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American Morning

Ashcroft Hospitalized

Aired March 05, 2004 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning everybody and welcome. It is exactly half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. We're going to come to you with more on the condition of Attorney General John Ashcroft in just a few moments. He is in intensive care at a hospital in Washington, D.C. He's being treated for gallstone pancreatitis. And Dr. Sanjay Gupta is going to explain a little bit more about his condition and just how serious it might be.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also in a few moments here, we'll talk about the mystery on how much water once existed on Mars and how long ago. Can the Rovers give the answers? We'll talk to a scientist from the American Museum of Natural History. Had put on latex gloves for this show this morning. So we'll get to that also in a moment.

Our top story's from Iraq now. A last-minute hitch for the signing of Iraq's interim constitution in Baghdad. Some Shi'ite members of the Iraqi Governing Council said to have last-minute reservations over the charter, causing that delay. That continues at this hour.

The signing was to have taken place about 8:00 a.m. Eastern time, about 90 minutes ago. Political sources say the delay could be substantial. We don't have a better definition than that now. The document is a big milestone in U.S. plans to hand over power in Iraq come June 30.

U.S. voters appear split over who they want at this point in the White House next November. A new Associated Press poll shows President Bush is supported by 46 percent of that survey, John Kerry 45 percent. Also on the board, independent candidate Ralph Nader. He has 6 percent in that poll by the Associated Press.

The University of Colorado has imposed tough new rules on football recruiting. Among the guidelines, chaperoned activities and an 11:00 p.m. Curfew. This is after several women accused players and recruits from the Colorado football team of rape or sexual assault. The university denying allegations that its football program used sex and alcohol to lure recruits to the school, but has launched an investigation on campus.

Arizona, flash flooding, hail pounding parts of that state. Heavy rain and ice fell from the sky in Phoenix. And rush hour traffic stop and go as drivers tried to navigate through the flooded streets. That was the scene yesterday in Arizona hoping for better today.

O'BRIEN: That's got to be so scary for a driver. I mean that water is high and moving pretty fast.

HEMMER: Tough going.

(WEATHER UPDATE)

O'BRIEN: We're learning more this morning that John Ashcroft underwent emergency gallstone surgery last night. Dr. Sanjay Gupta's got an update on all this for us this morning. Good morning.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning. yes, he's in the emergency room doing what lot of doctors call letting the pancreas cool down for a little bit.

Typically gallstone pancreatitis, when the gallstone actually inflames part of the pancreatitis, can be a painful thing. Someone can have abdominal pain, someone can have back pain, fever, nausea, things like that.

So basically probably what he's enduring right now, it will probably take a couple days until they know how they're going to proceed.

O'BRIEN: You've got a picture of the gallbladder and sort of how the whole system works. Can you kind of walk us through what the problem is and where the problem is?

GUPTA: Yes, it's a little be hard to see. This is from a Web site, GeneralSurgery.com.

But essentially in green there is the gallbladder. And those little black things are stones that typically go down and go straight into the intestine. That usually happens in most people without any problems at all.

Now pancreas, who is just above that, can sometimes get blocked up by those stones and therefore that causes all these symptoms. It sort of basic mechanics of medicine. These enzymes are trying to get through but they can't because a stone is blocking it. And that's what causes all the pain.

O'BRIEN: Apparently the attorney general had been complaining about -- he thought he had the flu. He complained about flu-like symptoms to his friends, I guess, and family members as well. Is that typical?

GUPTA: Symptoms Well the Typically -- and we have a list of the symptoms, are more typically related to the abdominal pain and the back pain. But oftentimes a lot that -- people can get nausea, they can get fevers, they can have what are known as elevated enzymes which is just this very painful thing in the abdominal cavity and the back as well. When these enzymes start to build up, it causes that pain.

O'BRIEN: Gallstones are not uncommon. So what percentage of folks who have gallstones or even gallstone disease are going to get pancreatitis? GUPTA: Very small percentage. Gallstones themselves, everyone's heard of those, they're pretty common. About 20 million American adults get those, 5 percent of those people will then go on to develop gallstone disease.

And then about less than 1 percent will also involve the adjoining pancreas. That's a very rare situation. Typically in women this is more common. Men it's more likely to be caused actually by alcohol use.

O'BRIEN: I was going to ask you that. What are the causes? I mean why would the attorney general get gallstone pancreatitis? Is it just, you know, bad luck essentially?

GUPTA: Well you know, they're calling it gallstone pancreatitis, which means that it's a mechanical obstruction of the stone. Now why some people develop stones as opposed to other people, a little bit harder. A lot of times more related to diet, it's more related to any medications he may have been taking. Things like that are the most likely culprits here.

O'BRIEN: All right, well, he is in the emergency room. Underwent some surgery. And doctors are saying that in 48 hours they'll have a better idea of exactly what his condition is.

GUPTA: That's right. It's usually how long it takes.

O'BRIEN: Thanks, Sanjay.

GUPTA: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Bill.

HEMMER: Now to the Red Planet. NASA's two Mars Rovers, Spirit and Opportunity, already having provided evidence of water on Mars. There is more work to be done though. Bit earlier I talked to Michael Shara, head of astro physics at the American Museum of Natural History here in New York. We started today with a bit of a geological show and tell.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MICHAEL SHARA, AMERICAN MUSEUM OF NATURAL HISTORY: I've brought along a piece of geracite (ph). Geracite is the...

HEMMER: Can I put my gloves on?

SHARA: I think if you want to handle it, because it's kind of messy stuff.

HEMMER: All right (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

SHARA: And it's going to leave a lot of stains on your hands and clothing.

This geracite is a rock that pretty much only forms in water. And geracitie has now been identified essentially conclusively by the Mars rovers, and there's really nothing else to say other than proof- positive there is water on Mars. There has been water in the past on Mars.

HEMMER: Why are you wearing gloves?

SHARA: Well, if you hold the rock, you'll see what happens to your fingers. It's stuff that's really crumbly. It comes off in your hands. It's got iron in it.

HEMMER: It's not dangerous, is it?

SHARA: Absolutely not. No, contamination. It's just iron and sulfur and oxygen, no danger at all, but extremely messy.

HEMMER: It is very soft, too.

SHARA: A very soft mineral.

HEMMER: Tell me this. Here, take that.

SHARA: OK.

HEMMER: Hematite. Why have I heard -- boy, you can see it right there (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

SHARA: That's right. Exactly.

HEMMER: Why we have heard so much about hematite? And what is the difference with geracite (ph)?

SHARA: It's a different -- a slightly different composition. The iron is locked up in a slightly different way. The hematite is basically iron and oxygen. We've got sulfur -- additional sulfur locked up in here, which makes it so soft. But this demonstrates essentially beyond any doubt that there was water deposition, that there were rocks deposited by water on Mars.

HEMMER: A couple of critical questions then. If you're going to go ahead and say there was water on Mars, how much water? Was it saturated or not?

SHARA: We'd love to know that, and that's why the rovers are now taking off. They're able to traverse 100 meters, maybe 200 or 300 meters a day. And as they get further and further away from their landing sites, they're going to check more and more to see how extensive it was; hopefully, also get higher up and give us an idea perhaps as to how deep the water might have been on Mars in the past.

HEMMER: And then the ultimate question: How long ago in the past was there water?

SHARA: A very tough question. The technology on board isn't there, unfortunately. We can't determine from the uranium and thorium (ph) and potassium clocks in these rocks. Like this rock, I could tell you how old it is if I analyzed it properly. We're going to have to send another rover -- another set of rovers, or bring rocks back to Earth to check those nuclear clocks.

HEMMER: Quickly, where did you get this?

SHARA: This is basically a rock that you can find almost anywhere.

HEMMER: Anywhere?

SHARA: On Earth. On Earth. This is not a Martian rock.

HEMMER: I understand that.

SHARA: No, no. But it's a common mineral on Earth, fairly common. Wherever water, rivers, lakes lay down rocks, you find this sort of stuff.

HEMMER: Listen, next week there's going to be a huge announcement that's come out about the Hubble Telescope. There's going to be a picture that is released. And I am told that this will be a headline in every newspaper around the world. Why so confident of the news for next week?

SHARA: Well, the images have been taken, and they're finally being set up for release by the Space Telescope Science Institute. This is an extraordinary image, 400 orbits of the Hubble Telescope. Six hundred hours have been devoted to taking this ultra-deep image.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HEMMER: Michael Shara again earlier today. Next week astronomers will gather at the American Museum of Natural History, analyzing in public view the new data from that Hubbell Telescope. Said to be in a a very exciting time. Next week, we will follow it then of course.

O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, an Iraqi girl injured by American arms makes her recovery here in the U.S. We've got her amazing story just ahead. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Welcome back everybody. Let's update you on the story about Attorney General John Ashcroft. As we mentioned, he is in intensive care. He was admitted on Thursday suffering from gallstone pancreatitis. Apparently doctors say they plan to watch him for 48 hours before making any decisions. And we will see if it ends up that he goes in for surgery or not.

Of course, we're continuing to follow this story of the attorney general who's suffering apparently from a very painful condition called gallstone pancreatitis. It does not seem to be life threatening from what we have heard.

Another story we're following this morning. A story of a young Iraqi girl whose life seems to mirror the condition of post-war Iraq itself. Elaine Quijano has this little girl's story of hope and loss. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In some ways, she's no different than others her age. But at 13, Ma'rwa is carrying memories and grief few adults could bear. Last November an errant U.S. mortar shell smashed into her family's farm house north of Baghdad. Five family members died and Ma'rwa was paralyzed from the waist down.

MAJ. MARY ADAMS-CHALLENGER, 21ST COMBAT SUPPORT HOSPITAL: I know we can't help everybody, but I figured if we could just start with this one young girl.

QUIJANO: Physical therapist Major Mary Adams-Challenger met and treated Ma'rwa in Iraq, as did pediatrician Major Sharnell Hoffer.

MAJ. SHARNELLE HOFFER, ARMY NATIONAL GUARD: I wanted to explore different avenues to help her.

QUIJANO: Those avenues proved a complex maze of bureaucracy. But with the help groups like The National Spinal Cord Injury Association, three months later the majors found themselves waiting for Ma'rwa...

ADAMS-CHALLENGER: She's here!

QUIJANO: ... on the tarmac at Andrews Air Force Base in Maryland. They weren't supposed to, but they rushed into the plane's belly to greet her.

ADAMS-CHALLENGER: Hi, baby. It's so good to see you. Thank you.

QUIJANO: Ma'rwa's 15-hour trip to the U.S. marked only the beginning of her journey. Days later at the National Rehabilitation Hospital in Washington...

MA'RWA AHTEEMI, PARALYZED IN IRAQ WAR: Ow.

QUIJANO: ... Ma'rwa told of her need to return to her family and her old life.

AHTEEMI (through translator): I have no option. I have no get my treatment. I have to be able to walk again and then go back home.

QUIJANO: (on camera): Although Ma'rwa does have some feeling in her upper legs, doctors here say it's too early to tell whether she'll ever walk again.

(voice-over): Those who helped bring her here say Ma'rwa isn't alone, and say more needs to be done for other disabled Iraqis.

MARCIE ROTH, NATL, SPINAL CORD INJURY ASSN.: The liberation of those people, their freedom, their independence, must include people with disabilities.

QUIJANO: Even for Ma'rwa, there are no guarantees.

AHTEEMI (through translator): My father, he is crying until I am back home there.

QUIJANO: Only the certainty her and her family's lives will never be the same.

Elaine Quijano, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Nice story of a courageous little girl.

HEMMER: In a moment here, disappointing news in the jobs front came out a bit earlier today. How the market's reacting. We'll check in with Andy on that right after this. Back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: Welcome back. Lot of economic news to talk about. Big jobs report came out about an hour and 15 minutes ago. We'll check on the markets right now, see the impact there. Here's Andy back with that. What are you gauging?

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE": Well predictably, the markets not liking that jobs report because it was anemic, to say the least. Let's check in on the Dow right now and go to the Big Board and see -- oh, let's talk about the jobs report first? All right.

the unemployment rate holds at 5.6 percent. We were looking to add 112,000 jobs. Boy, we fell short. Only 21,000 jobs. Even worse -- now let's go to the board. We're down 45 points. It could be worse as far as that goes because you see that we're down 44 point in the Dow.

Some other bad news in terms of the jobs report. January revised down, also. And factory jobs down, construction jobs down. The White House not going to like this at all.

Speaking of the White House, you may remember that at one point they were predicting job growth of 2.6 million for this year. Now to be fair, they backed off that number. But to achieve the 2.6 million for the following months of the year, they'd have to get 248,000 jobs per month.

(CROSSTALK)

SERWER: Now that you've got two months in the bag, you can see that's rather unlikely, I think.

HEMMER: The point you made last hour, the unemployment numbers stayed the same though. How does that work?

SERWER: It's a formula with a numerator and denominator. It has to do with how many people are looking for jobs. Basically the number of people looking for jobs held constant. We did create some so the number stays the same. If you follow that.

HEMMER: I follow it, slightly.

(CROSSTALK)

HEMMER: MasterCard, a bit controversy about the new card, credit cards. What's happening now?

SERWER: MasterCard has a new 9/11 credit card. And it's called the Spirit of America. This is issued by MBNA, that's the giant credit card company. And like the president's ad, it's sparking some controversy here. And you can imagine why.

There are people who are suggesting that survivors of 9/11 and people involved of course in that situation would take offense. This is the president's ad of course that's been so controversial over the past couple days.

MBNA says that part of the money from the credit card goes to a fund called the Bravest Fund, which contributes money to the fire department and others involved in that tragedy.

"The Daily News" reporting people are unhappy with this card and questions how much money from this fund actually goes to victims. Story about that in "The New York Daily News."

HEMMER: Thank you, Andy. Have a good weekend.

SERWER: You, too. Have fun.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: Turning now to a Transatlantic legal battle raging right now. We're talking about the case that involves Big Red, the mascot of Western Kentucky University and the media empire of the Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi.

The school says that a satirical news show produced by one of Berlusconi's companies knocked off Big Red by creating a character named Gabibo. The Italian company is also taking legal action as well.

Earlier this morning we were joined by Western Kentucky University President Gary Ransdell and also a replacement Big Red. And I asked Dr. Ransdell why they set the lawsuit at $250 billion.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DR. GARY RANSDELL, PRESIDENT, WESTERN KENTUCKY UNIV.: Well, that's the estimated volume of income that Gabibo has earned since 1991, and since we created Big Red and have a copyright and are receiving royalties, we are simply letting our licensing agent earn our share of that revenue.

O'BRIEN: As you mentioned, Gabibo around since 1991. So when did you first figure out, or just think that there were some kind of similarity between Gabibo and Big Red?

RANSDELL: Well, actually our licensing agent, Crossland Enterprises, discovered that in 1991 when Gabibo was created, and followed it, and 18 months ago, decided to pursue litigation when it was found out that they had actually acknowledged copying Big Red when they created Big Red in 1991. Big Red has been around for 25 years, since 1979.

O'BRIEN: Who acknowledged copying Big Red?

RANSDELL: The officials with the Italian television station when they actually came up with the concept. They saw Big Red after his performance presumably at an NCAA basketball tournament and decided that they might take a run at a similar image.

O'BRIEN: The same TV program officials said this. This is "Striscia La Notizia." They say that the two characters, they believe, are actually very different. "Big Red is a mute mascot that acts as a cheerleader on the edge of the field. Gabibo is a walking, talking character that's part of the daily satirical TV show 'Striscia La Notizia.' Big Red is an amorphous blob. Gabibo was created as a puppet, with the head of Besugo, a wide-mouthed goldfish with large eyes.

"We find it difficult how a university can allow its name to be associated with an action that is so clearly malicious and commercially inspired. Perhaps because it's simply not aware of the full facts."

They say, in fact, they go on to say, that in their mind, "Gabibo, Big Red and Elmo all sort of look kind of similar."

RANSDELL: Well, I think a lot of differences with Elmo, and Elmo has been around a very long time, and we went through the patent licensing process, and if you look at the images, they do look very were much alike, and given their documented acknowledgement, we think that Crossland Enterprises has a good case. And their job is to place and protect our brand, logos, images, and so they are simply doing their job.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: President of Western Kentucky University and Big Red. Temporary Big Red. The real Big Red apparently on the stand testifying in Italy right now. They suspect 18 months before that case could be wrapped up.

HEMMER: Can't make this stuff up, can we?

O'BRIEN: No. Not that one, no.

HEMMER: Let's get a break here. Still to come on CNN next hour, the latest on the condition of John Ashcroft hospitalized earlier today said to be in intensive care. Daryn has that next hour. We are back on AMERICAN MORNING right after this.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Jack and the "Question of the Day."

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Indeed. If there were an 11th Commandment, what should it be has been the thing we're playing with al morning.

Dawn writes, "Thou shalt not talk, conduct phone calls, slurp beverages, gaffaw loudly during tender moments, cough uncontrollably, crinkle cellophane or back the back of my sentence the movie starts."

HEMMER: Amen.

CAFFERTY: Diane in Phoenix: "Thou shalt not sue for frivolous reasons."

Zelia: "Thou shalt not change the currency more than once a century." I agree with you, Zelia. They're redesigning the nickel since because they don't have anything else to do in Washington. So we need to make a new nickel.

Dean in Dayton, Ohio: "Thou shalt be cool."

Sherry in Kyoto, Japan: "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor John's husband or thy's neighbor Suzie's wife."

HEMMER: Got a story to tell?

CAFFERTY: And Connie in San Diego writes -- and this is on a serious note. And she' right. "Thou shalt not have an 11th Commandment. It would seem the 10 God gave Moses are enough for us to live by and most of us can't even follow them."

(CROSSTALK)

HEMMER: We got to run. Have a great weekend, OK

O'BRIEN: Likewise.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired March 5, 2004 - 09:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning everybody and welcome. It is exactly half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. We're going to come to you with more on the condition of Attorney General John Ashcroft in just a few moments. He is in intensive care at a hospital in Washington, D.C. He's being treated for gallstone pancreatitis. And Dr. Sanjay Gupta is going to explain a little bit more about his condition and just how serious it might be.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also in a few moments here, we'll talk about the mystery on how much water once existed on Mars and how long ago. Can the Rovers give the answers? We'll talk to a scientist from the American Museum of Natural History. Had put on latex gloves for this show this morning. So we'll get to that also in a moment.

Our top story's from Iraq now. A last-minute hitch for the signing of Iraq's interim constitution in Baghdad. Some Shi'ite members of the Iraqi Governing Council said to have last-minute reservations over the charter, causing that delay. That continues at this hour.

The signing was to have taken place about 8:00 a.m. Eastern time, about 90 minutes ago. Political sources say the delay could be substantial. We don't have a better definition than that now. The document is a big milestone in U.S. plans to hand over power in Iraq come June 30.

U.S. voters appear split over who they want at this point in the White House next November. A new Associated Press poll shows President Bush is supported by 46 percent of that survey, John Kerry 45 percent. Also on the board, independent candidate Ralph Nader. He has 6 percent in that poll by the Associated Press.

The University of Colorado has imposed tough new rules on football recruiting. Among the guidelines, chaperoned activities and an 11:00 p.m. Curfew. This is after several women accused players and recruits from the Colorado football team of rape or sexual assault. The university denying allegations that its football program used sex and alcohol to lure recruits to the school, but has launched an investigation on campus.

Arizona, flash flooding, hail pounding parts of that state. Heavy rain and ice fell from the sky in Phoenix. And rush hour traffic stop and go as drivers tried to navigate through the flooded streets. That was the scene yesterday in Arizona hoping for better today.

O'BRIEN: That's got to be so scary for a driver. I mean that water is high and moving pretty fast.

HEMMER: Tough going.

(WEATHER UPDATE)

O'BRIEN: We're learning more this morning that John Ashcroft underwent emergency gallstone surgery last night. Dr. Sanjay Gupta's got an update on all this for us this morning. Good morning.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning. yes, he's in the emergency room doing what lot of doctors call letting the pancreas cool down for a little bit.

Typically gallstone pancreatitis, when the gallstone actually inflames part of the pancreatitis, can be a painful thing. Someone can have abdominal pain, someone can have back pain, fever, nausea, things like that.

So basically probably what he's enduring right now, it will probably take a couple days until they know how they're going to proceed.

O'BRIEN: You've got a picture of the gallbladder and sort of how the whole system works. Can you kind of walk us through what the problem is and where the problem is?

GUPTA: Yes, it's a little be hard to see. This is from a Web site, GeneralSurgery.com.

But essentially in green there is the gallbladder. And those little black things are stones that typically go down and go straight into the intestine. That usually happens in most people without any problems at all.

Now pancreas, who is just above that, can sometimes get blocked up by those stones and therefore that causes all these symptoms. It sort of basic mechanics of medicine. These enzymes are trying to get through but they can't because a stone is blocking it. And that's what causes all the pain.

O'BRIEN: Apparently the attorney general had been complaining about -- he thought he had the flu. He complained about flu-like symptoms to his friends, I guess, and family members as well. Is that typical?

GUPTA: Symptoms Well the Typically -- and we have a list of the symptoms, are more typically related to the abdominal pain and the back pain. But oftentimes a lot that -- people can get nausea, they can get fevers, they can have what are known as elevated enzymes which is just this very painful thing in the abdominal cavity and the back as well. When these enzymes start to build up, it causes that pain.

O'BRIEN: Gallstones are not uncommon. So what percentage of folks who have gallstones or even gallstone disease are going to get pancreatitis? GUPTA: Very small percentage. Gallstones themselves, everyone's heard of those, they're pretty common. About 20 million American adults get those, 5 percent of those people will then go on to develop gallstone disease.

And then about less than 1 percent will also involve the adjoining pancreas. That's a very rare situation. Typically in women this is more common. Men it's more likely to be caused actually by alcohol use.

O'BRIEN: I was going to ask you that. What are the causes? I mean why would the attorney general get gallstone pancreatitis? Is it just, you know, bad luck essentially?

GUPTA: Well you know, they're calling it gallstone pancreatitis, which means that it's a mechanical obstruction of the stone. Now why some people develop stones as opposed to other people, a little bit harder. A lot of times more related to diet, it's more related to any medications he may have been taking. Things like that are the most likely culprits here.

O'BRIEN: All right, well, he is in the emergency room. Underwent some surgery. And doctors are saying that in 48 hours they'll have a better idea of exactly what his condition is.

GUPTA: That's right. It's usually how long it takes.

O'BRIEN: Thanks, Sanjay.

GUPTA: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Bill.

HEMMER: Now to the Red Planet. NASA's two Mars Rovers, Spirit and Opportunity, already having provided evidence of water on Mars. There is more work to be done though. Bit earlier I talked to Michael Shara, head of astro physics at the American Museum of Natural History here in New York. We started today with a bit of a geological show and tell.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MICHAEL SHARA, AMERICAN MUSEUM OF NATURAL HISTORY: I've brought along a piece of geracite (ph). Geracite is the...

HEMMER: Can I put my gloves on?

SHARA: I think if you want to handle it, because it's kind of messy stuff.

HEMMER: All right (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

SHARA: And it's going to leave a lot of stains on your hands and clothing.

This geracite is a rock that pretty much only forms in water. And geracitie has now been identified essentially conclusively by the Mars rovers, and there's really nothing else to say other than proof- positive there is water on Mars. There has been water in the past on Mars.

HEMMER: Why are you wearing gloves?

SHARA: Well, if you hold the rock, you'll see what happens to your fingers. It's stuff that's really crumbly. It comes off in your hands. It's got iron in it.

HEMMER: It's not dangerous, is it?

SHARA: Absolutely not. No, contamination. It's just iron and sulfur and oxygen, no danger at all, but extremely messy.

HEMMER: It is very soft, too.

SHARA: A very soft mineral.

HEMMER: Tell me this. Here, take that.

SHARA: OK.

HEMMER: Hematite. Why have I heard -- boy, you can see it right there (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

SHARA: That's right. Exactly.

HEMMER: Why we have heard so much about hematite? And what is the difference with geracite (ph)?

SHARA: It's a different -- a slightly different composition. The iron is locked up in a slightly different way. The hematite is basically iron and oxygen. We've got sulfur -- additional sulfur locked up in here, which makes it so soft. But this demonstrates essentially beyond any doubt that there was water deposition, that there were rocks deposited by water on Mars.

HEMMER: A couple of critical questions then. If you're going to go ahead and say there was water on Mars, how much water? Was it saturated or not?

SHARA: We'd love to know that, and that's why the rovers are now taking off. They're able to traverse 100 meters, maybe 200 or 300 meters a day. And as they get further and further away from their landing sites, they're going to check more and more to see how extensive it was; hopefully, also get higher up and give us an idea perhaps as to how deep the water might have been on Mars in the past.

HEMMER: And then the ultimate question: How long ago in the past was there water?

SHARA: A very tough question. The technology on board isn't there, unfortunately. We can't determine from the uranium and thorium (ph) and potassium clocks in these rocks. Like this rock, I could tell you how old it is if I analyzed it properly. We're going to have to send another rover -- another set of rovers, or bring rocks back to Earth to check those nuclear clocks.

HEMMER: Quickly, where did you get this?

SHARA: This is basically a rock that you can find almost anywhere.

HEMMER: Anywhere?

SHARA: On Earth. On Earth. This is not a Martian rock.

HEMMER: I understand that.

SHARA: No, no. But it's a common mineral on Earth, fairly common. Wherever water, rivers, lakes lay down rocks, you find this sort of stuff.

HEMMER: Listen, next week there's going to be a huge announcement that's come out about the Hubble Telescope. There's going to be a picture that is released. And I am told that this will be a headline in every newspaper around the world. Why so confident of the news for next week?

SHARA: Well, the images have been taken, and they're finally being set up for release by the Space Telescope Science Institute. This is an extraordinary image, 400 orbits of the Hubble Telescope. Six hundred hours have been devoted to taking this ultra-deep image.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HEMMER: Michael Shara again earlier today. Next week astronomers will gather at the American Museum of Natural History, analyzing in public view the new data from that Hubbell Telescope. Said to be in a a very exciting time. Next week, we will follow it then of course.

O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, an Iraqi girl injured by American arms makes her recovery here in the U.S. We've got her amazing story just ahead. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Welcome back everybody. Let's update you on the story about Attorney General John Ashcroft. As we mentioned, he is in intensive care. He was admitted on Thursday suffering from gallstone pancreatitis. Apparently doctors say they plan to watch him for 48 hours before making any decisions. And we will see if it ends up that he goes in for surgery or not.

Of course, we're continuing to follow this story of the attorney general who's suffering apparently from a very painful condition called gallstone pancreatitis. It does not seem to be life threatening from what we have heard.

Another story we're following this morning. A story of a young Iraqi girl whose life seems to mirror the condition of post-war Iraq itself. Elaine Quijano has this little girl's story of hope and loss. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In some ways, she's no different than others her age. But at 13, Ma'rwa is carrying memories and grief few adults could bear. Last November an errant U.S. mortar shell smashed into her family's farm house north of Baghdad. Five family members died and Ma'rwa was paralyzed from the waist down.

MAJ. MARY ADAMS-CHALLENGER, 21ST COMBAT SUPPORT HOSPITAL: I know we can't help everybody, but I figured if we could just start with this one young girl.

QUIJANO: Physical therapist Major Mary Adams-Challenger met and treated Ma'rwa in Iraq, as did pediatrician Major Sharnell Hoffer.

MAJ. SHARNELLE HOFFER, ARMY NATIONAL GUARD: I wanted to explore different avenues to help her.

QUIJANO: Those avenues proved a complex maze of bureaucracy. But with the help groups like The National Spinal Cord Injury Association, three months later the majors found themselves waiting for Ma'rwa...

ADAMS-CHALLENGER: She's here!

QUIJANO: ... on the tarmac at Andrews Air Force Base in Maryland. They weren't supposed to, but they rushed into the plane's belly to greet her.

ADAMS-CHALLENGER: Hi, baby. It's so good to see you. Thank you.

QUIJANO: Ma'rwa's 15-hour trip to the U.S. marked only the beginning of her journey. Days later at the National Rehabilitation Hospital in Washington...

MA'RWA AHTEEMI, PARALYZED IN IRAQ WAR: Ow.

QUIJANO: ... Ma'rwa told of her need to return to her family and her old life.

AHTEEMI (through translator): I have no option. I have no get my treatment. I have to be able to walk again and then go back home.

QUIJANO: (on camera): Although Ma'rwa does have some feeling in her upper legs, doctors here say it's too early to tell whether she'll ever walk again.

(voice-over): Those who helped bring her here say Ma'rwa isn't alone, and say more needs to be done for other disabled Iraqis.

MARCIE ROTH, NATL, SPINAL CORD INJURY ASSN.: The liberation of those people, their freedom, their independence, must include people with disabilities.

QUIJANO: Even for Ma'rwa, there are no guarantees.

AHTEEMI (through translator): My father, he is crying until I am back home there.

QUIJANO: Only the certainty her and her family's lives will never be the same.

Elaine Quijano, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Nice story of a courageous little girl.

HEMMER: In a moment here, disappointing news in the jobs front came out a bit earlier today. How the market's reacting. We'll check in with Andy on that right after this. Back in a moment.

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HEMMER: Welcome back. Lot of economic news to talk about. Big jobs report came out about an hour and 15 minutes ago. We'll check on the markets right now, see the impact there. Here's Andy back with that. What are you gauging?

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE": Well predictably, the markets not liking that jobs report because it was anemic, to say the least. Let's check in on the Dow right now and go to the Big Board and see -- oh, let's talk about the jobs report first? All right.

the unemployment rate holds at 5.6 percent. We were looking to add 112,000 jobs. Boy, we fell short. Only 21,000 jobs. Even worse -- now let's go to the board. We're down 45 points. It could be worse as far as that goes because you see that we're down 44 point in the Dow.

Some other bad news in terms of the jobs report. January revised down, also. And factory jobs down, construction jobs down. The White House not going to like this at all.

Speaking of the White House, you may remember that at one point they were predicting job growth of 2.6 million for this year. Now to be fair, they backed off that number. But to achieve the 2.6 million for the following months of the year, they'd have to get 248,000 jobs per month.

(CROSSTALK)

SERWER: Now that you've got two months in the bag, you can see that's rather unlikely, I think.

HEMMER: The point you made last hour, the unemployment numbers stayed the same though. How does that work?

SERWER: It's a formula with a numerator and denominator. It has to do with how many people are looking for jobs. Basically the number of people looking for jobs held constant. We did create some so the number stays the same. If you follow that.

HEMMER: I follow it, slightly.

(CROSSTALK)

HEMMER: MasterCard, a bit controversy about the new card, credit cards. What's happening now?

SERWER: MasterCard has a new 9/11 credit card. And it's called the Spirit of America. This is issued by MBNA, that's the giant credit card company. And like the president's ad, it's sparking some controversy here. And you can imagine why.

There are people who are suggesting that survivors of 9/11 and people involved of course in that situation would take offense. This is the president's ad of course that's been so controversial over the past couple days.

MBNA says that part of the money from the credit card goes to a fund called the Bravest Fund, which contributes money to the fire department and others involved in that tragedy.

"The Daily News" reporting people are unhappy with this card and questions how much money from this fund actually goes to victims. Story about that in "The New York Daily News."

HEMMER: Thank you, Andy. Have a good weekend.

SERWER: You, too. Have fun.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: Turning now to a Transatlantic legal battle raging right now. We're talking about the case that involves Big Red, the mascot of Western Kentucky University and the media empire of the Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi.

The school says that a satirical news show produced by one of Berlusconi's companies knocked off Big Red by creating a character named Gabibo. The Italian company is also taking legal action as well.

Earlier this morning we were joined by Western Kentucky University President Gary Ransdell and also a replacement Big Red. And I asked Dr. Ransdell why they set the lawsuit at $250 billion.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DR. GARY RANSDELL, PRESIDENT, WESTERN KENTUCKY UNIV.: Well, that's the estimated volume of income that Gabibo has earned since 1991, and since we created Big Red and have a copyright and are receiving royalties, we are simply letting our licensing agent earn our share of that revenue.

O'BRIEN: As you mentioned, Gabibo around since 1991. So when did you first figure out, or just think that there were some kind of similarity between Gabibo and Big Red?

RANSDELL: Well, actually our licensing agent, Crossland Enterprises, discovered that in 1991 when Gabibo was created, and followed it, and 18 months ago, decided to pursue litigation when it was found out that they had actually acknowledged copying Big Red when they created Big Red in 1991. Big Red has been around for 25 years, since 1979.

O'BRIEN: Who acknowledged copying Big Red?

RANSDELL: The officials with the Italian television station when they actually came up with the concept. They saw Big Red after his performance presumably at an NCAA basketball tournament and decided that they might take a run at a similar image.

O'BRIEN: The same TV program officials said this. This is "Striscia La Notizia." They say that the two characters, they believe, are actually very different. "Big Red is a mute mascot that acts as a cheerleader on the edge of the field. Gabibo is a walking, talking character that's part of the daily satirical TV show 'Striscia La Notizia.' Big Red is an amorphous blob. Gabibo was created as a puppet, with the head of Besugo, a wide-mouthed goldfish with large eyes.

"We find it difficult how a university can allow its name to be associated with an action that is so clearly malicious and commercially inspired. Perhaps because it's simply not aware of the full facts."

They say, in fact, they go on to say, that in their mind, "Gabibo, Big Red and Elmo all sort of look kind of similar."

RANSDELL: Well, I think a lot of differences with Elmo, and Elmo has been around a very long time, and we went through the patent licensing process, and if you look at the images, they do look very were much alike, and given their documented acknowledgement, we think that Crossland Enterprises has a good case. And their job is to place and protect our brand, logos, images, and so they are simply doing their job.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: President of Western Kentucky University and Big Red. Temporary Big Red. The real Big Red apparently on the stand testifying in Italy right now. They suspect 18 months before that case could be wrapped up.

HEMMER: Can't make this stuff up, can we?

O'BRIEN: No. Not that one, no.

HEMMER: Let's get a break here. Still to come on CNN next hour, the latest on the condition of John Ashcroft hospitalized earlier today said to be in intensive care. Daryn has that next hour. We are back on AMERICAN MORNING right after this.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Jack and the "Question of the Day."

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Indeed. If there were an 11th Commandment, what should it be has been the thing we're playing with al morning.

Dawn writes, "Thou shalt not talk, conduct phone calls, slurp beverages, gaffaw loudly during tender moments, cough uncontrollably, crinkle cellophane or back the back of my sentence the movie starts."

HEMMER: Amen.

CAFFERTY: Diane in Phoenix: "Thou shalt not sue for frivolous reasons."

Zelia: "Thou shalt not change the currency more than once a century." I agree with you, Zelia. They're redesigning the nickel since because they don't have anything else to do in Washington. So we need to make a new nickel.

Dean in Dayton, Ohio: "Thou shalt be cool."

Sherry in Kyoto, Japan: "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor John's husband or thy's neighbor Suzie's wife."

HEMMER: Got a story to tell?

CAFFERTY: And Connie in San Diego writes -- and this is on a serious note. And she' right. "Thou shalt not have an 11th Commandment. It would seem the 10 God gave Moses are enough for us to live by and most of us can't even follow them."

(CROSSTALK)

HEMMER: We got to run. Have a great weekend, OK

O'BRIEN: Likewise.

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