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CNN Live Sunday
Interview With Avery Friedman, Michael Smerconish
Aired December 21, 2003 - 10:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CATHERINE CALLAWAY, CNN ANCHOR: Behind the gates of Neverland, friends and family of Michael Jackson rally around the pop star as he faces child molestation charges. A "You are not alone" party was held yesterday at Jackson's ranch. Some 600 people attended the event named after a Jackson song, of course. Celebrities included: Tennis star, Serena Williams and "American Idol" host, Ryan Seacrest. Michael Jackson's case is just one of the high-profile cases making the news this week. The fate of sniper Lee Boyd Malvo, now in the hands of the jury, after his murder conviction and of course, you know all about the Rush Limbaugh case going back to court to keep his medical records sealed in that prescription drug probe. And, joining us to discuss these cases is CNN contributor and trial attorney, Michael Smerconish and civil rights attorney Avery Friedman.
Good morning to you both.
AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Good morning.
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, TRIAL ATTORNEY: Good morning.
CALLAWAY: Let me start with you first, Avery. You know, Michael throwing a party for himself, is this a good idea, now?
FRIEDMAN: You know, what's stunning to me is you've got a case -- and I do children's rights cases, where once you charge the defendant like Michael Jackson, the prosecutor usually bars contact with children. There were 600 people at the party yesterday Catherine, including children and the prosecutor, the district attorney did nothing. It's amazing.
CALLAWAY: And Michael, there were quite a cast of characters attending that party last night. How does that look for Michael Jackson?
SMERCONISH: Well, he's a character himself, but is he a character that molests children? I guess that's the whole issue in this case. Catherine, I have to tell you that when the charges were first announced a month or so ago, I convicted him, in my own mind, many times over. Today I'm not so sure. Mark Geragos, earlier this week on "Larry King Live," I thought, was forceful and fabulous on behalf of his client. And I am no longer so certain that the guy is guilty in this case, there's a lot yet to come out.
FRIEDMAN: (LAUGHING)
CALLAWAY: Avery, what do you think? I mean, it appears this case has being tried so publicly, it hasn't begun yet, we have seven count of child molestation, two of administering an intoxicating agent. What about these charges? Does the prosecution have a case?
FRIEDMAN: I mean, serious charges.
CALLAWAY: Yes, very serious charges.
FRIEDMAN: Very serious. The difficulty is that the case, even from its inception, drips with reasonable doubt. I don't know how Tom Sneddon is going to make this conviction. Now, we understand there's much more to go, Catherine, but the reality is that there are problems with this prosecution and I understand what Michael's saying. He may have convicted him in his mind, but I don't know that a jury's will do the same thing.
CALLAWAY: OK, are you...
SMERCONISH: No, and I'll tell you what I think it comes down to Avery is: What did they find when they executed that search warrant? Because -- you know, but for the blue dress from the Gap in the Clinton-Lewinsky situation...
CALLAWAY: Michael...
SMERCONISH: ...we'd never have known...
FRIEDMAN: That's right.
SMERCONISH: ...who to believe in that case? Did they find a blue dress from the Gap when they searched Neverland? That's what it's will come down to.
CALLAWAY: Lots of questions still in the Michael Jackson case.
FRIEDMAN: And you know what?
CALLAWAY: But, we've got to move on, though you gentlemen...
FRIEDMAN: All right.
CALLAWAY: ...because we've got lots of cases to talk about. Now, I want to talk about the John Lee Malvo case, and we can start with you, Avery. On -- jury, you know, has convicted. What now? Are we going to see a death penalty?
FRIEDMAN: Well, remember at the beginning, the battle among law enforcement was -- is he going to be tried in the district or -- of Maryland, or Virginia, and law enforcement was pushing for Virginia because they do it fast and they do it tough. Now, Virginia isn't Texas, but I'm predicting within a week, this coming week, you're going to see a death penalty verdict coming through from the jury.
CALLAWAY: What about you, Michael?
SMERCONISH: Well, what's good for the defense in this case, Catherine is that for once, the defense gets to be consistent. In other words, it's not one of these cases where they said, "he didn't do it" and then he's convicted and a few days later they have to say to the jury, "well, we know you didn't believe us when we said he didn't do it, but will you please believe us now?" They get to be consistent and say, "He was brainwashed. You know the role that he played, but he played it because he was brainwashed. He should not pay with his life."
CALLAWAY: Emotional testimony, though, in that case.
Let's move on to Rush Limbaugh. Medical records up for grabs, here. What's going to happen in that, Avery, will they be opened?
FRIEDMAN: Well, here's the reality, remember that Rush hasn't been charged, yet. But, the felony involved is something called "doc shopping," which means if the prosecution can show that he's going from doctor to doctor, and in fact, the evidence is that he's gotten two -- he got 2,000 pills in five month.
CALLAWAY: Wow.
FRIEDMAN: So, the judgment here is going to be that the judge is going to take it in chambers and he'll make a decision, protecting the privacy of Rush Limbaugh to a certain extent, my belief in this case, is that information is going to be released to the investigators and think it's going to lead to an indictment.
CALLAWAY: And Michael, what about you?
SMERCONISH: I don't know how the prosecution can be expected to conduct an investigation for doc shopping unless they get access to those records. I think the real play here, from Roy Black on behalf of Rush, is to try and keep it out of the public purview. I think they know that those records have got to be handed over to the prosecutors. The question is can they keep it from the public.
CALLAWAY: Hey, is this a merging of great legal minds this morning? You agreed on just about every issue.
FRIEDMAN: I think we may have. I don't know.
CALLAWAY: I think you did. All right, Avery Friedman, Michael Smerconish, nice to have you with us this morning.
SMERCONISH: Have a nice holiday, thank you.
CALLAWAY: You two, as well.
FRIEDMAN: Thank you, Catherine, have a wonderful holiday.
CALLAWAY: Bye-bye -- Sean.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired December 21, 2003 - 10:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CATHERINE CALLAWAY, CNN ANCHOR: Behind the gates of Neverland, friends and family of Michael Jackson rally around the pop star as he faces child molestation charges. A "You are not alone" party was held yesterday at Jackson's ranch. Some 600 people attended the event named after a Jackson song, of course. Celebrities included: Tennis star, Serena Williams and "American Idol" host, Ryan Seacrest. Michael Jackson's case is just one of the high-profile cases making the news this week. The fate of sniper Lee Boyd Malvo, now in the hands of the jury, after his murder conviction and of course, you know all about the Rush Limbaugh case going back to court to keep his medical records sealed in that prescription drug probe. And, joining us to discuss these cases is CNN contributor and trial attorney, Michael Smerconish and civil rights attorney Avery Friedman.
Good morning to you both.
AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Good morning.
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, TRIAL ATTORNEY: Good morning.
CALLAWAY: Let me start with you first, Avery. You know, Michael throwing a party for himself, is this a good idea, now?
FRIEDMAN: You know, what's stunning to me is you've got a case -- and I do children's rights cases, where once you charge the defendant like Michael Jackson, the prosecutor usually bars contact with children. There were 600 people at the party yesterday Catherine, including children and the prosecutor, the district attorney did nothing. It's amazing.
CALLAWAY: And Michael, there were quite a cast of characters attending that party last night. How does that look for Michael Jackson?
SMERCONISH: Well, he's a character himself, but is he a character that molests children? I guess that's the whole issue in this case. Catherine, I have to tell you that when the charges were first announced a month or so ago, I convicted him, in my own mind, many times over. Today I'm not so sure. Mark Geragos, earlier this week on "Larry King Live," I thought, was forceful and fabulous on behalf of his client. And I am no longer so certain that the guy is guilty in this case, there's a lot yet to come out.
FRIEDMAN: (LAUGHING)
CALLAWAY: Avery, what do you think? I mean, it appears this case has being tried so publicly, it hasn't begun yet, we have seven count of child molestation, two of administering an intoxicating agent. What about these charges? Does the prosecution have a case?
FRIEDMAN: I mean, serious charges.
CALLAWAY: Yes, very serious charges.
FRIEDMAN: Very serious. The difficulty is that the case, even from its inception, drips with reasonable doubt. I don't know how Tom Sneddon is going to make this conviction. Now, we understand there's much more to go, Catherine, but the reality is that there are problems with this prosecution and I understand what Michael's saying. He may have convicted him in his mind, but I don't know that a jury's will do the same thing.
CALLAWAY: OK, are you...
SMERCONISH: No, and I'll tell you what I think it comes down to Avery is: What did they find when they executed that search warrant? Because -- you know, but for the blue dress from the Gap in the Clinton-Lewinsky situation...
CALLAWAY: Michael...
SMERCONISH: ...we'd never have known...
FRIEDMAN: That's right.
SMERCONISH: ...who to believe in that case? Did they find a blue dress from the Gap when they searched Neverland? That's what it's will come down to.
CALLAWAY: Lots of questions still in the Michael Jackson case.
FRIEDMAN: And you know what?
CALLAWAY: But, we've got to move on, though you gentlemen...
FRIEDMAN: All right.
CALLAWAY: ...because we've got lots of cases to talk about. Now, I want to talk about the John Lee Malvo case, and we can start with you, Avery. On -- jury, you know, has convicted. What now? Are we going to see a death penalty?
FRIEDMAN: Well, remember at the beginning, the battle among law enforcement was -- is he going to be tried in the district or -- of Maryland, or Virginia, and law enforcement was pushing for Virginia because they do it fast and they do it tough. Now, Virginia isn't Texas, but I'm predicting within a week, this coming week, you're going to see a death penalty verdict coming through from the jury.
CALLAWAY: What about you, Michael?
SMERCONISH: Well, what's good for the defense in this case, Catherine is that for once, the defense gets to be consistent. In other words, it's not one of these cases where they said, "he didn't do it" and then he's convicted and a few days later they have to say to the jury, "well, we know you didn't believe us when we said he didn't do it, but will you please believe us now?" They get to be consistent and say, "He was brainwashed. You know the role that he played, but he played it because he was brainwashed. He should not pay with his life."
CALLAWAY: Emotional testimony, though, in that case.
Let's move on to Rush Limbaugh. Medical records up for grabs, here. What's going to happen in that, Avery, will they be opened?
FRIEDMAN: Well, here's the reality, remember that Rush hasn't been charged, yet. But, the felony involved is something called "doc shopping," which means if the prosecution can show that he's going from doctor to doctor, and in fact, the evidence is that he's gotten two -- he got 2,000 pills in five month.
CALLAWAY: Wow.
FRIEDMAN: So, the judgment here is going to be that the judge is going to take it in chambers and he'll make a decision, protecting the privacy of Rush Limbaugh to a certain extent, my belief in this case, is that information is going to be released to the investigators and think it's going to lead to an indictment.
CALLAWAY: And Michael, what about you?
SMERCONISH: I don't know how the prosecution can be expected to conduct an investigation for doc shopping unless they get access to those records. I think the real play here, from Roy Black on behalf of Rush, is to try and keep it out of the public purview. I think they know that those records have got to be handed over to the prosecutors. The question is can they keep it from the public.
CALLAWAY: Hey, is this a merging of great legal minds this morning? You agreed on just about every issue.
FRIEDMAN: I think we may have. I don't know.
CALLAWAY: I think you did. All right, Avery Friedman, Michael Smerconish, nice to have you with us this morning.
SMERCONISH: Have a nice holiday, thank you.
CALLAWAY: You two, as well.
FRIEDMAN: Thank you, Catherine, have a wonderful holiday.
CALLAWAY: Bye-bye -- Sean.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
