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CNN Live Sunday
Interview with Maj. Gen. don Shepherd
Aired November 02, 2003 - 16:08 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN ANCHOR: Let's call on one of our CNN military analyst, retired Air Force Major General Don Shepherd is on the phone with us now from Tucson, Arizona.
General, we heard in Chris Plante's report there there are thousands of these ammo depots. We heard Secretary Rumsfeld say that it's not a surprise that the surface-to-air missiles are floating around the region. Are you surprised that we haven't had one of these attacks sooner?
MAJ. GEN. DON SHEPHERD, RET. AIR FORCE: Not at all Andrea. And we have had these attacks before, it's just that the missiles didn't hit before. This is the first one, at least recently, that's hit. We had some that hit during the war.
On the recent trip to Iraq we were told there are literally hundreds of these ammo dumps around. It's totally impractical because of the dispersion and the number to guard them with U.S. troops, because then you got to guard the U.S. troops that are guarding the ammo dumps and resupply them, which means more convoys throughout.
So, it's a really difficult problem. It would probably take as much as five years to destroy the ammo that's around there. This doesn't surprise me at all.
KOPPEL: So then how can the U.S. military defend against future heat-seeking missile attacks?
SHEPHERD: Well, we defend against heat-seeking missiles all the time. We have infrared counter measures. Out of security reasons I won't go into what has them and what doesn't and the techniques and tactics. But the helicopters and fixed wing (ph) both have infrared counter measures. They don't always work.
A lot depends on timing and a lot depends on if you see the missile coming. Flying at night is a big defense tactic. But if you're going to fly at night, that leaves them the day to do whatever they want.
So the reality is you have to use the entire flock and take the risks and do the best you can. You're not going to eliminate all of these attacks. The longer we stay the more they'll come and the more people we're going to lose. That's for sure, Andrea.
KOPPEL: If there have been numerous attempts, and this was the first since major combat ended that was actually successful, is there anything that the U.S. military could or should be doing differently, or is this just a lucky shot?
SHEPHERD: Well, it's hard to say whether it's a lucky shot. By the way, when you see the helicopters on the scene they're not only evacuating the dead and wounded but they're gathering information. It's important to know for sure whether the aircraft was brought down by missile. That's what's been reported, but we need to confirm that, what type of missile and where it was shot from and get any information we can from the other crew members or people that may have seen that. All that's very, very important. It's just really difficult to say.
Now, what we should be doing, the main thing we should be doing is accelerating as much as possible the training of Iraqis to take over. I heard Jane Arraf's report and she's exactly right, it's most difficult to do anything culturally sensitive when you're occupying someone else's country.
The main thing they're doing is rather than huge sweeps of large numbers of troops and numerous villages is they're using targeted intelligence to go after specific targets, specific people rather than going in and picking off an entire village by waking them up at 2:00 in the morning.
All of these things are still very difficult and my judgment is there is there's way Americans are going to make friends of the sunnis in the sunni or ba'athist triangle. The key is to turn it back to the Iraqis and get out when they're ready to take it over and hold their own.
KOPPEL: And that is certainly -- we know the Bush administration would like to do, but it takes a certain amount of time train those Iraqi, get them up to speed. Major General Don Shepherd joining us on the phone from Tucson, Arizona, thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired November 2, 2003 - 16:08 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN ANCHOR: Let's call on one of our CNN military analyst, retired Air Force Major General Don Shepherd is on the phone with us now from Tucson, Arizona.
General, we heard in Chris Plante's report there there are thousands of these ammo depots. We heard Secretary Rumsfeld say that it's not a surprise that the surface-to-air missiles are floating around the region. Are you surprised that we haven't had one of these attacks sooner?
MAJ. GEN. DON SHEPHERD, RET. AIR FORCE: Not at all Andrea. And we have had these attacks before, it's just that the missiles didn't hit before. This is the first one, at least recently, that's hit. We had some that hit during the war.
On the recent trip to Iraq we were told there are literally hundreds of these ammo dumps around. It's totally impractical because of the dispersion and the number to guard them with U.S. troops, because then you got to guard the U.S. troops that are guarding the ammo dumps and resupply them, which means more convoys throughout.
So, it's a really difficult problem. It would probably take as much as five years to destroy the ammo that's around there. This doesn't surprise me at all.
KOPPEL: So then how can the U.S. military defend against future heat-seeking missile attacks?
SHEPHERD: Well, we defend against heat-seeking missiles all the time. We have infrared counter measures. Out of security reasons I won't go into what has them and what doesn't and the techniques and tactics. But the helicopters and fixed wing (ph) both have infrared counter measures. They don't always work.
A lot depends on timing and a lot depends on if you see the missile coming. Flying at night is a big defense tactic. But if you're going to fly at night, that leaves them the day to do whatever they want.
So the reality is you have to use the entire flock and take the risks and do the best you can. You're not going to eliminate all of these attacks. The longer we stay the more they'll come and the more people we're going to lose. That's for sure, Andrea.
KOPPEL: If there have been numerous attempts, and this was the first since major combat ended that was actually successful, is there anything that the U.S. military could or should be doing differently, or is this just a lucky shot?
SHEPHERD: Well, it's hard to say whether it's a lucky shot. By the way, when you see the helicopters on the scene they're not only evacuating the dead and wounded but they're gathering information. It's important to know for sure whether the aircraft was brought down by missile. That's what's been reported, but we need to confirm that, what type of missile and where it was shot from and get any information we can from the other crew members or people that may have seen that. All that's very, very important. It's just really difficult to say.
Now, what we should be doing, the main thing we should be doing is accelerating as much as possible the training of Iraqis to take over. I heard Jane Arraf's report and she's exactly right, it's most difficult to do anything culturally sensitive when you're occupying someone else's country.
The main thing they're doing is rather than huge sweeps of large numbers of troops and numerous villages is they're using targeted intelligence to go after specific targets, specific people rather than going in and picking off an entire village by waking them up at 2:00 in the morning.
All of these things are still very difficult and my judgment is there is there's way Americans are going to make friends of the sunnis in the sunni or ba'athist triangle. The key is to turn it back to the Iraqis and get out when they're ready to take it over and hold their own.
KOPPEL: And that is certainly -- we know the Bush administration would like to do, but it takes a certain amount of time train those Iraqi, get them up to speed. Major General Don Shepherd joining us on the phone from Tucson, Arizona, thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
