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American Morning

Condoleezza Rice Given Green Light to Testify; 'Paging Dr. Gupta'

Aired March 31, 2004 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. Welcome back everybody. It is exactly half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. In just a few moments, a woman who was thought to be in about in her 60s has Scott Peterson's lawyer, Mark Geragos, very upset. The question of course is, what exactly is her agenda? It's a very bizarre twist in what was already a very odd story anyway. We're going to get a report on that. I think that's fair to say.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: It involves a tour bus on the way to Reno, Nevada, too. So we'll fill in the blanks on that in a moment.

Also, John Kerry could be campaigning in a sling for a few days. Sanjay is along in a moment to explain why the Democratic presidential candidate needs surgery. He'll get it done today. And talk about his prognosis, too, as well. Sanjay's up in a moment.

O'BRIEN: Other top stories this morning, though, first, five American soldiers killed in Iraq. The U.S. military now confirming that a bomb went off under a military vehicle west of Baghdad, near Fallujah. That city was the scene of another brutal attack. Witnesses say rebels threw grenades at two civilian cars, who were carrying four nationals, killing at least four. More on this story is coming up in our next half hour.

The CIA's new chief weapons inspector in Iraq, Charles Duelfer, says weapons of mass destruction could still be found there. Duelfer testified in private before a Senate committee yesterday. He says the CIA regularly receives reports of concealed weapons. Duelfer's comments contrast with those of his predecessor, David Kay. David Kay has said he doesn't think WMDs will be found in Iraq.

More sexual assault allegations have surfaced at the University of Colorado. An official from a Boulder rape crisis center told the panel that is investigating the scandal that two more women have come forward in recent months. Since 1997, eight women have claimed they were raped by men who were linked to the school's football programs. No charges have been filed.

In High Point, North Carolina, business leaders are trying to halt production of T-shirts that offend NAACP members. The shirts show a Confederate flag and a grinning young boy urinating on the NAACP logo on the back. Another logo says "Yo Yao." That refers to county commissioner Bill Yao, who has been called a racist. Yao clashed with black leaders, when he declared the NAACP to the Taliban. An Internet company is the group actually manufacturing the T-shirts. In Connecticut, three southbound lanes of Interstate 95 have been reopened. Crews worked during the night to replace an overpass in Bridgeport that was shut down a week ago due to a fiery crash. Officials say the temporary bridge is safe, but they're urging commuters to stick to that 45 miles per hour speed limit.

HEMMER: That has been one big headache for a lot of folks in the northeast.

O'BRIEN: No question about that.

You know what, no one is going to stick to that 45-mile-an-hour speed limit. have you been on 95?

HEMMER: So long as it's not backed up, right, so long as you can move on I-95.

O'BRIEN: Right, as long as the traffic's moving.

(WEATHER REPORT)

HEMMER: Now that Condoleezza Rice is given a green light to testify, the White House wants that appearance to happen ASAP. It should happen, we are told, within the next two weeks at the outmost. West Virginia Senator, Jay Rockefeller, ranking Democrat in the Intel Committee, with us live here on Capitol Hill to talk about it.

Senator, welcome back. Nice to have you here back with us on AMERICAN MORNING.

Will this help end the argument when Condoleezza talks and answers these questions, or just move it forward, do you believe?

SEN. JAY ROCKEFELLER (D-WV), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: It will move it forward. This is not a story that has a quick ending, Bill, because essentially Dick Clarke -- and this isn't about Dick Clarke himself, but what he advised on security and counterterrorism, that is to both Clinton, Bush and two presidents before that. He felt, one, that there wasn't enough urgency in the present President Bush's White House about terrorism, the whole subject. The president admitted that himself in the Bob Woodward book.

But I think in some ways, he was even more disturbed that we went into Iraq, that it was sort of a predetermined effort by some people who surrounded the president, who've made up their mind really that they wanted to go into Iraq, and he felt that that tremendously -- he took resources away from the war on terrorism on a global basis. And I think he was right. That's what the argument is really about.

HEMMER: Since you mentioned Dick Clarke, that argument, if that's what it comes down to you, is this essentially his testimony versus hers?

ROCKEFELLER: No, I think it's a question of whether her testimony, in fact, varies that much from his, in fact, or you know, on the Senate Intelligence Committee. Of course, I heard all this testimony back in 2002, and then I went back and reread all of it this last weekend. And there's very little variation, or none, about what he said in front of the 9/11 Commission and what he said two years ago, and I think that the plan that he gave to Clinton is going to end up -- and this is what Condi Rice will have to tell us -- not varying very much, in fact, from what it was that the president agreed to on September 11th which, of course, was too late, and which was very frustrating to him.

HEMMER: You are suggesting no inconsistencies based on what you saw in 2002 and what you heard last week.

ROCKEFELLER: None.

HEMMER: Some poll numbers I want to put on the screen here, asking Americans, CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll, whether or not the Bush administration is covering up something about handling intelligence on terrorism prior to 9/11. 53 percent say yes, just a shade over majority there, but then when asked had the Bush administration had prevented 9/11 from happening, 27 percent say yes, 67 percent say, no. How could Dr. Rice's testimony affect the perceptions of Americans, when we look at these polls?

ROCKEFELLER: I'm not sure it matters. I don't mean to be cynical about polls, but polls can change so much. And, I mean, Dick Clarke himself said that there wasn't any guaranteed way of stopping September 11th from happening. He specifically said no in his testimony before the 9/11 commission. But I think what he felt was a whole lot more could have been done by the Bush administration about terrorism, about al Qaeda on a global basis, and there were all kinds of signs popping up around the world that things were going to happen, even some talk about airline attacks, and really there was no sense of urgency. And I think that was just vastly frustrating to a 30-year professional who had been doing counterterrorism for four different presidents, who was a Republican, but who really disdained politicians and bureaucrats. I mean, he wanted to get things done, and he was frustrated by the Bush administration. I think that's really the story of him.

HEMMER: I don't have much time for this -- what's your one question you want Condoleezza Rice to answer?

ROCKEFELLER: I think the one question that she will have to answer, and that is, was there really any really fundamental difference between the terrorism plan that Clarke had drawn up for President Clinton, and -- in October, and then -- of 2000, and then the plan which Clarke had to wait for eight months before the president's cabinet, so to speak, ratified it, and that happened just one week before September 11th. Was it really, more or less, the same plan? And I think the answer is going to be, yes, but we shall see.

ROCKEFELLER: We shall, indeed.

HEMMER: Senator, thank you. Jay Rockefeller there in D.C. Appreciate it.

ROCKEFELLER: Thank you. HEMMER: Republican Senator Saxby Chambliss, also a member of the Intelligence Committee, our guest next hour, here on AMERICAN MORNING -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Michael Jackson meets with lawmakers on Capitol Hill today for a second day in a row. Jackson promoted the fight against AIDS in Africa while he was meeting yesterday with a dozen members of the Congressional Black Caucus. He had requested a meeting with the entire caucus, but was turned down. Michael Jackson, of course, facing sexual molestation charges in California.

Scott Peterson's attorney has accused a potential juror of lying to get on the case.

Ted Rowlands has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The potential juror a grandmother estimated to be in her sixties seemed visibly shaken according to those in the courtroom when defense attorney Mark Geragos asked her if she was trying to lie her way on to the jury to convict Scott Peterson. Citing a phone tip to his office, Geragos claims an acquaintance of the potential juror said she was bragging about passing the initial juror test and said of Scott Peterson, quote, "he's guilty as hell and I'm going to get him."

Later Geragos labeled her as a stealth juror.

MARK GERAGOS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: A stealth juror is somebody who comes into a courtroom and has an agenda and does not disclose that agenda and tries to get on the jury to execute that agenda.

ROWLANDS: The man providing the tip, according to Geragos, is a resident of the same seniors citizen center as the potential juror. The statements, according to Geragos, were allegedly made on a group bus trip to Reno, Nevada. In court, the potential juror repeatedly denied the accusations and at one point she raised her hand to seemingly acknowledge that she knew that she was under oath.

DEAN JOHNSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: What could happen to her? She could potentially be prosecuted by the San Mateo county district attorney's office for perjury and that carries a maximum penalty of four years in prison.

ROWLANDS: The judge issued a subpoena for the alleged whistleblower to come to court and tell his story under oath.

(on camera): The district attorney here in San Mateo County has indicated that he is aware of what happened in court but said that it would be a long shot for him to actually charge this woman with perjury. Meanwhile, court has adjourned for the week. Mark Geragos is scheduled to appear in a Santa Maria courtroom on Friday representing Michael Jackson.

Ted Rowlands, CNN, Redwood City, California. (END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Scott Peterson is accused of killing his pregnant wife and unborn son. The case has already been moved once to avoid potentially biased jurors.

HEMMER: Still to come here, an abducted boy returned to his mother after the instincts of a tourist. We'll talk to her next hour here.

O'BRIEN: Also John Kerry, he's not going to be shaking hands with anybody for a while. Dr. Sanjay Gupta's going to tell us what the candidate can expect from his surgery today.

HEMMER: Also in the coming hour, fire, then an explosion rocking a small town. Stay with us, let you know the aftermath of this, in a moment on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: In baseball, a torn rotator cuff could end your career. In politics, it might only sideline you for a couple of weeks. Senator John Kerry will undergo shoulder surgery today at a Boston hospital. And Dr. Sanjay Gupta is here to tell us a little bit more about the procedure, and also, maybe more importantly, the recovery.

Good morning.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

Yes, in baseball, I guess you hear about that. But politicians carrying the world on their shoulders maybe, a lot of handshaking.

O'BRIEN: Only in their own mind.

GUPTA: Right, lots of -- but seriously, a rotator torn cuff. His history dates back to '92. He actually had a fall off a bicycle at that time, broke his collarbone and several ribs, injuring his shoulder at that time. Sort of lived with it, as so many people do, with sort of painful shoulders, maybe a little bit of a rotator cuff injury at that time. Then, just this past January, on a campaign bus, the bus lurches forward, he grabs a handrail, and wrenches his shoulder back around. This is his right shoulder. Significant injury at that time. Sort of been living with it for the last couple of months, decided to have an operation today.

The rotator cuff, a lot of people do know about the rotator cuff, what it is, four muscles that essentially let you do various things with your arm, allows you to lift your arm about your head, move it around, things like that. If you have symptoms from a rotator cuff injury, you're going to have symptoms such as pain, obviously, pain in the shoulder. You also might feel your shoulder popping from time to time, and you sort of get that sense when you move it around and actually pop your shoulder. Also weakness, stiffness in the arms as well. Sometimes a bone spur can occur there as well. Obviously, in his case, he decided to have an operation to have this done. Now as far as operations go, it's actually one of the more commonly done operations. It takes about 30 to 40 minutes. It's done for a 1/2 to 2 inch incision that's right on the front of the shoulder blade here, and basically takes -- patients usually wake up right after anesthesia from this sort of thing.

O'BRIEN: Well, how do they fix it? What do they do?

GUPTA: Basically, there's a tendon that goes from one of the muscles to one of the bones, and that tendon is torn. All they do is essentially make a little incision in the shoulder and open up that tendon and suture it back together.

O'BRIEN: So seven to 10 days then, he waits for the sutures to come out. What's his recovery like?

GUPTA: Well, you know, we talks to the orthopedic surgeon. Dr. Zarens (ph) out of Boston is going to be doing this operation, basically said he's going to be in a sling for a few days. This is his dominant shoulder, which is the most commonplace for, you know, whatever dominant arm you have is the more likely shoulder to injure, and you're going to be in the sling for a few days. They say that a few days later, he should be out and around. He's probably not going to be doing a lot of handshaking or hoisting of babies, or anything like that for a while, but as far as pain, as far as recovery goes, you know, four and a half to six months, nine months to a year for a full recovery.

O'BRIEN: How long before he can do the -- I mean, you were sort of laughing while you said the handshaking and the hoisting of babies, but of course, all that is really critical to campaigning.

GUPTA: Absolutely. His doctor got that question more than anything else, talking about the handshaking. And you know, the sling for a few days. He obviously can't do any handshaking during that. A lot of that is just going to be sort of pain-limited after that, what he can tolerate. He's probably going to be on some pain medications, although doctors say, not narcotics, for more than a couple of days, and it's just going to be sort of pain-limited. You know, maybe a week or two before he can start doing -- he won't be doing any vigorous handshaking or any heavy baby lifting.

O'BRIEN: Maybe only very thin, small babies.

All right, Sanjay, thank you very much.

Can we talk now about my cold and what I can take, because I can't take anything to get over it?

GUPTA: Next segment.

O'BRIEN: I would really appreciate that. Put some thought into that. I need that -- Bill.

HEMMER: All right, Soledad, thanks. Before the operation, Senator Kerry appearing on MTV, talking about same-sex marriage, and Senator Kerry says he also believes homosexuality, quote, "who you are from birth," some serious topics and a few lighter issues as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well if I weren't cool and I told you I was cool, I wouldn't be cool. So, look, I don't know what I was in college. I was just like every other kid in college, trying to get by and probably, you know, made all my share of mistakes in trying to do that.

It's up to you, Michael, and other people to judge whether anything I do today is cool. My daughter would probably tell you I'm a freak at times.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: We will have to ask Vanessa about that. MTV now a must stop for presidential candidates.

In a moment here, should Donald Trump fire himself? Avoid his troubles facing Trump's casinos. In a moment, Andy's back with that, after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: Welcome back.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Donald Trump fired up about his reality TV show, but his casinos are down on their luck. With that, Andy Serwer is here "Minding Your Business."

The Donald has got troubles in Atlantic City.

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Yes, we've been talking about this a little bit. You know, obviously, he's riding high with "The Apprentice," Manhattan real estate doing very well. But one part of his empire not riding so high, and that is the casino business, as you mentioned Jack.

A note yesterday released by his auditors, saying if he doesn't get an infusion of $400 million in Credit Suisse First Boston, the company faces bankruptcy; $1.8 billion, obviously being hurt by the Borgata, which is your new facility down in Atlantic City.

But the thing is you can always say this about The Donald, he is always on the edge, he doesn't really care about this casino business anyway, because he's kind of extricated himself, so this guy has got more lives than a cat. I would not worry about him.

CAFFERTY: Plus, if you get the banks in far enough, they have got to come up with the 400 million, because otherwise, they've got to go operate the damn casinos. So they'll give him the money and he'll be fine. SERWER: I think that's right.

A woman in Illinois, though, not so happy with The Donald lately. That's because she owns a pottery business called You're Fired. Now this is causing her some problems, because The Donald, of course that's his famous line from "The Apprentice." And now, he's trying to trademark, which I didn't know that, he's trying to trademark "You're fired." She's saying that's going to hurt her business, OK. I don't think she has a case here. Anyway, it's kind of a cute name for a little pottery place.

CAFFERTY: Oh, please. Just looking for some money.

SERWER: And speaking of casinos, Jack, this is kind of interesting, you won't believe this, down in New Mexico the Isleta Casino. It's big, it's big. it's down there south of Albuquerque. Listen to this, what they're saying. This is an ad campaign. They just pulled this, because people thought it was appropriate: "So the holidays have passed and those credit card bills keep piling up. There seems to be no relief in sight. How will you pay those huge bills? Well, the Isleta Casino Resort comes to your rescue!"

O'BRIEN: Oh, my God.

SERWER: Yes, That's from the department of puhleeze!

So anyway, they say fit to yank the ad.

O'BRIEN: What about the markets? We had two up days in a row. There must be something wrong.

SERWER: We're looking for three. Well, we are seeing some signs, perhaps, maybe some people are suggesting now, the economy is improving. You can see here, up across the board. The last day of the quarter today. This morning, Best Buy, that big consumer retail chain, electronics, saying that they sold a lot of stuff in the last quarter, some good numbers from that.

CAFFERTY: Big jobs reports Friday. The markets will be probably treading water a little ahead of that, too.

SERWER: That's right.

CAFFERTY: Thanks, Andy.

On to the Cafferty File. It's Wednesday -- things people said over the last week that got our attention, beginning with this: "When I said goodbye, he said this is a hell of a way to get viewers." NBC News correspondent Brian Williams on helping a man on an airplane who was having trouble breathing. Williams is a former emergency medical technician and volunteer firefighter.

"Halle Berry stood up there and thanked every else, but never said Diana Ross. I was nominated for an Academy Award for 'Lady Sings The Blues.' If it hadn't been for what I did, maybe she wouldn't have been standing there." This tedious, over the hill Diana Ross on being hurt that Halle Berry didn't thank her.

O'BRIEN: She's not over the hill. She has a little bit of a point.

Go on.

CAFFERTY: Thank you. Do you mind?

You get the whole rest of the three hours.

O'BRIEN: No, I have to split it with Hemmer.

CAFFERTY: She thanks Dorothy Dandridge, Lena Horne and Diahann Carroll, but she didn't mention Diana Ross. Now somehow, I just don't see Diana Ross in the same company as those other three, but hey, call me crazy.

Then there's this one: "Every morning she said, I despise you Mr. Trier, and she'd spit on the ground. That is unpleasant. She could have quit. I don't know why she didn't."

Director Lars Von Trier on working with the singer Bjork, the star of his film "Dancer in the Dark."

And finally this one: "It's not nice to make fun of people with issues." That would be Richard Simmons, that little dweeb exercise guy on slapping a fellow traveler at the Phoenix Airport.

O'BRIEN: I like Richard Simmons.

CAFFERTY: I'm not through, yet.

O'BRIEN: Sorry. Really? Not yet?

CAFFERTY: Who said, "Hey, everybody, it's Richard Simmons, let's drop our bags and rock to the 50s."

And I would like to thank Soledad for helping me.

SERWER: You never would have been here if it hadn't been for her.

O'BRIEN: I feel like I'm just helping bring you back on track. That's so kind of you.

HEMMER: Listen, while you were talking, she was writing out of control.

O'BRIEN: "Out of control" today. That's what I wrote.

CAFFERTY: When's the last hit movie Diana Ross had.

SERWER: She was in jail.

CAFFERTY: Oh yes, she was in jail for drunk driving, but she's not over the hill. O'BRIEN: I'm just saying, the woman has contributed a little bit, and maybe it was an oversight for Halle Berry, who is a lovely woman and next time I interview Halle, I'm going to ask her.

HEMMER: Your going to be off for a few days, right?

O'BRIEN: I am, thank God. Not even a little bit.

HEMMER: Let's get a break here in a moment.

Now that a deal has been struck, when will Condoleezza Rice testify? We'll get to that in a moment. A Republican member of the Senate Intel Committee with us live in D.C. Back in a moment, after this.

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Aired March 31, 2004 - 08:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. Welcome back everybody. It is exactly half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING. In just a few moments, a woman who was thought to be in about in her 60s has Scott Peterson's lawyer, Mark Geragos, very upset. The question of course is, what exactly is her agenda? It's a very bizarre twist in what was already a very odd story anyway. We're going to get a report on that. I think that's fair to say.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: It involves a tour bus on the way to Reno, Nevada, too. So we'll fill in the blanks on that in a moment.

Also, John Kerry could be campaigning in a sling for a few days. Sanjay is along in a moment to explain why the Democratic presidential candidate needs surgery. He'll get it done today. And talk about his prognosis, too, as well. Sanjay's up in a moment.

O'BRIEN: Other top stories this morning, though, first, five American soldiers killed in Iraq. The U.S. military now confirming that a bomb went off under a military vehicle west of Baghdad, near Fallujah. That city was the scene of another brutal attack. Witnesses say rebels threw grenades at two civilian cars, who were carrying four nationals, killing at least four. More on this story is coming up in our next half hour.

The CIA's new chief weapons inspector in Iraq, Charles Duelfer, says weapons of mass destruction could still be found there. Duelfer testified in private before a Senate committee yesterday. He says the CIA regularly receives reports of concealed weapons. Duelfer's comments contrast with those of his predecessor, David Kay. David Kay has said he doesn't think WMDs will be found in Iraq.

More sexual assault allegations have surfaced at the University of Colorado. An official from a Boulder rape crisis center told the panel that is investigating the scandal that two more women have come forward in recent months. Since 1997, eight women have claimed they were raped by men who were linked to the school's football programs. No charges have been filed.

In High Point, North Carolina, business leaders are trying to halt production of T-shirts that offend NAACP members. The shirts show a Confederate flag and a grinning young boy urinating on the NAACP logo on the back. Another logo says "Yo Yao." That refers to county commissioner Bill Yao, who has been called a racist. Yao clashed with black leaders, when he declared the NAACP to the Taliban. An Internet company is the group actually manufacturing the T-shirts. In Connecticut, three southbound lanes of Interstate 95 have been reopened. Crews worked during the night to replace an overpass in Bridgeport that was shut down a week ago due to a fiery crash. Officials say the temporary bridge is safe, but they're urging commuters to stick to that 45 miles per hour speed limit.

HEMMER: That has been one big headache for a lot of folks in the northeast.

O'BRIEN: No question about that.

You know what, no one is going to stick to that 45-mile-an-hour speed limit. have you been on 95?

HEMMER: So long as it's not backed up, right, so long as you can move on I-95.

O'BRIEN: Right, as long as the traffic's moving.

(WEATHER REPORT)

HEMMER: Now that Condoleezza Rice is given a green light to testify, the White House wants that appearance to happen ASAP. It should happen, we are told, within the next two weeks at the outmost. West Virginia Senator, Jay Rockefeller, ranking Democrat in the Intel Committee, with us live here on Capitol Hill to talk about it.

Senator, welcome back. Nice to have you here back with us on AMERICAN MORNING.

Will this help end the argument when Condoleezza talks and answers these questions, or just move it forward, do you believe?

SEN. JAY ROCKEFELLER (D-WV), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: It will move it forward. This is not a story that has a quick ending, Bill, because essentially Dick Clarke -- and this isn't about Dick Clarke himself, but what he advised on security and counterterrorism, that is to both Clinton, Bush and two presidents before that. He felt, one, that there wasn't enough urgency in the present President Bush's White House about terrorism, the whole subject. The president admitted that himself in the Bob Woodward book.

But I think in some ways, he was even more disturbed that we went into Iraq, that it was sort of a predetermined effort by some people who surrounded the president, who've made up their mind really that they wanted to go into Iraq, and he felt that that tremendously -- he took resources away from the war on terrorism on a global basis. And I think he was right. That's what the argument is really about.

HEMMER: Since you mentioned Dick Clarke, that argument, if that's what it comes down to you, is this essentially his testimony versus hers?

ROCKEFELLER: No, I think it's a question of whether her testimony, in fact, varies that much from his, in fact, or you know, on the Senate Intelligence Committee. Of course, I heard all this testimony back in 2002, and then I went back and reread all of it this last weekend. And there's very little variation, or none, about what he said in front of the 9/11 Commission and what he said two years ago, and I think that the plan that he gave to Clinton is going to end up -- and this is what Condi Rice will have to tell us -- not varying very much, in fact, from what it was that the president agreed to on September 11th which, of course, was too late, and which was very frustrating to him.

HEMMER: You are suggesting no inconsistencies based on what you saw in 2002 and what you heard last week.

ROCKEFELLER: None.

HEMMER: Some poll numbers I want to put on the screen here, asking Americans, CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll, whether or not the Bush administration is covering up something about handling intelligence on terrorism prior to 9/11. 53 percent say yes, just a shade over majority there, but then when asked had the Bush administration had prevented 9/11 from happening, 27 percent say yes, 67 percent say, no. How could Dr. Rice's testimony affect the perceptions of Americans, when we look at these polls?

ROCKEFELLER: I'm not sure it matters. I don't mean to be cynical about polls, but polls can change so much. And, I mean, Dick Clarke himself said that there wasn't any guaranteed way of stopping September 11th from happening. He specifically said no in his testimony before the 9/11 commission. But I think what he felt was a whole lot more could have been done by the Bush administration about terrorism, about al Qaeda on a global basis, and there were all kinds of signs popping up around the world that things were going to happen, even some talk about airline attacks, and really there was no sense of urgency. And I think that was just vastly frustrating to a 30-year professional who had been doing counterterrorism for four different presidents, who was a Republican, but who really disdained politicians and bureaucrats. I mean, he wanted to get things done, and he was frustrated by the Bush administration. I think that's really the story of him.

HEMMER: I don't have much time for this -- what's your one question you want Condoleezza Rice to answer?

ROCKEFELLER: I think the one question that she will have to answer, and that is, was there really any really fundamental difference between the terrorism plan that Clarke had drawn up for President Clinton, and -- in October, and then -- of 2000, and then the plan which Clarke had to wait for eight months before the president's cabinet, so to speak, ratified it, and that happened just one week before September 11th. Was it really, more or less, the same plan? And I think the answer is going to be, yes, but we shall see.

ROCKEFELLER: We shall, indeed.

HEMMER: Senator, thank you. Jay Rockefeller there in D.C. Appreciate it.

ROCKEFELLER: Thank you. HEMMER: Republican Senator Saxby Chambliss, also a member of the Intelligence Committee, our guest next hour, here on AMERICAN MORNING -- Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Michael Jackson meets with lawmakers on Capitol Hill today for a second day in a row. Jackson promoted the fight against AIDS in Africa while he was meeting yesterday with a dozen members of the Congressional Black Caucus. He had requested a meeting with the entire caucus, but was turned down. Michael Jackson, of course, facing sexual molestation charges in California.

Scott Peterson's attorney has accused a potential juror of lying to get on the case.

Ted Rowlands has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The potential juror a grandmother estimated to be in her sixties seemed visibly shaken according to those in the courtroom when defense attorney Mark Geragos asked her if she was trying to lie her way on to the jury to convict Scott Peterson. Citing a phone tip to his office, Geragos claims an acquaintance of the potential juror said she was bragging about passing the initial juror test and said of Scott Peterson, quote, "he's guilty as hell and I'm going to get him."

Later Geragos labeled her as a stealth juror.

MARK GERAGOS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: A stealth juror is somebody who comes into a courtroom and has an agenda and does not disclose that agenda and tries to get on the jury to execute that agenda.

ROWLANDS: The man providing the tip, according to Geragos, is a resident of the same seniors citizen center as the potential juror. The statements, according to Geragos, were allegedly made on a group bus trip to Reno, Nevada. In court, the potential juror repeatedly denied the accusations and at one point she raised her hand to seemingly acknowledge that she knew that she was under oath.

DEAN JOHNSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: What could happen to her? She could potentially be prosecuted by the San Mateo county district attorney's office for perjury and that carries a maximum penalty of four years in prison.

ROWLANDS: The judge issued a subpoena for the alleged whistleblower to come to court and tell his story under oath.

(on camera): The district attorney here in San Mateo County has indicated that he is aware of what happened in court but said that it would be a long shot for him to actually charge this woman with perjury. Meanwhile, court has adjourned for the week. Mark Geragos is scheduled to appear in a Santa Maria courtroom on Friday representing Michael Jackson.

Ted Rowlands, CNN, Redwood City, California. (END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Scott Peterson is accused of killing his pregnant wife and unborn son. The case has already been moved once to avoid potentially biased jurors.

HEMMER: Still to come here, an abducted boy returned to his mother after the instincts of a tourist. We'll talk to her next hour here.

O'BRIEN: Also John Kerry, he's not going to be shaking hands with anybody for a while. Dr. Sanjay Gupta's going to tell us what the candidate can expect from his surgery today.

HEMMER: Also in the coming hour, fire, then an explosion rocking a small town. Stay with us, let you know the aftermath of this, in a moment on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: In baseball, a torn rotator cuff could end your career. In politics, it might only sideline you for a couple of weeks. Senator John Kerry will undergo shoulder surgery today at a Boston hospital. And Dr. Sanjay Gupta is here to tell us a little bit more about the procedure, and also, maybe more importantly, the recovery.

Good morning.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

Yes, in baseball, I guess you hear about that. But politicians carrying the world on their shoulders maybe, a lot of handshaking.

O'BRIEN: Only in their own mind.

GUPTA: Right, lots of -- but seriously, a rotator torn cuff. His history dates back to '92. He actually had a fall off a bicycle at that time, broke his collarbone and several ribs, injuring his shoulder at that time. Sort of lived with it, as so many people do, with sort of painful shoulders, maybe a little bit of a rotator cuff injury at that time. Then, just this past January, on a campaign bus, the bus lurches forward, he grabs a handrail, and wrenches his shoulder back around. This is his right shoulder. Significant injury at that time. Sort of been living with it for the last couple of months, decided to have an operation today.

The rotator cuff, a lot of people do know about the rotator cuff, what it is, four muscles that essentially let you do various things with your arm, allows you to lift your arm about your head, move it around, things like that. If you have symptoms from a rotator cuff injury, you're going to have symptoms such as pain, obviously, pain in the shoulder. You also might feel your shoulder popping from time to time, and you sort of get that sense when you move it around and actually pop your shoulder. Also weakness, stiffness in the arms as well. Sometimes a bone spur can occur there as well. Obviously, in his case, he decided to have an operation to have this done. Now as far as operations go, it's actually one of the more commonly done operations. It takes about 30 to 40 minutes. It's done for a 1/2 to 2 inch incision that's right on the front of the shoulder blade here, and basically takes -- patients usually wake up right after anesthesia from this sort of thing.

O'BRIEN: Well, how do they fix it? What do they do?

GUPTA: Basically, there's a tendon that goes from one of the muscles to one of the bones, and that tendon is torn. All they do is essentially make a little incision in the shoulder and open up that tendon and suture it back together.

O'BRIEN: So seven to 10 days then, he waits for the sutures to come out. What's his recovery like?

GUPTA: Well, you know, we talks to the orthopedic surgeon. Dr. Zarens (ph) out of Boston is going to be doing this operation, basically said he's going to be in a sling for a few days. This is his dominant shoulder, which is the most commonplace for, you know, whatever dominant arm you have is the more likely shoulder to injure, and you're going to be in the sling for a few days. They say that a few days later, he should be out and around. He's probably not going to be doing a lot of handshaking or hoisting of babies, or anything like that for a while, but as far as pain, as far as recovery goes, you know, four and a half to six months, nine months to a year for a full recovery.

O'BRIEN: How long before he can do the -- I mean, you were sort of laughing while you said the handshaking and the hoisting of babies, but of course, all that is really critical to campaigning.

GUPTA: Absolutely. His doctor got that question more than anything else, talking about the handshaking. And you know, the sling for a few days. He obviously can't do any handshaking during that. A lot of that is just going to be sort of pain-limited after that, what he can tolerate. He's probably going to be on some pain medications, although doctors say, not narcotics, for more than a couple of days, and it's just going to be sort of pain-limited. You know, maybe a week or two before he can start doing -- he won't be doing any vigorous handshaking or any heavy baby lifting.

O'BRIEN: Maybe only very thin, small babies.

All right, Sanjay, thank you very much.

Can we talk now about my cold and what I can take, because I can't take anything to get over it?

GUPTA: Next segment.

O'BRIEN: I would really appreciate that. Put some thought into that. I need that -- Bill.

HEMMER: All right, Soledad, thanks. Before the operation, Senator Kerry appearing on MTV, talking about same-sex marriage, and Senator Kerry says he also believes homosexuality, quote, "who you are from birth," some serious topics and a few lighter issues as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well if I weren't cool and I told you I was cool, I wouldn't be cool. So, look, I don't know what I was in college. I was just like every other kid in college, trying to get by and probably, you know, made all my share of mistakes in trying to do that.

It's up to you, Michael, and other people to judge whether anything I do today is cool. My daughter would probably tell you I'm a freak at times.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: We will have to ask Vanessa about that. MTV now a must stop for presidential candidates.

In a moment here, should Donald Trump fire himself? Avoid his troubles facing Trump's casinos. In a moment, Andy's back with that, after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HEMMER: Welcome back.

JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Donald Trump fired up about his reality TV show, but his casinos are down on their luck. With that, Andy Serwer is here "Minding Your Business."

The Donald has got troubles in Atlantic City.

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Yes, we've been talking about this a little bit. You know, obviously, he's riding high with "The Apprentice," Manhattan real estate doing very well. But one part of his empire not riding so high, and that is the casino business, as you mentioned Jack.

A note yesterday released by his auditors, saying if he doesn't get an infusion of $400 million in Credit Suisse First Boston, the company faces bankruptcy; $1.8 billion, obviously being hurt by the Borgata, which is your new facility down in Atlantic City.

But the thing is you can always say this about The Donald, he is always on the edge, he doesn't really care about this casino business anyway, because he's kind of extricated himself, so this guy has got more lives than a cat. I would not worry about him.

CAFFERTY: Plus, if you get the banks in far enough, they have got to come up with the 400 million, because otherwise, they've got to go operate the damn casinos. So they'll give him the money and he'll be fine. SERWER: I think that's right.

A woman in Illinois, though, not so happy with The Donald lately. That's because she owns a pottery business called You're Fired. Now this is causing her some problems, because The Donald, of course that's his famous line from "The Apprentice." And now, he's trying to trademark, which I didn't know that, he's trying to trademark "You're fired." She's saying that's going to hurt her business, OK. I don't think she has a case here. Anyway, it's kind of a cute name for a little pottery place.

CAFFERTY: Oh, please. Just looking for some money.

SERWER: And speaking of casinos, Jack, this is kind of interesting, you won't believe this, down in New Mexico the Isleta Casino. It's big, it's big. it's down there south of Albuquerque. Listen to this, what they're saying. This is an ad campaign. They just pulled this, because people thought it was appropriate: "So the holidays have passed and those credit card bills keep piling up. There seems to be no relief in sight. How will you pay those huge bills? Well, the Isleta Casino Resort comes to your rescue!"

O'BRIEN: Oh, my God.

SERWER: Yes, That's from the department of puhleeze!

So anyway, they say fit to yank the ad.

O'BRIEN: What about the markets? We had two up days in a row. There must be something wrong.

SERWER: We're looking for three. Well, we are seeing some signs, perhaps, maybe some people are suggesting now, the economy is improving. You can see here, up across the board. The last day of the quarter today. This morning, Best Buy, that big consumer retail chain, electronics, saying that they sold a lot of stuff in the last quarter, some good numbers from that.

CAFFERTY: Big jobs reports Friday. The markets will be probably treading water a little ahead of that, too.

SERWER: That's right.

CAFFERTY: Thanks, Andy.

On to the Cafferty File. It's Wednesday -- things people said over the last week that got our attention, beginning with this: "When I said goodbye, he said this is a hell of a way to get viewers." NBC News correspondent Brian Williams on helping a man on an airplane who was having trouble breathing. Williams is a former emergency medical technician and volunteer firefighter.

"Halle Berry stood up there and thanked every else, but never said Diana Ross. I was nominated for an Academy Award for 'Lady Sings The Blues.' If it hadn't been for what I did, maybe she wouldn't have been standing there." This tedious, over the hill Diana Ross on being hurt that Halle Berry didn't thank her.

O'BRIEN: She's not over the hill. She has a little bit of a point.

Go on.

CAFFERTY: Thank you. Do you mind?

You get the whole rest of the three hours.

O'BRIEN: No, I have to split it with Hemmer.

CAFFERTY: She thanks Dorothy Dandridge, Lena Horne and Diahann Carroll, but she didn't mention Diana Ross. Now somehow, I just don't see Diana Ross in the same company as those other three, but hey, call me crazy.

Then there's this one: "Every morning she said, I despise you Mr. Trier, and she'd spit on the ground. That is unpleasant. She could have quit. I don't know why she didn't."

Director Lars Von Trier on working with the singer Bjork, the star of his film "Dancer in the Dark."

And finally this one: "It's not nice to make fun of people with issues." That would be Richard Simmons, that little dweeb exercise guy on slapping a fellow traveler at the Phoenix Airport.

O'BRIEN: I like Richard Simmons.

CAFFERTY: I'm not through, yet.

O'BRIEN: Sorry. Really? Not yet?

CAFFERTY: Who said, "Hey, everybody, it's Richard Simmons, let's drop our bags and rock to the 50s."

And I would like to thank Soledad for helping me.

SERWER: You never would have been here if it hadn't been for her.

O'BRIEN: I feel like I'm just helping bring you back on track. That's so kind of you.

HEMMER: Listen, while you were talking, she was writing out of control.

O'BRIEN: "Out of control" today. That's what I wrote.

CAFFERTY: When's the last hit movie Diana Ross had.

SERWER: She was in jail.

CAFFERTY: Oh yes, she was in jail for drunk driving, but she's not over the hill. O'BRIEN: I'm just saying, the woman has contributed a little bit, and maybe it was an oversight for Halle Berry, who is a lovely woman and next time I interview Halle, I'm going to ask her.

HEMMER: Your going to be off for a few days, right?

O'BRIEN: I am, thank God. Not even a little bit.

HEMMER: Let's get a break here in a moment.

Now that a deal has been struck, when will Condoleezza Rice testify? We'll get to that in a moment. A Republican member of the Senate Intel Committee with us live in D.C. Back in a moment, after this.

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