanned 40.5 million pieces of e-mail and found the Sobig virus in 23.2. Sobig, in fact, accounted for 98 percent of all viruses found. But get this. Sobig is not alone.
There is the blaster worm, AKA Lovsan, and two viruses which purport to fix the blaster, and they do, but they also clog up your computer. Then there's Sobig, now in its sixth variant form, having been around since January. And the newest is Dumaru, which appears as an e-mail from Microsoft. It's not.
JEFF SCHILLER, NETWORK MANAGER, MIT: I'm not exactly sure who to blame here, OK? It is certainly the case that it's gone past the prank stage. There's real harm being cost. Real dollars are being lost. Real people are losing sleep. I'm sitting here slightly bleary-eyed. I was up half the night. It's not fun anymore. The first one of these, OK, fine, that's cute. The next one, all right, sure, shame on me. But it's getting a little old.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TUCKER: These are costly in terms of dollars, human capital, and technology. The best advice, Lou, is the most obvious: Update your anti-virus software at least once a week, if not once a day. DOBBS: OK. Bill, thanks -- Bill Tucker.
Fast-moving wildfires in Oregon forced a change in the president's schedule today. The White House moved a speech on forest policy to a new location tonight, away from these fires. The president's focus is not only on forest policy in Oregon. President Bush is also trying to persuade voters there upset with the economy to vote for Republicans in the next presidential election.
Oregon has an unemployment rate of 8.1 percent. That is the highest unemployment rate in the country. It also has a budget deficit of $2.5 billion. As a percentage of state spending, that deficit is the second biggest in the country. President Bush will deliver his speech on forest policy in just a few moments. We'll be going live when he takes the podium. He is also expected to talk about energy policy. We'll bring you the speech as soon as it begins.
Also still ahead here: Baghdad is the center of the global war on terror, according to the commander of U.S. forces. Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr will report.
Then: What cease-fire? A new wave of deadly violence leaves the Mideast road map in tatters. Michael Holmes reports from Gaza.
And this country's roads and rails are in a state of disrepair. Lisa Sylvester reports. And David Gunn, the president and CEO of Amtrak, joins us.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: General John Abizaid, the commander of U.S. forces in Iraq, today said Iraq is at the center of the global war on terror. The general said, terrorists linked to al Qaeda have moved into Baghdad and foreign terrorists have infiltrated Iraq, and many of them originating in Syria. The general said, the real issue for the coalition now is not the number of troops in Iraq, but rather the quality of intelligence.
Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two days after the bombing of the United Nations headquarters in Baghdad, the top U.S. military commander admitted just how serious the terrorist problem has become in Iraq.
GEN. JOHN ABIZAID, COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: It is emerging as the No. 1 security threat. And we are applying a lot of time, energy, and resources to identify it, understand it, and deal with it.
STARR: The military believes terrorist groups are operating in an area bound by Tikrit, Ar Ramadi, and Baghdad, perhaps some Saddam loyalists, but also foreign fighters infiltrating across the Syrian and Iranian borders, and worries that both groups are now working together.
ABIZAID: They are clearly a problem for us because of the sophistication of their attacks and because of the what I would call their tactics to go after Iraqis.
STARR: But it is Iraqis that the U.S. military is depending upon for a long-term security solution, not more U.S. combat troops.
ABIZAID: I think it's clear that we've got to do a lot more to bring an Iraqi face to the security establishments throughout Iraq very quickly.
STARR: There are already 50,000 Iraqis in the police force, on border patrols, and working in civilian defense and other forces, to guard pipelines, power plants, and other crucial facilities. The Bush administration is not predicting how many U.S. troops may be in Iraq in the months ahead.
DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: The president has indicated that whatever level of U.S. forces is appropriate, that the general will have that level. And he knows that.
STARR: One hundred and forty thousand U.S. troops are there now, plus 24,000 coalition forces. If a United Nations resolution results in more coalition forces, it's not clear the security situation would be calm enough for General Abizaid to allow U.S. soldiers to be sent home.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
STARR: And, Lou, in other Iraq news today, the Pentagon made it official that they have now captured the man known as Chemical Ali, Ali Hassan al-Majid.
Now, this is a very interesting tale, because, of course, they thought they killed him back in April during a bombing attack during the war, but then they developed information that he was still alive. Now, apparently, he was captured a few days ago, believed to be in northern Iraq, but the Pentagon offering no real details. Ali Hassan al-Majid was one of the most disliked, if you will, notorious members of Saddam Hussein's regime.
He was thought to be the man behind ordering the chemical poison gas attacks on the Kurds in the 1980s, the crackdown on the Shia in southern Iraq. He led the occupation of Kuwait, which led, of course, to the first war. But now, apparently, weeks after they thought they killed him and then found out that he was alive, he is now in custody -- Lou.
DOBBS: Barbara, thank you very much -- Barbara Starr reporting from the Pentagon.
The road map to peace in the Middle East is tonight in danger of collapse. Israel today killed a senior leader of the radical Islamist group Hamas, that attack in retaliation for the suicide bombing in Jerusalem that killed 20 people. Hamas and other radical Islamists later called off their cease-fire.
Michael Holmes reports from Gaza.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The missile strike literally minutes after CNN had concluded an interview with a senior Palestinian security official who had promised, he said, imminent action against the military wings of both Hamas and Islamic Jihad, the two groups who claimed responsibility for the deadly west Jerusalem bus bombing that killed 20 Israelis and wounded another 100.
The missiles target was Ismail Abu Shanab, a senior Hamas official, on the political side rather than the military side, and a man who is said by Palestinians to have been a moderate voice within the context of the Hamas political movement.
He is the man who was to go-to between the Palestinian authority and the Hamas group when a cease-fire was negotiated. Now, he was killed, burnt beyond recognition, along with two of his bodyguards, the bodies taken out by bystanders and taken away to hospitals.
An additional 12 people were injured, three of them critically. They, too, taken to hospitals. About an hour and a half later, Hamas said it was formally withdrawing from the cease-fire agreement. The Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade also withdrew. Both promised revenge attacks would take place as soon as possible.
Hamas also demanded that the Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abbas, resign from his position and, in the words of a senior Hamas official, leave the Palestinian territory.
The road map to peace, if not in tatters, is certainly in disarray.
Michael Holmes, CNN, Gaza City.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DOBBS: Secretary of State Colin Powell today urged Palestinians and Israelis to continue to support the road map. The secretary of state made his comments after talks with U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan in New York. Secretary Powell and Secretary-General Annan also talked about Iraq.
The Bush administration wants now the United Nations' help to bolster security in Iraq.
White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux is traveling with the president and joins us live from Redmond, Oregon -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Lou, this is the president's second stop in Oregon. He is focusing on fund-raising, as well as his environmental policy. He is here because he is highlighting his healthy forests initiative. He just got a tour of the wildfire scene that has devastated this community, also a briefing earlier in the day. It is a plan to clear out, to try to thin some of the underbrush of forests that are vulnerable to wildfires. There are some environmentalists, however, who say this simply supports the logging industry.
But, Lou, as you know, of course, the president is also focused on one of the greatest challenges when it comes to his foreign policy, those twin attacks in Iraq, as well as Israel. It was earlier today that Secretary Powell met with U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan. And in a reverse in policy in Iraq, Secretary Powell, as well as other U.S. officials, said they are now open to the possibility of another U.N. Security Council resolution that could provide some political cover for countries that are reluctant to send in troops and aid inside of Iraq.
But Secretary Powell also made it very clear that the mission, the peacekeeping mission, would remain in U.S. control.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: I think anybody making a contribution, a military contribution, sending their young men and women into harm's way, want them to be under solid, responsible, competent military leadership of the kind that is being provided by the coalition and the military component of the coalition under General Abizaid's command.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: And, Lou, also, Secretary Powell addressed the whole Middle East issue, the latest attack inside of Israel, again calling on Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas to dismantle those terrorist organizations.
Abbas, in turn, said that he needed the full cooperation, the authority of the Palestinian security forces to do just that. He asked Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat for assistance to give up some of those troops, some of that control. It is quite ironic, Lou, when you think about it. The one man this administration was trying to marginalize in a role in the Middle East peace process really took center stage today.
Secretary Powell, in an extraordinary move, called for Arafat's assistance in allowing those troops to be turned over to Abbas, so that he could crack down on those terrorist organizations -- Lou.
DOBBS: Suzanne, the president, as you hear, is about to approach the podium. And we would, if we may, Suzanne, ask you to stand by as the president is being introduced here. We're going to go to him just as soon as the introduction is complete, Suzanne.
What has been the reaction to the president there, with the high unemployment, the economic problems there in Oregon, if you've had the opportunity to test that condition?
MALVEAUX: Well, there were some protests on the last stop. About 250 protesters, quite frankly, were quite vocal and had their signs up on a number of policies, environmental policies, as well as economics, and, as you had mentioned, Lou, that Oregon has been devastated by the lack of funds.
They had just agreed within their own state to raise taxes on a temporary basis. It was just last year they actually had to close the schools early because they could not afford to keep them open. This is something that the Bush administration is going to have to deal with, the economic situation, as well as the environment, as well as the foreign policy issue. One of the things that Bush aides are concerned about now is that he is very strong when it comes to handling the war on terror, not as strong on economic and environmental issues, things that he is actually trying to address now.
But if this foreign policy situation inside of Iraq, inside of Israel, falls apart, then it really may have an impact on how voters see this president in the next election -- Lou.
DOBBS: A very important test beginning that will take us through to the elections of 2004. That campaign is definitely under way for both our Republican president and our Democratic candidates for the nomination.
Let's go to the president right now.
(INTERRUPTED BY CNN COVERAGE OF LIVE EVEN)
DOBBS: President Bush is about to deliver a speech on forest thinning, part of the forest policy of the Bush administration, with the backdrop of the fires raging there in Deschutes County in Oregon, the president tonight addressing a group in Redmond, Oregon.
We're going to continue now, guerrilla warfare, taking a look at how American troops can fight and win a war against an unseen enemy. General David Grange will be here "On Point."
And David Novak, professor of Jewish studies and philosophy, he has weighed in with the controversy raging now in Montgomery, Alabama, on the Ten Commandments. He will be our guest next.
Please stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The 2.5-ton granite monument of the Ten Commandments, as we reported earlier, Alabama's chief justice, Roy Moore, is defying a court order to remove that monument from a state building.
Professor David Novak is a professor of Jewish studies and philosophy at the University of Toronto, who says he has no objection to the monument's placement. The professor also has been asked to testify on behalf of Justice Moore. He joins us now.
Good to have you with us.
DAVID NOVAK, UNIVERSITY OF TORONTO: Good to be with you.
DOBBS: This controversy in Montgomery has the potential -- it is already one of national interest -- it has also, does it not, the potential to take on national importance?
NOVAK: Oh, definitely.
I understand that the case is being appealed now. And I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it reached the United States Supreme Court. It's a kind of perfect case to deal with religion and society issues.
DOBBS: The religious and societal issues, the Supreme Court of this country has ruled. A federal court has ordered the removal of the monument. The justice says he will not comply.
Give us, if you will, what your judgments are about the role of this monument embodying, as it does, the basic document, if you will, of the Judeo-Christian culture.
NOVAK: Well, whether the monument was advised -- I would advise him to put it there or not is not the question. The question is, is, I fail to see where there's any objection to it.
The monument is of the Ten Commandments, which come from the Hebrew Bible, or the Old Testament. But, clearly, they are norms or laws that have had rational appeal to people of all different kinds of backgrounds, whether they're Jews or Christians or whatever, even people of no religious background. And, definitely, the Bible has been a major influence on our law and morality, even for people who do not accept either the Jewish or Christian religion.
DOBBS: Do you believe Justice Moore is correct in his position to defy a court order?
NOVAK: I don't wish to comment on Justice Moore's reaction to the court order. I would hope that the case would be appealed. But I'm in no position to comment on that...
DOBBS: He already said -- Professor Novak, he has already said that he will apply for a writ of certiorari before the Supreme Court. This is hardly over in the legal system as well.
DOBBS: The reason I ask the question as to whether or not you supported that decision, here we have a man who is in a justice's robes in the state of Alabama, sworn to uphold the laws of that state and the laws of the country. This is a difficult -- and I'm going now to your background in philosophy as well as the Jewish studies. He is in a dickens of a bind, it seems to me, morally, ethically, and legally.
NOVAK: There's no question about it. And I'm in no position to comment on the legalities of the situation. I simply was an expert witness in the original trial because I saw nothing in his action that was contrary to the basic principle of separation of church and state, which is put forth in the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. And that's all that I'm really competent to comment upon.
But I really do hope that the case will be appealed, and I hope that it does reach the United States Supreme Court because in the area of religion and public life, religion society, the decisions of the U.S. Supreme Court over the past 50 years have been, shall we say, at times inconsistent. It doesn't seem that the justices in many cases have had a very clear understanding, to my point of view, of what religion is, first of all, or what a religion is, and what its relationship is to a secular society, a secular state.
DOBBS: A secular state with a -- the Ten Commandments. For some it is the embodiment of the core of their religion. For others it is the basic document of Judeo-Christian culture and reflects simply a natural law.
The justice, in putting his arguments and his advocacy behind the religious connotations of the Ten commandments, has certainly left out the possibility that he would have the argument that you've advanced.
NOVAK: Yes. I mean, I -- shall we say, I agree with what Chief Justice Moore did. I don't -- or I don't have objection to what he did in terms of putting up the Ten Commandments. Personally, I would present somewhat different arguments than he has put forth for what he has done. I think that we have to distinguish between kind of a general belief in God and a general belief in a natural law, which could be accepted by people of many different religious backgrounds, or indeed just a notion of natural law, that there's certain norms that are self-evident and that religion didn't even invent these norms, that kind of proclaimed them.
DOBBS: David Novak, we thank you for being with us here to help in the process. It's going to be a long process of illuminating all that's involved in this particular case.
NOVAK: Well, thank you for having me.
DOBBS: Thanks very much.
Tonight's quote is one man's pledge to continue his fight in Montgomery and beyond, saying, "Let me assure the fight to defend our constitutional rights to acknowledge God must and will continue." That from Judge -- Justice Roy Moore. He is the chief justice of the Alabama Supreme Court.
This debate is also the topic of our poll question tonight. In the Montgomery, Alabama controversy, "What should be done with the Ten Commandments monument? Leave it, Move it, Follow it?" Cast your vote at cnn.com/lou. We'll have the results later in the show.
Final results of yesterday's poll. The question: "Should the United States send more troops to Iraq to establish law and order?" Thirty-eight percent of you voted yes, 62% voted no.
When we continue, failing rails and roads, costing lives and billions of dollars. Lisa Sylvester reports from Washington. Amtrak's CEO, Peter Gunn, is our guest.
And hot wheels. The most popular cars among thieves.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: This week we've been reporting to you on the deterioration of America's infrastructure. Nowhere is that problem more evident than on this nation's roadways and railways, both in desperate need of repair, both costing this country and our economy billions of dollars each year.
Lisa Sylvester reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LISA SYLVESTER, CNNfn CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): You can be a good driver, but if you're on a bad road, it could cost you your life. One out of every three fatal highway accidents is partly due to poor road and pavement conditions.
Two years ago, eight students in Wyoming died when a driver crossed into their lane. The state had tried to widen the road to make it safer but didn't have the funding. Cash-strapped states are increasingly putting road projects on hold, despite the fact that nearly 60 percent of U.S. , roads are in need of improvement according to the Department of Transportation.
FRANK MORETTI, THE ROAD INFORMATION PROGRAM: In the last year, as state budgets are getting tighter, we're seeing money taken out of road construction and we're starting to see conditions slide again, unfortunately.
SYLVESTER: Poor road conditions cost drivers time and money. According to a study by Texas A&M University, traffic congestion in U.S. cities costs over $67 billion a year in lost productivity and excess fuel.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's terrible. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) terrible.
SYLVESTER: Traffic tie-ups are getting even worse. In the last decade interstate travel increased 37 percent, but miles of public roads increased only 5 percent.
The problem is not just with the nation's roadways. Subways and freight rail systems are also being strained.
ED HAMBERGER, ASSOCIATION OF AMERICAN RAILROADS: Seven billion dollars was spent on maintenance, 20 percent of replacing tracks, ties, ballast, new signal systems, switching systems. So there's a lot of wear and tear when you have a 286,000-pound car. SYLVESTER: And in the last decade, Americans have increasingly been using mass transit. But upgrades have not always kept pace. Transportation officials warn basic infrastructure investments must be made to keep subway and freight trains running.
MORT DOWNEY, FMR. DEP. TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: It won't go to an instant halt across the whole country like the power grid did, but it will do something like that. You'll see the inability for people to move, the inability to get goods in and out of our ports, and it will drastically affect the economy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: The deadline for Congress to authorize new transportation spending for the next six years is the end of September. The White House has proposed spending $247 billion. Congress is looking to up that figure. It will be a major debate when lawmakers return as various transportation groups and states lobby for additional money -- Lou.
DOBBS: Lisa, thank you. Lisa Sylvester.
Amtrak's president and CEO, David Gunn, says Amtrak is what he calls "the poster child" for this country's infrastructure problems.
David Gunn joins me now from Washington, D.C. Good to have you with us.
DAVID GUNN, AMTRAK PRESIDENT AND CEO: Thank you. Good to be here.
DOBBS: Two billion dollars, almost $2 billion you've asked for. Is that enough to keep Amtrak rolling?
GUNN: Yes. If we get the request funded that we've asked for, if we get what we asked for, we'll be able to start rebuilding the existing system and putting it back into a state of good repair.
DOBBS: For years there was lots of talk, much of it emanating from Amtrak itself, that in just another year or two, or perhaps a few, it would be profitable. You've been absolutely straightforward and honest and said that's not going to happen.
GUNN: It's a fantasy.
DOBBS: Why is that?
GUNN: Well, it's really -- at this point, it's almost irrelevant to discuss that. They've been talking about that since Amtrak was founded 30..
DOBBS: No, no, no. I'm asking you why is it that Amtrak can't make money? I know why they said -- I know why they did what they did.
GUNN: We exist in a highly subsidized environment. All of our competitors are subsidized, whether it's highways or airlines. And so it's not a true marketplace that you have out there.
And we have enormous capital needs. It's the capital needs that determine the need for -- the basic need for funding. And our capital plant is in very, very shaky condition. I mean, I have right now on the Northeast corridor, we have 200 track miles of rail that needs to be replaced. We have 400 track miles where you need to do the ballast cleaning and ballast replacement.
Between Penn Station and the North and Sunniside Yard we have -- we're down to one 1935 cable feeding our overhead wire. I mean, we...
DOBBS: David, if I may say, what you're describing, and it's too often something we're hearing from several quarters, whether we're looking at this country's dams or at its roads. How in the world did the world's only superpower, the most powerful economic entity in the world, get in this sorry shape?
GUNN: I really think that what happened in this country is we began to focus on instant gratification and consumption as opposed to long-term investment in the physical assets we need, in this case to run the transportation system, whether it be roads or railroads, freight or passenger. We have not -- we have been able to squeeze out of our capital plant current consumption, and we've enjoyed it, but now we've got to pay the piper and we've got to start putting money back into our infrastructure.
DOBBS: Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison as you know, one of the co- sponsors of legislation to provide far more money than either you, the White House, or anyone else has to this point up until the introduction of their legislation, had suggested. She says it's absolutely vital that we have a national rail system, that we have your company in business, and wants to see at least $12 billion put forward.
What's your reaction?
GUNN: Well, I don't want to get into specific legislation. What I need right now is I need the $1.8 billion. And if we want to sit down and talk about future expansion and growth, that's another subject. But I am desperate to save the existing system. And we are, based upon the statistics I just gave you, we are in real trouble. And we run the risk -- for example, if that cable fails that I mentioned in New York, we will basically break the northeast corridor. And New Jersey transit trains will be severely impacted in and out of the city. That's immediate, and I know what we need to fix my immediate problems, and really, I'm focusing on that. And for the long run we need higher investments. But for the short run we need enough to keep body and soul together and to get out of the mess that we're in.
DOBBS: What is the likelihood in your judgment that that is going to happen in the short run?
GUNN: Well, I'll tell you what, I work for a board of directors, and they have approved my budget. They have approved the $1.8 billion budget, which has a detailed capital recovery plan. And we are ordering the material for that budget. We are ordering the rail, the ties, the switches, and so forth that we need to carry out next year's reconstruction program. And I guess what I'd tell you is somebody's going to have to stop me and tell me to stop because I'm moving forward on that program. It would be irresponsible not to deal with these problems. If I don't deal with them, we're going to have a major calamity in my opinion.
DOBBS: David Gunn, thank you for being with us.
GUNN: Sure.
DOBBS: Come back as your problems, we hope, become more long- term in nature rather than short-term.
GUNN: I'd love it.
DOBBS: Thank you.
When we continue here, the unseen enemy. U.S. troops embroiled in a Guerrilla war in Iraq. General David "Grange On Point," Next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: In tonight's "grange on point," General David Grange takes on language. Guerrilla warfare, fighting the unseen enemy. These tactics are being used against the United States and Iraq. History has shown this type of war is difficult to win. And General David Grange now joins us from Chicago. Let's talk about the language first, David. The idea that the DOD in this administration refuse to call this guerrilla war, are they right?
GEN. DAVID GRANGE (RET), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: No, it's guerrilla war. You can argue that it's guerrilla tactics, but if you just take the Webster's Dictionary, the criminals, the terrorists, the regime insurgents, the foreign mercenaries, they're guerrillas, they're fighting a guerrilla warfare right now.
DOBBS: Have you -- you have had a long, distinguished career as a combat leader and veteran. With what is going on, we are hearing that some generals are saying we don't need troops, we're hearing from administration we need simply different applications of force but not, as they are fond of saying, boots on the ground.
Do we need troops, more troops in Iraq?
GRANGE: I think we do, and I think we should have had more troops earlier on. And here's why I say that. I think this is a different angle to take a look at this thing. It's not putting a troop every 10 feet along the street or on every corner. It's having enough troops in order to keep the pressure on these guerrillas during the transition period. The Iraqi police force is not established yet. The civil defense force is not established yet. The coalition that's in place is still waiting for more international military support. So it's better to have more than you need up front and then move the troops home than to say there's just enough and just barely make it. So I think, yes, we need more troops. DOBBS: And those troops, to provide more security for the ones we already have there, the U.S. military's being put in a very difficult position here, is it not, because without sufficient force, without a program moving ahead for rebuilding and reconstruction, this is really leveraging, multiplying the burden on the military, which has plenty to take care of already, is it not?
GRANGE: The military is well committed around the world right now, and I think committed to the maximum right here in Iraq. See, right now the military is in a reactive mode, and they need to move to a proactive posture, to pick the time and place against the enemy instead of the enemy picking the time and place to do a terrorist attack or a hit and run against coalition forces. And to be proactive you have to be everywhere in unpredictable means and keep the pressure on and influence the environment. To do that you really need to have a few more boots on the ground where you have the flexibility to do so.
DOBBS: What's your best judgment and I'm asking now for your assessment and speculation certainly. Do you think we're going to see those forces, the Pentagon move ahead, this administration move ahead and put more force on the ground in Iraq?
GRANGE: I believe there will be more American forces sent over as well as international forces. And you have to put the international forces in the equation. We've operated with our country as well as some of our coalition partners quite successfully with other international counter-guerrilla forces. And I think once that happens it'll make quite a difference.
DOBBS: General David "Grange on Point." Thank you very much.
GRANGE: Thank you, Lou.
DOBBS: Still ahead here, hall of fame jockey and star of "Seabiscuit." He faces death on the track and is recovering.
Peter Viles, has the story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Hall of Fame jockey Gary Stevens, who appears in the hit movie "Seabiscuit," took a terrible spill this past weekend in a race outside Chicago. He's recovering tonight in southern California, and as you will see, he was very lucky. Again. Peter Viles reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETER VILES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: If you've seen "Seabiscuit," the horse racing movie, you may have noticed a new actor. He played the part of the glamorous jockey George Wolf. The truth is he's not an actor at all. He really is a jockey and one of the very, very best. Hall of Famer Gary Stevens has won more than 4,000 times, three times at the Kentucky Derby. And until this weekend he was on top of the world. But then came the home stretch in the Arlington Million last Saturday outside Chicago. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Silvermonte (ph) on the outside. And it's Storming Home! Gary Stevens and storming home -- oh, he took a bad step there. Oh, Gary Stevens and storming home went down.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, we've talked before about the eccentricities of Storming Home and you see something scared him in the infield and just as soon as he crossed the finish line...
VILES: As Stevens lay on the track, those watching feared the worst.
CLIFF GOODRICH, PRES. ARLINGTON RACETRACK: If if happens to any jockey you're scared. These are 110-pound jockeys on 1,000-pound animals, and when they want to make a right turn all of a sudden there's not much a jockey can do.
VILES: Jockey Rene Douglas was riding just behind Stevens when he fell.
RENE DOUGLAS, JOCKEY: My horse hit him somehow. So I couldn't -- I tried to do the best I could, but I still -- my horse still step on him on the back.
VILES: Miraculously, Stevens did not suffer a serious head injury. He did suffer a collapsed lung and a broken vertebrae. He spoke yesterday on a conference call.
GARY STEVENS, JOCKEY (via telephone): I'm a little uncomfortable right now, as you may understand but after seeing the spill myself I'm glad this -- I'm just glad I'm alive right now.
VILES: Stevens says he has no memory of the spill itself, only his thoughts as he tried to breathe through a collapsed lung.
STEVENS: I was scared to death. I thought I was having a heart attack. I thought I was dying.
VILES: Stevens said he hopes to ride again and that he would ride the same horse, Storming Home, that threw him.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VILES: Stevens is in need of inspiration during his recovery, he can get it from the true story of "Seabiscuit" and from the jockey Red Pollard, who did recover from a life-threatening injury to ride again and to win again -- Lou.
DOBBS: Gary Stevens, a Hall of Fame jockey and also, as it turns out, I thought, an absolute superb job in "Seabiscuit."
VILES: Terrific acting. "Seabicuit" good reviews and if you want to see a definition of true grit, when he gets up off the ground there, that's some good stuff.
DOBBS: That is scary to watch. Thank you very much, Peter Viles. Coming up next, the results of tonight's poll. Also, positive signs on Wall Street. Christine Romans will have the market for us.
And your thoughts about the battle over the ten commandments monument in Montgomery, Alabama. Stay with us.
(COMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The results of tonight's poll. In the Montgomery, Alabama controversy, what should be done with the ten commandments monument? Leave it, move it, or follow it? 49 percent said leave it. 46 percent said move it. 5 percent, follow it. Thanks for voting on that question.
Turning now to stocks, the Nasdaq today had a new 16-month high. The Dow up 26 points. The Nasdaq climbing 17. Christine Romans is here with the market for us -- Christine.
CHRISTINE ROMANS: Jobless claims fell leading economic indicators grew and the Philadelphia Fed Index was at a five-year high. So that inspired some buying here today, but the big story, Lou, continues to be the industrial rally. This year the S&P 500 is up 14 percent, but look at the Morgan Stanley Cyclical Index. It's up 24 percent this year.
Over the past three months 19 Dow stocks are up at least 10 percent. Among them, Caterpillar. It's up four times that. Alcoa, Honeywell, and United Technologies. The transportation stocks, too, on fire. The Dow Jones transportation average hit a new 52-week high today. It's up 28 percent over the past six months.
Now, Lou, these are typically the stocks that rally in the early stages of an economic recovery. And meanwhile the stock market internals continue to look good. Today at least, above average volume finally. 66 percent of the volume at higher prices. More than 300 new 52 week highs. Only a handfull of new lows. And, Low, both Goldman Sacks and Smith Barney today raised their earnings targets for the S&P 500 for this year and next.
DOBBS: Sounds like a positive indicator all the way around. Christine Romans, thank you.
Turning now to some of your thoughts. Barbara James of Tustin, California, "The recent attacks suggest that terrorist groups know full well their days are numbered. If we are successful, our eventual success in Iraq is too important to be derailed by partisan politics. It's time for American's to stand tall and stand united.
Gary of Claremore, Oklahoma adds, "Jobless recovery, out dated infrastructure? Balderdash, and untrue. Our government and corporations are creating hundreds of thousands of high paying jobs and building a modern infrastructure. And India and Iraq thank the American taxpayers for doin it at no cost to them."
Mike Knup of Columbus, Nebraska wrote in about the ten commandments, "I perceive the ten commandments to be a moral code, not the property of a religion. I can find no evil in the ten commandments, but I do see evil in not allowing the toleration of their existence in public places."
Dan of Santa Barbara, California, "The separation of church and state is what should be held sacred in this country."
We love hearing from you. Send us you emails, loudobbs@cnn.com.
And finally tonight, the Cadillac Escalade is loved by athletes, celebrities, and other, and also car thieves. The insurance industry says the luxury SUV is stolen 4 times as often as any other vehicle on the road. The Dodge Stratus, which costs far less than the Escalade, popular with horse people, is the second most stolen car in the country.
Rounding out the top 5, the Mitubishi Mirage, the Jeep Wrangler, 4 wheel drive, and the Lincoln Navigator.
That's our show for tonight. Thanks for being with us. From all of us here, good night. From New York City.
"LIVE FROM THE HEADLINES" with Bill Hemmer is next.
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in Iraq; Unemployment Is Down For The Month Of July>
Aired August 21, 2003 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight: The Pentagon says fighters from the Mideast are infiltrating Iraq. General David Grange on the emerging guerrilla war.
The Bush administration is calling on the United Nations to provide more help in Iraq.
Tonight: Amtrak is an icon of this country's infrastructure problems. The head of Amtrak, David Gunn, joins us.
And America's hot wheels, the cars thieves love to steal.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT for Thursday, August 21. Here now, Lou Dobbs.
DOBBS: Good evening.
In God we trust, on the courts, we rely, colliding tonight in Montgomery, Alabama. At the heart of the conflict, a 5,300-pound granite monument of the Ten Commandments sitting in the lobby of a state building. The state's chief justice, who put it there, is now defying a federal court order that it be removed.
David Mattingly joins us from Montgomery with the very latest -- David.
DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Lou, he's been denied once by the U.S. Supreme Court. Today, his fellow justices on the Alabama Supreme Court turned against him. But Judge Roy Moore says that he will continue to fight to keep his monument to the Ten Commandments on public display.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHIEF JUSTICE RAY MOORE, ALABAMA SUPREME COURT: I say enough is enough. And we must dare defend our rights, which is the motto of this great state. No judge or man can dictate in whom we can believe and in whom we trust. The Ninth and 10th Amendment are not a part of the Constitution merely to make the Bill of Rights a round number.
The Ninth Amendment secured our rights as a people. And the 10th Amendment guaranteed our rights as a sovereign state.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MATTINGLY: His fellow justices today, all eight of them, ordered the building manager to take all necessary steps to comply with the federal court order and remove the monument. The deadline for that came and went at midnight last night. State officials are hopeful the move by the justices will be enough to keep the federal court from levying a $5,000 daily fine.
And it was about this time yesterday that 22 people were arrested inside when they refused to leave this building at the end of business hours, choosing instead to stay by the monument there and having to be arrested and charged with trespassing by the officials here. There's no chance of that happening today. The doors have been locked all day long. The only people that have been able to get in there are the ones with businesses with the court.
Now, outside here, dozens of people continue to remain. They are supportive of Justice Moore, some saying, Lou, they will again stay the night to keep watch on the monument. And what you see going on right now is something we've seen a lot today, a prayer vigil going on, people hoping for whatever might come along that would keep the monument here and support their point of view -- Lou.
DOBBS: David, a number of questions.
First, is there any indication as to when, with the order of the other justices, that the effort would be made to remove the monument?
MATTINGLY: There is some special language in that order that they handed out today that gave them some leeway in terms of practicality. This is a 2.5-ton monument. They have to decide where it's going to go and then how they're going to move it there.
The federal court ruling was concerning just the public display of this. So it's possible they could move it to someone's private chambers or out of the building entirely. I don't know if those decisions -- no one here knows if those decisions yet have been made.
DOBBS: And do we know Justice Moore's whereabouts this evening and his plans?
MATTINGLY: His plans are to keep fighting this. He says he's going to go back to the Supreme Court and, hopefully, they will accept his petition now to listen to the arguments in this case and perhaps have some sort of ruling in the future that would allow him to keep that monument on display, on public display, here in this public building.
DOBBS: Obviously, this issue that Justice Moore has provoked by putting that monument in a state building and now moving it all the way to the Supreme Court, it has become far more than a local or state issue. It is now a national issue. Is there any sense, a reading of the public support or opposition to the justice's position?
MATTINGLY: Well, probably the best way to answer that would be to look back at some recent history.
Judge Moore, when he was a circuit judge, did something similar by putting a wooden copy of the Ten Commandments up in his courtroom. There was a similar public outcry about that and considerable public debate. That sort of notoriety helped him actually become elected to the Supreme Court -- Lou.
DOBBS: David Mattingly, from Montgomery, Alabama, thank you very much.
Later in the broadcast, we'll have more on this subject of church and state. We'll be joined by David Novak, who is not an attorney, but rather a professor of Jewish studies and philosophy at the University of Toronto.
There are new developments tonight in the sniper attacks case in Charleston, West Virginia. Moments ago, police said, ballistics tests now confirm that the same gun was used in all three fatal shootings.
Jeanne Meserve is in Charleston and has the story for us -- Jeanne.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Lou, that's right. We're expecting a press conference momentarily with the police chief from the city of Charleston. He will tell us, according to sources, that these three shootings are linked ballistically.
There certainly were similarities. They all took place at convenience stores. They all took place at night. They all involved a single shot to the head or neck. But this is the official word. The ballistics do match.
The question today was, was there a fourth shooting? Last night, a 16-year-old girl was at a convenience store in nearby Dunbar. She told police that a bullet went whizzing by her head and that she saw a maroon truck. Other witnesses on the scene seem to corroborate her story. And a short time later, there was a chase given by a sheriff's deputy to a dark truck. The deputy lost the truck, however.
Today, investigators went back and forth over that area around the convenience store. And according to the sheriff's department, they found no relevant evidence.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PHIL MORRIS, KANAWHA COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT: What occurred at the Go-Mart, Dunbar is following up on. We did send our crime scene van down. We followed up on it. We could find out where nothing -- the building was hit, nor the vehicle was hit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MESERVE: The mayor of Charleston, Danny Jones, said today that the sheriff and his deputy are speaking for their department and only their department. They are not talking for the task force that is investigating these crimes. It's another public indication of the growing disconnection, at least within this investigation, although no one has said to this point that this apparent discord is affecting the quality of the probe. Meanwhile, authorities are still on the lookout for that Ford F- 150 extended cab truck. Today, they distributed yet another animation showing a truck like that near one of the crime scenes, but, still, nothing has shown up -- Lou, back to you.
DOBBS: Jeanne, thank you -- Jeanne Meserve.
Turning now to a nationwide attack of worms and viruses against computers, that virus has hit millions of computers over the past several days. The attacks have put everything from transportation systems to personal information at risk. And the newest of these viruses is spreading at a record rate.
Bill Tucker reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's so big and so fast, it briefly brought freight and commuter traffic in Washington, D.C., to a halt, as CSX computer systems were affected. It forced Air Canada to cancel and delay flights. Computers at Lockheed Martin were slowed, as were the computers at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. Yet, you can't see it. You can only know it was there or wanted to come in. It is the virus appropriately named Sobig.
JOS WHITE, PRESIDENT, MESSAGELABS: This is the most severe e- mail virus that we've ever seen. And, at its peak, one in every 17 e- mails that we were processing was a copy of the Sobig virus. So, certainly, we haven't seen numbers like this before. So it is spreading at a very, very fast rate. And the volumes are very, very high.
TUCKER: Internet service provider AOL says it scanned 40.5 million pieces of e-mail and found the Sobig virus in 23.2. Sobig, in fact, accounted for 98 percent of all viruses found. But get this. Sobig is not alone.
There is the blaster worm, AKA Lovsan, and two viruses which purport to fix the blaster, and they do, but they also clog up your computer. Then there's Sobig, now in its sixth variant form, having been around since January. And the newest is Dumaru, which appears as an e-mail from Microsoft. It's not.
JEFF SCHILLER, NETWORK MANAGER, MIT: I'm not exactly sure who to blame here, OK? It is certainly the case that it's gone past the prank stage. There's real harm being cost. Real dollars are being lost. Real people are losing sleep. I'm sitting here slightly bleary-eyed. I was up half the night. It's not fun anymore. The first one of these, OK, fine, that's cute. The next one, all right, sure, shame on me. But it's getting a little old.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TUCKER: These are costly in terms of dollars, human capital, and technology. The best advice, Lou, is the most obvious: Update your anti-virus software at least once a week, if not once a day. DOBBS: OK. Bill, thanks -- Bill Tucker.
Fast-moving wildfires in Oregon forced a change in the president's schedule today. The White House moved a speech on forest policy to a new location tonight, away from these fires. The president's focus is not only on forest policy in Oregon. President Bush is also trying to persuade voters there upset with the economy to vote for Republicans in the next presidential election.
Oregon has an unemployment rate of 8.1 percent. That is the highest unemployment rate in the country. It also has a budget deficit of $2.5 billion. As a percentage of state spending, that deficit is the second biggest in the country. President Bush will deliver his speech on forest policy in just a few moments. We'll be going live when he takes the podium. He is also expected to talk about energy policy. We'll bring you the speech as soon as it begins.
Also still ahead here: Baghdad is the center of the global war on terror, according to the commander of U.S. forces. Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr will report.
Then: What cease-fire? A new wave of deadly violence leaves the Mideast road map in tatters. Michael Holmes reports from Gaza.
And this country's roads and rails are in a state of disrepair. Lisa Sylvester reports. And David Gunn, the president and CEO of Amtrak, joins us.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: General John Abizaid, the commander of U.S. forces in Iraq, today said Iraq is at the center of the global war on terror. The general said, terrorists linked to al Qaeda have moved into Baghdad and foreign terrorists have infiltrated Iraq, and many of them originating in Syria. The general said, the real issue for the coalition now is not the number of troops in Iraq, but rather the quality of intelligence.
Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two days after the bombing of the United Nations headquarters in Baghdad, the top U.S. military commander admitted just how serious the terrorist problem has become in Iraq.
GEN. JOHN ABIZAID, COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: It is emerging as the No. 1 security threat. And we are applying a lot of time, energy, and resources to identify it, understand it, and deal with it.
STARR: The military believes terrorist groups are operating in an area bound by Tikrit, Ar Ramadi, and Baghdad, perhaps some Saddam loyalists, but also foreign fighters infiltrating across the Syrian and Iranian borders, and worries that both groups are now working together.
ABIZAID: They are clearly a problem for us because of the sophistication of their attacks and because of the what I would call their tactics to go after Iraqis.
STARR: But it is Iraqis that the U.S. military is depending upon for a long-term security solution, not more U.S. combat troops.
ABIZAID: I think it's clear that we've got to do a lot more to bring an Iraqi face to the security establishments throughout Iraq very quickly.
STARR: There are already 50,000 Iraqis in the police force, on border patrols, and working in civilian defense and other forces, to guard pipelines, power plants, and other crucial facilities. The Bush administration is not predicting how many U.S. troops may be in Iraq in the months ahead.
DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: The president has indicated that whatever level of U.S. forces is appropriate, that the general will have that level. And he knows that.
STARR: One hundred and forty thousand U.S. troops are there now, plus 24,000 coalition forces. If a United Nations resolution results in more coalition forces, it's not clear the security situation would be calm enough for General Abizaid to allow U.S. soldiers to be sent home.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
STARR: And, Lou, in other Iraq news today, the Pentagon made it official that they have now captured the man known as Chemical Ali, Ali Hassan al-Majid.
Now, this is a very interesting tale, because, of course, they thought they killed him back in April during a bombing attack during the war, but then they developed information that he was still alive. Now, apparently, he was captured a few days ago, believed to be in northern Iraq, but the Pentagon offering no real details. Ali Hassan al-Majid was one of the most disliked, if you will, notorious members of Saddam Hussein's regime.
He was thought to be the man behind ordering the chemical poison gas attacks on the Kurds in the 1980s, the crackdown on the Shia in southern Iraq. He led the occupation of Kuwait, which led, of course, to the first war. But now, apparently, weeks after they thought they killed him and then found out that he was alive, he is now in custody -- Lou.
DOBBS: Barbara, thank you very much -- Barbara Starr reporting from the Pentagon.
The road map to peace in the Middle East is tonight in danger of collapse. Israel today killed a senior leader of the radical Islamist group Hamas, that attack in retaliation for the suicide bombing in Jerusalem that killed 20 people. Hamas and other radical Islamists later called off their cease-fire.
Michael Holmes reports from Gaza.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The missile strike literally minutes after CNN had concluded an interview with a senior Palestinian security official who had promised, he said, imminent action against the military wings of both Hamas and Islamic Jihad, the two groups who claimed responsibility for the deadly west Jerusalem bus bombing that killed 20 Israelis and wounded another 100.
The missiles target was Ismail Abu Shanab, a senior Hamas official, on the political side rather than the military side, and a man who is said by Palestinians to have been a moderate voice within the context of the Hamas political movement.
He is the man who was to go-to between the Palestinian authority and the Hamas group when a cease-fire was negotiated. Now, he was killed, burnt beyond recognition, along with two of his bodyguards, the bodies taken out by bystanders and taken away to hospitals.
An additional 12 people were injured, three of them critically. They, too, taken to hospitals. About an hour and a half later, Hamas said it was formally withdrawing from the cease-fire agreement. The Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade also withdrew. Both promised revenge attacks would take place as soon as possible.
Hamas also demanded that the Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abbas, resign from his position and, in the words of a senior Hamas official, leave the Palestinian territory.
The road map to peace, if not in tatters, is certainly in disarray.
Michael Holmes, CNN, Gaza City.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DOBBS: Secretary of State Colin Powell today urged Palestinians and Israelis to continue to support the road map. The secretary of state made his comments after talks with U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan in New York. Secretary Powell and Secretary-General Annan also talked about Iraq.
The Bush administration wants now the United Nations' help to bolster security in Iraq.
White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux is traveling with the president and joins us live from Redmond, Oregon -- Suzanne.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Lou, this is the president's second stop in Oregon. He is focusing on fund-raising, as well as his environmental policy. He is here because he is highlighting his healthy forests initiative. He just got a tour of the wildfire scene that has devastated this community, also a briefing earlier in the day. It is a plan to clear out, to try to thin some of the underbrush of forests that are vulnerable to wildfires. There are some environmentalists, however, who say this simply supports the logging industry.
But, Lou, as you know, of course, the president is also focused on one of the greatest challenges when it comes to his foreign policy, those twin attacks in Iraq, as well as Israel. It was earlier today that Secretary Powell met with U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan. And in a reverse in policy in Iraq, Secretary Powell, as well as other U.S. officials, said they are now open to the possibility of another U.N. Security Council resolution that could provide some political cover for countries that are reluctant to send in troops and aid inside of Iraq.
But Secretary Powell also made it very clear that the mission, the peacekeeping mission, would remain in U.S. control.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: I think anybody making a contribution, a military contribution, sending their young men and women into harm's way, want them to be under solid, responsible, competent military leadership of the kind that is being provided by the coalition and the military component of the coalition under General Abizaid's command.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: And, Lou, also, Secretary Powell addressed the whole Middle East issue, the latest attack inside of Israel, again calling on Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas to dismantle those terrorist organizations.
Abbas, in turn, said that he needed the full cooperation, the authority of the Palestinian security forces to do just that. He asked Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat for assistance to give up some of those troops, some of that control. It is quite ironic, Lou, when you think about it. The one man this administration was trying to marginalize in a role in the Middle East peace process really took center stage today.
Secretary Powell, in an extraordinary move, called for Arafat's assistance in allowing those troops to be turned over to Abbas, so that he could crack down on those terrorist organizations -- Lou.
DOBBS: Suzanne, the president, as you hear, is about to approach the podium. And we would, if we may, Suzanne, ask you to stand by as the president is being introduced here. We're going to go to him just as soon as the introduction is complete, Suzanne.
What has been the reaction to the president there, with the high unemployment, the economic problems there in Oregon, if you've had the opportunity to test that condition?
MALVEAUX: Well, there were some protests on the last stop. About 250 protesters, quite frankly, were quite vocal and had their signs up on a number of policies, environmental policies, as well as economics, and, as you had mentioned, Lou, that Oregon has been devastated by the lack of funds.
They had just agreed within their own state to raise taxes on a temporary basis. It was just last year they actually had to close the schools early because they could not afford to keep them open. This is something that the Bush administration is going to have to deal with, the economic situation, as well as the environment, as well as the foreign policy issue. One of the things that Bush aides are concerned about now is that he is very strong when it comes to handling the war on terror, not as strong on economic and environmental issues, things that he is actually trying to address now.
But if this foreign policy situation inside of Iraq, inside of Israel, falls apart, then it really may have an impact on how voters see this president in the next election -- Lou.
DOBBS: A very important test beginning that will take us through to the elections of 2004. That campaign is definitely under way for both our Republican president and our Democratic candidates for the nomination.
Let's go to the president right now.
(INTERRUPTED BY CNN COVERAGE OF LIVE EVEN)
DOBBS: President Bush is about to deliver a speech on forest thinning, part of the forest policy of the Bush administration, with the backdrop of the fires raging there in Deschutes County in Oregon, the president tonight addressing a group in Redmond, Oregon.
We're going to continue now, guerrilla warfare, taking a look at how American troops can fight and win a war against an unseen enemy. General David Grange will be here "On Point."
And David Novak, professor of Jewish studies and philosophy, he has weighed in with the controversy raging now in Montgomery, Alabama, on the Ten Commandments. He will be our guest next.
Please stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The 2.5-ton granite monument of the Ten Commandments, as we reported earlier, Alabama's chief justice, Roy Moore, is defying a court order to remove that monument from a state building.
Professor David Novak is a professor of Jewish studies and philosophy at the University of Toronto, who says he has no objection to the monument's placement. The professor also has been asked to testify on behalf of Justice Moore. He joins us now.
Good to have you with us.
DAVID NOVAK, UNIVERSITY OF TORONTO: Good to be with you.
DOBBS: This controversy in Montgomery has the potential -- it is already one of national interest -- it has also, does it not, the potential to take on national importance?
NOVAK: Oh, definitely.
I understand that the case is being appealed now. And I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it reached the United States Supreme Court. It's a kind of perfect case to deal with religion and society issues.
DOBBS: The religious and societal issues, the Supreme Court of this country has ruled. A federal court has ordered the removal of the monument. The justice says he will not comply.
Give us, if you will, what your judgments are about the role of this monument embodying, as it does, the basic document, if you will, of the Judeo-Christian culture.
NOVAK: Well, whether the monument was advised -- I would advise him to put it there or not is not the question. The question is, is, I fail to see where there's any objection to it.
The monument is of the Ten Commandments, which come from the Hebrew Bible, or the Old Testament. But, clearly, they are norms or laws that have had rational appeal to people of all different kinds of backgrounds, whether they're Jews or Christians or whatever, even people of no religious background. And, definitely, the Bible has been a major influence on our law and morality, even for people who do not accept either the Jewish or Christian religion.
DOBBS: Do you believe Justice Moore is correct in his position to defy a court order?
NOVAK: I don't wish to comment on Justice Moore's reaction to the court order. I would hope that the case would be appealed. But I'm in no position to comment on that...
DOBBS: He already said -- Professor Novak, he has already said that he will apply for a writ of certiorari before the Supreme Court. This is hardly over in the legal system as well.
DOBBS: The reason I ask the question as to whether or not you supported that decision, here we have a man who is in a justice's robes in the state of Alabama, sworn to uphold the laws of that state and the laws of the country. This is a difficult -- and I'm going now to your background in philosophy as well as the Jewish studies. He is in a dickens of a bind, it seems to me, morally, ethically, and legally.
NOVAK: There's no question about it. And I'm in no position to comment on the legalities of the situation. I simply was an expert witness in the original trial because I saw nothing in his action that was contrary to the basic principle of separation of church and state, which is put forth in the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. And that's all that I'm really competent to comment upon.
But I really do hope that the case will be appealed, and I hope that it does reach the United States Supreme Court because in the area of religion and public life, religion society, the decisions of the U.S. Supreme Court over the past 50 years have been, shall we say, at times inconsistent. It doesn't seem that the justices in many cases have had a very clear understanding, to my point of view, of what religion is, first of all, or what a religion is, and what its relationship is to a secular society, a secular state.
DOBBS: A secular state with a -- the Ten Commandments. For some it is the embodiment of the core of their religion. For others it is the basic document of Judeo-Christian culture and reflects simply a natural law.
The justice, in putting his arguments and his advocacy behind the religious connotations of the Ten commandments, has certainly left out the possibility that he would have the argument that you've advanced.
NOVAK: Yes. I mean, I -- shall we say, I agree with what Chief Justice Moore did. I don't -- or I don't have objection to what he did in terms of putting up the Ten Commandments. Personally, I would present somewhat different arguments than he has put forth for what he has done. I think that we have to distinguish between kind of a general belief in God and a general belief in a natural law, which could be accepted by people of many different religious backgrounds, or indeed just a notion of natural law, that there's certain norms that are self-evident and that religion didn't even invent these norms, that kind of proclaimed them.
DOBBS: David Novak, we thank you for being with us here to help in the process. It's going to be a long process of illuminating all that's involved in this particular case.
NOVAK: Well, thank you for having me.
DOBBS: Thanks very much.
Tonight's quote is one man's pledge to continue his fight in Montgomery and beyond, saying, "Let me assure the fight to defend our constitutional rights to acknowledge God must and will continue." That from Judge -- Justice Roy Moore. He is the chief justice of the Alabama Supreme Court.
This debate is also the topic of our poll question tonight. In the Montgomery, Alabama controversy, "What should be done with the Ten Commandments monument? Leave it, Move it, Follow it?" Cast your vote at cnn.com/lou. We'll have the results later in the show.
Final results of yesterday's poll. The question: "Should the United States send more troops to Iraq to establish law and order?" Thirty-eight percent of you voted yes, 62% voted no.
When we continue, failing rails and roads, costing lives and billions of dollars. Lisa Sylvester reports from Washington. Amtrak's CEO, Peter Gunn, is our guest.
And hot wheels. The most popular cars among thieves.
Stay with us.
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DOBBS: This week we've been reporting to you on the deterioration of America's infrastructure. Nowhere is that problem more evident than on this nation's roadways and railways, both in desperate need of repair, both costing this country and our economy billions of dollars each year.
Lisa Sylvester reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LISA SYLVESTER, CNNfn CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): You can be a good driver, but if you're on a bad road, it could cost you your life. One out of every three fatal highway accidents is partly due to poor road and pavement conditions.
Two years ago, eight students in Wyoming died when a driver crossed into their lane. The state had tried to widen the road to make it safer but didn't have the funding. Cash-strapped states are increasingly putting road projects on hold, despite the fact that nearly 60 percent of U.S. , roads are in need of improvement according to the Department of Transportation.
FRANK MORETTI, THE ROAD INFORMATION PROGRAM: In the last year, as state budgets are getting tighter, we're seeing money taken out of road construction and we're starting to see conditions slide again, unfortunately.
SYLVESTER: Poor road conditions cost drivers time and money. According to a study by Texas A&M University, traffic congestion in U.S. cities costs over $67 billion a year in lost productivity and excess fuel.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's terrible. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) terrible.
SYLVESTER: Traffic tie-ups are getting even worse. In the last decade interstate travel increased 37 percent, but miles of public roads increased only 5 percent.
The problem is not just with the nation's roadways. Subways and freight rail systems are also being strained.
ED HAMBERGER, ASSOCIATION OF AMERICAN RAILROADS: Seven billion dollars was spent on maintenance, 20 percent of replacing tracks, ties, ballast, new signal systems, switching systems. So there's a lot of wear and tear when you have a 286,000-pound car. SYLVESTER: And in the last decade, Americans have increasingly been using mass transit. But upgrades have not always kept pace. Transportation officials warn basic infrastructure investments must be made to keep subway and freight trains running.
MORT DOWNEY, FMR. DEP. TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: It won't go to an instant halt across the whole country like the power grid did, but it will do something like that. You'll see the inability for people to move, the inability to get goods in and out of our ports, and it will drastically affect the economy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: The deadline for Congress to authorize new transportation spending for the next six years is the end of September. The White House has proposed spending $247 billion. Congress is looking to up that figure. It will be a major debate when lawmakers return as various transportation groups and states lobby for additional money -- Lou.
DOBBS: Lisa, thank you. Lisa Sylvester.
Amtrak's president and CEO, David Gunn, says Amtrak is what he calls "the poster child" for this country's infrastructure problems.
David Gunn joins me now from Washington, D.C. Good to have you with us.
DAVID GUNN, AMTRAK PRESIDENT AND CEO: Thank you. Good to be here.
DOBBS: Two billion dollars, almost $2 billion you've asked for. Is that enough to keep Amtrak rolling?
GUNN: Yes. If we get the request funded that we've asked for, if we get what we asked for, we'll be able to start rebuilding the existing system and putting it back into a state of good repair.
DOBBS: For years there was lots of talk, much of it emanating from Amtrak itself, that in just another year or two, or perhaps a few, it would be profitable. You've been absolutely straightforward and honest and said that's not going to happen.
GUNN: It's a fantasy.
DOBBS: Why is that?
GUNN: Well, it's really -- at this point, it's almost irrelevant to discuss that. They've been talking about that since Amtrak was founded 30..
DOBBS: No, no, no. I'm asking you why is it that Amtrak can't make money? I know why they said -- I know why they did what they did.
GUNN: We exist in a highly subsidized environment. All of our competitors are subsidized, whether it's highways or airlines. And so it's not a true marketplace that you have out there.
And we have enormous capital needs. It's the capital needs that determine the need for -- the basic need for funding. And our capital plant is in very, very shaky condition. I mean, I have right now on the Northeast corridor, we have 200 track miles of rail that needs to be replaced. We have 400 track miles where you need to do the ballast cleaning and ballast replacement.
Between Penn Station and the North and Sunniside Yard we have -- we're down to one 1935 cable feeding our overhead wire. I mean, we...
DOBBS: David, if I may say, what you're describing, and it's too often something we're hearing from several quarters, whether we're looking at this country's dams or at its roads. How in the world did the world's only superpower, the most powerful economic entity in the world, get in this sorry shape?
GUNN: I really think that what happened in this country is we began to focus on instant gratification and consumption as opposed to long-term investment in the physical assets we need, in this case to run the transportation system, whether it be roads or railroads, freight or passenger. We have not -- we have been able to squeeze out of our capital plant current consumption, and we've enjoyed it, but now we've got to pay the piper and we've got to start putting money back into our infrastructure.
DOBBS: Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison as you know, one of the co- sponsors of legislation to provide far more money than either you, the White House, or anyone else has to this point up until the introduction of their legislation, had suggested. She says it's absolutely vital that we have a national rail system, that we have your company in business, and wants to see at least $12 billion put forward.
What's your reaction?
GUNN: Well, I don't want to get into specific legislation. What I need right now is I need the $1.8 billion. And if we want to sit down and talk about future expansion and growth, that's another subject. But I am desperate to save the existing system. And we are, based upon the statistics I just gave you, we are in real trouble. And we run the risk -- for example, if that cable fails that I mentioned in New York, we will basically break the northeast corridor. And New Jersey transit trains will be severely impacted in and out of the city. That's immediate, and I know what we need to fix my immediate problems, and really, I'm focusing on that. And for the long run we need higher investments. But for the short run we need enough to keep body and soul together and to get out of the mess that we're in.
DOBBS: What is the likelihood in your judgment that that is going to happen in the short run?
GUNN: Well, I'll tell you what, I work for a board of directors, and they have approved my budget. They have approved the $1.8 billion budget, which has a detailed capital recovery plan. And we are ordering the material for that budget. We are ordering the rail, the ties, the switches, and so forth that we need to carry out next year's reconstruction program. And I guess what I'd tell you is somebody's going to have to stop me and tell me to stop because I'm moving forward on that program. It would be irresponsible not to deal with these problems. If I don't deal with them, we're going to have a major calamity in my opinion.
DOBBS: David Gunn, thank you for being with us.
GUNN: Sure.
DOBBS: Come back as your problems, we hope, become more long- term in nature rather than short-term.
GUNN: I'd love it.
DOBBS: Thank you.
When we continue here, the unseen enemy. U.S. troops embroiled in a Guerrilla war in Iraq. General David "Grange On Point," Next.
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DOBBS: In tonight's "grange on point," General David Grange takes on language. Guerrilla warfare, fighting the unseen enemy. These tactics are being used against the United States and Iraq. History has shown this type of war is difficult to win. And General David Grange now joins us from Chicago. Let's talk about the language first, David. The idea that the DOD in this administration refuse to call this guerrilla war, are they right?
GEN. DAVID GRANGE (RET), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: No, it's guerrilla war. You can argue that it's guerrilla tactics, but if you just take the Webster's Dictionary, the criminals, the terrorists, the regime insurgents, the foreign mercenaries, they're guerrillas, they're fighting a guerrilla warfare right now.
DOBBS: Have you -- you have had a long, distinguished career as a combat leader and veteran. With what is going on, we are hearing that some generals are saying we don't need troops, we're hearing from administration we need simply different applications of force but not, as they are fond of saying, boots on the ground.
Do we need troops, more troops in Iraq?
GRANGE: I think we do, and I think we should have had more troops earlier on. And here's why I say that. I think this is a different angle to take a look at this thing. It's not putting a troop every 10 feet along the street or on every corner. It's having enough troops in order to keep the pressure on these guerrillas during the transition period. The Iraqi police force is not established yet. The civil defense force is not established yet. The coalition that's in place is still waiting for more international military support. So it's better to have more than you need up front and then move the troops home than to say there's just enough and just barely make it. So I think, yes, we need more troops. DOBBS: And those troops, to provide more security for the ones we already have there, the U.S. military's being put in a very difficult position here, is it not, because without sufficient force, without a program moving ahead for rebuilding and reconstruction, this is really leveraging, multiplying the burden on the military, which has plenty to take care of already, is it not?
GRANGE: The military is well committed around the world right now, and I think committed to the maximum right here in Iraq. See, right now the military is in a reactive mode, and they need to move to a proactive posture, to pick the time and place against the enemy instead of the enemy picking the time and place to do a terrorist attack or a hit and run against coalition forces. And to be proactive you have to be everywhere in unpredictable means and keep the pressure on and influence the environment. To do that you really need to have a few more boots on the ground where you have the flexibility to do so.
DOBBS: What's your best judgment and I'm asking now for your assessment and speculation certainly. Do you think we're going to see those forces, the Pentagon move ahead, this administration move ahead and put more force on the ground in Iraq?
GRANGE: I believe there will be more American forces sent over as well as international forces. And you have to put the international forces in the equation. We've operated with our country as well as some of our coalition partners quite successfully with other international counter-guerrilla forces. And I think once that happens it'll make quite a difference.
DOBBS: General David "Grange on Point." Thank you very much.
GRANGE: Thank you, Lou.
DOBBS: Still ahead here, hall of fame jockey and star of "Seabiscuit." He faces death on the track and is recovering.
Peter Viles, has the story.
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DOBBS: Hall of Fame jockey Gary Stevens, who appears in the hit movie "Seabiscuit," took a terrible spill this past weekend in a race outside Chicago. He's recovering tonight in southern California, and as you will see, he was very lucky. Again. Peter Viles reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETER VILES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: If you've seen "Seabiscuit," the horse racing movie, you may have noticed a new actor. He played the part of the glamorous jockey George Wolf. The truth is he's not an actor at all. He really is a jockey and one of the very, very best. Hall of Famer Gary Stevens has won more than 4,000 times, three times at the Kentucky Derby. And until this weekend he was on top of the world. But then came the home stretch in the Arlington Million last Saturday outside Chicago. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Silvermonte (ph) on the outside. And it's Storming Home! Gary Stevens and storming home -- oh, he took a bad step there. Oh, Gary Stevens and storming home went down.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, we've talked before about the eccentricities of Storming Home and you see something scared him in the infield and just as soon as he crossed the finish line...
VILES: As Stevens lay on the track, those watching feared the worst.
CLIFF GOODRICH, PRES. ARLINGTON RACETRACK: If if happens to any jockey you're scared. These are 110-pound jockeys on 1,000-pound animals, and when they want to make a right turn all of a sudden there's not much a jockey can do.
VILES: Jockey Rene Douglas was riding just behind Stevens when he fell.
RENE DOUGLAS, JOCKEY: My horse hit him somehow. So I couldn't -- I tried to do the best I could, but I still -- my horse still step on him on the back.
VILES: Miraculously, Stevens did not suffer a serious head injury. He did suffer a collapsed lung and a broken vertebrae. He spoke yesterday on a conference call.
GARY STEVENS, JOCKEY (via telephone): I'm a little uncomfortable right now, as you may understand but after seeing the spill myself I'm glad this -- I'm just glad I'm alive right now.
VILES: Stevens says he has no memory of the spill itself, only his thoughts as he tried to breathe through a collapsed lung.
STEVENS: I was scared to death. I thought I was having a heart attack. I thought I was dying.
VILES: Stevens said he hopes to ride again and that he would ride the same horse, Storming Home, that threw him.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VILES: Stevens is in need of inspiration during his recovery, he can get it from the true story of "Seabiscuit" and from the jockey Red Pollard, who did recover from a life-threatening injury to ride again and to win again -- Lou.
DOBBS: Gary Stevens, a Hall of Fame jockey and also, as it turns out, I thought, an absolute superb job in "Seabiscuit."
VILES: Terrific acting. "Seabicuit" good reviews and if you want to see a definition of true grit, when he gets up off the ground there, that's some good stuff.
DOBBS: That is scary to watch. Thank you very much, Peter Viles. Coming up next, the results of tonight's poll. Also, positive signs on Wall Street. Christine Romans will have the market for us.
And your thoughts about the battle over the ten commandments monument in Montgomery, Alabama. Stay with us.
(COMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The results of tonight's poll. In the Montgomery, Alabama controversy, what should be done with the ten commandments monument? Leave it, move it, or follow it? 49 percent said leave it. 46 percent said move it. 5 percent, follow it. Thanks for voting on that question.
Turning now to stocks, the Nasdaq today had a new 16-month high. The Dow up 26 points. The Nasdaq climbing 17. Christine Romans is here with the market for us -- Christine.
CHRISTINE ROMANS: Jobless claims fell leading economic indicators grew and the Philadelphia Fed Index was at a five-year high. So that inspired some buying here today, but the big story, Lou, continues to be the industrial rally. This year the S&P 500 is up 14 percent, but look at the Morgan Stanley Cyclical Index. It's up 24 percent this year.
Over the past three months 19 Dow stocks are up at least 10 percent. Among them, Caterpillar. It's up four times that. Alcoa, Honeywell, and United Technologies. The transportation stocks, too, on fire. The Dow Jones transportation average hit a new 52-week high today. It's up 28 percent over the past six months.
Now, Lou, these are typically the stocks that rally in the early stages of an economic recovery. And meanwhile the stock market internals continue to look good. Today at least, above average volume finally. 66 percent of the volume at higher prices. More than 300 new 52 week highs. Only a handfull of new lows. And, Low, both Goldman Sacks and Smith Barney today raised their earnings targets for the S&P 500 for this year and next.
DOBBS: Sounds like a positive indicator all the way around. Christine Romans, thank you.
Turning now to some of your thoughts. Barbara James of Tustin, California, "The recent attacks suggest that terrorist groups know full well their days are numbered. If we are successful, our eventual success in Iraq is too important to be derailed by partisan politics. It's time for American's to stand tall and stand united.
Gary of Claremore, Oklahoma adds, "Jobless recovery, out dated infrastructure? Balderdash, and untrue. Our government and corporations are creating hundreds of thousands of high paying jobs and building a modern infrastructure. And India and Iraq thank the American taxpayers for doin it at no cost to them."
Mike Knup of Columbus, Nebraska wrote in about the ten commandments, "I perceive the ten commandments to be a moral code, not the property of a religion. I can find no evil in the ten commandments, but I do see evil in not allowing the toleration of their existence in public places."
Dan of Santa Barbara, California, "The separation of church and state is what should be held sacred in this country."
We love hearing from you. Send us you emails, loudobbs@cnn.com.
And finally tonight, the Cadillac Escalade is loved by athletes, celebrities, and other, and also car thieves. The insurance industry says the luxury SUV is stolen 4 times as often as any other vehicle on the road. The Dodge Stratus, which costs far less than the Escalade, popular with horse people, is the second most stolen car in the country.
Rounding out the top 5, the Mitubishi Mirage, the Jeep Wrangler, 4 wheel drive, and the Lincoln Navigator.
That's our show for tonight. Thanks for being with us. From all of us here, good night. From New York City.
"LIVE FROM THE HEADLINES" with Bill Hemmer is next.
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in Iraq; Unemployment Is Down For The Month Of July>
