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CNN Live At Daybreak

Deadly Explosions in Spain; Hunt for Osama Bin Laden; Hockey's Black Eye

Aired March 11, 2004 - 05:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you. Welcome to the second half hour of DAYBREAK. It's Thursday, March 11. From the CNN Global Headquarters in Atlanta, I'm Carol Costello. Thanks for waking up with us.
Here is what's happening now with a breaking news situation. Four hours ago, at least four devastating explosions rocked Madrid, Spain's railway network. Sixty-two people were killed. Our Al Goodman in Madrid told us just minutes ago that one official says the death toll could rise to 120.

The volatile issue of gay marriage comes up today in Massachusetts. The legislature meets to consider a ban on same-sex marriages.

In a race for the White House, President Bush talks about the economy in Bay Shore, New York today. On the Democratic side, Senator John Kerry says the Republican Machine is -- quoting here -- "the most crooked, lying group of people I have ever seen."

In Haiti, U.S. Marines have orders to help Haitian police officers disarm anyone with a weapon. Two Haitians have been killed in a run-in with the Marines.

And millions of dish network viewers have gotten back several popular channels. EchoStar Communications has agreed to a new contract today with Viacom, the parent company of CBS.

We update our top stories every 15 minutes. The next news update comes your way at 5:45 Eastern.

Could one of the -- we do have Al Goodman right now? Yes, we do. OK. As I told you, we have breaking news out of Madrid, Spain, some explosive devices planted on a commuter train there. At least 62 are dead.

We have Al Goodman live on the phone. He is on the scene in Madrid.

Al, bring us up to date.

AL GOODMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Carol, we can give you some more details now. There were three explosions aboard three different commuter trains. The brunt of this first place (ph) was this Atocha Train Station, one of the major train stations on the southern side of Madrid where I'm standing. We have been pushed back by police. In fact, just in the last hour and a half or so, we were pushed back even a bit further. There was another explosion, apparently a controlled explosion, of another device that was (ph) found and we saw smoke coming up out of the station area.

But before that, there were the deadly bombs. They happened just about 8:00 a.m. local time as the commuter trains were packed. One coming in to this Atocha Station, 29 people dead on that train. In another place called Pozo Del Tio Raimundo, another explosion that took the second brunt. And a third place called Santa Eugenia.

The government is blaming the Basque separatist group ETA, which, of course, is listed as a terrorist organization by the United States and by the European Union, of which Spain is a member. ETA is blamed for more than 800 deaths before this day in its 30-year fight for Basque independence. And here this day 60 is a single worst day in the -- single deadliest day in the history of ETA, if indeed it is ETA as everyone here believes -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Al, can you get into exactly how this was done? Were there bombs planted onboard individual train cars or were the bombs on the tracks?

GOODMAN: We have heard from reports that on one train there were bombs in plastic bags that were placed in the lead car, in the middle car and in the rear car of a particular train. Now that may have been the one coming into the Atocha Train Station.

Apparently these bombs were in the trains and not on the track, that's why some of the cars where the bombs were were just a scene of carnage, Carol, according to witnesses, whereas other cars, people managed to get off and were telling the grim story.

Now the police last Christmas Eve, at the other major train station in Madrid, foiled what they said was an ETA attempt to bombing there. So they had some warning that this might happen. And they have been on high alert, especially because we are just days ahead of the Sunday national parliamentary elections for prime minister where the ruling Conservative Party, Carol, has taken a hard-line stance against ETA, is currently ahead in the polls. They have called off all of their campaign events through the end of the campaign, which is late Friday -- Carol.

COSTELLO: But as far as we know, the elections there will go on.

Al, I wanted to ask you this, if ETA is indeed to blame and had planned a similar attack before that had been foiled, I know that Spain is on a high terror alert. Is there any lessons to be learned for U.S. intelligent sources as to how to prevent something like this or is it virtually impossible?

GOODMAN: Well I think anti-terrorism experts with whom we have spoken through the years will say and officials have said this publicly, even last year as they arrested nearly 200 ETA suspects, even last year as ETA had its lowest death count in 30 years, just 3 people dead in all of last year, Carol, officials said you can't ever count these guys out. And it just shows how unfortunately resilient this organization has been despite this -- the huge number of arrests.

So they have really been -- and how they have changed tactics. This is completely a change of tactics in -- for more than a decade, they have not tried any sort of mass bombing, specifically trying to target innocent civilians. They have gone for smaller targets, a judge, a police officer, a military official. One, two or three people might die in that. This is a huge change in tactics -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Well you know you talk about this change in tactics. As some terrorism experts that we interviewed earlier on CNN International said, they are not quite sure that this Spanish terrorist group is to blame because Spain has been on high alert. Spanish troops are inside of Iraq. Spain is a U.S. ally of the United States and the reason that Spain has been on such a high alert is because of al Qaeda. Is that right?

GOODMAN: Well indeed. And former officials of the former government of Saddam Hussein, when they were still in power, actually directly threatened. They said there would be consequences for which its allies, in this case Spain and Britain, were supporting the U.S.- led war in Iraq. And since then I believe there has been at least one al Qaeda communique also saying that Spain, because it has 1,300 troops in Iraq, would face some sort of threat. So they have been on alert for both al Qaeda, they have been on alert for ETA attacks as well. But the initial report here had been that this is an ETA, that is where the initial blame is going, although there, Carol, there's a lot yet to be discovered about this -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Well right, and ETA has not claimed responsibility either, at least not that we have heard of.

Al, another question for you, you know thousands of Americans ride commuter trains like the one in Madrid, Spain every day. I have ridden them a lot. There is no particular security after you get onboard that train. Is it different in Spain?

GOODMAN: Well the -- I mean you need a ticket to get on the train. They are really quite strict about people not getting on the train without a ticket, a little -- a little card that you stick in and you get on the train at the station. But basically anybody can get on.

The only trains where there's a bit of a stepped up security is the Bullet Train that leaves as well from this station right behind me. And that has security, Carol, like you would find at an airport where the bags are checked. They go through a metal detector. But in terms of the vast number of commuter chains -- trains, the Metros, this is a capital of five million people between the city and the surrounding regions, they just don't -- have never thought about putting that kind of airport type security on to the trains -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Al Goodman doing a great job live from Madrid, Spain and getting on the scene fast there for us, a wonderful job. Al Goodman live from Madrid, Spain this morning.

The high tech hunt for Osama bin Laden is intensifying along the Afghan-Pakistan border. The Pentagon is considering using a long- range air-to-ground surveillance system designed to locate, classify and track regardless of the weather. They may also use an aircraft that monitors electronic activity. And the military has plans now to use ground sensors, U-2 spy planes and unmanned Predator drones 24/7.

U.S. military is also working with Pakistani forces to try to flush bin Laden out of his hiding place.

Our Ryan Chilcote joins us live from the Afghan capital Kabul with more on the hunt for the terrorist mastermind.

And I know you just got there 24 hours ago, you've been on the ground a short time, so explain to us what you are doing there? You are embedded, right?

RYAN CHILCOTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's correct. I'm embedded with U.S. forces here in Afghanistan. U.S. forces really spread out throughout the country. I am at a base called Task Force Phoenix. It's OK to talk about that.

It is here in the Afghan capital. About 1,000 U.S. soldiers have teamed up with soldiers from seven other countries to train the Afghan army. This is a new thing. It's going to be called the Afghan National Army. It's paid for by the U.S. government and other countries. And their job is to train an army here in Afghanistan that would be loyal to the federal government.

That is absolutely key, the U.S. says, to making sure that this country develops in a democratic fashion and it can deal with terrorism on its own soil. It's particularly key to get that job done quickly because the United States would like to see an election held in this country as early as June. And it says it needs the Afghan National Army in place, particularly in eastern and southern Afghanistan, to make that happen.

Now of course a lot of what is going on here in Afghanistan is focused around what we're hearing the hunt for Osama bin Laden. Military spokesmen here on the ground are playing down a lot of that talk coming out of Washington. They are saying, after all, if they knew where Osama bin Laden was right now they would have already captured him. So I think it's fair to assume that they are not showing us all of their cards.

What we do know is that the U.S. has several fire bases. Fire bases are small bases where U.S. troops are located in eastern Afghanistan near that border and both conventional forces and the very secretive special operations forces are running operations on a regular basis. They say maybe nothing increased right now in that area looking for elements of Taliban and al Qaeda and, of course, Osama bin Laden.

Lastly, there's been a lot of talk about, again, coming from the United States, about a spring offensive here in Afghanistan. The military here on the ground not ruling that out, but they are certainly not saying what it would be like if there is going to be one and when it would happen -- Carol. COSTELLO: You've been in Afghanistan before, is there a sense in talking to the soldiers now that they are getting closer to finding Osama bin Laden?

CHILCOTE: I'm not so sure of that. The U.S. soldiers here are really engaged in a lot of different things that have to do with broader subjects than just finding Osama bin Laden. I think you'd probably find as many opinions on whether they will find Osama bin Laden here among the soldiers as you'd find anywhere in the United States. It really sort of depends on how much people believe in luck, I guess.

What the soldiers here are focused on is things, like I said, training the Afghan army, like these provisional -- these provisional reconstruction teams that the army has fielded out into the regions to do stuff like winning hearts and minds, by working to reconstruct Afghanistan instead of just carrying out offensive military operations. So they are really focused on those kinds of things. And for a lot of the soldiers here, because the hunt for Osama bin Laden is really quite a secretive effort, it is just a matter of speculation for them whether Osama will be caught or not -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Ryan Chilcote reporting live from Afghanistan this morning. We're going to get back to you in the next hour of DAYBREAK. We appreciate it.

We have on the phone with us right now the Spanish Foreign Minister Ana Palacio. Of course we've been telling you all morning long about those terrible explosions onboard a commuter train in Madrid. We know at least 62 people have been killed and maybe more.

Are you with us?

ANA PALACIO, SPANISH FOREIGN MINISTER: Yes, I am with you.

COSTELLO: Thank you so much.

PALACIO: Hello, good morning.

COSTELLO: Good morning.

PALACIO: Good morning to all of you. I'm -- I feel that I'm speaking to friends, to American friends that know very well and have a very clear, very clear memory of what happened in September 11. And that's why I must say from the outset that we are absolutely shocked that many media, many American media are still calling it a terrorist group, not a terrorist group but a separatist group. It says -- if after September 11 the Spanish media would have called al Qaeda a religious organization that uses terrorist means and bin Laden the leader of a religious organization that does not agree with American policy and that -- in the -- in the context of the -- of the Twin Towers terrorist attack.

COSTELLO: Well I think in this instance that we can indeed call this a terrorist group because the U.S. recognizes it as a terrorist group, this Basque separatist group ETA. And you think that they are...

PALACIO: No, no, no, on the contrary, may I set the record straight. ETA is included in the terrorist list of the U.S. It's included as terrorist also in the terrorist list of the European Union. That's why I am saying that let us set the record straight and not send a very misleading message to the -- to the -- to the public opinion. ETA is in the terrorist list of the U.S. And I hope that today the administration will make a very clear statement reminding all Americans, and especially all American media, that this is so.

COSTELLO: So you want President Bush to come out and say something?

PALACIO: No, no, not especially President Bush, but the administration. I will be speaking, I hope, in the last -- in the next hour or so with Secretary of State Colin Powell, because you know it's very -- it's very -- when you -- when you are in a -- after such a terrible thing is -- imagine. Just imagine the Spanish media just speaking about al Qaeda a religious organization that uses terrorist means or bin Laden a religious leader. It's something we Spaniards are not understand from, especially from our American friends that have gone through such a terrible experience similar to the one we are living right now in Spain.

I am not...

COSTELLO: Minister Palacio,...

PALACIO: No, no, but I, and let...

COSTELLO: ... we do -- we do understand.

PALACIO: Let me -- let me insist that I'm not just -- it's not my way of saying ETA is a terrorist organization. It's you Americans, you Americans that have put ETA in the, very rightly so by the way, in the terrorist list of the United States.

COSTELLO: Right, and we have done that. And I don't think there is any doubt that this was a terrorist act, whoever is to blame. Why do you think that ETA and not al Qaeda is to blame for this attack?

PALACIO: Because this bears the hallmark of ETA. Let me remind you that two weeks ago we -- our security forces stopped a truckload of explosives that could have not had the consequences of today's terrorist attack but a much bigger consequences. There were -- there were explosives able to blow many buildings in these -- in these trucks. And we knew we had information that ETA was trying to, I mean, to let...

COSTELLO: Right, because they tried...

PALACIO: Yes, intervene in this -- in the -- in the middle of these -- of these run-ups to the elections. We have general elections on Sunday. But of course we are -- we are waiting until there is an official statement, which has not yet come, an official statement or ETA claiming that they are the responsibles for this. COSTELLO: Yes, they haven't come out with any claim of responsibility.

PALACIO: No, not yet.

COSTELLO: I just wondered, since authorities were able to stop an initial attack on train tracks by this Basque separatist group, this group ETA, tell us how difficult it has been to prevent such attacks within Spain, because Spain has been on high alert, right?

PALACIO: Well, Patricia, could you admit after September 11 to speak with someone that would call bin Laden an al Qaeda separatist organization? So please do not ask me a question referring to ETA as a separatist organization. Really it's very -- I mean it's something that we Spaniards cannot understand and especially we cannot understand it from our American friends. So please don't use this way of qualifying ETA.

COSTELLO: OK.

PALACIO: ETA is a terrorist organization. At least don't call them a separatist organization.

COSTELLO: All right. I apologize for that. But can you address the question of how difficult these kinds of attacks are to figure out they are going to happen and how to stop them?

PALACIO: Well you know terrorism is terrorism. Terrorism is exactly the same threat in America, in New York or in Spain or, by the way, in Tokyo or in Istanbul. Unfortunately, it's not easy to fight these and to prevent these terrorist attacks. We, the Spanish security forces, have prevented many, many attacks by ETA lately. But unfortunately, we were not able to prevent this one, as your security forces were not able to prevent what happened in the Twin Towers and in the Pentagon.

COSTELLO: Thank you very much. The Spanish Foreign Minister Ana Palacio joining us live by phone from Spain this morning. And our recent death reports from the attacks aboard that commuter train in Madrid 131 dead now.

We're going to take a short break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Vancouver Canucks forward Todd Bertuzzi will hear his punishment this morning for a sucker punch that severely injured an opponent. But on the eve of that punishment, Bertuzzi was contrite about the hit on Colorado's Steve Moore.

Here's more of what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TODD BERTUZZI, VANCOUVER CANUCKS: Steve, I just want to apologize for what happened out there, that I had no intention on hurting you, that I feel awful for what transpired.

To the fans of hockey and to the fans of Vancouver, for the kids that watch this game, I am truly sorry. I don't play that -- I don't play the game that way, and I'm not a mean spirited person. And I'm sorry for what happened.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: For the second time in four years, Vancouver police are investigating a vicious hit during a hockey game.

CNN's Kimberly Osias reports on the double standard of violence in the sport.

031000CN.V84

COSTELLO: Paul Kelly, who was an attorney for Marty McSorley after his February 2000 attack, will be a guest on CNN's "AMERICAN MORNING." That begins, of course, at 7:00 a.m. Eastern.

We're back in just a minute.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: It is time, Chad, to take a look at papers across America to see what's happening locally...

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: OK, "Front Page."

COSTELLO: ... in towns and cities and, you know, all that kind of stuff. This is from the "Chicago Sun-Times." You can see the headline there, Daley to firefighters: rat out the racists. Apparently what's happening, supposedly some firefighters within the department are using the fire radio to spew racial hatred. They are actually using...

MYERS: Yikes!

COSTELLO: ... racial slurs over the radio. And supposedly the firefighters can't figure out who is doing it. The mayor is calling them to action and saying rat out these people so that they can be punished.

MYERS: Do they think it's just somebody else with a radio or do they think it's...

COSTELLO: No, they think it's -- they think it's...

MYERS: ... other firefighters?

COSTELLO: ... other firefighters.

MYERS: Yikes!

COSTELLO: I guess they are also trying to use this underground Web site that the fire department has and they are spewing hatred on that as well. So we'll see what happens.

On to the "Pittsburgh Tribune Review." You see that, they can't get their MTV. Apparently...

MYERS: Yes, mine was off for a while, too, on my dish network. I wasn't pleased.

COSTELLO: Did -- I wouldn't be pleased either. Well apparently there's this dispute over programming costs between EchoStar and Viacom, the company that owns MTV, VH1, Nickelodeon, CBS. And apparently some agreement has been come to. So, for the local affiliates in Pittsburgh, they got their MTV back or soon will.

MYERS: I couldn't see my Comedy Central.

COSTELLO: Oh no!

MYERS: I know.

COSTELLO: To "The Times," "The Reporter," this is out of Dover New Philadelphia, Ohio. And as you can see, Tim Couch is on the front page. I don't know if you know anything about the Cleveland Browns, there's been this horrible quarterback controversy you know last year between Kelly Holcomb and Tim Couch.

MYERS: Of course.

COSTELLO: They couldn't decide who was the lead quarterback.

MYERS: Right.

COSTELLO: Well they are both gone this year, this coming year.

MYERS: Well that will fix it, won't it?

COSTELLO: Right. And they have hired Jeff Garcia who has problems of his own. The San Francisco quarterback, you know?

MYERS: Yes, sure.

COSTELLO: Remember he just got stopped for drunk driving?

MYERS: Yes. He's not a young one though, is he?

COSTELLO: No, he's in his 30s.

MYERS: Well.

COSTELLO: So, no, and he's not the greatest either. He's sort of up and down.

MYERS: Hey, careful about that.

COSTELLO: Sorry. Sorry Jeff Garcia.

MYERS: All right. COSTELLO: I hope you do well in Cleveland.

MYERS: We'll have more later.

COSTELLO: All right, we certainly will. Thank you very much -- Chad.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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Hockey's Black Eye>


Aired March 11, 2004 - 05:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you. Welcome to the second half hour of DAYBREAK. It's Thursday, March 11. From the CNN Global Headquarters in Atlanta, I'm Carol Costello. Thanks for waking up with us.
Here is what's happening now with a breaking news situation. Four hours ago, at least four devastating explosions rocked Madrid, Spain's railway network. Sixty-two people were killed. Our Al Goodman in Madrid told us just minutes ago that one official says the death toll could rise to 120.

The volatile issue of gay marriage comes up today in Massachusetts. The legislature meets to consider a ban on same-sex marriages.

In a race for the White House, President Bush talks about the economy in Bay Shore, New York today. On the Democratic side, Senator John Kerry says the Republican Machine is -- quoting here -- "the most crooked, lying group of people I have ever seen."

In Haiti, U.S. Marines have orders to help Haitian police officers disarm anyone with a weapon. Two Haitians have been killed in a run-in with the Marines.

And millions of dish network viewers have gotten back several popular channels. EchoStar Communications has agreed to a new contract today with Viacom, the parent company of CBS.

We update our top stories every 15 minutes. The next news update comes your way at 5:45 Eastern.

Could one of the -- we do have Al Goodman right now? Yes, we do. OK. As I told you, we have breaking news out of Madrid, Spain, some explosive devices planted on a commuter train there. At least 62 are dead.

We have Al Goodman live on the phone. He is on the scene in Madrid.

Al, bring us up to date.

AL GOODMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Carol, we can give you some more details now. There were three explosions aboard three different commuter trains. The brunt of this first place (ph) was this Atocha Train Station, one of the major train stations on the southern side of Madrid where I'm standing. We have been pushed back by police. In fact, just in the last hour and a half or so, we were pushed back even a bit further. There was another explosion, apparently a controlled explosion, of another device that was (ph) found and we saw smoke coming up out of the station area.

But before that, there were the deadly bombs. They happened just about 8:00 a.m. local time as the commuter trains were packed. One coming in to this Atocha Station, 29 people dead on that train. In another place called Pozo Del Tio Raimundo, another explosion that took the second brunt. And a third place called Santa Eugenia.

The government is blaming the Basque separatist group ETA, which, of course, is listed as a terrorist organization by the United States and by the European Union, of which Spain is a member. ETA is blamed for more than 800 deaths before this day in its 30-year fight for Basque independence. And here this day 60 is a single worst day in the -- single deadliest day in the history of ETA, if indeed it is ETA as everyone here believes -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Al, can you get into exactly how this was done? Were there bombs planted onboard individual train cars or were the bombs on the tracks?

GOODMAN: We have heard from reports that on one train there were bombs in plastic bags that were placed in the lead car, in the middle car and in the rear car of a particular train. Now that may have been the one coming into the Atocha Train Station.

Apparently these bombs were in the trains and not on the track, that's why some of the cars where the bombs were were just a scene of carnage, Carol, according to witnesses, whereas other cars, people managed to get off and were telling the grim story.

Now the police last Christmas Eve, at the other major train station in Madrid, foiled what they said was an ETA attempt to bombing there. So they had some warning that this might happen. And they have been on high alert, especially because we are just days ahead of the Sunday national parliamentary elections for prime minister where the ruling Conservative Party, Carol, has taken a hard-line stance against ETA, is currently ahead in the polls. They have called off all of their campaign events through the end of the campaign, which is late Friday -- Carol.

COSTELLO: But as far as we know, the elections there will go on.

Al, I wanted to ask you this, if ETA is indeed to blame and had planned a similar attack before that had been foiled, I know that Spain is on a high terror alert. Is there any lessons to be learned for U.S. intelligent sources as to how to prevent something like this or is it virtually impossible?

GOODMAN: Well I think anti-terrorism experts with whom we have spoken through the years will say and officials have said this publicly, even last year as they arrested nearly 200 ETA suspects, even last year as ETA had its lowest death count in 30 years, just 3 people dead in all of last year, Carol, officials said you can't ever count these guys out. And it just shows how unfortunately resilient this organization has been despite this -- the huge number of arrests.

So they have really been -- and how they have changed tactics. This is completely a change of tactics in -- for more than a decade, they have not tried any sort of mass bombing, specifically trying to target innocent civilians. They have gone for smaller targets, a judge, a police officer, a military official. One, two or three people might die in that. This is a huge change in tactics -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Well you know you talk about this change in tactics. As some terrorism experts that we interviewed earlier on CNN International said, they are not quite sure that this Spanish terrorist group is to blame because Spain has been on high alert. Spanish troops are inside of Iraq. Spain is a U.S. ally of the United States and the reason that Spain has been on such a high alert is because of al Qaeda. Is that right?

GOODMAN: Well indeed. And former officials of the former government of Saddam Hussein, when they were still in power, actually directly threatened. They said there would be consequences for which its allies, in this case Spain and Britain, were supporting the U.S.- led war in Iraq. And since then I believe there has been at least one al Qaeda communique also saying that Spain, because it has 1,300 troops in Iraq, would face some sort of threat. So they have been on alert for both al Qaeda, they have been on alert for ETA attacks as well. But the initial report here had been that this is an ETA, that is where the initial blame is going, although there, Carol, there's a lot yet to be discovered about this -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Well right, and ETA has not claimed responsibility either, at least not that we have heard of.

Al, another question for you, you know thousands of Americans ride commuter trains like the one in Madrid, Spain every day. I have ridden them a lot. There is no particular security after you get onboard that train. Is it different in Spain?

GOODMAN: Well the -- I mean you need a ticket to get on the train. They are really quite strict about people not getting on the train without a ticket, a little -- a little card that you stick in and you get on the train at the station. But basically anybody can get on.

The only trains where there's a bit of a stepped up security is the Bullet Train that leaves as well from this station right behind me. And that has security, Carol, like you would find at an airport where the bags are checked. They go through a metal detector. But in terms of the vast number of commuter chains -- trains, the Metros, this is a capital of five million people between the city and the surrounding regions, they just don't -- have never thought about putting that kind of airport type security on to the trains -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Al Goodman doing a great job live from Madrid, Spain and getting on the scene fast there for us, a wonderful job. Al Goodman live from Madrid, Spain this morning.

The high tech hunt for Osama bin Laden is intensifying along the Afghan-Pakistan border. The Pentagon is considering using a long- range air-to-ground surveillance system designed to locate, classify and track regardless of the weather. They may also use an aircraft that monitors electronic activity. And the military has plans now to use ground sensors, U-2 spy planes and unmanned Predator drones 24/7.

U.S. military is also working with Pakistani forces to try to flush bin Laden out of his hiding place.

Our Ryan Chilcote joins us live from the Afghan capital Kabul with more on the hunt for the terrorist mastermind.

And I know you just got there 24 hours ago, you've been on the ground a short time, so explain to us what you are doing there? You are embedded, right?

RYAN CHILCOTE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's correct. I'm embedded with U.S. forces here in Afghanistan. U.S. forces really spread out throughout the country. I am at a base called Task Force Phoenix. It's OK to talk about that.

It is here in the Afghan capital. About 1,000 U.S. soldiers have teamed up with soldiers from seven other countries to train the Afghan army. This is a new thing. It's going to be called the Afghan National Army. It's paid for by the U.S. government and other countries. And their job is to train an army here in Afghanistan that would be loyal to the federal government.

That is absolutely key, the U.S. says, to making sure that this country develops in a democratic fashion and it can deal with terrorism on its own soil. It's particularly key to get that job done quickly because the United States would like to see an election held in this country as early as June. And it says it needs the Afghan National Army in place, particularly in eastern and southern Afghanistan, to make that happen.

Now of course a lot of what is going on here in Afghanistan is focused around what we're hearing the hunt for Osama bin Laden. Military spokesmen here on the ground are playing down a lot of that talk coming out of Washington. They are saying, after all, if they knew where Osama bin Laden was right now they would have already captured him. So I think it's fair to assume that they are not showing us all of their cards.

What we do know is that the U.S. has several fire bases. Fire bases are small bases where U.S. troops are located in eastern Afghanistan near that border and both conventional forces and the very secretive special operations forces are running operations on a regular basis. They say maybe nothing increased right now in that area looking for elements of Taliban and al Qaeda and, of course, Osama bin Laden.

Lastly, there's been a lot of talk about, again, coming from the United States, about a spring offensive here in Afghanistan. The military here on the ground not ruling that out, but they are certainly not saying what it would be like if there is going to be one and when it would happen -- Carol. COSTELLO: You've been in Afghanistan before, is there a sense in talking to the soldiers now that they are getting closer to finding Osama bin Laden?

CHILCOTE: I'm not so sure of that. The U.S. soldiers here are really engaged in a lot of different things that have to do with broader subjects than just finding Osama bin Laden. I think you'd probably find as many opinions on whether they will find Osama bin Laden here among the soldiers as you'd find anywhere in the United States. It really sort of depends on how much people believe in luck, I guess.

What the soldiers here are focused on is things, like I said, training the Afghan army, like these provisional -- these provisional reconstruction teams that the army has fielded out into the regions to do stuff like winning hearts and minds, by working to reconstruct Afghanistan instead of just carrying out offensive military operations. So they are really focused on those kinds of things. And for a lot of the soldiers here, because the hunt for Osama bin Laden is really quite a secretive effort, it is just a matter of speculation for them whether Osama will be caught or not -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Ryan Chilcote reporting live from Afghanistan this morning. We're going to get back to you in the next hour of DAYBREAK. We appreciate it.

We have on the phone with us right now the Spanish Foreign Minister Ana Palacio. Of course we've been telling you all morning long about those terrible explosions onboard a commuter train in Madrid. We know at least 62 people have been killed and maybe more.

Are you with us?

ANA PALACIO, SPANISH FOREIGN MINISTER: Yes, I am with you.

COSTELLO: Thank you so much.

PALACIO: Hello, good morning.

COSTELLO: Good morning.

PALACIO: Good morning to all of you. I'm -- I feel that I'm speaking to friends, to American friends that know very well and have a very clear, very clear memory of what happened in September 11. And that's why I must say from the outset that we are absolutely shocked that many media, many American media are still calling it a terrorist group, not a terrorist group but a separatist group. It says -- if after September 11 the Spanish media would have called al Qaeda a religious organization that uses terrorist means and bin Laden the leader of a religious organization that does not agree with American policy and that -- in the -- in the context of the -- of the Twin Towers terrorist attack.

COSTELLO: Well I think in this instance that we can indeed call this a terrorist group because the U.S. recognizes it as a terrorist group, this Basque separatist group ETA. And you think that they are...

PALACIO: No, no, no, on the contrary, may I set the record straight. ETA is included in the terrorist list of the U.S. It's included as terrorist also in the terrorist list of the European Union. That's why I am saying that let us set the record straight and not send a very misleading message to the -- to the -- to the public opinion. ETA is in the terrorist list of the U.S. And I hope that today the administration will make a very clear statement reminding all Americans, and especially all American media, that this is so.

COSTELLO: So you want President Bush to come out and say something?

PALACIO: No, no, not especially President Bush, but the administration. I will be speaking, I hope, in the last -- in the next hour or so with Secretary of State Colin Powell, because you know it's very -- it's very -- when you -- when you are in a -- after such a terrible thing is -- imagine. Just imagine the Spanish media just speaking about al Qaeda a religious organization that uses terrorist means or bin Laden a religious leader. It's something we Spaniards are not understand from, especially from our American friends that have gone through such a terrible experience similar to the one we are living right now in Spain.

I am not...

COSTELLO: Minister Palacio,...

PALACIO: No, no, but I, and let...

COSTELLO: ... we do -- we do understand.

PALACIO: Let me -- let me insist that I'm not just -- it's not my way of saying ETA is a terrorist organization. It's you Americans, you Americans that have put ETA in the, very rightly so by the way, in the terrorist list of the United States.

COSTELLO: Right, and we have done that. And I don't think there is any doubt that this was a terrorist act, whoever is to blame. Why do you think that ETA and not al Qaeda is to blame for this attack?

PALACIO: Because this bears the hallmark of ETA. Let me remind you that two weeks ago we -- our security forces stopped a truckload of explosives that could have not had the consequences of today's terrorist attack but a much bigger consequences. There were -- there were explosives able to blow many buildings in these -- in these trucks. And we knew we had information that ETA was trying to, I mean, to let...

COSTELLO: Right, because they tried...

PALACIO: Yes, intervene in this -- in the -- in the middle of these -- of these run-ups to the elections. We have general elections on Sunday. But of course we are -- we are waiting until there is an official statement, which has not yet come, an official statement or ETA claiming that they are the responsibles for this. COSTELLO: Yes, they haven't come out with any claim of responsibility.

PALACIO: No, not yet.

COSTELLO: I just wondered, since authorities were able to stop an initial attack on train tracks by this Basque separatist group, this group ETA, tell us how difficult it has been to prevent such attacks within Spain, because Spain has been on high alert, right?

PALACIO: Well, Patricia, could you admit after September 11 to speak with someone that would call bin Laden an al Qaeda separatist organization? So please do not ask me a question referring to ETA as a separatist organization. Really it's very -- I mean it's something that we Spaniards cannot understand and especially we cannot understand it from our American friends. So please don't use this way of qualifying ETA.

COSTELLO: OK.

PALACIO: ETA is a terrorist organization. At least don't call them a separatist organization.

COSTELLO: All right. I apologize for that. But can you address the question of how difficult these kinds of attacks are to figure out they are going to happen and how to stop them?

PALACIO: Well you know terrorism is terrorism. Terrorism is exactly the same threat in America, in New York or in Spain or, by the way, in Tokyo or in Istanbul. Unfortunately, it's not easy to fight these and to prevent these terrorist attacks. We, the Spanish security forces, have prevented many, many attacks by ETA lately. But unfortunately, we were not able to prevent this one, as your security forces were not able to prevent what happened in the Twin Towers and in the Pentagon.

COSTELLO: Thank you very much. The Spanish Foreign Minister Ana Palacio joining us live by phone from Spain this morning. And our recent death reports from the attacks aboard that commuter train in Madrid 131 dead now.

We're going to take a short break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Vancouver Canucks forward Todd Bertuzzi will hear his punishment this morning for a sucker punch that severely injured an opponent. But on the eve of that punishment, Bertuzzi was contrite about the hit on Colorado's Steve Moore.

Here's more of what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TODD BERTUZZI, VANCOUVER CANUCKS: Steve, I just want to apologize for what happened out there, that I had no intention on hurting you, that I feel awful for what transpired.

To the fans of hockey and to the fans of Vancouver, for the kids that watch this game, I am truly sorry. I don't play that -- I don't play the game that way, and I'm not a mean spirited person. And I'm sorry for what happened.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: For the second time in four years, Vancouver police are investigating a vicious hit during a hockey game.

CNN's Kimberly Osias reports on the double standard of violence in the sport.

031000CN.V84

COSTELLO: Paul Kelly, who was an attorney for Marty McSorley after his February 2000 attack, will be a guest on CNN's "AMERICAN MORNING." That begins, of course, at 7:00 a.m. Eastern.

We're back in just a minute.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: It is time, Chad, to take a look at papers across America to see what's happening locally...

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: OK, "Front Page."

COSTELLO: ... in towns and cities and, you know, all that kind of stuff. This is from the "Chicago Sun-Times." You can see the headline there, Daley to firefighters: rat out the racists. Apparently what's happening, supposedly some firefighters within the department are using the fire radio to spew racial hatred. They are actually using...

MYERS: Yikes!

COSTELLO: ... racial slurs over the radio. And supposedly the firefighters can't figure out who is doing it. The mayor is calling them to action and saying rat out these people so that they can be punished.

MYERS: Do they think it's just somebody else with a radio or do they think it's...

COSTELLO: No, they think it's -- they think it's...

MYERS: ... other firefighters?

COSTELLO: ... other firefighters.

MYERS: Yikes!

COSTELLO: I guess they are also trying to use this underground Web site that the fire department has and they are spewing hatred on that as well. So we'll see what happens.

On to the "Pittsburgh Tribune Review." You see that, they can't get their MTV. Apparently...

MYERS: Yes, mine was off for a while, too, on my dish network. I wasn't pleased.

COSTELLO: Did -- I wouldn't be pleased either. Well apparently there's this dispute over programming costs between EchoStar and Viacom, the company that owns MTV, VH1, Nickelodeon, CBS. And apparently some agreement has been come to. So, for the local affiliates in Pittsburgh, they got their MTV back or soon will.

MYERS: I couldn't see my Comedy Central.

COSTELLO: Oh no!

MYERS: I know.

COSTELLO: To "The Times," "The Reporter," this is out of Dover New Philadelphia, Ohio. And as you can see, Tim Couch is on the front page. I don't know if you know anything about the Cleveland Browns, there's been this horrible quarterback controversy you know last year between Kelly Holcomb and Tim Couch.

MYERS: Of course.

COSTELLO: They couldn't decide who was the lead quarterback.

MYERS: Right.

COSTELLO: Well they are both gone this year, this coming year.

MYERS: Well that will fix it, won't it?

COSTELLO: Right. And they have hired Jeff Garcia who has problems of his own. The San Francisco quarterback, you know?

MYERS: Yes, sure.

COSTELLO: Remember he just got stopped for drunk driving?

MYERS: Yes. He's not a young one though, is he?

COSTELLO: No, he's in his 30s.

MYERS: Well.

COSTELLO: So, no, and he's not the greatest either. He's sort of up and down.

MYERS: Hey, careful about that.

COSTELLO: Sorry. Sorry Jeff Garcia.

MYERS: All right. COSTELLO: I hope you do well in Cleveland.

MYERS: We'll have more later.

COSTELLO: All right, we certainly will. Thank you very much -- Chad.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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