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American Morning
Martha Stewart Trial
Aired February 24, 2004 - 07:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: The Martha Stewart trial now. Martha Stewart's business manager defended her boss, saying that Stewart and her broker had set a sale price for ImClone shares before the stock took a dive.
The government says that Stewart and the broker concocted the story to cover up an illegal tip.
Meanwhile, both sides are anxiously waiting to hear whether the judge in the case is going to drop any of the charges.
To bring us up-to-speed on all of this, CNN senior legal analyst Jeff Toobin in court yesterday, back today, I imagine.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: Good morning.
Heidi DeLuca was on the stand, and what she said really counteracted the prosecution's case that this $60 sell point was completely fabricated by Martha Stewart and her broker. What did Heidi DeLuca say?
TOOBIN: A very critical issue in the case, because the issue is: Did Martha Stewart lie about why she sold the stock? And her explanation has been to all of the investigators who asked her, it wasn't because I got a tip that Sam Waksal, the CEO, was selling. It was because I had an agreement with Peter Bacanovic, my broker, to sell when the stock hit 60.
Heidi DeLuca, her business manager, the person who works on all of her personal finances, even though she's on the staff of Martha Stewart Living company -- which I thought was sort of odd in and of itself. But anyway, she said that in November, a month before the stock sale, she had a conversation with Peter Bacanovic that, you know, when the stock hits 60 or 61 Martha really ought to sell, and I'm going to talk about that with Martha, she was quoted Bacanovic as saying.
It wasn't iron clad. It wasn't, you know, a piece of paper. There was no corroboration of it, but this was the first independent piece of evidence that said there was this agreement to sell at 60.
O'BRIEN: Yesterday, it was Peter Bacanovic's lawyers who were really taking over. Today, we're going to see Martha Stewart's defense team defending her. How linked are these cases? I mean, if doom for Bacanovic, does that mean ultimately doom for Martha Stewart? Or one being cleared, does that mean the other is cleared as well?
TOOBIN: That's interesting. That has kind of ebbed and flowed over the trial, how coordinated the defenses are. When it comes to someone like Heidi DeLuca, Bacanovic and Stewart are very much aligned. Their interests are really...
O'BRIEN: They both benefit.
TOOBIN: Or they both have an interest in establishing there was this plan to sell at 60. When it came to other witnesses like Douglas Faneuil, he was much more damaging towards Bacanovic. That's, of course, Bacanovic's assistant -- Faneuil. And, in fact, at that point, Stewart's lawyers said, well, you know, there may have been a conspiracy between Faneuil and Bacanovic, but Martha had nothing to do with it.
So, the alliance has not always been consistent.
O'BRIEN: Is that an unusual arrangement, or do you see this a lot?
TOOBIN: You see that commonly in multi-defendant cases. Usually, they are allied, but the defendants sometimes have conflicting interests.
O'BRIEN: Bill Cosby was in the courtroom yesterday.
TOOBIN: Bill Cosby...
O'BRIEN: He came in and said he was supporting his friend.
TOOBIN: You know, how you can tell he's a really big celebrity? He was wearing sunglasses indoors. Like, what is that? I don't know. He said...
O'BRIEN: Oh, come on, Jeff.
TOOBIN: It was just, like, you know, maybe we should start doing that.
O'BRIEN: And signing autographs outside apparently.
TOOBIN: There he was. No, he was -- he stayed for about an hour.
O'BRIEN: Do you think jurors care?
TOOBIN: You know...
O'BRIEN: I mean, do jurors say, well, Bill Cosby supports Martha Stewart. Maybe I should vote against a conviction.
TOOBIN: I was trying to look and see how many jurors even noticed he was there. I thought a couple were doing double takes. You know, in the context of a month-long-plus trial, a celebrity sitting there for an hour one afternoon I don't think is going to make any difference at all, but it was entertaining to see him there. He said he brought Martha some chocolate Jello.
O'BRIEN: Oh. That's sort of sweet. Martha on the stand? Yes or no? Weve got to end every interview this way.
TOOBIN: It's looking more and more like no. And I'm increasingly confident about that. I don't like to make many predictions, but that one...
O'BRIEN: We always put you on the spot anyway.
TOOBIN: All right.
O'BRIEN: Jeff Toobin, thanks.
TOOBIN: All right.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
Aired February 24, 2004 - 07:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: The Martha Stewart trial now. Martha Stewart's business manager defended her boss, saying that Stewart and her broker had set a sale price for ImClone shares before the stock took a dive.
The government says that Stewart and the broker concocted the story to cover up an illegal tip.
Meanwhile, both sides are anxiously waiting to hear whether the judge in the case is going to drop any of the charges.
To bring us up-to-speed on all of this, CNN senior legal analyst Jeff Toobin in court yesterday, back today, I imagine.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: Good morning.
Heidi DeLuca was on the stand, and what she said really counteracted the prosecution's case that this $60 sell point was completely fabricated by Martha Stewart and her broker. What did Heidi DeLuca say?
TOOBIN: A very critical issue in the case, because the issue is: Did Martha Stewart lie about why she sold the stock? And her explanation has been to all of the investigators who asked her, it wasn't because I got a tip that Sam Waksal, the CEO, was selling. It was because I had an agreement with Peter Bacanovic, my broker, to sell when the stock hit 60.
Heidi DeLuca, her business manager, the person who works on all of her personal finances, even though she's on the staff of Martha Stewart Living company -- which I thought was sort of odd in and of itself. But anyway, she said that in November, a month before the stock sale, she had a conversation with Peter Bacanovic that, you know, when the stock hits 60 or 61 Martha really ought to sell, and I'm going to talk about that with Martha, she was quoted Bacanovic as saying.
It wasn't iron clad. It wasn't, you know, a piece of paper. There was no corroboration of it, but this was the first independent piece of evidence that said there was this agreement to sell at 60.
O'BRIEN: Yesterday, it was Peter Bacanovic's lawyers who were really taking over. Today, we're going to see Martha Stewart's defense team defending her. How linked are these cases? I mean, if doom for Bacanovic, does that mean ultimately doom for Martha Stewart? Or one being cleared, does that mean the other is cleared as well?
TOOBIN: That's interesting. That has kind of ebbed and flowed over the trial, how coordinated the defenses are. When it comes to someone like Heidi DeLuca, Bacanovic and Stewart are very much aligned. Their interests are really...
O'BRIEN: They both benefit.
TOOBIN: Or they both have an interest in establishing there was this plan to sell at 60. When it came to other witnesses like Douglas Faneuil, he was much more damaging towards Bacanovic. That's, of course, Bacanovic's assistant -- Faneuil. And, in fact, at that point, Stewart's lawyers said, well, you know, there may have been a conspiracy between Faneuil and Bacanovic, but Martha had nothing to do with it.
So, the alliance has not always been consistent.
O'BRIEN: Is that an unusual arrangement, or do you see this a lot?
TOOBIN: You see that commonly in multi-defendant cases. Usually, they are allied, but the defendants sometimes have conflicting interests.
O'BRIEN: Bill Cosby was in the courtroom yesterday.
TOOBIN: Bill Cosby...
O'BRIEN: He came in and said he was supporting his friend.
TOOBIN: You know, how you can tell he's a really big celebrity? He was wearing sunglasses indoors. Like, what is that? I don't know. He said...
O'BRIEN: Oh, come on, Jeff.
TOOBIN: It was just, like, you know, maybe we should start doing that.
O'BRIEN: And signing autographs outside apparently.
TOOBIN: There he was. No, he was -- he stayed for about an hour.
O'BRIEN: Do you think jurors care?
TOOBIN: You know...
O'BRIEN: I mean, do jurors say, well, Bill Cosby supports Martha Stewart. Maybe I should vote against a conviction.
TOOBIN: I was trying to look and see how many jurors even noticed he was there. I thought a couple were doing double takes. You know, in the context of a month-long-plus trial, a celebrity sitting there for an hour one afternoon I don't think is going to make any difference at all, but it was entertaining to see him there. He said he brought Martha some chocolate Jello.
O'BRIEN: Oh. That's sort of sweet. Martha on the stand? Yes or no? Weve got to end every interview this way.
TOOBIN: It's looking more and more like no. And I'm increasingly confident about that. I don't like to make many predictions, but that one...
O'BRIEN: We always put you on the spot anyway.
TOOBIN: All right.
O'BRIEN: Jeff Toobin, thanks.
TOOBIN: All right.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
