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American Morning
Terrorist Bombings Hit Madrid Days Before Parliamentary Elections
Aired March 11, 2004 - 07:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: The devastating death toll from a terrorist attack: more than 100 people killed in a series of bombings in Madrid.
John Kerry calls an opponent the most crooked, lying group of people I've ever seen. The GOP demanding an apology.
And...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TODD BERTUZZI, VANCOUVER CANUCKS: I'm not a mean-spirited person, and I'm sorry for what happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: A hockey player apologizes for a blindside punch. Punishment is expected today on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Bill Hemmer and Soledad O'Brien.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, good morning. 7:00 here in New York, and a lot of news to cover this hour.
Also politics. Some Republicans have a problem with TV ads that attack the White House. It's not what they say but how they're being funded.
We'll talk to the man in a moment behind those ads. Former Bill Clinton aide Harold Ickes is our guest here on AMERICAN MORNING.
O'BRIEN: Also this morning, Michael Jackson's prosecutor has called for a grand jury.
He won't say what it's all about, but some analysts think it could be a closed-door dress rehearsal for a trial.
Jeff Toobin is going to join us and help explain that.
HEMMER: Also Jack Cafferty -- good morning to you.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: How are you doing? Opening day of the baseball season just a couple of weeks away now, but instead of looking forward to the first pitch and the crack of the bat, the sport is mired in a controversy about steroids.
We'll take a look.
HEMMER: Jack, thanks.
We're going to get straight away to Madrid, the height of the morning rush hour in the Spanish capitol -- a series of explosions ripping through three separate trains.
Late word reported from Madrid leaves it unclear who's responsible.
No claim of responsibility publicly. There are suspects, however, including the Basque separatist group, ETA. The Basque people live in the mountainous region in northern Spain along the border with France.
Regional ties are strong in the area, and many Basques support a separate Basque homeland apart from the Spanish federal government.
ETA, which is on the U.S. State Department's list of terrorist organizations, is blamed for some 800 deaths since it first began its fight for independence.
Our Madrid bureau chief Al Goodman is on the scene getting more information, in fact, at this time. Much more from Madrid in a few moments.
But just to recap -- let you know what we know right now -- at least 131 are dead. More than 400 others are wounded near simultaneous explosions hitting three separate trains right during the morning rush hour, 8 a.m. local time in Madrid.
All this coming now ahead of Sunday's general election in Spain, and, again just to reiterate -- no claim of responsibility yet from Madrid.
We will not leave this story long; it is an absolute tragedy this morning in Madrid.
We'll get you the latest as soon as we get it here.
O'BRIEN: Pictures of the devastation are just terrible. We'll continue to update that of course this morning.
Other headlines making news this morning, President Bush will attend the groundbreaking today for a 9/11 memorial in East Meadow, New York.
The Long Island memorial will feature two aluminum towers rising 30 feet above a reflecting pool
Some families of 9/11 victims say they will protest the president's visit in light of the controversy over his campaign reelection ads. We've got more on this story coming up in a little bit. A roadside bombing has killed another U.S. soldier in Iraq.
The soldier died last night from wounds suffered after the attack in west Ba'qubah some 30 miles north of Baghdad.
Two other soldiers were wounded in that same attack.
Teen sniper Lee Boyd Malvo has been sentenced to life in prison without parole. The judge yesterday upheld the punishment a jury had recommended back in December.
Malvo, now 19 years old, was convicted of capital murder in the shooting death of FBI analyst Linda Franklin. She was one of ten people killed during the October 2002 sniper attacks.
In Washington, the House has easily passed the so-called "cheeseburger bill." The bill protects restaurants and the food industry from obesity lawsuits.
The vote was 276 to 139 on the measure. Supporters said people need to take responsibility for what they eat.
Some Democrats argued that the bill was not needed because most obesity claims have actually been dismissed in the courts.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: President Bush's campaign organization is demanding an apology for a remark by Senator John Kerry yesterday after addressing labor leaders by satellite from Chicago.
Senator Kerry turned to supporters standing behind him and then said this:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: These guys are -- these guys are the most crooked -- you know -- lying group of people I've ever seen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: The Bush campaign says the statement is unbecoming of a presidential candidate. No apology has been issued.
Senator Kerry will meet today with Congressional Democrats; also have a private meeting with a formal rival, Senator John Edwards, and his major donors as well.
As the campaign heats up so does the political feud between Republicans and Democrats. The president's reelection campaign has filed a complaint about a series of anti-Bush ads launched by the pro- Kerry group, Media Fund.
Republicans claim that the ad, paid for by Democratic supporters skirt campaign spending laws. Former Clinton White House adviser Harold Ickes heads up the Media Fund. He joins us this morning.
Nice to see you. Thanks for joining us.
HAROLD ICKES, DIRECTOR, THE MEDIA FUND: Good to be here.
O'BRIEN: I want to read you a little bit of what Ben Ginsburg, who is with the Bush-Cheney campaign had to say.
In fact we'll play a short clip of what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BEN GINSBURG, BUSH-CHENEY LEGAL COUNSEL: It's an attempt to illegally hijack a federal election by using illegal soft money from Democrat's special interest groups, to defeat a specific federal candidate. That's a violation of federal law.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Is the intention of the Media Fund to circumvent the law?
ICKES: It is not. We are operating well within the bounds of the law. Ben Ginsburg is merely a mouthpiece.
O'BRIEN: I want to read to you a little bit of what the law specifically has to say.
It says the special interest groups raise unlimited soft money, which they use for voter mobilization and certain types of issue advocacy, but not for efforts that expressly advocate the election or defeat of a federal candidate.
That being said, let's watch one of the ads.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AD ANNOUNCER: President Bush. Remember the American dream? It's about hope, not fear. It's about more jobs at home, not tax breaks for shipping jobs overseas.
It's about giving our children their chance, not our debt. It's about providing health care for people, not just profits.
It's about fighting for the middle class, not special interests.
George Bush's priorities are eroding the American dream.
It's time to take our country back from corporate greed and make America work for every American.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: You don't think this ad is expressly calling for the defeat of George Bush?
ICKES: It is not. It is not saying vote for Bush; vote for against Bush; vote for Kerry. It is saying -- talking about the policies of the Bush administration and how they've eroded the position of the American middle class.
O'BRIEN: The men who wrote the law -- John McCain -- said you're obviously trying to skirt the law.
In fact, the way he put it was "duh." And here's what he had to say about what the Media Fund and others like it are doing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: It's plain as the nose on your face that these 527s are organized and are engaging in partisan political activity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: You could argue he knows better than anybody else what exactly the intention of this law would be. Why do you think he's wrong?
ICKES: He has not said specifically that this is illegal. He may use the word skirt, but the Congress had the full chance to debate this; we were doing this prior to the law, the enactment of a new law.
They made no change in Congress with respect to the activities we're doing.
And we're committed to do it now. It's very clear that the Congress made no change in this area of the law.
O'BRIEN: He may not have said its illegal, but he did say if the FEC does not reign you in, he intends to take it to court. You don't think that's essentially the equivalent of it's illegal?
ICKES: We don't think the courts have the power. It's the Congress that enacted the statute, they made no change from the prior way we could use it.
O'BRIEN: No secret, of course, that a former Kerry campaign manager is a consultant to your organization, the Media Fund.
So are you working at any capacity at all? For the Kerry campaign?
ICKES: No, we are forbidden from having conversations with the Kerry campaign. We do not coordinate with the Kerry campaign; it's forbidden by law and we don't do it.
O'BRIEN: What are the chances do you think that you're going to be successful?
Of course obviously, as you well know, all of this is being challenged.
ICKES: We think that there's no basis at all to the FEC, the federal elections commission, to restrict what we're doing and if they do we will go into court and challenge it on the grounds that they have no basis in law for making any changes.
O'BRIEN: Looks like it might be heading to court. Harold Ickes joining us this morning, nice to see you.
Thanks for being with us.
ICKES: Good to see you. Thank you.
O'BRIEN: California Congressman David Dryer is going to join us at 9 a.m. Eastern Time with the Bush campaign's response to the Media Fund's ad, we should note -- Bill.
HEMMER: Soledad, President Bush meanwhile defending his economic policy while calling the Democratic mindset tired and defeatist.
Yesterday in Ohio, a battleground state that's lost 160,000 manufacturing jobs during his term, John King reporting today the president was working to give Americans some economic optimism.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Thermagon is a Cleveland high tech company that exports 60 percent of its products. This presidential visit designed to make the point trade is part of the solution for a struggling jobs market, not the problem.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Listen, the best product on any shelf anywhere in the world says "Made In The USA."
KING: The president didn't name names, but suggests critics who blame him for manufacturing jobs lost to cheap overseas labor markets would do the economy a lot more harm than good.
BUSH: That old policy of tax and spend is the enemy of job creation. The old policy of economic isolationism is a recipes for economic disaster.
KING: Mr. Bush's success in making his case could determine whether he has a job come January.
Eighty-five percent of Americans in a new CNN poll say keeping American jobs from going overseas will be important in their choice for president.
Democrat John Kerry supported the North American Free Trade Agreement and a similar pact with China and in appealing for union support, Senator Kerry now promises if elected to review all major trade deals.
KERRY: George Bush thinks exporting our jobs is good economic policy. I believe that creating jobs here in America, keeping good jobs here and exporting goods is good for our economy.
KING (on camera): Five months after the president promised to name a new administration manufacturing czar, officials say the post will go to a Nebraska businessman who is an outspoken advocate of free trade.
Senator Kerry calls it too little, too late and says one new government bureaucrat can't make up for the loss of 2.5 million manufacturing jobs.
John King, CNN, the White House.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: Also, one more note, the president talks about the economy again today in an event on New York's Long Island. We'll cover that for you a bit later -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: About two hours from now the National Hockey League is expected to meet out its punishment to Todd Bertuzzi of the Vancouver Canucks.
Bertuzzi attacked Colorado's Steve Moore on Monday night, leaving Moore with a broken neck, a concussion and some facial cuts.
Well last night a very remorseful Bertuzzi publicly apologized to Moore, who remains in a Vancouver hospital. Bertuzzi says he feels awful about what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BERTUZZI: Fans of hockey and the fans of Vancouver, for the kids that watch this game, I'm truly sorry. I don't play that -- I don't play the game that way and I'm not a mean-spirited person.
I'm sorry for what happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Vancouver police are looking into the attack.
At the bottom of the hour we're going to talk to an attorney who represented another NHL player who was prosecuted for an on-ice attack.
HEMMER: Some interesting comments, too.
Bertuzzi one of the best players in the League this year. Interesting to see if the NHL takes much action on this. That attorney doesn't think so, so we'll get his thoughts in a moment.
In a moment here are prosecutors in the Michael Jackson trying to avoid a public hearing by taking their case to a grand jury. We'll get to that with Jeff Toobin in a moment.
O'BRIEN: Also this morning the same sex marriage debate. Massachusetts, the state that started it all prepares for another round.
HEMMER: Also a Web site drawing fire from undercover police officers showing their pictures and their names, even their home address. That's ahead here on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: Updating the figures from this tragic story out of Madrid, Spain a story breaking several hours ago.
The new numbers now, 173 are said to be dead. This from our affiliate there. Also getting word from the interior minister at least 600 are injured.
We've got a live crew on the scene we'll get to them live at the bottom of the hour so stay tuned for more out of Madrid this morning a significant story that will be a big part of our coverage for the next three hours time.
In the meantime though back in this country the D.A. in Santa Barbara, California is said to be convening a grand jury in Michael Jackson's child molestation case.
A closed-door proceeding would allow prosecutors to present their evidence in secret thus avoiding a very public preliminary hearing.
What does this all mean, though? Our legal analyst is here with us, Jeff Toobin. Good morning to you.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Hi.
HEMMER: New strategy, different strategy, what?
TOOBIN: There are two ways that prosecutors in California can bring a case forward after someone has been arrested.
One is a preliminary hearing, which a lot of people have seen. There was one in the Blake hearing -- Blake case not too long ago, which is like a mini-trial, it takes place in public, there's no jury.
Hearsay evidence is admissible but it is a public proceeding or prosecutors can use a grand jury, which is entirely secret. They control entirely what questions are asked, who appears and that's only disclosed after the charges have been brought by the Grand Jury.
What they have decided to do is forego the preliminary hearing which is the usual route in felony cases in California and use a secret grand jury.
HEMMER: So if you're a DA or a prosecutor what is your strategy to help benefit your case if you want to keep it private?
TOOBIN: Well, first of all you avoid a circus, you don't have the enormous attention that a preliminary hearing in the Michael Jackson case. We've seen that in this case beyond what even the wildest imaginings. The other thing and I think it's very important here is in a grand jury you can use it to investigate are there more victims out there; are there people who could corroborate the story. Grand jury is an investigative tool as well.
In this case, at least based on my observation of it so far, really needs more investigation, really needs more -- needs some help. And a grand jury is a way to do that much more than a preliminary hearing.
HEMMER: You say this case is not so strong?
TOOBIN: Absolutely not.
HEMMER: Why not?
TOOBIN: Because this is basically a one-witness case involving a sick, unfortunately -- a kid with cancer -- who you know will have his credibility attacked. That is it appears like it's the whole case.
Remember the district attorney said we want to see if other victims come forward. No victims have come forward as far as anyone is aware.
The grand jury allows them to try to build other parts into this case in a way that a preliminary hearing wouldn't.
HEMMER: Legal 101, do both sides get to see how the boy will now be as a witness if you go to the grand jury?
TOOBIN: If he testifies in the grand jury, that will be in secret. If he then later testifies at the trial, as he certainly would if this case proceeds, they will -- the prosecutors -- the defense -- would get to see the transcript of his appearance but they would never actually see him on the witness stand in the grand jury.
HEMMER: Jeff, thanks.
Jeffrey Toobin, talk to you a bit later this morning on another topic. Here's Soledad.
O'BRIEN: This afternoon, Massachusetts's lawmakers will once again debate an amendment to ban same-sex marriages. The state Supreme Court has ruled that same-sex marriages must be allowed there by May.
Last night, opponents of the amendment rallied around the state capital building. Many say a law that would ban same-sex marriages still is discriminatory even if it allows civil unions.
In February, Massachusetts's lawmakers failed in three tries to pass a ban on same-sex marriages. The state's house speaker and senate president predicts success this time around
Still to come this morning, the end of a public battle between a satellite company and the home of MTV and Sponge Bob Square Pants. But will millions of viewers forgive and forget? We'll look at that ahead as AMERICAN MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: All right after yesterday's tumble on Wall Street what can we expect today? Boy the numbers were down yesterday.
Plus the latest dish on the spat involving the Dish Network and to dish that Andy Serwer is back his "Minding Your Business."
Good morning.
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Good morning.
HEMMER: Triple digit loss for the Dow 30.
SERWER: Yes, biggest point decline since last May, Bill.
Really kind of a dismal picture on Wall Street yesterday. There's no other way to put it.
Let's take a look at the numbers. Down about 1.5 percent on both the Dow and the Nasdaq.
The immediate catalyst yesterday, Bill, the $43 billion trade deficit in January -- we mentioned that briefly yesterday.
The real surprise there is that U.S. goods aren't being sold in Europe as they -- as we anticipated. The weaker dollar is supposed to give that a boost. That's not happening and people on Wall Street are very concerned here.
Let's take a look at where we are for the year. Oh, we don't have that screen; I'm sorry about that.
Anyway year to date we're down about 1.5 percent; we're in the red for all the indexes. People are starting to use the C-word, that's correction.
And the real consensus on Wall Street is that the growth, the acceleration is over that we're not moving ahead. They're not prepared to say yet that we're moving backwards but we seem to be stalled a little bit here.
HEMMER: Going on 2000 (ph) for the Nasdaq we're still under that about 1964 (ph), I believe. Today better news or not? Rebound?
SERWER: No, not at all. In fact futures are sharply lower this morning so looks like we're going to have a lower overhead.
HEMMER: What's the dish on Echo Star?
SERWER: Well you know we have this dispute between Echo Star and Viacom where they took up all the CBS programming and that 16 cities, 1.6 million Americans weren't getting their MTV, but it's back this morning.
And you know they caved, they capitulated, why? "CSI," "Survivor" on tonight and we don't want our people missing that and then also even more importantly next week "March Madness" on CBS.
HEMMER: You are so right.
SERWER: Tip them away.
HEMMER: Get your bracket filled out today. It's a holiday.
SERWER: No you canceled Sunday.
HEMMER: That's right.
(CROSSTALK)
SERWER: You're welcome.
O'BRIEN: And we're going get -- do a little thing on that, right?
SERWER: I hope we are. We're going to get Jack in on it.
HEMMER: What's that?
CAFFERTY: If you wish.
SERWER: OK, good.
O'BRIEN: Are you in charge?
SERWER: I'm in charge, I'll do it. Yes.
O'BRIEN: Let us know.
SERWER: OK.
O'BRIEN: In fact, it is time for "The Cafferty Files," the question of the day. Hello.
CAFFERTY: How are you doing? America's favorite pastime, opening day a couple of weeks away.
There was a problem. Senator John McCain yesterday threatened Congressional action if Major League baseball and its players union don't crack down on steroid use.
The executive director of the union, Donald Fehr said he thinks current testing is sufficient and the union has long said that testing invades the privacy of players. So what?
In 2003, five to seven percent of professional baseball players tested positive for steroids. The League said the players who test positive this year could -- not will -- could face suspensions and fines. Senator McCain compared professional baseball to the NFL, where a positive test result means an immediate four-game suspension, or Olympic athletes who are suspended for one year after their first offense, permanently banned after their second offense.
So the question is, should there be a zero tolerance policy for steroids in baseball?
Reggie Jackson, a great homerun hitter and -- for the Yankees and Oakland as in the paper this morning saying, quote here, "Somebody definitely is guilty of taking steroids. You can't be breaking records hitting 200 homeruns in three or four seasons. Hank Aaron never hit 50 in a season so you're going to tell me that you're a grater hitter than Henry Aaron? Barry Bonds hit 73 homeruns in 2001. He would have hit 100 if they would have pitched to him. I mean, come on now." Unquote.
That's Reggie Jackson talking about steroids in baseball. So write to us and let us know what you think.
HEMMER: That's a great topic.
SERWER: Did you see the cover of "Sports Illustrated" this week? Are we in the Asterisk Era as far as baseball goes, meaning are all the records really subject to question.
Jeff Greenfield wrote a piece in that issue of "Sports Illustrated" you should check it out.
HEMMER: Oh, yes? You know it was just a week ago baseball came out and said the preseason ticket sales are better this year for this season they have been in years.
CAFFERTY: See that's the problem, though.
HEMMER: It makes you wonder if the guy's hitting 73 homeruns people will go to the ballpark to see him.
(CROSSTALK)
HEMMER: Give us good baseball or do we care whether or not it's natural.
SERWER: It's juiced.
O'BRIEN: And also don't they all basically say well if somebody else is using steroids you have to as well because how do you possibly compete?
HEMMER: Joe Biden was on the Hill yesterday and he's going to join us next hour too so we'll get his thoughts on this. Great headline today in "The Washington Post" -- Fear and Loathing on Capitol Hill.
Did you see that? CAFFERTY: Or there's one in the New York paper -- Fear Strikes Out. A really great biography of the Boston Red Sox players. I think it was, wasn't it?
HEMMER: Yes, we'll get to that as we continue. Also back to Spain in a moment and in a moment political intrigue, kid spies at the movies this weekend.
"90-Second Pop" is back on a Thursday morning right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: All right good morning again, 7:30 here in New York.
Breaking news out of Madrid, Spain. We will not leave that story for long. We'll get you back there live in a moment.
Also a question today in sports, how hard will the NHL come down on Todd Bertuzzi for that brutal hit earlier in the week that broke an opponent's neck?
In a moment we'll talk with the lawyer who defended Marty McSorley four years ago. McSorley was punished by the League, convicted of assault for a vicious on-ice incident.
In that case, he used his stick. We'll see what the comparisons are if there are any for this case.
O'BRIEN: What kind of punishment did McSorley get?
HEMMER: Well, he was at the end of his career and they suspended him for the rest of the year and he never came back to the ice so he just went into retirement.
O'BRIEN: Career-ending for him. Interesting.
Also this morning, we're going to find out about the pressure on John Kerry to apologize for some strong remarks that he made on the campaign trail; we'll explain what they were and who's taking umbrage at them this morning but first our top story this morning.
We begin in Spain where more than 170 people dead after a massive attack on Madrid's commuter train system. Three separate trains were hit in near back-to-back explosions. Nearly 600 others were injured in those blasts. Spanish officials are now blaming the Basque separatist group ETA. No one has claimed responsibility for the attacks. We've got much more on this, of course, throughout the morning, and we will update you on developments there.
Five detainees freed from Guantanamo Bay prison in Cuba have now also been released from British custody. The British detainees left the U.S. naval base on Tuesday, were flown to London. One of the men was released immediately. The remaining four were questioned and then released by British police without being charged. Four others British detainees are still being held at Gitmo. Singer Diana Ross is being ordered back to jail. An Arizona judge said she failed to complete a two-day jail sentence in Connecticut by one hour. Now he wants Ross to serve jail time in Tucson. Ross was arrested in December 2002 on DUI charges.
And a Michigan man is lucky to be alive today after a car slammed through the front of his house. The man walked away with minor injuries after the car came within just three feet of the couch where he was sleeping. The driver was thrown from the car, seriously hurt. Police believe that alcohol might have been a factor in that crash. The pictures...
HEMMER: That's a heck of a wake-up call, huh?
O'BRIEN: Yes, and look around, there's the car like this from you.
HEMMER: That's right. Good morning.
(WEATHER BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Senator John Kerry will seek support on Capitol Hill today in meetings with House and Senate Democrats. He's also going to meet with another of his former rivals, Senator John Edwards, as well a large group of Edwards' donors.
Senator Kerry met with Howard Dean in Washington yesterday. He also continued to attack President Bush's policy -- policies, rather, as well as Republican political moves.
National correspondent Bob Franken in Washington, D.C. for us with some details on all of that this morning.
Hey, Bob, good morning.
BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad.
And the meeting with House members will be held in private down the hall there, here at the Library of Congress in the Thomas Jefferson room, which is for members.
Now, an awful lot of controversy swirling around right now. The chairman of the Republican Elect Bush Campaign, Mark Racicot, is calling on Senator Kerry to apologize for a negative attack that he made yesterday, according to Racicot, comments that Racicot characterizes as unbecoming of a candidate for the presidency of the United States of America.
And Kerry certainly set a tone yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FRANKEN (voice-over): John Kerry is clearly not pulling any punches about what his aids call the Bush campaign's deceit.
KERRY: These guys are the most crooked, you know, lying group that I've ever seen.
FRANKEN: This is just the most recent Kerry attack this month on foreign policy.
KERRY: I think George Bush has run the most arrogant, inept, reckless and ideological foreign policy in the modern history of our country.
FRANKEN: On the famous photo-op.
KERRY: That George Bush thought he could just play dress-up on an aircraft carrier.
FRANKEN: On the president's plan for a Mars mission.
KERRY: Send Bush to Mars. There's another idea.
FRANKEN: On the issues, particularly the economy, Kerry believes he has the president on the defensive.
KERRY: Ladies and gentlemen, it's got to be getting lonely for George Bush. It seems he's the last person left in America who actually believes his failed policies will ever work.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FRANKEN: Kerry is having these meeting with his fellow Democrats, including Edwards, this afternoon, Senator John Edwards, in an effort to coordinate the Democratic message -- or, as his critics are saying, the Democratic assault -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Are there any expectations -- realistic expectations that Senator Kerry will even consider apologizing for those comments? He made it clear that -- or his campaign made it clear that he was not speaking about the president.
FRANKEN: Well, let's just probably put it this way, Soledad: Don't hold your breath.
O'BRIEN: We do say that a lot, don't we? That's how we end almost every one of our interviews: Don't hold your breath. Bob Franken for us this morning. Bob, thanks.
HEMMER: We want to get you back to Spain quickly now, and on the scene with us, our Madrid bureau chief, Al Goodman, who has been responding there for several hours now.
The numbers, as we have them, according to officials there in Madrid: 173 are dead, 592 are wounded.
Three separate attacks on three separate trains at the morning rush hour, 8:00 a.m. local time in Madrid, Spain. There has been no claim of responsibility at this point.
Al Goodman, let's try and bring you in now, live from the scene there in Madrid. What's the latest from the Spanish authorities that you are gathering? Hello.
Al Goodman, Bell Hemmer, CNN New York, if you can hear me, I would really like to bring you in now and get the very latest what you're gathering from the scene. We have watched these pictures now for several hours. One member of the Spanish government already saying it's an absolute massacre.
Al, try, again. What do you have for us?
AL GOODMAN, CNN MADRID BUREAU CHIEF: The just did live shots. One, two, three...
HEMMER: All right, our apologies to our viewers at home. As you can tell, there is still chaos around that scene, as we continue to monitor it. Again, 173 dead, almost 600 wounded, and we caution you, those numbers could change as the story progresses throughout the morning here.
O'BRIEN: And, of course, the timing of the attacks are interesting as well. It's coming ahead of the elections on Sunday, and many people think that that was not a coincidence; that the timing was planned.
HEMMER: Yes. And as soon as we get Al up and working there -- we apologize again to our viewers -- we'll get you back there.
In the meantime, though, there is a significant story in the world of sports today. Fighting separates hockey from other professional sports, and even those who claim it's a necessary evil admit that Todd Bertuzzi's attack on an opposing player was out of bounds.
The National Hockey League is expected to rule today on punishment, and higher authorities are deciding whether or not there was a crime committed on the ice earlier in the week.
Kimberly Osias now has more in Vancouver.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It was a full-on ambush, a round house punch to the head from behind in Monday night's game. Today, the 6 foot 3, 245-pound Todd Bertuzzi will find out how he'll be sanctioned by the NHL for jumping rookie Avalanche forward Steve Moore, forcing him face first into the ice.
Last night, he apologized to hockey fans, his teammates and especially the player he injured.
TODD BERTUZZI, VANCOUVER CANUCKS FORWARD: Steve, I just want to apologize for what happened out there, that I had no intention on hurting you. And that I feel awful for what transpired.
OSIAS: Moore is in a Vancouver hospital with a broken neck, cuts on his face and a concussion. He'll miss the rest of the season.
MELODY ESCALLIER, CANADIAN RESIDENT: I was absolutely disgusted. I thought it was no better than a mugging, actually.
OSIAS: Bertuzzi's career is on hold while the NHL debates his future. Vancouver police are investigating. The All-Star forward could face criminal charges.
This is the second time in four years a violent involving the NHL has become a criminal matter. Flashback February 2000: Boston Bruins tough guy Marty McSorley struck former Canuck player Donald Brashear with his stick. McSorley was convicted in Canada of assault with a weapon, but served no jail time. The league suspended him for a year, and he never returned.
WAYNE BROWN, HOCKEY FAN: It's put a bad eye on hockey right now. People don't want to see this kind of stuff. Fighting is a part of what hockey is, and I don't think they'll ever get rid of that.
OSIAS (on camera): Today, we'll see if NHL officials will give it their best shot.
Kimberly Osias, CNN, Vancouver, Canada.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: Attorney Paul Kelly represented Marty McSorley when the former Boston Bruin player was convicted of assault. That was four years ago. Paul Kelly is our guest today, live in Boston.
Nice to have you, and good morning to you.
PAUL KELLY, ATTORNEY FOR MARTY MCSORLEY: Good morning, Bill.
You believe what we're talking about, Bertuzzi, is actually worse than what happened with your client. Why do you believe that.
KELLY: Well, there's an element of premeditation in the current event involving Bertuzzi that didn't exist in the McSorley case. The McSorley incident evolved out of the emotion, the adrenaline of that particular game. The facts here in the Bertuzzi case suggest that this was a deliberate act, which followed an incident which had occurred with another player a few days before. I think that's a major factor which separates the two.
HEMMER: Can Bertuzzi be charged in this?
KELLY: He can, and he probably will. Again, I don't believe that professional athletes should be charged criminally for much of what goes on, on the playing surface, whether it be on the ice or the baseball diamond or the football field.
But in Vancouver, the police authorities and the prosecutors, having already having charged Marty McSorley for the act that took place in February of 2000, my sense is for that consistency's sake they really have no choice but to charge Mr. Bertuzzi. The difference being, of course, McSorley was the opposing player who came into Vancouver having played for the Boston Burins, Bertuzzi is not only a home team player, but one of their very best, All-Star for the Vancouver Canucks.
HEMMER: Let me be clear on this, Mr. Kelly. I believe you told our producers last night this is a tough call for the NHL with Bertuzzi. Why do you believe that?
KELLY: It's a tough call. And McSorley was a 17-year veteran at the end of his career, playing on a non-playoff team, not even a regular player. It was very easy for them to take very harsh action against McSorley.
Bertuzzi is playing on a top team. He is one of the finest players, a top scorer, an All-Star this past year, last year. His is a very good team with him; not such a great team without him. There is a financial aspect to this issue. I mean, do they want to bounce Todd Bertuzzi for a year, or for the remainder of the season and the playoffs? And what kind of an impact does that have on the league, the team?
HEMMER: That is a heck of a suggestion there that you're saying. The NHL would put the game over the possibility of assault on the ice. Is that what you're saying?
KELLY: Well, the -- no, I think they have to strike a balance. Clearly, the NHL wants to send a strong message of deterrence to other players that this type of behavior, premeditated attacks on a defenseless player who you outweigh by 50 pounds, causing a serious injury -- broken neck, concussion -- has to be prohibited.
On the other hand, they do not want -- I mean, if you look back over the past few years, the NHL has treated its star players more leniently than they have treated the tough guys, the enforcers, the Marty McSorleys of the league. That will be a factor. They won't express that that's a factor, but it will be a factor in the decision that they make.
HEMMER: Thanks for talking. Paul Kelly, the former attorney for Marty McSorley, in Boston, Massachusetts. We should get that announcement from the NHL in about less than two hours, about 9:00 a.m. Eastern time.
O'BRIEN: It will be interesting to see if what he is predicting -- that it does play a role, sort of how popular and how important he is to his team -- is going to be whether or not...
HEMMER: That's right. And this is (UNINTELLIGIBLE) that a lot of people do not know.
O'BRIEN: Yes, it sure does.
Still to come this morning on AMERICAN MORNING, from hockey to baseball, Washington lawmakers tell Major League Baseball, crack down on steroid use yourselves or were going to force you to do it. We're going to speak with one senator who is leading that charge.
HEMMER: Also, nearly a year after Elizabeth Smart's return home, her parents will join us live to talk about how their daughter is doing today.
O'BRIEN: And, life can still be sweet, even after an "American Idol" defeat.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (singing): For every girl in history, she moves.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Oh, that's ugly, isn't it? For this contestant, believe it or not, his ship has come in. We'll explain ahead as AMERICAN MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: I can hear it. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) but thank you. I'll take that.
Welcome to a mad, crazy edition of "90-Second Pop." We're starting down so low, aren't we?
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Today -- hello.
Today, we're talking about Johnny Depp. He goes to the big screen. Also, a reject gets a record deal. And who is nearly Martha?
Here to discuss this morning, Toure, a contributing editor for "Rolling Stone."
Nice to see you. Good morning.
TOURE, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, "ROLLING STONE": Nice to see you.
O'BRIEN: Also, "New York" magazine contributing editor, Sarah Bernard.
Nice to see you as well, Sarah.
SARAH BERNARD, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, "NEW YORK": Hello.
O'BRIEN: And B.J. Sigesmund, staff editor for "US Weekly."
Good morning.
B.J. SIGUSMUND, STAFF EDITOR, "US WEEKLY": Hello.
O'BRIEN: Let's get right to it. Should we start with the Martha wannabes?
TOURE: Yes.
SIGESMUND: Yes. O'BRIEN: Wow! What a cutthroat bunch.
BERNARD: Competition is very stiff.
O'BRIEN: The woman has not even been sentenced yet. That doesn't happen until June. And already, there's a handful...
TOURE: They want in.
O'BRIEN: ... a half-a-dozen...
BERNARD: There's a lot of people that would be really good at it. I have to recommend Nigella Lawson (ph), who is the sexy food queen of London.
O'BRIEN: I love watching her cook.
(CROSSTALK)
BERNARD: And she has an amazing show on the Style Network.
TOURE: She just has it, right? I just want to watch her.
O'BRIEN: Yes, she does.
BERNARD: She makes you want to cook or something like that.
TOURE: She just makes it seem easy.
SIGESMUND: Yes, although I still don't cook.
O'BRIEN: You just watch, right.
BERNARD: But with Martha, you didn't necessarily cook either. You just liked to think that you could, and that was her gift really. She made you think that you could do all these things. I think the real question is: Why do people think that they can replace her? I think what she did, even though you might not have liked her business choices, was really special. And I don't think any of these women can actually take over what she did.
O'BRIEN: Who besides Nigella Lawson (ph)?
BERNARD: Katie Brown (ph), who has a show on the H&G Network.
O'BRIEN: Bee Smith (ph)?
BERNARD: Bee Smith (ph) also is very -- her restaurants and her product line, she's already very established. And you actually had a good idea.
SIGESMUND: Well, there is Chris...
BERNARD: Oh.
SIGESMUND: Sorry, I was going to say Chris Madden (ph) also. She has written, like, 16 books on home furnishings, and she already has a deal, a Martha-like deal at J.C. Penney, where they're going to have furniture and bath towels designed by her, plus she's moving into television this fall.
O'BRIEN: I just don't know that any of these names can take over Martha.
BERNARD: I don't think they really can. And I think -- and I don't know that Martha is really going to go away. I think...
O'BRIEN: Besides to prison for a little bit.
BERNARD: Right. Well, that's...
TOURE: Well, you know, but Martha is known for making these comebacks, right? Her whole career begins when she catches her husband cheating, which is probably the lowest moment of her life until now. And she says, OK, I'm going to get it together and start this catering business and...
SIGESMUND: Right.
TOURE: ... she creates this empire.
SIGESMUND: Plus, I don't...
TOURE: So, she could come back.
BERNARD: She's a survivor.
TOURE: Yes.
SIGESMUND: And I don't think it looks bad to have Martha Stewart towels in your home just because she possibly made a mistake.
O'BRIEN: It is the best magazine ever.
TOURE: It's the same magazine.
O'BRIEN: "Martha Stewart Living" is a fantastic...
TOURE: It's the same towels. It's...
O'BRIEN: Behind bars or not.
TOURE: Right.
BERNARD: She might lose in advertising for a while, but after a while they might come back.
O'BRIEN: Right.
BERNARD: And the shoppers will continue.
O'BRIEN: Well, what confidence for Martha. I hope she's watching this. TOURE: Go, Martha!
O'BRIEN: We're sending a shout out to Martha.
BERNARD: Yes.
O'BRIEN: All right, explain this to me. Remember this guy...
TOURE: Oh!
O'BRIEN: ... who got dinged from "American Idol?"
BERNARD: Oh!
TOURE: Yes.
O'BRIEN: Let's listen to a little bit of William Hung.
TOURE: Can we cover our ears?
O'BRIEN: You may. Actually, yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM HUNG, "AMERICAN IDOL" CONTESTANT (singing): Oh, baby. She moves. She moves. I go crazy because she looks like...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: You know what I love about Paula Abdul? Like, she's such a lady. She is just, like, hmmm!
(LAUGHTER)
O'BRIEN: Simon is just being completely unpleasant, and Paula is, like, hmmm, how do I break it to him he's not going to be a star?
SIGESMUND: Right.
O'BRIEN: It turns out he is going to be a star.
TOURE: But, you know, I mean, this is the whole beginning of "American Idol." The first start of the show is the fantasizatoin (ph) of somebody who is terrible.
O'BRIEN: Fantasization (ph), what did you say?
SIGESMUND: That was nice.
TOURE: Fantasization (ph). But it's...
O'BRIEN: Is that a word?
TOURE: They're making fun of the retarded. And they'll laugh with you, but they don't really know the joke. And it's just...
O'BRIEN: He totally knows the joke.
TOURE: No, we're laughing at him. We're beating him up.
O'BRIEN: He does.
TOURE: And he's not making any money of this.
O'BRIEN: He got a record deal.
TOURE: For $20,000.
BERNARD: He got a very small record deal.
TOURE: It's nothing.
SIGESMUND: But it doesnt matter. The point is, he's, like, an instant celebrity. And in a time when we are minting new celebrities, you know, with rowdy television, this one literally became an overnight sensation. He was nobody, and then the next day everyone was all, "She bangs, she bangs." The thing that I think is great is he actually has the same publicist as Jennifer Lopez. And that is true. And I don't think he's going away anytime soon.
O'BRIEN: We can go so far with that. We've got to move on.
TOURE: Or you get Benny Medina (ph). He'll be to the moon.
O'BRIEN: He's going to be a superstar. Let's talk weekend movies. Johnny Depp has got a new one, which looks really, really, creepy, called "Secret Window."
SIGESMUND: Yes. This is based on a Stephen King novella. He plays a tortured writer, who one of his readers comes along to stalk him, because he's convinced that he stole one of his story ideas. That guy is played by John Shooter.
O'BRIEN: Did you like it or didn't like it?
SIGESMUND: At "US Weekly," we gave it two and a half stars. We thought it was OK. It has a lot of decent scares and some laughs, too....
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Not exactly...
SIGESMUND: Two and a half stars. What can I tell you?
BERNARD: Two and a half, that's all you can say.
SIGESMUND: I have to say it's not going to do better, "The Passion" and probably "Starsky & Hutch" are still going to be in the top two starts.
O'BRIEN: Not a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) endorsement.
TOURE: One thing, we have, like, the freaky, crazy, writer character. Like, why are the writers weird?
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Hello, it's Stephen King.
(LAUGHTER)
SIGESMUND: If you've seen "Misery"...
O'BRIEN: OK, hi, writers are weird. You all are weird sometimes.
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Please, oh, please, we could talk about this off camera. Writers generally are a very weird bunch.
TOURE: That's not true.
O'BRIEN: And I say that with a lot of love, you guys. You guys, as always, nice to see you, and thank you.
TOURE: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: I say that lovingly, of course, right? Weird in a goody way -- Bill.
HEMMER: Something tells me that conversation is going to continue into the commercial.
In a moment here, one of Martha Stewart's confidantes is describing what it's like to be at her side during the courtroom ordeal. We'll get to that in a moment right after this.
Also, Jack is back on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: It's been about a week since Martha Stewart was convicted of obstruction of justice and lying. Since then, she has met with her probation officer, and she has been daily fodder for late-night TV. Her supporters, though, stand by her. Here's what one long-time colleague told CNN about the Martha Stewart portrayed in the media and the Martha Stewart that she knows.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SALLI LAGRONE, FRIEND OF MARTHA STEWART: The person I know is someone who has been loyal to people. If you look at her company, she has employees who have been with her for many, many years, who have been brought up through the ranks. The person I know is generous. She is very curious. She's very intelligent. She's very inquisitive. She is very dependable. And I don't have to reconcile other people's opinions, because the person I know is my friend.
(END VIDEOTAPE) HEMMER: That from last night with Paula Zahn, "PAULA ZAHN NOW." Stewart's sentencing is scheduled for June 17, and we will speak tomorrow with her stylist, Martha Stewart's stylist, here on AMERICAN MORNING (UNINTELLIGIBLE). You like that, Jack.
CAFFERTY: That's a joke, right?
HEMMER: No, it's true, a friend.
CAFFERTY: We're really going to do that.
HEMMER: It's a friend and it's a colleague and a confidante.
CAFFERTY: Martha Stewart's stylist.
HEMMER: And I think you're going to talk with her.
CAFFERTY: I may take tomorrow off.
Senator John McCain threatening -- I don't believe that, but we'll see. It will probably happen. John McCain threatening congressional action yesterday. Monday, the guy who gives her pedicures will be here live. Senator...
HEMMER: And her manicurist is here on Tuesday.
CAFFERTY: I'm getting myself in trouble here.
HEMMER: Yes, you are.
CAFFERTY: If Major League Baseball and its players union don't crack down on steroid use, Senator John McCain threatened congressional action yesterday. The executive director of the union said he thinks the current rules are sufficient.
In the NFL, a positive test: an immediate four-game suspension. Olympic athletes stripped of their medals. Second time they're kicked clear out of the games and never compete again.
Should there be a zero-tolerance policy in Major League Baseball?
Here's some of what you have written.
Doug in Knoxville, Maryland: "I totally agree with the banning of steroids, not only in baseball, but in all sports. At least the Olympics got it right when they not only banned steroid use. They have stripped from those athletes who have tested positive. Maybe if an athlete tests positive and their multimillion-dollar contract is voided, and all of the monies repaid to the owners, this will stop." Probably do it.
Paul in Hellertown, Pennsylvania: "Perhaps the greatest harm resulting from the sports drug-enhancing problem are the records of the clean athletes that have been eclipsed by the steroid junkies. The former athletes earned and deserve their 15 minutes of fame. The latter are nothing more than win-at-all-costs cheat." Mel here in New York: "The more I see zero-tolerance policies for anything, the closer I come to zero tolerance for zero tolerance. It's another one of those simple, easy-to-understand wrong answers."
And my man, Red, in Ontario, who never fails to disappoint.
HEMMER: Come on, Reg!
CAFFERTY: "Jack, does this mean the governors of California of Minnesota will not be allowed to throw out the traditional first ball in the season?"
I love that.
HEMMER: Senator Biden is on here in a couple minutes. There's an antitrust law that governs baseball, which means they can essentially operate on their own island. Senator McCain and Senator Biden are saying that they'll take action if baseball does not in terms of drug testing, because the union is strong.
O'BRIEN: Yes, but that action?
HEMMER: What can Congress do if you have the antitrust laws that protect the game?
CAFFERTY: I don't know, unless they change the law, and that's what Congress does. They can do that, I suppose.
O'BRIEN: Excellent question for Biden, I believe.
HEMMER: Yes, I believe so, as a matter of fact.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
HEMMER: That answer forthcoming. Thanks, Jack.
CAFFERTY: I want to know what you're going to ask Martha Stewart's stylist.
HEMMER: Me, no it's you. It's you!
CAFFERTY: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) yet?
O'BRIEN: I hope it's me. I want to talk to Martha Stewart's stylist.
HEMMER: You know what? You just won.
O'BRIEN: Will I have to talk about Martha, or can I talk about styling? That will be interesting.
All right, coming up this morning, from humble roots comes a powerful political movement. Now MoveOn.org is facing some harsh criticism from Republicans. We'll take a look at that just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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Aired March 11, 2004 - 07:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: The devastating death toll from a terrorist attack: more than 100 people killed in a series of bombings in Madrid.
John Kerry calls an opponent the most crooked, lying group of people I've ever seen. The GOP demanding an apology.
And...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TODD BERTUZZI, VANCOUVER CANUCKS: I'm not a mean-spirited person, and I'm sorry for what happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: A hockey player apologizes for a blindside punch. Punishment is expected today on this AMERICAN MORNING.
ANNOUNCER: From the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Bill Hemmer and Soledad O'Brien.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, good morning. 7:00 here in New York, and a lot of news to cover this hour.
Also politics. Some Republicans have a problem with TV ads that attack the White House. It's not what they say but how they're being funded.
We'll talk to the man in a moment behind those ads. Former Bill Clinton aide Harold Ickes is our guest here on AMERICAN MORNING.
O'BRIEN: Also this morning, Michael Jackson's prosecutor has called for a grand jury.
He won't say what it's all about, but some analysts think it could be a closed-door dress rehearsal for a trial.
Jeff Toobin is going to join us and help explain that.
HEMMER: Also Jack Cafferty -- good morning to you.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: How are you doing? Opening day of the baseball season just a couple of weeks away now, but instead of looking forward to the first pitch and the crack of the bat, the sport is mired in a controversy about steroids.
We'll take a look.
HEMMER: Jack, thanks.
We're going to get straight away to Madrid, the height of the morning rush hour in the Spanish capitol -- a series of explosions ripping through three separate trains.
Late word reported from Madrid leaves it unclear who's responsible.
No claim of responsibility publicly. There are suspects, however, including the Basque separatist group, ETA. The Basque people live in the mountainous region in northern Spain along the border with France.
Regional ties are strong in the area, and many Basques support a separate Basque homeland apart from the Spanish federal government.
ETA, which is on the U.S. State Department's list of terrorist organizations, is blamed for some 800 deaths since it first began its fight for independence.
Our Madrid bureau chief Al Goodman is on the scene getting more information, in fact, at this time. Much more from Madrid in a few moments.
But just to recap -- let you know what we know right now -- at least 131 are dead. More than 400 others are wounded near simultaneous explosions hitting three separate trains right during the morning rush hour, 8 a.m. local time in Madrid.
All this coming now ahead of Sunday's general election in Spain, and, again just to reiterate -- no claim of responsibility yet from Madrid.
We will not leave this story long; it is an absolute tragedy this morning in Madrid.
We'll get you the latest as soon as we get it here.
O'BRIEN: Pictures of the devastation are just terrible. We'll continue to update that of course this morning.
Other headlines making news this morning, President Bush will attend the groundbreaking today for a 9/11 memorial in East Meadow, New York.
The Long Island memorial will feature two aluminum towers rising 30 feet above a reflecting pool
Some families of 9/11 victims say they will protest the president's visit in light of the controversy over his campaign reelection ads. We've got more on this story coming up in a little bit. A roadside bombing has killed another U.S. soldier in Iraq.
The soldier died last night from wounds suffered after the attack in west Ba'qubah some 30 miles north of Baghdad.
Two other soldiers were wounded in that same attack.
Teen sniper Lee Boyd Malvo has been sentenced to life in prison without parole. The judge yesterday upheld the punishment a jury had recommended back in December.
Malvo, now 19 years old, was convicted of capital murder in the shooting death of FBI analyst Linda Franklin. She was one of ten people killed during the October 2002 sniper attacks.
In Washington, the House has easily passed the so-called "cheeseburger bill." The bill protects restaurants and the food industry from obesity lawsuits.
The vote was 276 to 139 on the measure. Supporters said people need to take responsibility for what they eat.
Some Democrats argued that the bill was not needed because most obesity claims have actually been dismissed in the courts.
(WEATHER REPORT)
O'BRIEN: President Bush's campaign organization is demanding an apology for a remark by Senator John Kerry yesterday after addressing labor leaders by satellite from Chicago.
Senator Kerry turned to supporters standing behind him and then said this:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: These guys are -- these guys are the most crooked -- you know -- lying group of people I've ever seen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: The Bush campaign says the statement is unbecoming of a presidential candidate. No apology has been issued.
Senator Kerry will meet today with Congressional Democrats; also have a private meeting with a formal rival, Senator John Edwards, and his major donors as well.
As the campaign heats up so does the political feud between Republicans and Democrats. The president's reelection campaign has filed a complaint about a series of anti-Bush ads launched by the pro- Kerry group, Media Fund.
Republicans claim that the ad, paid for by Democratic supporters skirt campaign spending laws. Former Clinton White House adviser Harold Ickes heads up the Media Fund. He joins us this morning.
Nice to see you. Thanks for joining us.
HAROLD ICKES, DIRECTOR, THE MEDIA FUND: Good to be here.
O'BRIEN: I want to read you a little bit of what Ben Ginsburg, who is with the Bush-Cheney campaign had to say.
In fact we'll play a short clip of what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BEN GINSBURG, BUSH-CHENEY LEGAL COUNSEL: It's an attempt to illegally hijack a federal election by using illegal soft money from Democrat's special interest groups, to defeat a specific federal candidate. That's a violation of federal law.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Is the intention of the Media Fund to circumvent the law?
ICKES: It is not. We are operating well within the bounds of the law. Ben Ginsburg is merely a mouthpiece.
O'BRIEN: I want to read to you a little bit of what the law specifically has to say.
It says the special interest groups raise unlimited soft money, which they use for voter mobilization and certain types of issue advocacy, but not for efforts that expressly advocate the election or defeat of a federal candidate.
That being said, let's watch one of the ads.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AD ANNOUNCER: President Bush. Remember the American dream? It's about hope, not fear. It's about more jobs at home, not tax breaks for shipping jobs overseas.
It's about giving our children their chance, not our debt. It's about providing health care for people, not just profits.
It's about fighting for the middle class, not special interests.
George Bush's priorities are eroding the American dream.
It's time to take our country back from corporate greed and make America work for every American.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: You don't think this ad is expressly calling for the defeat of George Bush?
ICKES: It is not. It is not saying vote for Bush; vote for against Bush; vote for Kerry. It is saying -- talking about the policies of the Bush administration and how they've eroded the position of the American middle class.
O'BRIEN: The men who wrote the law -- John McCain -- said you're obviously trying to skirt the law.
In fact, the way he put it was "duh." And here's what he had to say about what the Media Fund and others like it are doing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: It's plain as the nose on your face that these 527s are organized and are engaging in partisan political activity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: You could argue he knows better than anybody else what exactly the intention of this law would be. Why do you think he's wrong?
ICKES: He has not said specifically that this is illegal. He may use the word skirt, but the Congress had the full chance to debate this; we were doing this prior to the law, the enactment of a new law.
They made no change in Congress with respect to the activities we're doing.
And we're committed to do it now. It's very clear that the Congress made no change in this area of the law.
O'BRIEN: He may not have said its illegal, but he did say if the FEC does not reign you in, he intends to take it to court. You don't think that's essentially the equivalent of it's illegal?
ICKES: We don't think the courts have the power. It's the Congress that enacted the statute, they made no change from the prior way we could use it.
O'BRIEN: No secret, of course, that a former Kerry campaign manager is a consultant to your organization, the Media Fund.
So are you working at any capacity at all? For the Kerry campaign?
ICKES: No, we are forbidden from having conversations with the Kerry campaign. We do not coordinate with the Kerry campaign; it's forbidden by law and we don't do it.
O'BRIEN: What are the chances do you think that you're going to be successful?
Of course obviously, as you well know, all of this is being challenged.
ICKES: We think that there's no basis at all to the FEC, the federal elections commission, to restrict what we're doing and if they do we will go into court and challenge it on the grounds that they have no basis in law for making any changes.
O'BRIEN: Looks like it might be heading to court. Harold Ickes joining us this morning, nice to see you.
Thanks for being with us.
ICKES: Good to see you. Thank you.
O'BRIEN: California Congressman David Dryer is going to join us at 9 a.m. Eastern Time with the Bush campaign's response to the Media Fund's ad, we should note -- Bill.
HEMMER: Soledad, President Bush meanwhile defending his economic policy while calling the Democratic mindset tired and defeatist.
Yesterday in Ohio, a battleground state that's lost 160,000 manufacturing jobs during his term, John King reporting today the president was working to give Americans some economic optimism.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Thermagon is a Cleveland high tech company that exports 60 percent of its products. This presidential visit designed to make the point trade is part of the solution for a struggling jobs market, not the problem.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Listen, the best product on any shelf anywhere in the world says "Made In The USA."
KING: The president didn't name names, but suggests critics who blame him for manufacturing jobs lost to cheap overseas labor markets would do the economy a lot more harm than good.
BUSH: That old policy of tax and spend is the enemy of job creation. The old policy of economic isolationism is a recipes for economic disaster.
KING: Mr. Bush's success in making his case could determine whether he has a job come January.
Eighty-five percent of Americans in a new CNN poll say keeping American jobs from going overseas will be important in their choice for president.
Democrat John Kerry supported the North American Free Trade Agreement and a similar pact with China and in appealing for union support, Senator Kerry now promises if elected to review all major trade deals.
KERRY: George Bush thinks exporting our jobs is good economic policy. I believe that creating jobs here in America, keeping good jobs here and exporting goods is good for our economy.
KING (on camera): Five months after the president promised to name a new administration manufacturing czar, officials say the post will go to a Nebraska businessman who is an outspoken advocate of free trade.
Senator Kerry calls it too little, too late and says one new government bureaucrat can't make up for the loss of 2.5 million manufacturing jobs.
John King, CNN, the White House.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: Also, one more note, the president talks about the economy again today in an event on New York's Long Island. We'll cover that for you a bit later -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: About two hours from now the National Hockey League is expected to meet out its punishment to Todd Bertuzzi of the Vancouver Canucks.
Bertuzzi attacked Colorado's Steve Moore on Monday night, leaving Moore with a broken neck, a concussion and some facial cuts.
Well last night a very remorseful Bertuzzi publicly apologized to Moore, who remains in a Vancouver hospital. Bertuzzi says he feels awful about what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BERTUZZI: Fans of hockey and the fans of Vancouver, for the kids that watch this game, I'm truly sorry. I don't play that -- I don't play the game that way and I'm not a mean-spirited person.
I'm sorry for what happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Vancouver police are looking into the attack.
At the bottom of the hour we're going to talk to an attorney who represented another NHL player who was prosecuted for an on-ice attack.
HEMMER: Some interesting comments, too.
Bertuzzi one of the best players in the League this year. Interesting to see if the NHL takes much action on this. That attorney doesn't think so, so we'll get his thoughts in a moment.
In a moment here are prosecutors in the Michael Jackson trying to avoid a public hearing by taking their case to a grand jury. We'll get to that with Jeff Toobin in a moment.
O'BRIEN: Also this morning the same sex marriage debate. Massachusetts, the state that started it all prepares for another round.
HEMMER: Also a Web site drawing fire from undercover police officers showing their pictures and their names, even their home address. That's ahead here on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: Updating the figures from this tragic story out of Madrid, Spain a story breaking several hours ago.
The new numbers now, 173 are said to be dead. This from our affiliate there. Also getting word from the interior minister at least 600 are injured.
We've got a live crew on the scene we'll get to them live at the bottom of the hour so stay tuned for more out of Madrid this morning a significant story that will be a big part of our coverage for the next three hours time.
In the meantime though back in this country the D.A. in Santa Barbara, California is said to be convening a grand jury in Michael Jackson's child molestation case.
A closed-door proceeding would allow prosecutors to present their evidence in secret thus avoiding a very public preliminary hearing.
What does this all mean, though? Our legal analyst is here with us, Jeff Toobin. Good morning to you.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Hi.
HEMMER: New strategy, different strategy, what?
TOOBIN: There are two ways that prosecutors in California can bring a case forward after someone has been arrested.
One is a preliminary hearing, which a lot of people have seen. There was one in the Blake hearing -- Blake case not too long ago, which is like a mini-trial, it takes place in public, there's no jury.
Hearsay evidence is admissible but it is a public proceeding or prosecutors can use a grand jury, which is entirely secret. They control entirely what questions are asked, who appears and that's only disclosed after the charges have been brought by the Grand Jury.
What they have decided to do is forego the preliminary hearing which is the usual route in felony cases in California and use a secret grand jury.
HEMMER: So if you're a DA or a prosecutor what is your strategy to help benefit your case if you want to keep it private?
TOOBIN: Well, first of all you avoid a circus, you don't have the enormous attention that a preliminary hearing in the Michael Jackson case. We've seen that in this case beyond what even the wildest imaginings. The other thing and I think it's very important here is in a grand jury you can use it to investigate are there more victims out there; are there people who could corroborate the story. Grand jury is an investigative tool as well.
In this case, at least based on my observation of it so far, really needs more investigation, really needs more -- needs some help. And a grand jury is a way to do that much more than a preliminary hearing.
HEMMER: You say this case is not so strong?
TOOBIN: Absolutely not.
HEMMER: Why not?
TOOBIN: Because this is basically a one-witness case involving a sick, unfortunately -- a kid with cancer -- who you know will have his credibility attacked. That is it appears like it's the whole case.
Remember the district attorney said we want to see if other victims come forward. No victims have come forward as far as anyone is aware.
The grand jury allows them to try to build other parts into this case in a way that a preliminary hearing wouldn't.
HEMMER: Legal 101, do both sides get to see how the boy will now be as a witness if you go to the grand jury?
TOOBIN: If he testifies in the grand jury, that will be in secret. If he then later testifies at the trial, as he certainly would if this case proceeds, they will -- the prosecutors -- the defense -- would get to see the transcript of his appearance but they would never actually see him on the witness stand in the grand jury.
HEMMER: Jeff, thanks.
Jeffrey Toobin, talk to you a bit later this morning on another topic. Here's Soledad.
O'BRIEN: This afternoon, Massachusetts's lawmakers will once again debate an amendment to ban same-sex marriages. The state Supreme Court has ruled that same-sex marriages must be allowed there by May.
Last night, opponents of the amendment rallied around the state capital building. Many say a law that would ban same-sex marriages still is discriminatory even if it allows civil unions.
In February, Massachusetts's lawmakers failed in three tries to pass a ban on same-sex marriages. The state's house speaker and senate president predicts success this time around
Still to come this morning, the end of a public battle between a satellite company and the home of MTV and Sponge Bob Square Pants. But will millions of viewers forgive and forget? We'll look at that ahead as AMERICAN MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: All right after yesterday's tumble on Wall Street what can we expect today? Boy the numbers were down yesterday.
Plus the latest dish on the spat involving the Dish Network and to dish that Andy Serwer is back his "Minding Your Business."
Good morning.
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Good morning.
HEMMER: Triple digit loss for the Dow 30.
SERWER: Yes, biggest point decline since last May, Bill.
Really kind of a dismal picture on Wall Street yesterday. There's no other way to put it.
Let's take a look at the numbers. Down about 1.5 percent on both the Dow and the Nasdaq.
The immediate catalyst yesterday, Bill, the $43 billion trade deficit in January -- we mentioned that briefly yesterday.
The real surprise there is that U.S. goods aren't being sold in Europe as they -- as we anticipated. The weaker dollar is supposed to give that a boost. That's not happening and people on Wall Street are very concerned here.
Let's take a look at where we are for the year. Oh, we don't have that screen; I'm sorry about that.
Anyway year to date we're down about 1.5 percent; we're in the red for all the indexes. People are starting to use the C-word, that's correction.
And the real consensus on Wall Street is that the growth, the acceleration is over that we're not moving ahead. They're not prepared to say yet that we're moving backwards but we seem to be stalled a little bit here.
HEMMER: Going on 2000 (ph) for the Nasdaq we're still under that about 1964 (ph), I believe. Today better news or not? Rebound?
SERWER: No, not at all. In fact futures are sharply lower this morning so looks like we're going to have a lower overhead.
HEMMER: What's the dish on Echo Star?
SERWER: Well you know we have this dispute between Echo Star and Viacom where they took up all the CBS programming and that 16 cities, 1.6 million Americans weren't getting their MTV, but it's back this morning.
And you know they caved, they capitulated, why? "CSI," "Survivor" on tonight and we don't want our people missing that and then also even more importantly next week "March Madness" on CBS.
HEMMER: You are so right.
SERWER: Tip them away.
HEMMER: Get your bracket filled out today. It's a holiday.
SERWER: No you canceled Sunday.
HEMMER: That's right.
(CROSSTALK)
SERWER: You're welcome.
O'BRIEN: And we're going get -- do a little thing on that, right?
SERWER: I hope we are. We're going to get Jack in on it.
HEMMER: What's that?
CAFFERTY: If you wish.
SERWER: OK, good.
O'BRIEN: Are you in charge?
SERWER: I'm in charge, I'll do it. Yes.
O'BRIEN: Let us know.
SERWER: OK.
O'BRIEN: In fact, it is time for "The Cafferty Files," the question of the day. Hello.
CAFFERTY: How are you doing? America's favorite pastime, opening day a couple of weeks away.
There was a problem. Senator John McCain yesterday threatened Congressional action if Major League baseball and its players union don't crack down on steroid use.
The executive director of the union, Donald Fehr said he thinks current testing is sufficient and the union has long said that testing invades the privacy of players. So what?
In 2003, five to seven percent of professional baseball players tested positive for steroids. The League said the players who test positive this year could -- not will -- could face suspensions and fines. Senator McCain compared professional baseball to the NFL, where a positive test result means an immediate four-game suspension, or Olympic athletes who are suspended for one year after their first offense, permanently banned after their second offense.
So the question is, should there be a zero tolerance policy for steroids in baseball?
Reggie Jackson, a great homerun hitter and -- for the Yankees and Oakland as in the paper this morning saying, quote here, "Somebody definitely is guilty of taking steroids. You can't be breaking records hitting 200 homeruns in three or four seasons. Hank Aaron never hit 50 in a season so you're going to tell me that you're a grater hitter than Henry Aaron? Barry Bonds hit 73 homeruns in 2001. He would have hit 100 if they would have pitched to him. I mean, come on now." Unquote.
That's Reggie Jackson talking about steroids in baseball. So write to us and let us know what you think.
HEMMER: That's a great topic.
SERWER: Did you see the cover of "Sports Illustrated" this week? Are we in the Asterisk Era as far as baseball goes, meaning are all the records really subject to question.
Jeff Greenfield wrote a piece in that issue of "Sports Illustrated" you should check it out.
HEMMER: Oh, yes? You know it was just a week ago baseball came out and said the preseason ticket sales are better this year for this season they have been in years.
CAFFERTY: See that's the problem, though.
HEMMER: It makes you wonder if the guy's hitting 73 homeruns people will go to the ballpark to see him.
(CROSSTALK)
HEMMER: Give us good baseball or do we care whether or not it's natural.
SERWER: It's juiced.
O'BRIEN: And also don't they all basically say well if somebody else is using steroids you have to as well because how do you possibly compete?
HEMMER: Joe Biden was on the Hill yesterday and he's going to join us next hour too so we'll get his thoughts on this. Great headline today in "The Washington Post" -- Fear and Loathing on Capitol Hill.
Did you see that? CAFFERTY: Or there's one in the New York paper -- Fear Strikes Out. A really great biography of the Boston Red Sox players. I think it was, wasn't it?
HEMMER: Yes, we'll get to that as we continue. Also back to Spain in a moment and in a moment political intrigue, kid spies at the movies this weekend.
"90-Second Pop" is back on a Thursday morning right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: All right good morning again, 7:30 here in New York.
Breaking news out of Madrid, Spain. We will not leave that story for long. We'll get you back there live in a moment.
Also a question today in sports, how hard will the NHL come down on Todd Bertuzzi for that brutal hit earlier in the week that broke an opponent's neck?
In a moment we'll talk with the lawyer who defended Marty McSorley four years ago. McSorley was punished by the League, convicted of assault for a vicious on-ice incident.
In that case, he used his stick. We'll see what the comparisons are if there are any for this case.
O'BRIEN: What kind of punishment did McSorley get?
HEMMER: Well, he was at the end of his career and they suspended him for the rest of the year and he never came back to the ice so he just went into retirement.
O'BRIEN: Career-ending for him. Interesting.
Also this morning, we're going to find out about the pressure on John Kerry to apologize for some strong remarks that he made on the campaign trail; we'll explain what they were and who's taking umbrage at them this morning but first our top story this morning.
We begin in Spain where more than 170 people dead after a massive attack on Madrid's commuter train system. Three separate trains were hit in near back-to-back explosions. Nearly 600 others were injured in those blasts. Spanish officials are now blaming the Basque separatist group ETA. No one has claimed responsibility for the attacks. We've got much more on this, of course, throughout the morning, and we will update you on developments there.
Five detainees freed from Guantanamo Bay prison in Cuba have now also been released from British custody. The British detainees left the U.S. naval base on Tuesday, were flown to London. One of the men was released immediately. The remaining four were questioned and then released by British police without being charged. Four others British detainees are still being held at Gitmo. Singer Diana Ross is being ordered back to jail. An Arizona judge said she failed to complete a two-day jail sentence in Connecticut by one hour. Now he wants Ross to serve jail time in Tucson. Ross was arrested in December 2002 on DUI charges.
And a Michigan man is lucky to be alive today after a car slammed through the front of his house. The man walked away with minor injuries after the car came within just three feet of the couch where he was sleeping. The driver was thrown from the car, seriously hurt. Police believe that alcohol might have been a factor in that crash. The pictures...
HEMMER: That's a heck of a wake-up call, huh?
O'BRIEN: Yes, and look around, there's the car like this from you.
HEMMER: That's right. Good morning.
(WEATHER BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Senator John Kerry will seek support on Capitol Hill today in meetings with House and Senate Democrats. He's also going to meet with another of his former rivals, Senator John Edwards, as well a large group of Edwards' donors.
Senator Kerry met with Howard Dean in Washington yesterday. He also continued to attack President Bush's policy -- policies, rather, as well as Republican political moves.
National correspondent Bob Franken in Washington, D.C. for us with some details on all of that this morning.
Hey, Bob, good morning.
BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad.
And the meeting with House members will be held in private down the hall there, here at the Library of Congress in the Thomas Jefferson room, which is for members.
Now, an awful lot of controversy swirling around right now. The chairman of the Republican Elect Bush Campaign, Mark Racicot, is calling on Senator Kerry to apologize for a negative attack that he made yesterday, according to Racicot, comments that Racicot characterizes as unbecoming of a candidate for the presidency of the United States of America.
And Kerry certainly set a tone yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FRANKEN (voice-over): John Kerry is clearly not pulling any punches about what his aids call the Bush campaign's deceit.
KERRY: These guys are the most crooked, you know, lying group that I've ever seen.
FRANKEN: This is just the most recent Kerry attack this month on foreign policy.
KERRY: I think George Bush has run the most arrogant, inept, reckless and ideological foreign policy in the modern history of our country.
FRANKEN: On the famous photo-op.
KERRY: That George Bush thought he could just play dress-up on an aircraft carrier.
FRANKEN: On the president's plan for a Mars mission.
KERRY: Send Bush to Mars. There's another idea.
FRANKEN: On the issues, particularly the economy, Kerry believes he has the president on the defensive.
KERRY: Ladies and gentlemen, it's got to be getting lonely for George Bush. It seems he's the last person left in America who actually believes his failed policies will ever work.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FRANKEN: Kerry is having these meeting with his fellow Democrats, including Edwards, this afternoon, Senator John Edwards, in an effort to coordinate the Democratic message -- or, as his critics are saying, the Democratic assault -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: Are there any expectations -- realistic expectations that Senator Kerry will even consider apologizing for those comments? He made it clear that -- or his campaign made it clear that he was not speaking about the president.
FRANKEN: Well, let's just probably put it this way, Soledad: Don't hold your breath.
O'BRIEN: We do say that a lot, don't we? That's how we end almost every one of our interviews: Don't hold your breath. Bob Franken for us this morning. Bob, thanks.
HEMMER: We want to get you back to Spain quickly now, and on the scene with us, our Madrid bureau chief, Al Goodman, who has been responding there for several hours now.
The numbers, as we have them, according to officials there in Madrid: 173 are dead, 592 are wounded.
Three separate attacks on three separate trains at the morning rush hour, 8:00 a.m. local time in Madrid, Spain. There has been no claim of responsibility at this point.
Al Goodman, let's try and bring you in now, live from the scene there in Madrid. What's the latest from the Spanish authorities that you are gathering? Hello.
Al Goodman, Bell Hemmer, CNN New York, if you can hear me, I would really like to bring you in now and get the very latest what you're gathering from the scene. We have watched these pictures now for several hours. One member of the Spanish government already saying it's an absolute massacre.
Al, try, again. What do you have for us?
AL GOODMAN, CNN MADRID BUREAU CHIEF: The just did live shots. One, two, three...
HEMMER: All right, our apologies to our viewers at home. As you can tell, there is still chaos around that scene, as we continue to monitor it. Again, 173 dead, almost 600 wounded, and we caution you, those numbers could change as the story progresses throughout the morning here.
O'BRIEN: And, of course, the timing of the attacks are interesting as well. It's coming ahead of the elections on Sunday, and many people think that that was not a coincidence; that the timing was planned.
HEMMER: Yes. And as soon as we get Al up and working there -- we apologize again to our viewers -- we'll get you back there.
In the meantime, though, there is a significant story in the world of sports today. Fighting separates hockey from other professional sports, and even those who claim it's a necessary evil admit that Todd Bertuzzi's attack on an opposing player was out of bounds.
The National Hockey League is expected to rule today on punishment, and higher authorities are deciding whether or not there was a crime committed on the ice earlier in the week.
Kimberly Osias now has more in Vancouver.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It was a full-on ambush, a round house punch to the head from behind in Monday night's game. Today, the 6 foot 3, 245-pound Todd Bertuzzi will find out how he'll be sanctioned by the NHL for jumping rookie Avalanche forward Steve Moore, forcing him face first into the ice.
Last night, he apologized to hockey fans, his teammates and especially the player he injured.
TODD BERTUZZI, VANCOUVER CANUCKS FORWARD: Steve, I just want to apologize for what happened out there, that I had no intention on hurting you. And that I feel awful for what transpired.
OSIAS: Moore is in a Vancouver hospital with a broken neck, cuts on his face and a concussion. He'll miss the rest of the season.
MELODY ESCALLIER, CANADIAN RESIDENT: I was absolutely disgusted. I thought it was no better than a mugging, actually.
OSIAS: Bertuzzi's career is on hold while the NHL debates his future. Vancouver police are investigating. The All-Star forward could face criminal charges.
This is the second time in four years a violent involving the NHL has become a criminal matter. Flashback February 2000: Boston Bruins tough guy Marty McSorley struck former Canuck player Donald Brashear with his stick. McSorley was convicted in Canada of assault with a weapon, but served no jail time. The league suspended him for a year, and he never returned.
WAYNE BROWN, HOCKEY FAN: It's put a bad eye on hockey right now. People don't want to see this kind of stuff. Fighting is a part of what hockey is, and I don't think they'll ever get rid of that.
OSIAS (on camera): Today, we'll see if NHL officials will give it their best shot.
Kimberly Osias, CNN, Vancouver, Canada.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: Attorney Paul Kelly represented Marty McSorley when the former Boston Bruin player was convicted of assault. That was four years ago. Paul Kelly is our guest today, live in Boston.
Nice to have you, and good morning to you.
PAUL KELLY, ATTORNEY FOR MARTY MCSORLEY: Good morning, Bill.
You believe what we're talking about, Bertuzzi, is actually worse than what happened with your client. Why do you believe that.
KELLY: Well, there's an element of premeditation in the current event involving Bertuzzi that didn't exist in the McSorley case. The McSorley incident evolved out of the emotion, the adrenaline of that particular game. The facts here in the Bertuzzi case suggest that this was a deliberate act, which followed an incident which had occurred with another player a few days before. I think that's a major factor which separates the two.
HEMMER: Can Bertuzzi be charged in this?
KELLY: He can, and he probably will. Again, I don't believe that professional athletes should be charged criminally for much of what goes on, on the playing surface, whether it be on the ice or the baseball diamond or the football field.
But in Vancouver, the police authorities and the prosecutors, having already having charged Marty McSorley for the act that took place in February of 2000, my sense is for that consistency's sake they really have no choice but to charge Mr. Bertuzzi. The difference being, of course, McSorley was the opposing player who came into Vancouver having played for the Boston Burins, Bertuzzi is not only a home team player, but one of their very best, All-Star for the Vancouver Canucks.
HEMMER: Let me be clear on this, Mr. Kelly. I believe you told our producers last night this is a tough call for the NHL with Bertuzzi. Why do you believe that?
KELLY: It's a tough call. And McSorley was a 17-year veteran at the end of his career, playing on a non-playoff team, not even a regular player. It was very easy for them to take very harsh action against McSorley.
Bertuzzi is playing on a top team. He is one of the finest players, a top scorer, an All-Star this past year, last year. His is a very good team with him; not such a great team without him. There is a financial aspect to this issue. I mean, do they want to bounce Todd Bertuzzi for a year, or for the remainder of the season and the playoffs? And what kind of an impact does that have on the league, the team?
HEMMER: That is a heck of a suggestion there that you're saying. The NHL would put the game over the possibility of assault on the ice. Is that what you're saying?
KELLY: Well, the -- no, I think they have to strike a balance. Clearly, the NHL wants to send a strong message of deterrence to other players that this type of behavior, premeditated attacks on a defenseless player who you outweigh by 50 pounds, causing a serious injury -- broken neck, concussion -- has to be prohibited.
On the other hand, they do not want -- I mean, if you look back over the past few years, the NHL has treated its star players more leniently than they have treated the tough guys, the enforcers, the Marty McSorleys of the league. That will be a factor. They won't express that that's a factor, but it will be a factor in the decision that they make.
HEMMER: Thanks for talking. Paul Kelly, the former attorney for Marty McSorley, in Boston, Massachusetts. We should get that announcement from the NHL in about less than two hours, about 9:00 a.m. Eastern time.
O'BRIEN: It will be interesting to see if what he is predicting -- that it does play a role, sort of how popular and how important he is to his team -- is going to be whether or not...
HEMMER: That's right. And this is (UNINTELLIGIBLE) that a lot of people do not know.
O'BRIEN: Yes, it sure does.
Still to come this morning on AMERICAN MORNING, from hockey to baseball, Washington lawmakers tell Major League Baseball, crack down on steroid use yourselves or were going to force you to do it. We're going to speak with one senator who is leading that charge.
HEMMER: Also, nearly a year after Elizabeth Smart's return home, her parents will join us live to talk about how their daughter is doing today.
O'BRIEN: And, life can still be sweet, even after an "American Idol" defeat.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (singing): For every girl in history, she moves.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: Oh, that's ugly, isn't it? For this contestant, believe it or not, his ship has come in. We'll explain ahead as AMERICAN MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: I can hear it. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) but thank you. I'll take that.
Welcome to a mad, crazy edition of "90-Second Pop." We're starting down so low, aren't we?
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Today -- hello.
Today, we're talking about Johnny Depp. He goes to the big screen. Also, a reject gets a record deal. And who is nearly Martha?
Here to discuss this morning, Toure, a contributing editor for "Rolling Stone."
Nice to see you. Good morning.
TOURE, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, "ROLLING STONE": Nice to see you.
O'BRIEN: Also, "New York" magazine contributing editor, Sarah Bernard.
Nice to see you as well, Sarah.
SARAH BERNARD, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, "NEW YORK": Hello.
O'BRIEN: And B.J. Sigesmund, staff editor for "US Weekly."
Good morning.
B.J. SIGUSMUND, STAFF EDITOR, "US WEEKLY": Hello.
O'BRIEN: Let's get right to it. Should we start with the Martha wannabes?
TOURE: Yes.
SIGESMUND: Yes. O'BRIEN: Wow! What a cutthroat bunch.
BERNARD: Competition is very stiff.
O'BRIEN: The woman has not even been sentenced yet. That doesn't happen until June. And already, there's a handful...
TOURE: They want in.
O'BRIEN: ... a half-a-dozen...
BERNARD: There's a lot of people that would be really good at it. I have to recommend Nigella Lawson (ph), who is the sexy food queen of London.
O'BRIEN: I love watching her cook.
(CROSSTALK)
BERNARD: And she has an amazing show on the Style Network.
TOURE: She just has it, right? I just want to watch her.
O'BRIEN: Yes, she does.
BERNARD: She makes you want to cook or something like that.
TOURE: She just makes it seem easy.
SIGESMUND: Yes, although I still don't cook.
O'BRIEN: You just watch, right.
BERNARD: But with Martha, you didn't necessarily cook either. You just liked to think that you could, and that was her gift really. She made you think that you could do all these things. I think the real question is: Why do people think that they can replace her? I think what she did, even though you might not have liked her business choices, was really special. And I don't think any of these women can actually take over what she did.
O'BRIEN: Who besides Nigella Lawson (ph)?
BERNARD: Katie Brown (ph), who has a show on the H&G Network.
O'BRIEN: Bee Smith (ph)?
BERNARD: Bee Smith (ph) also is very -- her restaurants and her product line, she's already very established. And you actually had a good idea.
SIGESMUND: Well, there is Chris...
BERNARD: Oh.
SIGESMUND: Sorry, I was going to say Chris Madden (ph) also. She has written, like, 16 books on home furnishings, and she already has a deal, a Martha-like deal at J.C. Penney, where they're going to have furniture and bath towels designed by her, plus she's moving into television this fall.
O'BRIEN: I just don't know that any of these names can take over Martha.
BERNARD: I don't think they really can. And I think -- and I don't know that Martha is really going to go away. I think...
O'BRIEN: Besides to prison for a little bit.
BERNARD: Right. Well, that's...
TOURE: Well, you know, but Martha is known for making these comebacks, right? Her whole career begins when she catches her husband cheating, which is probably the lowest moment of her life until now. And she says, OK, I'm going to get it together and start this catering business and...
SIGESMUND: Right.
TOURE: ... she creates this empire.
SIGESMUND: Plus, I don't...
TOURE: So, she could come back.
BERNARD: She's a survivor.
TOURE: Yes.
SIGESMUND: And I don't think it looks bad to have Martha Stewart towels in your home just because she possibly made a mistake.
O'BRIEN: It is the best magazine ever.
TOURE: It's the same magazine.
O'BRIEN: "Martha Stewart Living" is a fantastic...
TOURE: It's the same towels. It's...
O'BRIEN: Behind bars or not.
TOURE: Right.
BERNARD: She might lose in advertising for a while, but after a while they might come back.
O'BRIEN: Right.
BERNARD: And the shoppers will continue.
O'BRIEN: Well, what confidence for Martha. I hope she's watching this. TOURE: Go, Martha!
O'BRIEN: We're sending a shout out to Martha.
BERNARD: Yes.
O'BRIEN: All right, explain this to me. Remember this guy...
TOURE: Oh!
O'BRIEN: ... who got dinged from "American Idol?"
BERNARD: Oh!
TOURE: Yes.
O'BRIEN: Let's listen to a little bit of William Hung.
TOURE: Can we cover our ears?
O'BRIEN: You may. Actually, yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM HUNG, "AMERICAN IDOL" CONTESTANT (singing): Oh, baby. She moves. She moves. I go crazy because she looks like...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
O'BRIEN: You know what I love about Paula Abdul? Like, she's such a lady. She is just, like, hmmm!
(LAUGHTER)
O'BRIEN: Simon is just being completely unpleasant, and Paula is, like, hmmm, how do I break it to him he's not going to be a star?
SIGESMUND: Right.
O'BRIEN: It turns out he is going to be a star.
TOURE: But, you know, I mean, this is the whole beginning of "American Idol." The first start of the show is the fantasizatoin (ph) of somebody who is terrible.
O'BRIEN: Fantasization (ph), what did you say?
SIGESMUND: That was nice.
TOURE: Fantasization (ph). But it's...
O'BRIEN: Is that a word?
TOURE: They're making fun of the retarded. And they'll laugh with you, but they don't really know the joke. And it's just...
O'BRIEN: He totally knows the joke.
TOURE: No, we're laughing at him. We're beating him up.
O'BRIEN: He does.
TOURE: And he's not making any money of this.
O'BRIEN: He got a record deal.
TOURE: For $20,000.
BERNARD: He got a very small record deal.
TOURE: It's nothing.
SIGESMUND: But it doesnt matter. The point is, he's, like, an instant celebrity. And in a time when we are minting new celebrities, you know, with rowdy television, this one literally became an overnight sensation. He was nobody, and then the next day everyone was all, "She bangs, she bangs." The thing that I think is great is he actually has the same publicist as Jennifer Lopez. And that is true. And I don't think he's going away anytime soon.
O'BRIEN: We can go so far with that. We've got to move on.
TOURE: Or you get Benny Medina (ph). He'll be to the moon.
O'BRIEN: He's going to be a superstar. Let's talk weekend movies. Johnny Depp has got a new one, which looks really, really, creepy, called "Secret Window."
SIGESMUND: Yes. This is based on a Stephen King novella. He plays a tortured writer, who one of his readers comes along to stalk him, because he's convinced that he stole one of his story ideas. That guy is played by John Shooter.
O'BRIEN: Did you like it or didn't like it?
SIGESMUND: At "US Weekly," we gave it two and a half stars. We thought it was OK. It has a lot of decent scares and some laughs, too....
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Not exactly...
SIGESMUND: Two and a half stars. What can I tell you?
BERNARD: Two and a half, that's all you can say.
SIGESMUND: I have to say it's not going to do better, "The Passion" and probably "Starsky & Hutch" are still going to be in the top two starts.
O'BRIEN: Not a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) endorsement.
TOURE: One thing, we have, like, the freaky, crazy, writer character. Like, why are the writers weird?
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Hello, it's Stephen King.
(LAUGHTER)
SIGESMUND: If you've seen "Misery"...
O'BRIEN: OK, hi, writers are weird. You all are weird sometimes.
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Please, oh, please, we could talk about this off camera. Writers generally are a very weird bunch.
TOURE: That's not true.
O'BRIEN: And I say that with a lot of love, you guys. You guys, as always, nice to see you, and thank you.
TOURE: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: I say that lovingly, of course, right? Weird in a goody way -- Bill.
HEMMER: Something tells me that conversation is going to continue into the commercial.
In a moment here, one of Martha Stewart's confidantes is describing what it's like to be at her side during the courtroom ordeal. We'll get to that in a moment right after this.
Also, Jack is back on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HEMMER: It's been about a week since Martha Stewart was convicted of obstruction of justice and lying. Since then, she has met with her probation officer, and she has been daily fodder for late-night TV. Her supporters, though, stand by her. Here's what one long-time colleague told CNN about the Martha Stewart portrayed in the media and the Martha Stewart that she knows.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SALLI LAGRONE, FRIEND OF MARTHA STEWART: The person I know is someone who has been loyal to people. If you look at her company, she has employees who have been with her for many, many years, who have been brought up through the ranks. The person I know is generous. She is very curious. She's very intelligent. She's very inquisitive. She is very dependable. And I don't have to reconcile other people's opinions, because the person I know is my friend.
(END VIDEOTAPE) HEMMER: That from last night with Paula Zahn, "PAULA ZAHN NOW." Stewart's sentencing is scheduled for June 17, and we will speak tomorrow with her stylist, Martha Stewart's stylist, here on AMERICAN MORNING (UNINTELLIGIBLE). You like that, Jack.
CAFFERTY: That's a joke, right?
HEMMER: No, it's true, a friend.
CAFFERTY: We're really going to do that.
HEMMER: It's a friend and it's a colleague and a confidante.
CAFFERTY: Martha Stewart's stylist.
HEMMER: And I think you're going to talk with her.
CAFFERTY: I may take tomorrow off.
Senator John McCain threatening -- I don't believe that, but we'll see. It will probably happen. John McCain threatening congressional action yesterday. Monday, the guy who gives her pedicures will be here live. Senator...
HEMMER: And her manicurist is here on Tuesday.
CAFFERTY: I'm getting myself in trouble here.
HEMMER: Yes, you are.
CAFFERTY: If Major League Baseball and its players union don't crack down on steroid use, Senator John McCain threatened congressional action yesterday. The executive director of the union said he thinks the current rules are sufficient.
In the NFL, a positive test: an immediate four-game suspension. Olympic athletes stripped of their medals. Second time they're kicked clear out of the games and never compete again.
Should there be a zero-tolerance policy in Major League Baseball?
Here's some of what you have written.
Doug in Knoxville, Maryland: "I totally agree with the banning of steroids, not only in baseball, but in all sports. At least the Olympics got it right when they not only banned steroid use. They have stripped from those athletes who have tested positive. Maybe if an athlete tests positive and their multimillion-dollar contract is voided, and all of the monies repaid to the owners, this will stop." Probably do it.
Paul in Hellertown, Pennsylvania: "Perhaps the greatest harm resulting from the sports drug-enhancing problem are the records of the clean athletes that have been eclipsed by the steroid junkies. The former athletes earned and deserve their 15 minutes of fame. The latter are nothing more than win-at-all-costs cheat." Mel here in New York: "The more I see zero-tolerance policies for anything, the closer I come to zero tolerance for zero tolerance. It's another one of those simple, easy-to-understand wrong answers."
And my man, Red, in Ontario, who never fails to disappoint.
HEMMER: Come on, Reg!
CAFFERTY: "Jack, does this mean the governors of California of Minnesota will not be allowed to throw out the traditional first ball in the season?"
I love that.
HEMMER: Senator Biden is on here in a couple minutes. There's an antitrust law that governs baseball, which means they can essentially operate on their own island. Senator McCain and Senator Biden are saying that they'll take action if baseball does not in terms of drug testing, because the union is strong.
O'BRIEN: Yes, but that action?
HEMMER: What can Congress do if you have the antitrust laws that protect the game?
CAFFERTY: I don't know, unless they change the law, and that's what Congress does. They can do that, I suppose.
O'BRIEN: Excellent question for Biden, I believe.
HEMMER: Yes, I believe so, as a matter of fact.
CAFFERTY: Yes.
HEMMER: That answer forthcoming. Thanks, Jack.
CAFFERTY: I want to know what you're going to ask Martha Stewart's stylist.
HEMMER: Me, no it's you. It's you!
CAFFERTY: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) yet?
O'BRIEN: I hope it's me. I want to talk to Martha Stewart's stylist.
HEMMER: You know what? You just won.
O'BRIEN: Will I have to talk about Martha, or can I talk about styling? That will be interesting.
All right, coming up this morning, from humble roots comes a powerful political movement. Now MoveOn.org is facing some harsh criticism from Republicans. We'll take a look at that just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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