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CNN Live Today
CU Football Scandal
Aired February 19, 2004 - 11:09 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: We want to get some perspective on the rights of the alleged victims in the CU scandal. Susan Barnes is an attorney and advocate working on issues involving sexual harassment and women in the military. She joins us from Denver.
Susan, good to have you.
We're drawing on your experience, obviously, after the allegations of rape at the Air Force Academy, and elsewhere in the military, separate and distinct obviously from what happened at the University of Colorado. I want to first play the portion, the key portion, out of Coach Barnett's news conference that was indicting to him and was used to suspend him temporarily.
Let's share that with the audience first.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GARY BARNETT, UNIV. OF COLORADO FOOTBALL COACH: It was obvious Katie was not very good, she was awful, OK. So you know what guys do? they respect your ability. I mean, you can be 90 years old, but if you can go out and play, they respect you. Well, Katie was a girl, and not only was she a girl, she was terrible, OK. And there is no other way to say it, she couldn't kick the ball through the uprights. We had -- she took reps instead of player whose were much better than her, because we were giving her an opportunity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LIN: All right. Susan, to me, obviously criticism of her performance. Personally, I do not have a problem with the criticism of her performance. The key to me was when he said, "not only was she a girl," "not only was she a girl," which meant to me in the wording that the fact that she was a girl was a problem in and of itself. Would you agree?
SUSAN BARNES, ATTY.: Oh, I agree. There are some universal lessons to be learned, whether it's on the battlefield or the athletic field. Coach Barnett, with apologies to the rhinoceros, has all the sensitivity of a rhinoceros. But the universal lesson is you don't get anywhere with these sexual harassment issues unless in a hostile environment you have really good leadership at the top, and that's probably what the CU athletic department lacks right now is evidence by Coach Barnett's statements.
LIN: Because we don't really know what happened to Katie Hnida back in 2000. She claims she was raped. She didn't file criminal charges. Why didn't she pursue the case when she had the opportunity? And now that she's gone public with it, why doesn't she go ahead and help in the criminal investigation?
BARNES: Well, I don't know the answer to that because I don't represent Hnida. But let me just tell you generally that many young woman are reluctant to go further, because they, generally, know they're going to be losers. That was a lesson of all of those cases that we worked on in the '90s involving military women, which was they lost their careers, they lost their reputations, and so a lot women are understandably reluctant in the high-profile situation to speak out.
But having said that, let me tell you that with our system of criminal justice, people are entitled to defend themselves. And when women don't come forward promptly, then of course they're going to be the questions such as the one you, at least by implication, asked.
LIN: Because doesn't this actually -- I mean, let's say there is another woman out there and this happened under similar circumstances. By watching how this is being handled, by watching that Katie Hnida isn't really coming forward and not only making these allegations, but then trying to press charges or further the investigation, what kind of a message does that send?
BARNES: Well, I think the message it sends -- and I'm not criticizing Hnida here, because her response is really understandable. But the fact is that when women see what happens to Hnida with the questions now raised about her, precisely because she hasn't gone to the criminal justice system, where this very serious charge belongs, then it undercuts her credibility.
And I'm not suggesting she's not credible, because what women -- I need to tell you that in my experience, the reason women come forward is to help other women. And they know they're going to be sacrificing themselves and their reputation. I'm sure what she wants to do is help improve a situation that she found intolerable four years ago.
LIN: It's a tough situation. Susan Barnes, thank you very much.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired February 19, 2004 - 11:09 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: We want to get some perspective on the rights of the alleged victims in the CU scandal. Susan Barnes is an attorney and advocate working on issues involving sexual harassment and women in the military. She joins us from Denver.
Susan, good to have you.
We're drawing on your experience, obviously, after the allegations of rape at the Air Force Academy, and elsewhere in the military, separate and distinct obviously from what happened at the University of Colorado. I want to first play the portion, the key portion, out of Coach Barnett's news conference that was indicting to him and was used to suspend him temporarily.
Let's share that with the audience first.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GARY BARNETT, UNIV. OF COLORADO FOOTBALL COACH: It was obvious Katie was not very good, she was awful, OK. So you know what guys do? they respect your ability. I mean, you can be 90 years old, but if you can go out and play, they respect you. Well, Katie was a girl, and not only was she a girl, she was terrible, OK. And there is no other way to say it, she couldn't kick the ball through the uprights. We had -- she took reps instead of player whose were much better than her, because we were giving her an opportunity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LIN: All right. Susan, to me, obviously criticism of her performance. Personally, I do not have a problem with the criticism of her performance. The key to me was when he said, "not only was she a girl," "not only was she a girl," which meant to me in the wording that the fact that she was a girl was a problem in and of itself. Would you agree?
SUSAN BARNES, ATTY.: Oh, I agree. There are some universal lessons to be learned, whether it's on the battlefield or the athletic field. Coach Barnett, with apologies to the rhinoceros, has all the sensitivity of a rhinoceros. But the universal lesson is you don't get anywhere with these sexual harassment issues unless in a hostile environment you have really good leadership at the top, and that's probably what the CU athletic department lacks right now is evidence by Coach Barnett's statements.
LIN: Because we don't really know what happened to Katie Hnida back in 2000. She claims she was raped. She didn't file criminal charges. Why didn't she pursue the case when she had the opportunity? And now that she's gone public with it, why doesn't she go ahead and help in the criminal investigation?
BARNES: Well, I don't know the answer to that because I don't represent Hnida. But let me just tell you generally that many young woman are reluctant to go further, because they, generally, know they're going to be losers. That was a lesson of all of those cases that we worked on in the '90s involving military women, which was they lost their careers, they lost their reputations, and so a lot women are understandably reluctant in the high-profile situation to speak out.
But having said that, let me tell you that with our system of criminal justice, people are entitled to defend themselves. And when women don't come forward promptly, then of course they're going to be the questions such as the one you, at least by implication, asked.
LIN: Because doesn't this actually -- I mean, let's say there is another woman out there and this happened under similar circumstances. By watching how this is being handled, by watching that Katie Hnida isn't really coming forward and not only making these allegations, but then trying to press charges or further the investigation, what kind of a message does that send?
BARNES: Well, I think the message it sends -- and I'm not criticizing Hnida here, because her response is really understandable. But the fact is that when women see what happens to Hnida with the questions now raised about her, precisely because she hasn't gone to the criminal justice system, where this very serious charge belongs, then it undercuts her credibility.
And I'm not suggesting she's not credible, because what women -- I need to tell you that in my experience, the reason women come forward is to help other women. And they know they're going to be sacrificing themselves and their reputation. I'm sure what she wants to do is help improve a situation that she found intolerable four years ago.
LIN: It's a tough situation. Susan Barnes, thank you very much.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
