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CNN Live Sunday

Political Debate

Aired December 07, 2003 - 11:11   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Today's "Political Debate" now: A new assignment for James Baker, President Bush and his re-election race, the Democrats huddle in Florida, and Al Sharpton hosts "Saturday Night Live," and it was a good one.
Our guests, in Washington, are Democratic strategist Cliff Schecter. Cliff, hello to you.

CLIFF SCHECTER, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Hi, how are you?

COLLINS: Great. And Republican strategist Kim Alfano. Kim, hello to you, as well. I appreciate both of you being with us today. Let's start with James Baker. Kim, let me just ask you. You know, the Bushes' last turned to Jim Baker when things went sour, if you will, in Florida. What are they doing now?

KIM ALFANO, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I think they're doing what George Bush has done throughout his presidency, picking the best man for the job and the times and finding the very best help they can find to turn around the country of Iraq, and I think there's no one probably more qualified or more respected from both parties than James Baker on this issue. And I think at a time when the biggest stumbling block to success in Iraq is whether or not they can get their economy jump started, no one's better qualified to go help negotiate those...

COLLINS: How so, Kim?

ALFANO: Well, I mean, I think right now, how can you expect them to build a democracy in Iraq if they're burdened with incredible debt? I think there's someone - there's probably not anyone who knows the players in this better than Baker, and I think that he's got the qualifications to maybe talk to the allies and see, you know, if he can't help reduce some of that debt and the service to that debt. And I think that will help the country start paying for more citizens on the streets to help with security, help them get their hospitals up and running, and their economy continue to grow. And I think it is a critical element of any democracy.

COLLINS: Cliff, let me ask you, it may be a fair statement to say that on both sides of the fence, if you will, Baker is a respected statesman. Is he the best man for the job? Some say the debt can go as high as $125 billion.

SCHECTER: Is he a respected statesman? Absolutely. Is he the wrong man for the job? He absolutely is. This is just another example of this administration... COLLINS: Why is he the wrong man for the job?

SCHECTER: I'll explain it exactly. The administration has brought crony capitalism to a new zenith. You've got a guy whose biggest client is Halliburton. So we can expect to see more big contracts and gas price gouging in Iraq. He's a guy who represents the Saudi princes against the families of those who were killed on 9/11. He's part of that whole axis of financial power between the Bush administration and the Saudis, which is one of the reasons, maybe, we've been so tough on Iraq, but Saudi Arabia keeps building those Madrassas, teaching kids to hate America. Bankrolling groups like the Taliban and separatists around the world. He is not the right guy. He has numerous conflicts...

COLLINS: Who is the right guy?

SCHECTER: Who is the right guy? There are a number of people that are the right guy. I guess they already offended Anthony Zinni, so we can't send him back. He called the policy over there a brain fart. Excuse my language. But there are plenty of people he could send over there. Some of the folks right now sitting on the 9/11 commission like Lee Hamilton, and who didn't show up on the 9/11 commission, like Henry Kissinger and others, I would say, in my opinion, would be better than James Baker who went into Florida when they needed to steal votes and were there for them.

COLLINS: I know you're disagreeing, Kim. But I have to get to the Democratic National Convention. How do you think this went, Kim?

ALFANO: The Democratic National Convention -- you mean the Democratic convention in Florida?

COLLINS: Yes, ma'am.

ALFANO: OK. How did it go? I think it went as predicted. It was one of the most hateful, angry groups of mobs of people I've ever seen. If you listen to any of those speeches, especially if you listen to Kerry, they were fired up and throwing all the red meat they possibly could into the crowd in a desperation to attract the far left. I think Florida is angry because they still don't believe what the truth is, that Bush did win in Florida, that, you know, most every press analysis of what happened in Florida said that Bush won, that ...

COLLINS: But that's in the past. Let's talk about what we saw last night. Who is the shining star for the Democrats in your opinion? Of course, Cliff, I want to hear from you, as well.

ALFANO: Do you want me first?

COLLINS: Yes.

ALFANO: Obviously the shining star for the Democrats is Howard Dean, because Howard Dean was the first and the most consistent in tapping into that far left visceral, you know, hate, which is blinded by politics. They don't care about the policies right now. They just want to hate Bush, and I think the person who is the head of that banner is Howard Dean and he's being fueled by that across the country by the liberal left.

COLLINS: Cliff, do you think that there has become someone that the Democratic Party is really identifying with right now?

SCHECTER: Well, let me just say quickly, to respond to that, the Republican Party obviously has collective amnesia from the 90s. These folks that were distributing the Clinton chronicles, claiming that Bill Clinton had murdered people while in Arkansas, and got together at their conventions and put together the Arkansas project to dig up -- spend millions of dollars digging up dirt on a sitting president, suddenly are calling us the party of hate, which I always find rather amusing that the McCarthy-ite party could ever call us the party of hate.

But to move on to your question and say who were the stars there last night, Howard Dean is a star, and some of the things he's done, the fund-raising he's put together, is phenomenal. It's not just Republicans now, hitting up every corporate special interest. Howard Dean is actually raising money from smaller people, from people with less money.

ALFANO: But he's still really...

SCHECTER: Wesley Clark, who is a veteran of Vietnam and wasn't spending his time trying to perfect the beer bong strategy like George Bush and actually led a coalition in Kosovo where not one person was killed, unlike this debacle we're now living through in Iraq. And Dick Gephardt, who's spoken for the working man for years and doesn't try to fool people with the confederate flag and gay marriage and other cultural divisiveness, but actually tries to speak to people's better interests...

COLLINS: Cliff, let me ask you a question quickly, if I could, about -- you bring up Gephardt. We've seen a lot of flip-flopping on issues. Wesley Clark, is he for the war, is he against the war? Gephardt now coming out and saying he's no longer for leave no child behind, the education policy by President Bush, now has joined Kerry and others to sort of denounce that whole program. Is that making it sort of difficult for people to find the candidate that they want from this party?

SCHECTER: Well, absolutely not. This -- the leave no child behind is a joke because President Bush refused to fund his own program. I mean ...

COLLINS: Kim, I'm going to give you the last word. Kim, go right ahead.

ALFANO: I mean, it's just amazing. He's just listed a whole list of flip-flops before you even asked the question about Gephardt's latest flip-flop. The whole key is the party can't find any other ideology, any other thing to hang their hat on except that -- and Dean even said it -- that they need to abandon the middle and go to the left and that they just need to get rid of Bush. They're just an anti-Bush party, not a pro anything party and won't stick with anything.

COLLINS: Sorry that we're running out of time this morning, but Cliff Schecter, we appreciate your time very much. And Kim Alfano, as well. Thanks, guys.

ALFANO: Thanks, Heidi.

SCHECTER: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired December 7, 2003 - 11:11   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Today's "Political Debate" now: A new assignment for James Baker, President Bush and his re-election race, the Democrats huddle in Florida, and Al Sharpton hosts "Saturday Night Live," and it was a good one.
Our guests, in Washington, are Democratic strategist Cliff Schecter. Cliff, hello to you.

CLIFF SCHECTER, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Hi, how are you?

COLLINS: Great. And Republican strategist Kim Alfano. Kim, hello to you, as well. I appreciate both of you being with us today. Let's start with James Baker. Kim, let me just ask you. You know, the Bushes' last turned to Jim Baker when things went sour, if you will, in Florida. What are they doing now?

KIM ALFANO, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I think they're doing what George Bush has done throughout his presidency, picking the best man for the job and the times and finding the very best help they can find to turn around the country of Iraq, and I think there's no one probably more qualified or more respected from both parties than James Baker on this issue. And I think at a time when the biggest stumbling block to success in Iraq is whether or not they can get their economy jump started, no one's better qualified to go help negotiate those...

COLLINS: How so, Kim?

ALFANO: Well, I mean, I think right now, how can you expect them to build a democracy in Iraq if they're burdened with incredible debt? I think there's someone - there's probably not anyone who knows the players in this better than Baker, and I think that he's got the qualifications to maybe talk to the allies and see, you know, if he can't help reduce some of that debt and the service to that debt. And I think that will help the country start paying for more citizens on the streets to help with security, help them get their hospitals up and running, and their economy continue to grow. And I think it is a critical element of any democracy.

COLLINS: Cliff, let me ask you, it may be a fair statement to say that on both sides of the fence, if you will, Baker is a respected statesman. Is he the best man for the job? Some say the debt can go as high as $125 billion.

SCHECTER: Is he a respected statesman? Absolutely. Is he the wrong man for the job? He absolutely is. This is just another example of this administration... COLLINS: Why is he the wrong man for the job?

SCHECTER: I'll explain it exactly. The administration has brought crony capitalism to a new zenith. You've got a guy whose biggest client is Halliburton. So we can expect to see more big contracts and gas price gouging in Iraq. He's a guy who represents the Saudi princes against the families of those who were killed on 9/11. He's part of that whole axis of financial power between the Bush administration and the Saudis, which is one of the reasons, maybe, we've been so tough on Iraq, but Saudi Arabia keeps building those Madrassas, teaching kids to hate America. Bankrolling groups like the Taliban and separatists around the world. He is not the right guy. He has numerous conflicts...

COLLINS: Who is the right guy?

SCHECTER: Who is the right guy? There are a number of people that are the right guy. I guess they already offended Anthony Zinni, so we can't send him back. He called the policy over there a brain fart. Excuse my language. But there are plenty of people he could send over there. Some of the folks right now sitting on the 9/11 commission like Lee Hamilton, and who didn't show up on the 9/11 commission, like Henry Kissinger and others, I would say, in my opinion, would be better than James Baker who went into Florida when they needed to steal votes and were there for them.

COLLINS: I know you're disagreeing, Kim. But I have to get to the Democratic National Convention. How do you think this went, Kim?

ALFANO: The Democratic National Convention -- you mean the Democratic convention in Florida?

COLLINS: Yes, ma'am.

ALFANO: OK. How did it go? I think it went as predicted. It was one of the most hateful, angry groups of mobs of people I've ever seen. If you listen to any of those speeches, especially if you listen to Kerry, they were fired up and throwing all the red meat they possibly could into the crowd in a desperation to attract the far left. I think Florida is angry because they still don't believe what the truth is, that Bush did win in Florida, that, you know, most every press analysis of what happened in Florida said that Bush won, that ...

COLLINS: But that's in the past. Let's talk about what we saw last night. Who is the shining star for the Democrats in your opinion? Of course, Cliff, I want to hear from you, as well.

ALFANO: Do you want me first?

COLLINS: Yes.

ALFANO: Obviously the shining star for the Democrats is Howard Dean, because Howard Dean was the first and the most consistent in tapping into that far left visceral, you know, hate, which is blinded by politics. They don't care about the policies right now. They just want to hate Bush, and I think the person who is the head of that banner is Howard Dean and he's being fueled by that across the country by the liberal left.

COLLINS: Cliff, do you think that there has become someone that the Democratic Party is really identifying with right now?

SCHECTER: Well, let me just say quickly, to respond to that, the Republican Party obviously has collective amnesia from the 90s. These folks that were distributing the Clinton chronicles, claiming that Bill Clinton had murdered people while in Arkansas, and got together at their conventions and put together the Arkansas project to dig up -- spend millions of dollars digging up dirt on a sitting president, suddenly are calling us the party of hate, which I always find rather amusing that the McCarthy-ite party could ever call us the party of hate.

But to move on to your question and say who were the stars there last night, Howard Dean is a star, and some of the things he's done, the fund-raising he's put together, is phenomenal. It's not just Republicans now, hitting up every corporate special interest. Howard Dean is actually raising money from smaller people, from people with less money.

ALFANO: But he's still really...

SCHECTER: Wesley Clark, who is a veteran of Vietnam and wasn't spending his time trying to perfect the beer bong strategy like George Bush and actually led a coalition in Kosovo where not one person was killed, unlike this debacle we're now living through in Iraq. And Dick Gephardt, who's spoken for the working man for years and doesn't try to fool people with the confederate flag and gay marriage and other cultural divisiveness, but actually tries to speak to people's better interests...

COLLINS: Cliff, let me ask you a question quickly, if I could, about -- you bring up Gephardt. We've seen a lot of flip-flopping on issues. Wesley Clark, is he for the war, is he against the war? Gephardt now coming out and saying he's no longer for leave no child behind, the education policy by President Bush, now has joined Kerry and others to sort of denounce that whole program. Is that making it sort of difficult for people to find the candidate that they want from this party?

SCHECTER: Well, absolutely not. This -- the leave no child behind is a joke because President Bush refused to fund his own program. I mean ...

COLLINS: Kim, I'm going to give you the last word. Kim, go right ahead.

ALFANO: I mean, it's just amazing. He's just listed a whole list of flip-flops before you even asked the question about Gephardt's latest flip-flop. The whole key is the party can't find any other ideology, any other thing to hang their hat on except that -- and Dean even said it -- that they need to abandon the middle and go to the left and that they just need to get rid of Bush. They're just an anti-Bush party, not a pro anything party and won't stick with anything.

COLLINS: Sorry that we're running out of time this morning, but Cliff Schecter, we appreciate your time very much. And Kim Alfano, as well. Thanks, guys.

ALFANO: Thanks, Heidi.

SCHECTER: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com