Return to Transcripts main page

American Morning

Life and Death Battle in Florida

Aired October 22, 2003 - 09:10   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, turning now to the emotional life and death debate going on in Florida. By order of the state's governor, a rehydration tube has now been reattached to Terri Schiavo, who has been in a vegetative state for 13 years. Her parents have been fighting to keep her alive, but her feeding tube was removed last week after her husband won a court order.
Joining us this morning to talk about the issues that are raised by this very complicated case is CNN's legal analyst Jeff Toobin.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Hi.

O'BRIEN: Good morning. Nice to see you.

Wow, a lot to get to, so we'll just dive right in. Right now, the way it stands is that this tube has been reinserted. They're going to start hydrating her to prepare for, I guess, bringing nutrition back into her body. Why would the legislature get involved in this in the first place? And just how unusual is this element of the case? Because it's a fairly unusual case across the board.

TOOBIN: Across the board. Tremendously unusual that a legislature would pass a law that has only an impact on one person. Explicitly, this is just a law that affects her only.

And I think you have to look at the context of this battle. This is really about one thing that's not even being mentioned, which is abortion. This is about the abortion wars in a different setting, because all...

O'BRIEN: How so?

TOOBIN: Because what it is, the people who want to get this woman reattached to a feeding tube want to expand the definition of life. In the early stages, they want life to be defined as a fetus. In the late stages, they want life to be defined as any sort of beating heart. But if you look, it's the same people. It is the pro- life forces who are behind this, Randall Terry of Operation Rescue, he's been very much involved in this. And, you know, it's a pro-life legislature; Governor Jeb Bush is a pro-life governor. That is the context in which this is all occurring.

O'BRIEN: They got into the whole debate, though, after the fact. I mean, once the feeding tube was removed. Why not, if that's the case, and they see it building on this really as an abortion rights platform or against abortion platform eventually, why not get into the fray much earlier on? TOOBIN: Because it wasn't in newspapers, it wasn't on TV until then. One of the many bizarre aspects of this is usually when the legislature makes any sort of ruling, they have hearings, they look at the facts. Here there has been no sorts of hearings. This is only because this case has gotten into the news. Pro-life forces around the country have been mobilized sending e-mails, phone calls. They are acting solely on the basis of what they see on television, which, it's not -- there's nothing illegal about that. But it just -- that's the only reason that it came to their attention now.

O'BRIEN: Terri Schiavo's husband, Michael, went to court, and it was blocked on a technicality. He couldn't get any kind of a motion, sort of blocking the other motion that would reinsert the feeding tube. This is getting so confusing, I'm beginning to feel like I'm talking in circles of logic here. If he went to the right court, if it wasn't a technicality, what would happen next? And he has five now days to do so.

TOOBIN: You know, I'm going to give you a ringing I don't know. this situation is so complicated now, because there is an issue independent of whether it's OK to reattach the feeding tube, whether a legislature can pass a law that is solely directed at one person. Some courts have said that's unconstitutional even on its face. So that's one of the issues that will probably be litigated in the next few days.

O'BRIEN: And while it's solely directed at one person, doesn't that set precedent? Even if you only intend the law to be for one person, to some degree, once you get in the courts, doesn't that set precedent for future cases? It's been done before.

TOOBIN: It might. It might. What's so odd is that laws usually have general applications. In looking at this narrowly, the question is, it does not seem like it will set a precedent, because it only applies to one person, but it does set a context that if other cases come up like this, that courts will be reluctant to remove feeding tubes.

What's so strange about this case is that she did not have some illness that was going to apparently kill her. You know, she lived for 13 years. She might live for another 13. The only issue for her was nutrition. And eventually he won -- the husband won the right to take her off the tube. That is usually the case, that guardians can win those kinds of cases, but you know, they are all very different.

O'BRIEN: Everything up in the air right now. Jeff Toobin, thanks.

TOOBIN: More litigation to come. And it's very sad, this is a human being, family. I mean, it's not a political football.

O'BRIEN: Yes, it does seem that everyone in the case really does love her. There's not a sense that there is somebody who does not love her and wants the best for her, but they're all coming at it from a different direction.

TOOBIN: To say the least.

O'BRIEN: Thanks.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired October 22, 2003 - 09:10   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, turning now to the emotional life and death debate going on in Florida. By order of the state's governor, a rehydration tube has now been reattached to Terri Schiavo, who has been in a vegetative state for 13 years. Her parents have been fighting to keep her alive, but her feeding tube was removed last week after her husband won a court order.
Joining us this morning to talk about the issues that are raised by this very complicated case is CNN's legal analyst Jeff Toobin.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Hi.

O'BRIEN: Good morning. Nice to see you.

Wow, a lot to get to, so we'll just dive right in. Right now, the way it stands is that this tube has been reinserted. They're going to start hydrating her to prepare for, I guess, bringing nutrition back into her body. Why would the legislature get involved in this in the first place? And just how unusual is this element of the case? Because it's a fairly unusual case across the board.

TOOBIN: Across the board. Tremendously unusual that a legislature would pass a law that has only an impact on one person. Explicitly, this is just a law that affects her only.

And I think you have to look at the context of this battle. This is really about one thing that's not even being mentioned, which is abortion. This is about the abortion wars in a different setting, because all...

O'BRIEN: How so?

TOOBIN: Because what it is, the people who want to get this woman reattached to a feeding tube want to expand the definition of life. In the early stages, they want life to be defined as a fetus. In the late stages, they want life to be defined as any sort of beating heart. But if you look, it's the same people. It is the pro- life forces who are behind this, Randall Terry of Operation Rescue, he's been very much involved in this. And, you know, it's a pro-life legislature; Governor Jeb Bush is a pro-life governor. That is the context in which this is all occurring.

O'BRIEN: They got into the whole debate, though, after the fact. I mean, once the feeding tube was removed. Why not, if that's the case, and they see it building on this really as an abortion rights platform or against abortion platform eventually, why not get into the fray much earlier on? TOOBIN: Because it wasn't in newspapers, it wasn't on TV until then. One of the many bizarre aspects of this is usually when the legislature makes any sort of ruling, they have hearings, they look at the facts. Here there has been no sorts of hearings. This is only because this case has gotten into the news. Pro-life forces around the country have been mobilized sending e-mails, phone calls. They are acting solely on the basis of what they see on television, which, it's not -- there's nothing illegal about that. But it just -- that's the only reason that it came to their attention now.

O'BRIEN: Terri Schiavo's husband, Michael, went to court, and it was blocked on a technicality. He couldn't get any kind of a motion, sort of blocking the other motion that would reinsert the feeding tube. This is getting so confusing, I'm beginning to feel like I'm talking in circles of logic here. If he went to the right court, if it wasn't a technicality, what would happen next? And he has five now days to do so.

TOOBIN: You know, I'm going to give you a ringing I don't know. this situation is so complicated now, because there is an issue independent of whether it's OK to reattach the feeding tube, whether a legislature can pass a law that is solely directed at one person. Some courts have said that's unconstitutional even on its face. So that's one of the issues that will probably be litigated in the next few days.

O'BRIEN: And while it's solely directed at one person, doesn't that set precedent? Even if you only intend the law to be for one person, to some degree, once you get in the courts, doesn't that set precedent for future cases? It's been done before.

TOOBIN: It might. It might. What's so odd is that laws usually have general applications. In looking at this narrowly, the question is, it does not seem like it will set a precedent, because it only applies to one person, but it does set a context that if other cases come up like this, that courts will be reluctant to remove feeding tubes.

What's so strange about this case is that she did not have some illness that was going to apparently kill her. You know, she lived for 13 years. She might live for another 13. The only issue for her was nutrition. And eventually he won -- the husband won the right to take her off the tube. That is usually the case, that guardians can win those kinds of cases, but you know, they are all very different.

O'BRIEN: Everything up in the air right now. Jeff Toobin, thanks.

TOOBIN: More litigation to come. And it's very sad, this is a human being, family. I mean, it's not a political football.

O'BRIEN: Yes, it does seem that everyone in the case really does love her. There's not a sense that there is somebody who does not love her and wants the best for her, but they're all coming at it from a different direction.

TOOBIN: To say the least.

O'BRIEN: Thanks.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com