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American Morning

Don't Ask, Don't Tell

Aired August 26, 2003 - 09:13   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Jason Michael Tiner was a combat systems instructor for the Navy until his appearance on a television show ended his military career. Tiner went on the dating show called "Boy Meets Boy" and told millions that he's gay. Tiner had broken the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy about homosexuality and was discharged from the military a week ago. Jason Tiner joins us from San Diego this morning, and we need to note when asked about Tiner's case, the Navy confirmed he had been discharged, but would not comment any further.
Michael, uses the name Jason on the show, but Michael is your first name.

Appreciate you joining us on the show.

You were well aware of the military's don't ask, don't tell policy about homosexuality, right?

MICHAEL TINER, DISCHARGED FROM NAVY: I was. I was aware of that policy.

O'BRIEN: So give me a sense why you would go on a show when you clearly knew that it would spell the end of what was a very good military career?

TINER: Well you know, I was in the military for eight years, and the military, they instill fighting for what you believe in, which overall is freedom. I believe that every man and woman deserves the same freedom. We're all Americans. So with that, I think that all gay men and women in the military, they should have the freedom to -- to go on a gay dating show, if they so desire. I mean, the don't ask, don't tell policy is an unjust policy. It's a double -- they hold us to a double standard. If that was a straight man or woman that went on a straight show, such as "Joe Millionaire" or one of those, they would have never been fired from their job as I was.

O'BRIEN: So, then, doing the show was essentially a planned protest against the military's policy, is that right to say?

TINER: Yes. In a sense, it certainly was.

O'BRIEN: You're out to your family. Did your superiors before the show know that you were gay?

TINER: No, they didn't. They didn't. There's been at different commands that I've been at throughout the Navy, people at the commands did know. Superiors, as far as superiors, no, they didn't know. Commanding officers did know. People did know. And, you know, it was never a problem. It was never a problem. My command didn't know until I told them the week before the show aired.

O'BRIEN: And in fact, what I read was that a colleague saw you in the promotion for the show and then you went to your superiors and told them that the show was coming out and basically said, I'm gay, and that was when the discharge sort of got rolling, got under way.

O'BRIEN: Right, exactly.

TINER: What's your reaction, then, to the people who say, listen, the door is slowly opening by the two, I guess, official allowance of gays in the military by this don't ask, don't tell policy, you just sort of have to be patient. What's your response to them?

TINER: My response is don't ask, don't tell, a lot of people have this misconception that since the don't ask, don't tell policy is in place you can be gay, be in the military and you can be openly gay, you can talk about your boyfriend or your girlfriend, you know, and of the same sex, and that's OK. That's wrong. There's millions of Americans that don't understand that we will be fired from our jobs if they find out that we're gay. Don't ask, don't tell actually -- it could have took us a step back, because before it was just a military rule that you couldn't be gay. After President Clinton signed in don't ask, don't tell, it became law. So it has to go through the courts.

O'BRIEN: So you think by making it a law in some ways, it puts gay right as step backward, as opposed to moving things forward, albeit slowly, as some of the proponents of that law might say?

TINER: Right. I think that since it is a law now, since they do have to go through the courts, the anti-sodomy law was just lifted. I think that now it's actually going to help. But I think that in the beginning, I don't think it was put in place to help us, because it certainly hasn't helped us at all. We're fired from our job if they find out that we're gay. It did nothing for us. It just allowed us to come in the military and hide who we really are.

O'BRIEN: In fact, you're one of about 1,200 people that have lost their jobs, been discharged from the military, because of being homosexual or lesbian.

TINER: That's right.

O'BRIEN: Now tell me, you've been honorably discharged. I know you say you had a great experience, although you didn't win the show, you had a great experience on the show. What happens now? Will you go court? Will you become an activist for this issue? What do you do next?

TINER: I certainly am. I'm working right now for the San Diego Chapter of American Veterans for Equal Rights with the president, Bob Lehman. So I will be working with them to do whatever I can to abolish this ridiculous policy. O'BRIEN: Michael Jason Tiner, thanks for joining us this morning.

TINER: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired August 26, 2003 - 09:13   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Jason Michael Tiner was a combat systems instructor for the Navy until his appearance on a television show ended his military career. Tiner went on the dating show called "Boy Meets Boy" and told millions that he's gay. Tiner had broken the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy about homosexuality and was discharged from the military a week ago. Jason Tiner joins us from San Diego this morning, and we need to note when asked about Tiner's case, the Navy confirmed he had been discharged, but would not comment any further.
Michael, uses the name Jason on the show, but Michael is your first name.

Appreciate you joining us on the show.

You were well aware of the military's don't ask, don't tell policy about homosexuality, right?

MICHAEL TINER, DISCHARGED FROM NAVY: I was. I was aware of that policy.

O'BRIEN: So give me a sense why you would go on a show when you clearly knew that it would spell the end of what was a very good military career?

TINER: Well you know, I was in the military for eight years, and the military, they instill fighting for what you believe in, which overall is freedom. I believe that every man and woman deserves the same freedom. We're all Americans. So with that, I think that all gay men and women in the military, they should have the freedom to -- to go on a gay dating show, if they so desire. I mean, the don't ask, don't tell policy is an unjust policy. It's a double -- they hold us to a double standard. If that was a straight man or woman that went on a straight show, such as "Joe Millionaire" or one of those, they would have never been fired from their job as I was.

O'BRIEN: So, then, doing the show was essentially a planned protest against the military's policy, is that right to say?

TINER: Yes. In a sense, it certainly was.

O'BRIEN: You're out to your family. Did your superiors before the show know that you were gay?

TINER: No, they didn't. They didn't. There's been at different commands that I've been at throughout the Navy, people at the commands did know. Superiors, as far as superiors, no, they didn't know. Commanding officers did know. People did know. And, you know, it was never a problem. It was never a problem. My command didn't know until I told them the week before the show aired.

O'BRIEN: And in fact, what I read was that a colleague saw you in the promotion for the show and then you went to your superiors and told them that the show was coming out and basically said, I'm gay, and that was when the discharge sort of got rolling, got under way.

O'BRIEN: Right, exactly.

TINER: What's your reaction, then, to the people who say, listen, the door is slowly opening by the two, I guess, official allowance of gays in the military by this don't ask, don't tell policy, you just sort of have to be patient. What's your response to them?

TINER: My response is don't ask, don't tell, a lot of people have this misconception that since the don't ask, don't tell policy is in place you can be gay, be in the military and you can be openly gay, you can talk about your boyfriend or your girlfriend, you know, and of the same sex, and that's OK. That's wrong. There's millions of Americans that don't understand that we will be fired from our jobs if they find out that we're gay. Don't ask, don't tell actually -- it could have took us a step back, because before it was just a military rule that you couldn't be gay. After President Clinton signed in don't ask, don't tell, it became law. So it has to go through the courts.

O'BRIEN: So you think by making it a law in some ways, it puts gay right as step backward, as opposed to moving things forward, albeit slowly, as some of the proponents of that law might say?

TINER: Right. I think that since it is a law now, since they do have to go through the courts, the anti-sodomy law was just lifted. I think that now it's actually going to help. But I think that in the beginning, I don't think it was put in place to help us, because it certainly hasn't helped us at all. We're fired from our job if they find out that we're gay. It did nothing for us. It just allowed us to come in the military and hide who we really are.

O'BRIEN: In fact, you're one of about 1,200 people that have lost their jobs, been discharged from the military, because of being homosexual or lesbian.

TINER: That's right.

O'BRIEN: Now tell me, you've been honorably discharged. I know you say you had a great experience, although you didn't win the show, you had a great experience on the show. What happens now? Will you go court? Will you become an activist for this issue? What do you do next?

TINER: I certainly am. I'm working right now for the San Diego Chapter of American Veterans for Equal Rights with the president, Bob Lehman. So I will be working with them to do whatever I can to abolish this ridiculous policy. O'BRIEN: Michael Jason Tiner, thanks for joining us this morning.

TINER: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com