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Pakistani Troops Trying to Capture Top Al Qaeda Leaders May Have Lost Chance; Interview with Mohammed Al Douri

Aired March 22, 2004 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Welcome, everybody. It's just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. Lots going on in the news this morning. We're look at whether fugitives may have escaped from Pakistan.
Also, the latest legal battle starting up once again in the Scott Peterson murder trial.

Plus, Sanjay Gupta has got a report on smoking and allergies and how pets can actually figure into your health equation.

BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also, in a moment here, old friend Jack Horkheimer of Miami Planetarium back with us today. Several items of interest, including a big asteroid that came very close to Earth last week. How close? Closer than a lot of people liked apparently. But it's a big place out there. The Mars rovers -- is it time for them to ride off into the Martian sunset, or is NASA right now getting actually more from the rovers than they ever thought possible originally? We'll get to that in a moment.

O'BRIEN: All right, let's get to our top story this morning, though. First, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon says Israel will press ahead with its war on terror after an Israeli strike left the spiritual leader of Hamas dead. Thousands took to the street for today's funeral procession for Sheik Ahmed Yassin. Yasser Arafat has declared three days of mourning following that attach. That, and much more on the story to come this morning.

Former counterterrorism coordinator Richard Clarke claims President Bush ignored warnings about terrorist attacks before September 11th. Clarke also says the president has done a terrible job battling terrorism since the terrorist attacks of 9/11.

National security adviser Condoleezza Rice dismissed Clarke's claims earlier right here on AMERICAN MORNING.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATL. SECURITY ADVISER: This wasn't an issue of who knew about al Qaeda. This is an issue of what we were going to do about al Qaeda. And it was Dick Clarke's job to develop for this president a broad, comprehensive strategy for dealing with the al Qaeda threat, and he eventually did that, and I think did a very good job. But this retrospective rewriting of the history of the first several months of the administration is not helpful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Richard Clarke is set to testify before the 9/11 Commission later this week.

In business news, Wal-Mart does it once again. The retail giant, once again, tops the fortune 500 list for a third straight year, with sales of almost $259 billion. Wal-Mart leads the list of the nation's largest publicly traded companies. The ranking is based on the company's 2003 reported sales figures.

In racing, Jeff Gordon says he is not pointing fingers for his recent loss, but he is blaming slow drivers for a scary wreck yesterday that sent him behind the wall at Darlington Raceway in South Carolina. Gordon says he dodged the slower cars almost from the start. He wants NASCAR leaders to keep drivers who can't keep up to speed off the track. Gordon finished 41st behind the winner, Jimmie Johnson.

(WEATHER REPORT)

HEMMER: Back overseas again. Pakistani troops trying to capture suspected top al Qaeda leaders may have lost a chance because of secret tunnels discovered earlier. Those tunnels been found in the mountains where the Pakistanis have been battling al Qaeda fighters for days.

Steve Coll back with us, author of the book "Ghost Wars," managing editor of "The Washington Post," back with us from D.C.

Nice to have you back, Steve. Good morning to you on this Monday.

STEVE COLL, AUTHOR, "GHOST WARS": Bill, good to be with you.

HEMMER: I have to think that these tunnels don't surprise you for a minute, neither do the caves in the area.

COLL: They've been built over 15, 20 years, not just in the Wana (ph) region, but all up and down that area, and it's not just the caves and tunnels, but the pathways, and walkways and mountains themselves that make it so difficult to pin anybody down.

HEMMER: So here's the obvious question, if you put 7,000 Pakistani soldiers in that area, is that enough to secure the area?

COLL: Well, it's very difficult to encircle anybody, even with 7,000 troops because the hills are so forbidding, there's so little infrastructure in many areas where the compounds are located, and also, as we've seen over the last week, the local population is broadly hostile to the Pakistani army in this region, and so they don't have a lot of allies on the ground from village to village.

HEMMER: What do you make of the fact the Pakistani leadership now backing off claim of a high-value target that was spoken of by Pervez Musharraf last week. COLL: I think they probably feel like they got out ahead of themselves with their confident sounding announcements. They had a lot of agendas they were trying to establish at the same time. One was to signal the United States and the public abroad that they were serious about this attack. And at the same time, I think they really were excited about the resistance they discovered in this compound, which they interpreted to mean that there was somebody important there. There may have been, but I think their sense of who it actually was probably a lot more uncertain than they let on in their initial comments.

HEMMER: Can you say from Washington D.C., that the Pakistanis did this right or wrong?

COLL: Well, I think it's hard to say so starkly. I think it's clear that the events of the last week signal a new willingness of the Pakistan army to apply force in a region they've not been able to operate like this for an awful long while. And this really was a pretty significant campaign for them. They took a lot of casualties, and went into an area where they stirred the dust politically, and probably are going to take a lot of heat at home for what they did.

At the same time, it obviously was not as successful an operation as they thought it was going to be earlier in the week.

HEMMER: Steve Coll, come back any time. Always a pleasure to talk to you.

COLL: Thank you.

HEMMER: You got it -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Two businessmen from Finland were killed in Baghdad today when their convoy was ambushed on the way to a meeting. They are the latest civilians to be killed in a series of attacks.

Yesterday, in the Iraqi capital, rockets landed in and near the so-called green zone, where U.S. had administrators are based. Two Iraqis were killed. Six others, including a U.S. soldier were injured.

Joining us this morning from Dubai, in the United Arab Emirates, to talk about the latest violence in Iraq, is Mohammed Al Douri. He is the former Iraqi ambassador to the United Nations.

Nice to see you, sir. Thanks for being with us.

Let's first begin with the civilian attacks. It seems in recent days certainly that they are on the increase. Does this signal to you in any way a change in the tactics of the insurgents?

MOHAMMED AL DOURI, FMR. IRAQI AMB. TO U.N.: Well, you know, that means the war has not ended right now. Now, there is another kind of war, a war of liberation, which is legal, which is national, which is acceptable by everybody. So we have not to be surprised when we will hear about more about these attacks and these problems in Iraq. HEMMER: Do you think these attacks will or should impact the June 30th handover date?

AL DOURI: Sorry, I didn't...

HEMMER: Forgive me because we have quite a significant delay. But I'm curious to know if you think these attacks should impact or should delay the June 30th handover date?

AL DOURI: Well, you know, the handover of sovereignty to Iraqi people for me is a myth, really, is an illusion. So I -- there will be a change, perhaps from one group appointed by the United States to another group. So this date is really not the most important date for Iraq. The most important date for Iraqi people is the date of liberation, when the occupying power will leave the country. At that time, really, there will be a change, a sense of change for the Iraqi people.

HEMMER: It has been one year since the war first began. Do you believe that Iraqis are better off today than they were one year ago?

AL DOURI: Well, we have -- we have had hoped that there will be a kind of change, but unfortunately, what we are living now is a state of chaos, is a state of fear and pain, is a state of lawlessness, is a state of killing, kidnapping children and others, lack of electricity, lack of all services, daily services needed by people. So, really, the change is not for the best, but for the worst. So this is what we are realizing now.

I think it's better to go to the people in Iraq and ask them if there is a tangible amelioration of their daily life. Unfortunately, there is no change. They are still waiting and they are still suffering at the same time.

HEMMER: Mohammed Al Douri is the former Iraqi ambassador to the United Nations.

Nice to see you, sir. Thank you for joining us this morning -- Bill.

HEMMER: About 19 minutes now before the hour. Shifting our focus quite deliberately back in the U.S. now. From California, Scott Peterson's attorney back in court, arguing for yet another change of venue. If they win, it's No. 2. The site for the trial already changed once, Modesto to Redwood City. Mark Geragos claims that prospective jurors there have drawn conclusions about the guilt or innocence of Scott Peterson. He's charged of murdering his wife, Laci, and their unborn child.

And CNN legal analyst Christopher Darden up early today, with us from California to talk about it.

Nice to see you, Chris. Good morning.

CHRISTOPHER DARDEN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Nice to see you. Good morning. HEMMER: I tell you, it seems like we've been talking about this thing for four weeks and running. Does he stand a chance to get a second change of venue?

DARDEN: Well, absolutely he stands a chance. And he knows probably better than anyone else whether or not it's a very good chance. They've gone through 1,000 jurors. They have 381 left. And all of those jurors have filled out questionnaires. And so certainly there's some indication in those questionnaires as to whether or not many of the jurors believe Scott Peterson is guilty. If that is the case, then he has a good argument.

HEMMER: From what I hear, if you are going to take it anywhere in California, you take it to Southern California, you take it to L.A. County.

DARDEN: Absolutely.

HEMMER: You agree with that?

DARDEN: Oh, yes, yes. I think it's foolish to select those northern California counties in the first place. They all share common media markets with Modesto, and a lot of people in Modesto commute to the Bay Area or vice versa, and so you have a sharing of media markets. And, plus, Laci and Conrad were found just across the bay from San Mateo County. So you have people with a vested interest to what happens to Scott Peterson.

HEMMER: It's my interest they don't want to go that south because of the cost. How do they balance that?

DARDEN: Well, you know, justice can be expensive.

HEMMER: Amber Frey is set to testify. She's eight months pregnant. Have you stopped for a moment to think about what the impact of that could be if she's on the stand about to give birth?

DARDEN: Well, I think that can be detrimental to the defense. It will make her a whole lot more sympathetic as a witness. But, in all likelihood, she won't reach the witness stand before she gives birth, and the defense won't have to deal with that issue.

HEMMER: One more thing here, videotapes apparently are admissible. The judge is saying there's apparently nothing on them. What are these tape, Chris?

DARDEN: You know, I'm not quite sure. And I am looking forward to see what's on them myself. I'm also looking forward to hearing Amber Frey's testimony finally, and to hear exactly what's on those tapes. But they may provide corroboration for the prosecution's case.

HEMMER: We'll watch it.

DARDEN: Which is Peterson killed his wife and child.

HEMMER: Christopher, thank you. Christopher Darden there in L.A. Nice to talk to you. Speak again.

DARDEN: Nice to talk to you.

HEMMER: All right, good deal.

O'BRIEN: Still to come on AMERICAN MORNING: Pets can help keep children with allergies from suffering. But that all goes out the window if the parents themselves don't break themselves of a bad habit. We'll explain.

HEMMER; A close call in space the other day, about 26,000 miles close. Were astronomers worried? Find out in a moment.

Back in a moment, after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Early exposure to pets in the home can actually have a positive effect on children who are prone to allergies. But a new study says that benefit goes right out the window if one or both parents smoke.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta at the CNN Center for us this morning with some details.

Sanjay, good morning.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad.

Yes, big topic, especially this time of year, 40 to 50 million Americans suffering from significant allergies. People were encouraged a couple of years ago, there was a study that came out looking at household pets and the possible protective effects it may have on children developing allergies later in life. The study basically said that children with two or more pets, whether they are dogs or cats, reduce allergies by up to 50 percent. Those sorts of allergies from dust mites, grass, ragweed, things like that.

Now a follow-up study now, Soledad, just coming out this weekend, talking about negating those protective effects by parents who smoke. Children with parents who smoke regularly lost the protective benefits of pets, those were all negated, if either one or both of those parents smoked.

Now this has been a point of some speculation for some time. Obviously, secondhand smoke is bad for you, but to actually draw a cause and effect that if the parents smoked, they actually would negate the effects, the beneficial effects of those pets in terms of allergies, this is sort of new stuff.

A couple of crude rules of thumb: one, if both parents have significant allergies, then your child has about a 50 percent chance of developing allergies him or herself. If one parent has significant allergies, about a 25 percent. Not a huge surprise here, Soledad, that smoking, secondhand smoking, is bad, but this protective effect gone if the parent smokes -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Can you explain how the exposure to allergens ahead of time will actually protect children from getting allergies? That seems almost counterintuitive.

GUPTA: Yes, you know, this is interesting, and this is sort of the basis on by which allergy shots are based, all sorts of things. Two sort of rules of thumb here. If you introduce allergens and you introduce them early in life, you may develop a protective effect later on in life. In the case of pets, about 50 percent.

Here's how it might work. Basically, the immune system favors allergies. So you know, when your baby is developing, when a child is developing, they favor allergies. They're looking for those sorts of things. So if you naturally expose them to the bacteria or other allergens, they're going to start to recognize those things, and next time they come knocking on the door, they're going to say no, we're not going to accept it this time, and basically the body becomes conditioned against those allergies. So a little bit of exposure early on may condition the body, so to speak, so the next time the allergy is seen, the body won't react to it -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Interesting. All right, Sanjay, thanks a lot.

GUPTA: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, NASA set to turn the Mars rovers loose over a wider portion of the Red Planet. That, and some details about our relatively recent close call with an asteroid. Those stories are all ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: Well, NASA's planning to give the mars rovers longer leashes as they trek along the Red Planet. And Jack Horkheimer is back with us, the executive director of the Miami Planetarium with us from Miami to talk about that and other space news.

Nice to have you, Jack. Good morning to you.

JACK HORKHEIMER, EXEC. DIR., MIAMI PLANETARIUM: Good morning to you, Bill.

HEMMER: I understand the staff is going to be cut by one-third, but the software is going to be upgraded on the rovers. What impact could that be, Jack?

HORKHEIMER: Well, we want to get the rovers now that they've done all the really necessary science, we have actually done already what we've come for. Now that we've got this extra time, we are going to upgrade the software and perhaps in a week or so, turn off some of the hazard-avoidance systems, and let the rovers -- direct them to start moving even faster than they have been before. In fact, Spirit is going to cover about 150 feet a day, and Opportunity will cover about 300 feet a day, which is quite a lot of territory. We're going to examine new outcroppings and layers of rocks, to even get more support of evidence that water once existed in great quantities on the Red Planet.

HEMMER: You know, Jack, in a word, if NASA's gotten its money's worth already, are they satisfied at this point? If the rovers stopped today, would they be OK with that?

HORKHEIMER: It's OK with me, because I think the science is just incredible. We went there to try to prove that water did or did not exist at one time on the Red Planet in great quantities, and we now have evidence from two different areas on Mars that such indeed was the case. The evidence just seems to be overwhelming. And really more overwhelming than anybody at NASA ever anticipated.

HEMMER: Let me shift our focus a little bit. This asteroid came within 26,000 miles of Earth over the past few days. What can you tell us about what happened there, Jack?

HORKHEIMER: Well, we had nothing to worry about. The exciting part about this asteroid coming 10 times closer to Earth than the moon -- it was only 100 feet wide -- was that it was the largest object we've ever seen that has come this close. Now that doesn't mean they don't come this close very often. In fact, objects this big probably pass near our Earth about every other year. It's just that we haven't recorded them. So this is a first in science. And we're still waiting for pictures to come in from observers around the world who may have caught this on tape or actually caught it through very high fast-tracking telescopes.

HEMMER: You know, a pretty obvious and basic question here. Any time we talk about this proximity, how concerned should we ever be that one scores a direct hit?

HORKHEIMER: Well, you know, we should be concerned that this is a possibility. We should -- this is why we have these teams of near- Earth object observers, which we didn't have a few years ago. So it's very important we have this going on, so that we can catalog and discover these things.

However, contrary to the movies that we see, you know, where we think we have all these great, great defensive systems to nudge these things away from us in case they come toward us, that isn't exactly true. We'd need a long lead time to even get anything to nudge a small asteroid out of Earth's way. So we need more work, more study to catalog these objects, and then eventually we have to prepare ourselves with some kind of a defense system, and this is going to be a long process.

HEMMER: Thank you, Jack. Jack Horkheimer from Miami. Great to speak with you, as always. Keep looking up!

HORKHEIMER: Keep looking up.

O'BRIEN: You beat him to it.

HEMMER: Stealing your line, man. We're spending too much time together. Thanks.

O'BRIEN: And Jack Cafferty is here with the Cafferty File.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: You know it's hard to follow a segment like that. I mean, this is fairly mundane stuff I have here.

O'BRIEN: Try, Jack, try. Give it your all.

CAFFERTY: The British, in the event that some of Jack's friends from outerspace do pay us a visit, the British have selected the ambassador that they want to welcome aliens to Earth, if and when they come. Ozzy Osbourne would be the choice. I mean, you got -- can't do any better than that.

However, one of the editors of this online poll in Great Britain said that he's not sure what the Martians would make of Ozzy's individual approach to the English language. Osbourne got 26 percent of the vote. Tony Blair, the British prime minister, 12 percent, and George Bush, just 9 percent, and I don't know who that other guy is.

HEMMER: Simon Cowell, he's from "American Idol," the big judge from Australia, right?

CAFFERTY: Somehow I knew you'd know that.

Chicago's mayor wants to keep politics clean. Let me say that again -- Chicago's mayor wants to keep politics clean. His name is Richard Daley, and he's warned the politicians to stay away from politicians' divorce files. He said if people keep snooping through the divorce records of politicians, Daley, says there could be no end in sight. He suggested that employers might soon demand the same information from job applicants, and, of course, the other risk is that the people of Chicago would find out even more about what worms some of their political leaders are. So Daley wants the divorce records sealed.

Two French nutritionists are telling the people in France Big Macs are better for them than quiche. Remember that, what was that, "Real Men Don't Eat Quiche," it was a book or something years ago. Their new book praises McDonald's burgers for having a higher and healthier protein to fat ratio than France's traditional quiche lorraine. Despite public scorn from McDonald's in France, the company does manage to sell 90 million burgers a year over there.

HEMMER: "Real Men Don't Eat Quiche." Somehow I knew you'd know that.

CAFFERTY: And I did.

HEMMER: Thank you, Jack.

In a moment here, some serious charges against the White House, against the president, against Condoleezza Rice for the handling of the war, both pre- and post-09/11. The White House's position from Dr. Rice in a moment on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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May Have Lost Chance; Interview with Mohammed Al Douri>


Aired March 22, 2004 - 08:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Welcome, everybody. It's just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. Lots going on in the news this morning. We're look at whether fugitives may have escaped from Pakistan.
Also, the latest legal battle starting up once again in the Scott Peterson murder trial.

Plus, Sanjay Gupta has got a report on smoking and allergies and how pets can actually figure into your health equation.

BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Also, in a moment here, old friend Jack Horkheimer of Miami Planetarium back with us today. Several items of interest, including a big asteroid that came very close to Earth last week. How close? Closer than a lot of people liked apparently. But it's a big place out there. The Mars rovers -- is it time for them to ride off into the Martian sunset, or is NASA right now getting actually more from the rovers than they ever thought possible originally? We'll get to that in a moment.

O'BRIEN: All right, let's get to our top story this morning, though. First, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon says Israel will press ahead with its war on terror after an Israeli strike left the spiritual leader of Hamas dead. Thousands took to the street for today's funeral procession for Sheik Ahmed Yassin. Yasser Arafat has declared three days of mourning following that attach. That, and much more on the story to come this morning.

Former counterterrorism coordinator Richard Clarke claims President Bush ignored warnings about terrorist attacks before September 11th. Clarke also says the president has done a terrible job battling terrorism since the terrorist attacks of 9/11.

National security adviser Condoleezza Rice dismissed Clarke's claims earlier right here on AMERICAN MORNING.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATL. SECURITY ADVISER: This wasn't an issue of who knew about al Qaeda. This is an issue of what we were going to do about al Qaeda. And it was Dick Clarke's job to develop for this president a broad, comprehensive strategy for dealing with the al Qaeda threat, and he eventually did that, and I think did a very good job. But this retrospective rewriting of the history of the first several months of the administration is not helpful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Richard Clarke is set to testify before the 9/11 Commission later this week.

In business news, Wal-Mart does it once again. The retail giant, once again, tops the fortune 500 list for a third straight year, with sales of almost $259 billion. Wal-Mart leads the list of the nation's largest publicly traded companies. The ranking is based on the company's 2003 reported sales figures.

In racing, Jeff Gordon says he is not pointing fingers for his recent loss, but he is blaming slow drivers for a scary wreck yesterday that sent him behind the wall at Darlington Raceway in South Carolina. Gordon says he dodged the slower cars almost from the start. He wants NASCAR leaders to keep drivers who can't keep up to speed off the track. Gordon finished 41st behind the winner, Jimmie Johnson.

(WEATHER REPORT)

HEMMER: Back overseas again. Pakistani troops trying to capture suspected top al Qaeda leaders may have lost a chance because of secret tunnels discovered earlier. Those tunnels been found in the mountains where the Pakistanis have been battling al Qaeda fighters for days.

Steve Coll back with us, author of the book "Ghost Wars," managing editor of "The Washington Post," back with us from D.C.

Nice to have you back, Steve. Good morning to you on this Monday.

STEVE COLL, AUTHOR, "GHOST WARS": Bill, good to be with you.

HEMMER: I have to think that these tunnels don't surprise you for a minute, neither do the caves in the area.

COLL: They've been built over 15, 20 years, not just in the Wana (ph) region, but all up and down that area, and it's not just the caves and tunnels, but the pathways, and walkways and mountains themselves that make it so difficult to pin anybody down.

HEMMER: So here's the obvious question, if you put 7,000 Pakistani soldiers in that area, is that enough to secure the area?

COLL: Well, it's very difficult to encircle anybody, even with 7,000 troops because the hills are so forbidding, there's so little infrastructure in many areas where the compounds are located, and also, as we've seen over the last week, the local population is broadly hostile to the Pakistani army in this region, and so they don't have a lot of allies on the ground from village to village.

HEMMER: What do you make of the fact the Pakistani leadership now backing off claim of a high-value target that was spoken of by Pervez Musharraf last week. COLL: I think they probably feel like they got out ahead of themselves with their confident sounding announcements. They had a lot of agendas they were trying to establish at the same time. One was to signal the United States and the public abroad that they were serious about this attack. And at the same time, I think they really were excited about the resistance they discovered in this compound, which they interpreted to mean that there was somebody important there. There may have been, but I think their sense of who it actually was probably a lot more uncertain than they let on in their initial comments.

HEMMER: Can you say from Washington D.C., that the Pakistanis did this right or wrong?

COLL: Well, I think it's hard to say so starkly. I think it's clear that the events of the last week signal a new willingness of the Pakistan army to apply force in a region they've not been able to operate like this for an awful long while. And this really was a pretty significant campaign for them. They took a lot of casualties, and went into an area where they stirred the dust politically, and probably are going to take a lot of heat at home for what they did.

At the same time, it obviously was not as successful an operation as they thought it was going to be earlier in the week.

HEMMER: Steve Coll, come back any time. Always a pleasure to talk to you.

COLL: Thank you.

HEMMER: You got it -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Two businessmen from Finland were killed in Baghdad today when their convoy was ambushed on the way to a meeting. They are the latest civilians to be killed in a series of attacks.

Yesterday, in the Iraqi capital, rockets landed in and near the so-called green zone, where U.S. had administrators are based. Two Iraqis were killed. Six others, including a U.S. soldier were injured.

Joining us this morning from Dubai, in the United Arab Emirates, to talk about the latest violence in Iraq, is Mohammed Al Douri. He is the former Iraqi ambassador to the United Nations.

Nice to see you, sir. Thanks for being with us.

Let's first begin with the civilian attacks. It seems in recent days certainly that they are on the increase. Does this signal to you in any way a change in the tactics of the insurgents?

MOHAMMED AL DOURI, FMR. IRAQI AMB. TO U.N.: Well, you know, that means the war has not ended right now. Now, there is another kind of war, a war of liberation, which is legal, which is national, which is acceptable by everybody. So we have not to be surprised when we will hear about more about these attacks and these problems in Iraq. HEMMER: Do you think these attacks will or should impact the June 30th handover date?

AL DOURI: Sorry, I didn't...

HEMMER: Forgive me because we have quite a significant delay. But I'm curious to know if you think these attacks should impact or should delay the June 30th handover date?

AL DOURI: Well, you know, the handover of sovereignty to Iraqi people for me is a myth, really, is an illusion. So I -- there will be a change, perhaps from one group appointed by the United States to another group. So this date is really not the most important date for Iraq. The most important date for Iraqi people is the date of liberation, when the occupying power will leave the country. At that time, really, there will be a change, a sense of change for the Iraqi people.

HEMMER: It has been one year since the war first began. Do you believe that Iraqis are better off today than they were one year ago?

AL DOURI: Well, we have -- we have had hoped that there will be a kind of change, but unfortunately, what we are living now is a state of chaos, is a state of fear and pain, is a state of lawlessness, is a state of killing, kidnapping children and others, lack of electricity, lack of all services, daily services needed by people. So, really, the change is not for the best, but for the worst. So this is what we are realizing now.

I think it's better to go to the people in Iraq and ask them if there is a tangible amelioration of their daily life. Unfortunately, there is no change. They are still waiting and they are still suffering at the same time.

HEMMER: Mohammed Al Douri is the former Iraqi ambassador to the United Nations.

Nice to see you, sir. Thank you for joining us this morning -- Bill.

HEMMER: About 19 minutes now before the hour. Shifting our focus quite deliberately back in the U.S. now. From California, Scott Peterson's attorney back in court, arguing for yet another change of venue. If they win, it's No. 2. The site for the trial already changed once, Modesto to Redwood City. Mark Geragos claims that prospective jurors there have drawn conclusions about the guilt or innocence of Scott Peterson. He's charged of murdering his wife, Laci, and their unborn child.

And CNN legal analyst Christopher Darden up early today, with us from California to talk about it.

Nice to see you, Chris. Good morning.

CHRISTOPHER DARDEN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Nice to see you. Good morning. HEMMER: I tell you, it seems like we've been talking about this thing for four weeks and running. Does he stand a chance to get a second change of venue?

DARDEN: Well, absolutely he stands a chance. And he knows probably better than anyone else whether or not it's a very good chance. They've gone through 1,000 jurors. They have 381 left. And all of those jurors have filled out questionnaires. And so certainly there's some indication in those questionnaires as to whether or not many of the jurors believe Scott Peterson is guilty. If that is the case, then he has a good argument.

HEMMER: From what I hear, if you are going to take it anywhere in California, you take it to Southern California, you take it to L.A. County.

DARDEN: Absolutely.

HEMMER: You agree with that?

DARDEN: Oh, yes, yes. I think it's foolish to select those northern California counties in the first place. They all share common media markets with Modesto, and a lot of people in Modesto commute to the Bay Area or vice versa, and so you have a sharing of media markets. And, plus, Laci and Conrad were found just across the bay from San Mateo County. So you have people with a vested interest to what happens to Scott Peterson.

HEMMER: It's my interest they don't want to go that south because of the cost. How do they balance that?

DARDEN: Well, you know, justice can be expensive.

HEMMER: Amber Frey is set to testify. She's eight months pregnant. Have you stopped for a moment to think about what the impact of that could be if she's on the stand about to give birth?

DARDEN: Well, I think that can be detrimental to the defense. It will make her a whole lot more sympathetic as a witness. But, in all likelihood, she won't reach the witness stand before she gives birth, and the defense won't have to deal with that issue.

HEMMER: One more thing here, videotapes apparently are admissible. The judge is saying there's apparently nothing on them. What are these tape, Chris?

DARDEN: You know, I'm not quite sure. And I am looking forward to see what's on them myself. I'm also looking forward to hearing Amber Frey's testimony finally, and to hear exactly what's on those tapes. But they may provide corroboration for the prosecution's case.

HEMMER: We'll watch it.

DARDEN: Which is Peterson killed his wife and child.

HEMMER: Christopher, thank you. Christopher Darden there in L.A. Nice to talk to you. Speak again.

DARDEN: Nice to talk to you.

HEMMER: All right, good deal.

O'BRIEN: Still to come on AMERICAN MORNING: Pets can help keep children with allergies from suffering. But that all goes out the window if the parents themselves don't break themselves of a bad habit. We'll explain.

HEMMER; A close call in space the other day, about 26,000 miles close. Were astronomers worried? Find out in a moment.

Back in a moment, after this.

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O'BRIEN: Early exposure to pets in the home can actually have a positive effect on children who are prone to allergies. But a new study says that benefit goes right out the window if one or both parents smoke.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta at the CNN Center for us this morning with some details.

Sanjay, good morning.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Soledad.

Yes, big topic, especially this time of year, 40 to 50 million Americans suffering from significant allergies. People were encouraged a couple of years ago, there was a study that came out looking at household pets and the possible protective effects it may have on children developing allergies later in life. The study basically said that children with two or more pets, whether they are dogs or cats, reduce allergies by up to 50 percent. Those sorts of allergies from dust mites, grass, ragweed, things like that.

Now a follow-up study now, Soledad, just coming out this weekend, talking about negating those protective effects by parents who smoke. Children with parents who smoke regularly lost the protective benefits of pets, those were all negated, if either one or both of those parents smoked.

Now this has been a point of some speculation for some time. Obviously, secondhand smoke is bad for you, but to actually draw a cause and effect that if the parents smoked, they actually would negate the effects, the beneficial effects of those pets in terms of allergies, this is sort of new stuff.

A couple of crude rules of thumb: one, if both parents have significant allergies, then your child has about a 50 percent chance of developing allergies him or herself. If one parent has significant allergies, about a 25 percent. Not a huge surprise here, Soledad, that smoking, secondhand smoking, is bad, but this protective effect gone if the parent smokes -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Can you explain how the exposure to allergens ahead of time will actually protect children from getting allergies? That seems almost counterintuitive.

GUPTA: Yes, you know, this is interesting, and this is sort of the basis on by which allergy shots are based, all sorts of things. Two sort of rules of thumb here. If you introduce allergens and you introduce them early in life, you may develop a protective effect later on in life. In the case of pets, about 50 percent.

Here's how it might work. Basically, the immune system favors allergies. So you know, when your baby is developing, when a child is developing, they favor allergies. They're looking for those sorts of things. So if you naturally expose them to the bacteria or other allergens, they're going to start to recognize those things, and next time they come knocking on the door, they're going to say no, we're not going to accept it this time, and basically the body becomes conditioned against those allergies. So a little bit of exposure early on may condition the body, so to speak, so the next time the allergy is seen, the body won't react to it -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Interesting. All right, Sanjay, thanks a lot.

GUPTA: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, NASA set to turn the Mars rovers loose over a wider portion of the Red Planet. That, and some details about our relatively recent close call with an asteroid. Those stories are all ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.

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HEMMER: Well, NASA's planning to give the mars rovers longer leashes as they trek along the Red Planet. And Jack Horkheimer is back with us, the executive director of the Miami Planetarium with us from Miami to talk about that and other space news.

Nice to have you, Jack. Good morning to you.

JACK HORKHEIMER, EXEC. DIR., MIAMI PLANETARIUM: Good morning to you, Bill.

HEMMER: I understand the staff is going to be cut by one-third, but the software is going to be upgraded on the rovers. What impact could that be, Jack?

HORKHEIMER: Well, we want to get the rovers now that they've done all the really necessary science, we have actually done already what we've come for. Now that we've got this extra time, we are going to upgrade the software and perhaps in a week or so, turn off some of the hazard-avoidance systems, and let the rovers -- direct them to start moving even faster than they have been before. In fact, Spirit is going to cover about 150 feet a day, and Opportunity will cover about 300 feet a day, which is quite a lot of territory. We're going to examine new outcroppings and layers of rocks, to even get more support of evidence that water once existed in great quantities on the Red Planet.

HEMMER: You know, Jack, in a word, if NASA's gotten its money's worth already, are they satisfied at this point? If the rovers stopped today, would they be OK with that?

HORKHEIMER: It's OK with me, because I think the science is just incredible. We went there to try to prove that water did or did not exist at one time on the Red Planet in great quantities, and we now have evidence from two different areas on Mars that such indeed was the case. The evidence just seems to be overwhelming. And really more overwhelming than anybody at NASA ever anticipated.

HEMMER: Let me shift our focus a little bit. This asteroid came within 26,000 miles of Earth over the past few days. What can you tell us about what happened there, Jack?

HORKHEIMER: Well, we had nothing to worry about. The exciting part about this asteroid coming 10 times closer to Earth than the moon -- it was only 100 feet wide -- was that it was the largest object we've ever seen that has come this close. Now that doesn't mean they don't come this close very often. In fact, objects this big probably pass near our Earth about every other year. It's just that we haven't recorded them. So this is a first in science. And we're still waiting for pictures to come in from observers around the world who may have caught this on tape or actually caught it through very high fast-tracking telescopes.

HEMMER: You know, a pretty obvious and basic question here. Any time we talk about this proximity, how concerned should we ever be that one scores a direct hit?

HORKHEIMER: Well, you know, we should be concerned that this is a possibility. We should -- this is why we have these teams of near- Earth object observers, which we didn't have a few years ago. So it's very important we have this going on, so that we can catalog and discover these things.

However, contrary to the movies that we see, you know, where we think we have all these great, great defensive systems to nudge these things away from us in case they come toward us, that isn't exactly true. We'd need a long lead time to even get anything to nudge a small asteroid out of Earth's way. So we need more work, more study to catalog these objects, and then eventually we have to prepare ourselves with some kind of a defense system, and this is going to be a long process.

HEMMER: Thank you, Jack. Jack Horkheimer from Miami. Great to speak with you, as always. Keep looking up!

HORKHEIMER: Keep looking up.

O'BRIEN: You beat him to it.

HEMMER: Stealing your line, man. We're spending too much time together. Thanks.

O'BRIEN: And Jack Cafferty is here with the Cafferty File.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: You know it's hard to follow a segment like that. I mean, this is fairly mundane stuff I have here.

O'BRIEN: Try, Jack, try. Give it your all.

CAFFERTY: The British, in the event that some of Jack's friends from outerspace do pay us a visit, the British have selected the ambassador that they want to welcome aliens to Earth, if and when they come. Ozzy Osbourne would be the choice. I mean, you got -- can't do any better than that.

However, one of the editors of this online poll in Great Britain said that he's not sure what the Martians would make of Ozzy's individual approach to the English language. Osbourne got 26 percent of the vote. Tony Blair, the British prime minister, 12 percent, and George Bush, just 9 percent, and I don't know who that other guy is.

HEMMER: Simon Cowell, he's from "American Idol," the big judge from Australia, right?

CAFFERTY: Somehow I knew you'd know that.

Chicago's mayor wants to keep politics clean. Let me say that again -- Chicago's mayor wants to keep politics clean. His name is Richard Daley, and he's warned the politicians to stay away from politicians' divorce files. He said if people keep snooping through the divorce records of politicians, Daley, says there could be no end in sight. He suggested that employers might soon demand the same information from job applicants, and, of course, the other risk is that the people of Chicago would find out even more about what worms some of their political leaders are. So Daley wants the divorce records sealed.

Two French nutritionists are telling the people in France Big Macs are better for them than quiche. Remember that, what was that, "Real Men Don't Eat Quiche," it was a book or something years ago. Their new book praises McDonald's burgers for having a higher and healthier protein to fat ratio than France's traditional quiche lorraine. Despite public scorn from McDonald's in France, the company does manage to sell 90 million burgers a year over there.

HEMMER: "Real Men Don't Eat Quiche." Somehow I knew you'd know that.

CAFFERTY: And I did.

HEMMER: Thank you, Jack.

In a moment here, some serious charges against the White House, against the president, against Condoleezza Rice for the handling of the war, both pre- and post-09/11. The White House's position from Dr. Rice in a moment on AMERICAN MORNING.

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May Have Lost Chance; Interview with Mohammed Al Douri>