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American Morning

Protest Zones Set Up by Secret Service at Presidential Stops Around Country

Aired January 09, 2004 - 07:31   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Let's go back to this issue about security in America. Since September 11, Americans have made sacrifices in the name of national security. But the ACLU, the American Civil Liberties Union now taking issue with the way the Bush administration keeps protesters away from the president.
Is it a threat to free speech or is it simply protection for the commander-in-chief?

In a moment, both sides on this issue.

But first, Brian Cabell reports now in Knoxville.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On a cold wintry day, most, but not all of Knoxville, welcomes a visit from President Bush.

(on camera): If I wanted to protest against the president, where do I go?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right there.

CABELL: Right here on this sidewalk? That's it? I can't go across the street?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's where they've got the designated area for you.

CABELL (voice-over): It's called a free speech or first amendment zone. It's a confined and sometimes remote area set up by the Secret Service and local police specifically for demonstrators going to presidential visits. Here, the protesters were more than a quarter mile away and out of view from the president, who was visiting a school and touting his education program.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Public education, we've got to get it right. It's the gateway to hope.

CABELL: The president's second stop, at the Knoxville Convention Center for a fundraiser, brought the demonstrators closer. They were just across the street. But again they were confined, and, again, never caught a glimpse of him.

MARCUS KEYES, DEMONSTRATOR: I think the government, the present administration certainly considers any protester as a person who is not to be listened to.

CABELL: Historically, demonstrators have been kept at a distance from the president. His security is vital; their right to protest against him perhaps less so.

ARNETTE HEINTZE, FORMER SECRET SERVICE SPOKESMAN: There will be a line drawn in the sand as to how far they have to get in close proximity to exercise that right, because our number one obligation to the American people is keeping our president safe and secure.

CABELL: It's a delicate balance, protecting the president and allowing free speech. On this day, protesters were able to speak, but President Bush apparently never heard or saw them.

Brian Cabell, CNN, Knoxville.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HEMMER: Now, the ACLU is taking the Secret Service to court over these protest zones.

Vic Walczak, legal director of the ACLU's Pittsburgh office, with us now from the steel city. With him, Bill Neel, who was arrested back in 2002 for protesting the president.

We invited the Secret Service to join us. The offer was declined. We do have a statement, though. We'll get to that in a moment here.

First, to Mr. Walczak.

What's your beef with what's happening right now around the president?

VIC WALCZAK, AMERICAN CIVIL LIBERTIES UNION: Well, first of all, we are not claiming that protesters have a right to go inside any secure area. Our argument is that any place that the public is allowed to go, any place that pro-Bush people are allowed to go, protesters must be allowed in those areas, as well. And what we've seen the Secret Service do around the country is take anybody who's critical of the president and move them out of sight, out of earshot and out of mind.

The Secret Service can protect people from danger and harm. They can't protect them from criticism.

HEMMER: Let's go to a specific example with Mr. Neel then.

What happened in your case when you were arrested?

BILL NEEL, ARRESTED FOR PROTESTING AGAINST THE PRESIDENT: Well, I had gone to protests in Nevada on Labor Day of 2002. And they had taken my sign. I was standing on the street in front of the so-called free speech zone. And they told me that I had to go inside the cage where there was an actual cage surrounded by police officers, which to me seemed to be incarcerating me for being a protester. And I refused to go in there. And I was off the street and out of everyone's way. At the same time, people with pro-Bush signs were walking up and down the street and carrying signs and exhibiting them without being forced into this so-called free speech zone.

I told the officer that there was no such thing as a free speech zone, the whole country was a free speech zone, and he eventually arrested me and took me into custody.

HEMMER: So you simply, you're saying that you never went inside the pen that was set up for the protesters that were protesting the visit of the president? There were others -- and the Secret Service is saying this is an issue that goes directly to the protection and the security of the president.

Mr. Walczak, listen to the statement from the Secret Service. Actually, sorry, it's from a federal court ruling this past week in South Carolina. This is what the court says. "In this age of suicide bombers, where people are willing to strap explosives to themselves to literally become walking bombs, the Secret Service's concerns with allowing unscreened persons to stand in such close proximity of a slow moving vehicle carrying the president of the United States is not just understandable, but manifestly reasonable."

That's the statement from the court earlier this week.

In a post-9/11 world, is there a statement and argument to be made there?

WALCZAK: We have absolutely no disagreement with what the court said there with the Secret Service's right to protect people from harm -- the president from harm. But a perfect example is what happened in Knoxville yesterday. On the motorcade route to the school, 15 minutes before the president comes by, the Secret Service tells protesters sorry, you can't be here, it's dangerous to the president. They move them 150 or 200 feet away, where they're out of sight, out of mind. Within minutes, they allow people with Bush signs who've not gone through any kind of security to stand in the exact same location. And there's simply no justification for that from a security perspective.

HEMMER: Just a point of clarification. So we had two CNN camera crews along that parade route yesterday. They tell us they saw nothing of the sort.

WALCZAK: Right. There's a story in the Knoxville "News Sentinel" this morning and it makes quite clear that, in fact, this did happen yesterday. We're in the process of tracking down the evidence for that.

HEMMER: All right, thank you, gentlemen.

Vic Walczak there in Pittsburgh, also along with Bill Neel.

Let's talk about the, well, the regulations set up by the Secret Service.

Our own security expert, Kelly McCann, is with us from D.C. -- Kelly, you were listening there.

What are the rules for the Secret Service in terms of protests and public parades?

J. KELLY MCCANN, CNN SECURITY ANALYST: Well, the bottom line is they have the actual responsibility to keep the president alive, this physical security. They also have a need to protect any principal that you're protecting from embarrassment and harassment. And that's a lesser included task.

The bottom line here, it sounded like, in this argument, is the nomenclature. In other words, if you claim that you are protesting, then there are rules about protesting. But if you're not protesting, if you're a supporter or you're just walking on the street, then you don't fit into a category that necessarily has to be controlled. I mean that sounded to me like what the actual argument here is.

HEMMER: Do you know of cases, though, where certain protesters have been kept away, have been arrested for trying to express their own freedom of speech?

MCCANN: No, not of trying to express their own freedom of speech. Listen, the Secret Service, Bill, provides an outlet for protesters by providing a protest zone. It just happens that the protesters don't like where the provision is or what the provision is. But the bottom line is, is they are not quelling first amendment rights. They're allowing that outlet.

I mean let's not kid each other, I think that protesters not necessarily are interested in the president seeing their sign as much as they are the media videotaping the president seeing their signs, which is a totally different thing. As long as there's an outlet for that first amendment right, then the Secret Service can get about the business of protecting the president.

HEMMER: Is it your belief and understanding in a post-9/11 world that things have gotten more tough and stricter or not?

MCCANN: Oh, I don't think so. I mean listen, when John Hinckley shot President Reagan, he fired six rounds in two seconds, in two seconds. The whole event was over in four seconds. In this day and age, where people can arrive at a site looking like they're covered with dust and it could be anthrax, where shoulder fired weapons such as RPGs are available, lethal to 200 to 300 yards, I mean this is serious business.

It will always be contentions. You know that I've protected people and it's always difficult to deal with the media, to deal with people who have opposing opinions.

But the bottom line is nobody wants to stand with their heels locked on Monday in front of the director of the Secret Service and explain why the president died on their watch.

HEMMER: Kelly McCann, thanks for your opinion, your viewpoint, as well. Appreciate it.

MCCANN: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com





Stops Around Country>


Aired January 9, 2004 - 07:31   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Let's go back to this issue about security in America. Since September 11, Americans have made sacrifices in the name of national security. But the ACLU, the American Civil Liberties Union now taking issue with the way the Bush administration keeps protesters away from the president.
Is it a threat to free speech or is it simply protection for the commander-in-chief?

In a moment, both sides on this issue.

But first, Brian Cabell reports now in Knoxville.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On a cold wintry day, most, but not all of Knoxville, welcomes a visit from President Bush.

(on camera): If I wanted to protest against the president, where do I go?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right there.

CABELL: Right here on this sidewalk? That's it? I can't go across the street?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's where they've got the designated area for you.

CABELL (voice-over): It's called a free speech or first amendment zone. It's a confined and sometimes remote area set up by the Secret Service and local police specifically for demonstrators going to presidential visits. Here, the protesters were more than a quarter mile away and out of view from the president, who was visiting a school and touting his education program.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Public education, we've got to get it right. It's the gateway to hope.

CABELL: The president's second stop, at the Knoxville Convention Center for a fundraiser, brought the demonstrators closer. They were just across the street. But again they were confined, and, again, never caught a glimpse of him.

MARCUS KEYES, DEMONSTRATOR: I think the government, the present administration certainly considers any protester as a person who is not to be listened to.

CABELL: Historically, demonstrators have been kept at a distance from the president. His security is vital; their right to protest against him perhaps less so.

ARNETTE HEINTZE, FORMER SECRET SERVICE SPOKESMAN: There will be a line drawn in the sand as to how far they have to get in close proximity to exercise that right, because our number one obligation to the American people is keeping our president safe and secure.

CABELL: It's a delicate balance, protecting the president and allowing free speech. On this day, protesters were able to speak, but President Bush apparently never heard or saw them.

Brian Cabell, CNN, Knoxville.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HEMMER: Now, the ACLU is taking the Secret Service to court over these protest zones.

Vic Walczak, legal director of the ACLU's Pittsburgh office, with us now from the steel city. With him, Bill Neel, who was arrested back in 2002 for protesting the president.

We invited the Secret Service to join us. The offer was declined. We do have a statement, though. We'll get to that in a moment here.

First, to Mr. Walczak.

What's your beef with what's happening right now around the president?

VIC WALCZAK, AMERICAN CIVIL LIBERTIES UNION: Well, first of all, we are not claiming that protesters have a right to go inside any secure area. Our argument is that any place that the public is allowed to go, any place that pro-Bush people are allowed to go, protesters must be allowed in those areas, as well. And what we've seen the Secret Service do around the country is take anybody who's critical of the president and move them out of sight, out of earshot and out of mind.

The Secret Service can protect people from danger and harm. They can't protect them from criticism.

HEMMER: Let's go to a specific example with Mr. Neel then.

What happened in your case when you were arrested?

BILL NEEL, ARRESTED FOR PROTESTING AGAINST THE PRESIDENT: Well, I had gone to protests in Nevada on Labor Day of 2002. And they had taken my sign. I was standing on the street in front of the so-called free speech zone. And they told me that I had to go inside the cage where there was an actual cage surrounded by police officers, which to me seemed to be incarcerating me for being a protester. And I refused to go in there. And I was off the street and out of everyone's way. At the same time, people with pro-Bush signs were walking up and down the street and carrying signs and exhibiting them without being forced into this so-called free speech zone.

I told the officer that there was no such thing as a free speech zone, the whole country was a free speech zone, and he eventually arrested me and took me into custody.

HEMMER: So you simply, you're saying that you never went inside the pen that was set up for the protesters that were protesting the visit of the president? There were others -- and the Secret Service is saying this is an issue that goes directly to the protection and the security of the president.

Mr. Walczak, listen to the statement from the Secret Service. Actually, sorry, it's from a federal court ruling this past week in South Carolina. This is what the court says. "In this age of suicide bombers, where people are willing to strap explosives to themselves to literally become walking bombs, the Secret Service's concerns with allowing unscreened persons to stand in such close proximity of a slow moving vehicle carrying the president of the United States is not just understandable, but manifestly reasonable."

That's the statement from the court earlier this week.

In a post-9/11 world, is there a statement and argument to be made there?

WALCZAK: We have absolutely no disagreement with what the court said there with the Secret Service's right to protect people from harm -- the president from harm. But a perfect example is what happened in Knoxville yesterday. On the motorcade route to the school, 15 minutes before the president comes by, the Secret Service tells protesters sorry, you can't be here, it's dangerous to the president. They move them 150 or 200 feet away, where they're out of sight, out of mind. Within minutes, they allow people with Bush signs who've not gone through any kind of security to stand in the exact same location. And there's simply no justification for that from a security perspective.

HEMMER: Just a point of clarification. So we had two CNN camera crews along that parade route yesterday. They tell us they saw nothing of the sort.

WALCZAK: Right. There's a story in the Knoxville "News Sentinel" this morning and it makes quite clear that, in fact, this did happen yesterday. We're in the process of tracking down the evidence for that.

HEMMER: All right, thank you, gentlemen.

Vic Walczak there in Pittsburgh, also along with Bill Neel.

Let's talk about the, well, the regulations set up by the Secret Service.

Our own security expert, Kelly McCann, is with us from D.C. -- Kelly, you were listening there.

What are the rules for the Secret Service in terms of protests and public parades?

J. KELLY MCCANN, CNN SECURITY ANALYST: Well, the bottom line is they have the actual responsibility to keep the president alive, this physical security. They also have a need to protect any principal that you're protecting from embarrassment and harassment. And that's a lesser included task.

The bottom line here, it sounded like, in this argument, is the nomenclature. In other words, if you claim that you are protesting, then there are rules about protesting. But if you're not protesting, if you're a supporter or you're just walking on the street, then you don't fit into a category that necessarily has to be controlled. I mean that sounded to me like what the actual argument here is.

HEMMER: Do you know of cases, though, where certain protesters have been kept away, have been arrested for trying to express their own freedom of speech?

MCCANN: No, not of trying to express their own freedom of speech. Listen, the Secret Service, Bill, provides an outlet for protesters by providing a protest zone. It just happens that the protesters don't like where the provision is or what the provision is. But the bottom line is, is they are not quelling first amendment rights. They're allowing that outlet.

I mean let's not kid each other, I think that protesters not necessarily are interested in the president seeing their sign as much as they are the media videotaping the president seeing their signs, which is a totally different thing. As long as there's an outlet for that first amendment right, then the Secret Service can get about the business of protecting the president.

HEMMER: Is it your belief and understanding in a post-9/11 world that things have gotten more tough and stricter or not?

MCCANN: Oh, I don't think so. I mean listen, when John Hinckley shot President Reagan, he fired six rounds in two seconds, in two seconds. The whole event was over in four seconds. In this day and age, where people can arrive at a site looking like they're covered with dust and it could be anthrax, where shoulder fired weapons such as RPGs are available, lethal to 200 to 300 yards, I mean this is serious business.

It will always be contentions. You know that I've protected people and it's always difficult to deal with the media, to deal with people who have opposing opinions.

But the bottom line is nobody wants to stand with their heels locked on Monday in front of the director of the Secret Service and explain why the president died on their watch.

HEMMER: Kelly McCann, thanks for your opinion, your viewpoint, as well. Appreciate it.

MCCANN: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com





Stops Around Country>