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American Morning

Paging Dr. Gupta: Emotion and Pain

Aired October 14, 2003 - 08:44   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Anyone who's heart has ever been broken knows the pain is real. Now a new study suggests there's physical evidence to prove it.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta more now on the science of snubbing from the CNN Center.

Good morning, Sanjay. Good topic here.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Bill.

What do you think they're trying to tell us, you and I, doing this story?

HEMMER: Well, so hands are in the air, right?

GUPTA: Listen, this is something that's actually it is an interesting study. It's been the object of quite a bit of research, and it has to do with that sort of sick in the feeling stomach take people sometimes feel after their heart has been broken, or after they have been picked last for a team, for example. Bill, you know all too well about that sort of that thing.

You can see these children out here playing on the playground. The subjects of this study were 13 volunteers actually, who were put through a sort of an interesting test, which I'll tell you about in a little bit, and try to measure whether or not being snubbed through the process of this computer game could actually lead to the same sort of changes in the brain that occurs when you have physical pain.

Take a look at some of the images. The way they did this was they actually put these volunteers in what's known as a functional MRI scanner. I want to point a couple things out to you. On the left here, see that bright orange area. It's exactly the sort of area of the brain that activates when someone has what is known as visceral pain. That's that deep in the gut sort of pain. They notice this area of the brain lit up when these 13 volunteers were socially snubbed.

Now the image on the right also important there -- I think we just took it off. The image on the right was also important, because it actually showed a protective area of the brain. This area of the brain lights up to try and tell you brain, listen, it's not that bad, relax a little bit about this, it will be okay.

Interestingly, the researchers actually went on to say perhaps why this social snubbery activates these areas of the brain. And what they sort of hypothesized was that social snubbery while in and of itself may not be a big deal, sometimes if one is snubs, it may lead to the possible withdrawal of such things such as food, shelter and water long term. At least that's the way people thought of it evolutionary. So if you're being snubbed, could it lead to those things later on down the road? Obviously, not for most people, but it is still part of our primitive reflexes to think so, which is why we feel that deep in the gut sort of pain -- Bill.

HEMMER: You're a neurosurgeon. Go back to medical school. Did you know this before? Have they been studying this in the past, or is this brand new to you?

GUPTA: Well, the whole hypothesis that there are areas of the brain that actually light up very much in the same way with emotional pain as physical pain, that's sort of been known before. But I think that using these function MRI scanners, where you can actually see which part of the brain lights up, that is sort of new.

HEMMER: Got it. One more thing here. When you talk about kids, is there an age here? And is there any breakdown with adults?

GUPTA: They did this on 13 volunteers. They did not break it down in terms of age. And it was sort of interesting the way they did it. I'll take a look at a couple of diagrams here. Basically, this computer program, you thought you were playing catch with two other volunteers. This is including all three players sort of playing catch. You think you're playing with two other people, and then what happens is it's actually a computer model, there is no two other people, and they start to exclude you as a player, so 45 of the throws actually go just to the two computer models, and you don't get to play any more, although you think you are being snubber by two other actual human beings. So this was the basis. Obviously somewhat of a primitive basis, but interesting nonetheless.

HEMMER: Snubbing in the brain. Thanks you, Sanjay. Speak for yourself for getting chosen last. See you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired October 14, 2003 - 08:44   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Anyone who's heart has ever been broken knows the pain is real. Now a new study suggests there's physical evidence to prove it.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta more now on the science of snubbing from the CNN Center.

Good morning, Sanjay. Good topic here.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Bill.

What do you think they're trying to tell us, you and I, doing this story?

HEMMER: Well, so hands are in the air, right?

GUPTA: Listen, this is something that's actually it is an interesting study. It's been the object of quite a bit of research, and it has to do with that sort of sick in the feeling stomach take people sometimes feel after their heart has been broken, or after they have been picked last for a team, for example. Bill, you know all too well about that sort of that thing.

You can see these children out here playing on the playground. The subjects of this study were 13 volunteers actually, who were put through a sort of an interesting test, which I'll tell you about in a little bit, and try to measure whether or not being snubbed through the process of this computer game could actually lead to the same sort of changes in the brain that occurs when you have physical pain.

Take a look at some of the images. The way they did this was they actually put these volunteers in what's known as a functional MRI scanner. I want to point a couple things out to you. On the left here, see that bright orange area. It's exactly the sort of area of the brain that activates when someone has what is known as visceral pain. That's that deep in the gut sort of pain. They notice this area of the brain lit up when these 13 volunteers were socially snubbed.

Now the image on the right also important there -- I think we just took it off. The image on the right was also important, because it actually showed a protective area of the brain. This area of the brain lights up to try and tell you brain, listen, it's not that bad, relax a little bit about this, it will be okay.

Interestingly, the researchers actually went on to say perhaps why this social snubbery activates these areas of the brain. And what they sort of hypothesized was that social snubbery while in and of itself may not be a big deal, sometimes if one is snubs, it may lead to the possible withdrawal of such things such as food, shelter and water long term. At least that's the way people thought of it evolutionary. So if you're being snubbed, could it lead to those things later on down the road? Obviously, not for most people, but it is still part of our primitive reflexes to think so, which is why we feel that deep in the gut sort of pain -- Bill.

HEMMER: You're a neurosurgeon. Go back to medical school. Did you know this before? Have they been studying this in the past, or is this brand new to you?

GUPTA: Well, the whole hypothesis that there are areas of the brain that actually light up very much in the same way with emotional pain as physical pain, that's sort of been known before. But I think that using these function MRI scanners, where you can actually see which part of the brain lights up, that is sort of new.

HEMMER: Got it. One more thing here. When you talk about kids, is there an age here? And is there any breakdown with adults?

GUPTA: They did this on 13 volunteers. They did not break it down in terms of age. And it was sort of interesting the way they did it. I'll take a look at a couple of diagrams here. Basically, this computer program, you thought you were playing catch with two other volunteers. This is including all three players sort of playing catch. You think you're playing with two other people, and then what happens is it's actually a computer model, there is no two other people, and they start to exclude you as a player, so 45 of the throws actually go just to the two computer models, and you don't get to play any more, although you think you are being snubber by two other actual human beings. So this was the basis. Obviously somewhat of a primitive basis, but interesting nonetheless.

HEMMER: Snubbing in the brain. Thanks you, Sanjay. Speak for yourself for getting chosen last. See you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com