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Discussion on Rebuilding Efforts in Iraq

Aired August 21, 2003 - 11:12   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Let's get some more on this reconstruction effort in Iraq.
Rick Barton of the Center for Strategic and International Studies joins us live from Washington.

Mr. Barton, thank you very much. We wanted to talk to you this morning, because you had quite a few very interesting comments to make about this reconstruction process. And it appears as though you were rather pessimistic about this all ending up at least on a positive note sometime fairly soon. You think that almost every element over there that's working -- at least trying to work together -- is basically not happy at this point?

RICK BARTON, CO-DIRECTOR, CSIS: Well, I think it's just a huge undertaking. It's an enormous task. We underestimated how big the job was. And now, we're having to play catch-up at a very difficult moment, where we are losing some of the public confidence in Iraq. Clearly, the way these things succeed is when you get the silent majority working in a visible and a constructive fashion, and that hasn't yet happened in Iraq, because people are still afraid.

HARRIS: Now, if the U.N. does pull back quite a few of its workers, as we are hearing that they may do -- we've heard numbers for as much as between 10 and 30 percent of all of the people who are with the U.N. there, at least in Baghdad, may be pulled out of there. If that happens, how far back does the whole process get set?

BARTON: Well, one of the real challenges that we have on the ground is getting civilians who are familiar with Iraq, or at least Arabis (ph), to work in a dangerous place. So, when you have qualified people, who have at least gotten to know the place, leaving, that's a very negative trend line. We still need to find more of these kinds of people, because our 140,000 soldiers need civilians, not just as translators, but also as informed guides and interpreters of what's going on, on the ground, and we don't have that in the numbers that are required to do this job.

HARRIS: Let's talk about some of those numbers. You know, I'm sure you've heard President Bush's quote a little while ago, and months ago, when he was asked about what was going to happen over there in the theater, when he was asked about the terrorists over there who are trying to stall the efforts, and he said, bring them on. We've got all of the forces necessary that we need.

As you also may have heard, Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld also saying all along that we've got -- there are plenty of troops there on the ground. No more are needed.

We have yet to find another diplomat who has been there, who would agree with them on that. What do you think?

BARTON: Well, I think, at the very least, we need to be more visible in the community. We have to have more of a cop-on-the-beat, or at least a new-sheriff-in-the-neighborhood feeling around the countryside. We don't have that right now. And so, one way you get that is to have more people.

With the forest protection requirements that we have at present, it means that many, many, many of our soldiers are required just to keep -- to protect the outposts that we have and to protect the people who are trying to move within the country. That's not enough to give the Iraqis a sense of confidence.

HARRIS: All right. So, what, then, is the answer? If you were the one who was going to be advising either the U.N. or the U.S. on this particular matter, as these two parties are sitting down to talk about trying to encourage more nations to come on board here, what would you tell them?

BARTON: Well, I think, at this point, I would say we do need your troops. We need them wherever we can put them in the country, whether it's just to protect the United Nations operations or whether it is more expansive. We probably can use another 50,000 or 75,000 forces on the ground. We're going to need them for at least three to six months to clearly establish who is in charge and to give the Iraqis the feeling that the place is safe. Until it's safe, an awful lot of our work is just going to be handicapped.

HARRIS: Rick Barton, this is only the first of many conversations that we are going to have about this. No doubt. We will have to have you back. We sure do appreciate you coming on board.

BARTON: Thank you very much.

HARRIS: Take care. We'll talk with you down the road.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.







Aired August 21, 2003 - 11:12   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Let's get some more on this reconstruction effort in Iraq.
Rick Barton of the Center for Strategic and International Studies joins us live from Washington.

Mr. Barton, thank you very much. We wanted to talk to you this morning, because you had quite a few very interesting comments to make about this reconstruction process. And it appears as though you were rather pessimistic about this all ending up at least on a positive note sometime fairly soon. You think that almost every element over there that's working -- at least trying to work together -- is basically not happy at this point?

RICK BARTON, CO-DIRECTOR, CSIS: Well, I think it's just a huge undertaking. It's an enormous task. We underestimated how big the job was. And now, we're having to play catch-up at a very difficult moment, where we are losing some of the public confidence in Iraq. Clearly, the way these things succeed is when you get the silent majority working in a visible and a constructive fashion, and that hasn't yet happened in Iraq, because people are still afraid.

HARRIS: Now, if the U.N. does pull back quite a few of its workers, as we are hearing that they may do -- we've heard numbers for as much as between 10 and 30 percent of all of the people who are with the U.N. there, at least in Baghdad, may be pulled out of there. If that happens, how far back does the whole process get set?

BARTON: Well, one of the real challenges that we have on the ground is getting civilians who are familiar with Iraq, or at least Arabis (ph), to work in a dangerous place. So, when you have qualified people, who have at least gotten to know the place, leaving, that's a very negative trend line. We still need to find more of these kinds of people, because our 140,000 soldiers need civilians, not just as translators, but also as informed guides and interpreters of what's going on, on the ground, and we don't have that in the numbers that are required to do this job.

HARRIS: Let's talk about some of those numbers. You know, I'm sure you've heard President Bush's quote a little while ago, and months ago, when he was asked about what was going to happen over there in the theater, when he was asked about the terrorists over there who are trying to stall the efforts, and he said, bring them on. We've got all of the forces necessary that we need.

As you also may have heard, Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld also saying all along that we've got -- there are plenty of troops there on the ground. No more are needed.

We have yet to find another diplomat who has been there, who would agree with them on that. What do you think?

BARTON: Well, I think, at the very least, we need to be more visible in the community. We have to have more of a cop-on-the-beat, or at least a new-sheriff-in-the-neighborhood feeling around the countryside. We don't have that right now. And so, one way you get that is to have more people.

With the forest protection requirements that we have at present, it means that many, many, many of our soldiers are required just to keep -- to protect the outposts that we have and to protect the people who are trying to move within the country. That's not enough to give the Iraqis a sense of confidence.

HARRIS: All right. So, what, then, is the answer? If you were the one who was going to be advising either the U.N. or the U.S. on this particular matter, as these two parties are sitting down to talk about trying to encourage more nations to come on board here, what would you tell them?

BARTON: Well, I think, at this point, I would say we do need your troops. We need them wherever we can put them in the country, whether it's just to protect the United Nations operations or whether it is more expansive. We probably can use another 50,000 or 75,000 forces on the ground. We're going to need them for at least three to six months to clearly establish who is in charge and to give the Iraqis the feeling that the place is safe. Until it's safe, an awful lot of our work is just going to be handicapped.

HARRIS: Rick Barton, this is only the first of many conversations that we are going to have about this. No doubt. We will have to have you back. We sure do appreciate you coming on board.

BARTON: Thank you very much.

HARRIS: Take care. We'll talk with you down the road.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.