Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Live Today

Former Arizona Cardinal Pat Tillman Killed in Action in Afghanistan as Pentagon Fumes Over Release of Coffin Photos

Aired April 23, 2004 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: It is 11 a.m. on the East Coast, 8 a.m. on the West Coast. From CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Daryn Kagan.
Up first this hour on CNN, he walked away from the NFL playing field to join the Army after September 11 stirred his patriotism. Now former Arizona Cardinal Pat Tillman has been killed in action in Afghanistan. Our Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr joins with us this developing story -- Barbara.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Daryn, word reaching the Pentagon overnight that Pat Tillman was killed in action in southeastern Afghanistan. Yesterday his family now has been notified, we are told.

Pat Tillman had joined the U.S. Army Special Operations after the 9/11 attacks. He and his brother both giving up careers in sports to join the U.S. Military.

Pat Tillman was a safety for four years with the NFL with the Arizona Cardinals football team. Basically walking away from it all after the 9/11 attacks, joining the U.S. Military, joining the Rangers. He served a tour in Iraq and apparently now was in southeastern Afghanistan.

That is a part of Afghanistan that has been extremely dangerous. U.S. Special Forces, other conventional forces, Afghan army units have all been operating along that southeastern border region looking for Taliban and al Qaeda. There have been sporadic fire fights in that region over recent days and weeks.

This issue, however, Daryn, very sensitive here at the Pentagon. We are asked by Pentagon officials to remind people, of course, that hundreds of U.S. Troops have died in recent years in the war in Afghanistan, in the war in Iraq. Their names largely passing unnoticed by the public. But Pat Tillman was a name, a role model for many young Americans who watched him walk away from an NFL football career and join the U.S. military -- Daryn.

KAGAN: And it is with all due respect to the families that have lost loved ones in Iraq and in Afghanistan that we do report the story. As you said, he had some amount celebrity when he went off and his brother as well joined the military.

Ironic that we talk about the request on the Pentagon on a day when we're also talking about upset from the administration about the photos that have been released of other soldiers who were killed on duty.

STARR: This was a very unusual case. Under the Freedom of Information Act some photos on were released to a Web site that the Pentagon, perhaps, did not mean to release. They do not show these types of photographs of U.S. military remains being returned to Dover Air Force Base.

Nonetheless, these photographs never meant to be seen, only for history, have now been published, now coming out. This young man, you see, a soldier saluting his comrades. These pictures are very respectful, showing the ritual and ceremony that the U.S. military grants those come who are coming back.

It's just a very unusual look at what really happens for those making the final journey home.

KAGAN: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon. Barbara, thank you for both of those reports.

We want to get back to the Pat Tillman story, once again the former Arizona Cardinal. He walked away from his NFL career to join the Army along with his brother. He has been killed while serving in Afghanistan.

For more on the sports angle of the story, let's bring in Chris Dimino, 790 the Zone here in Atlanta. Chris, I would imagine you're getting a lot of phone calls, about this today.

CHRIS DIMINO, RADIO HOST: Yeah, Daryn. A lot of it when the news first broke. Certainly a lot of people figured out really where Pat Tillman fit in the NFL and why ultimately he did what he did. Choosing to go and serve.

Then again not serve in a way that he was going to go to bases and shake hands. it was much, much more than that. And the special training that required him to be in battle with something that he knew was going to have to happen first. This is not one of those situations where an agent or an athlete was looking for publicity because of some charity work. This goes way beyond that obviously.

KAGAN: He did it very privately. Once he made his decision he just left, he gave no interviews. Also there was some that tried to derive him, saying his career wasn't all it was going to be in the NFL. And yet, this was a man who always was trying to seek to go to the next level, even trying to beat his size in the position he was playing in the NFL.

DIMINO: Well this will sound strange as well. Football is a violent game and I think everybody knows that. I think what they take for granted everybody enjoys playing football.

Pat Tillman was one of those guys who enjoyed playing football. He enjoyed what went on the field and the contact and the things he had to do to play his position, at that level. Find the football and the guy with it and do something about it. I don't think Pat Tillman was on the down side. What I think Pat Tillman was kind of a throwback and I think it's easy to look at a guy who is undersized and say ago oh, well, $3.6 million on the table that he walked away from. It lets me know that someone had an interest in his football playing abilities.

KAGAN: How can the NFL go and honor him? How do you think, Chris?

DIMINO: That's a great question and I'm glad you brought up the sensitivity issue because it's a sensitive issue when with people serving in this situation. I'm sure the NFL will make note of it. It hasn't happened very often.

I think you'll go back to Vietnam to find another player who was killed in action. Buffalo Bills player back in the '60s and I think the NFL duly has to make note of it. But I also think they have to be sensitive to the issue that many of the people watching on TV every Sunday.

The people who drive the NFL are in situations where they have family members as well who are involved right now or who unfortunately might have passed.

KAGAN: Right and not just them, but the actual troops themselves. I'm sure the NFL making available their games overseas.

DIMINO: I think what you also have to take is this: you have to understand and appreciate what somebody was willing to give up. We all have thing in life we say we want to do life's circumstances might not allow us to do them.

He and his brother have decided especially after 9/11 that this was not something that could be overlooked any longer. It was an urge he and it was more than that, and he took action. I think that's what you honor. In my opinion more than the fact that he was an NFL player.

KAGAN: Good point. Chris Dimino, 790 the Zone here in Atlanta. Chris, thank you for your thoughts. We'll let you get back to the show here in Atlanta.

DIMINO: OK, Daryn, thank you.

KAGAN: We move on with other news. From the White House on down, officials are concerned about the possibility of a terrorist attack on U.S. soil. They're especially worried about events like political conventions and national holidays. Our Justice correspondent Kelli Arena has more on that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As al Qaeda or its associates are being blamed for the latest bombing in Riyadh, U.S. officials are becoming increasingly convinced another attack on U.S. soil could take place in the next few months. JOHN ASHCROFT, ATTORNEY GENERAL: There is, without a doubt in my mind a very serious level of activity of terrorism which concerns me greatly. We know that the terrorists have often sought symbolic targeting.

ARENA: Ashcroft's comments follow warnings from a myriad of officials from the President on down.

ROBERT MUELLER, FBI DIRECTOR: I think we have to be concerned about the possibility of terrorism attacks between now and the fall. The attacks in Madrid just before the elections there, we should we certainly have noted and we believe al Qaeda has noted.

ARENA: What's more, terrorism analysts believe Islamic extremists are becoming more angry as the U.S. continues to fight for democracy in Iraq. Officials say there is no credible or specific information regarding an attack. No time, place or tactic. Although there is speculative chatter to that effect.

REP. PORTER GOSS (R-FL), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: We are going to be on our guard. It will make it harder for the terrorists, but wherever they stick their heads up, they know we're going to be ready to come and get them.

ARENA (on camera): On a more positive note, counter terrorism officials say the public remains very much on guard. They say calls continue to come in from helpful citizens, reporting what they believe to be suspicious behavior.

Kelli Arena, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: From torn off roofs to toppled power lines, another day of severe weather in Oklahoma, are more storms in the forecast?

Plus, lifting the ban on "Mein Kampf." Why a German Jewish author wants his country to make Hitler's book available to a new generation of Germans.

And you've heard of Spider-Man, but what about Blak? Find out why his comic books are flying off the shelves that's all ahead on CNN LIVE TODAY.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(WEATHER REPORT)

KAGAN: Learning from the past. A German Jewish author is pushing Germany to drop the ban on Hitler's book, "Mein Kampf." but how do other Germans feel about that?

Plus the danger remains in Iraq, are Americans still interested in rebuilding the country we have the online buzz when CNN LIVE TODAY continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: Let's get you up to speed on the Middle East. Israeli troops staged raids across the West Bank today. Four Palestinians were killed. Israel says the men were militants aligned with the al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade or Yasser Arafat's Fatah movement. One of them was a civilian caught in the crossfire.

Now to concern about freight trains and chemical plants here in the U.S. as potential targets tend to increase. Some law makers and activists warn that terrorists could use freight trains carrying hazardous materials as weapons of mass destruction.

Security experts have also warned about the potential danger of chemical plants that could become targets. For some insight on just how vulnerable targets like freight trains and chemical plants might be, let's bring in former FBI investigator Bill Daly he is now with Controller's Risk Group and he is in New York City. Bill, good morning.

BILL DALY, FORMER FBI INVESTIGATOR: Good morning.

KAGAN: First of all. Let's just talk about how the infrastructure is set up across the U.S. You have train stations, and you have chemical plants and industrial sites close to population centers economically that has made sense.

DALY: Absolutely. When we developed these over the years it wasn't with the thought of trying to put them off into the desert some place away from where people lived. It was meant to give people jobs, meant to be near coastal looks where we could deliver raw materials to get to manufacturing sites to finished goods and as part of our economy.

Yes, they are embedded next to major metropolitan areas including places like here in New York City where there is some vulnerability, absolutely.

KAGAN: And even like what we've seen happen in the last 24 hours, in North Korea even though the North Koreans are saying that was an accident with the explosion, it is a good reminder of just how devastating something like that can be.

DALY: Oh, it is. And you know, it is not something that has gone unnoticed. If you remember going back several decades now to the Popol (ph) incident in India where thousands of people were killed because of the release of some gas.

The chemical industry has taken a number of steps to be able to limit the exposure of contaminants out into the air. Now this doesn't mean if somebody was to cause an explosion or disrupt the operation that things would not escape.

It means they've done some steps to be able to contain or limit the exposure at plants, but once we get into the area of transporting material such as this, whether it's by tanker truck or by tanker car and railroad, there certainly is an increased explosion because they're outside the confines of those plants and it is something the Homeland Security, Coast Guard and even the Chemical Association itself has looked at.

KAGAN: So how do you come up with a good working model of an economic situation that makes sense and yet trying to keep people safe?

DALY: Well, it certainly it is a balance. It's a balance between keeping these plants going, making them viable so they can produce raw and finished materials and also be able to make them more secure.

On the plant level it, actually becomes a little bit more academic because we have a closed proximity. We have a perimeter. We have a square, a circle we can work with.

It's once they start moving outside of those confines that we're concerned, but we have taken steps and the government has taken steps to limit the exposure during transport by making sure that the carriers themselves have certain licenses that people of background checks making sure that manifests and other information is more closely held and limiting the amount of material that might be transported any one time.

It's not to say that we're not exposed but I think if we look at the spectrum of exposure we have in our country from terrorists is that there are some other more desirable targets. Ones that are in the more public vein, one that are softer that could affect our economy affect citizens in a more direct way without having to go through several hurdles in order to get to the target much like you would at a chemical plant.

KAGAN: I'd love to ask you more questions on that.

In the minute we have left, I want to go from trains to planes, the Homeland Security Department looking at airport screeners, coming out with a very disturbing assessment whether they're a private company or the government running things, they're all doing a poor job.

DALY: It's sobering for people like all of us who travel. I'm actually surprised because in my certainly with a keen eye to it being in the industry, when I go through security is that they're doing much more.

I mean, just the other day I was asked to go through some special screening where they've gone through physically, my briefcase and my luggage. Taking off shoes. You know, it's very surprising and disappointing to hear that maybe these vulnerabilities, but they have been done with penetration studies that the government has conducted and it will be very interesting to hear what Homeland Security Department has to say about this.

In my own personal opinion as I looked at it, I would have said that time I would have said that there is more of a deterrent effect. There are more things going on. Apparently this study suggesting that the nuts and bolts of it aren't as we would have expected.

KAGAN: Shocking to those of us who travel so much. Really? That was all for nothing, apparently not. So far, it would appear doing better for many people traveling across the country.

Bill Daly, thanks for stopping by.

DALY: Thank you very much.

KAGAN: On to Germany. Some people say it's time to lift the government ban on Hitler's manifesto "Mein Kampf." Our Chris Burns has more from Berlin.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRIS BURNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It was ridiculed as the hysterical ranting of a jailed extremist. A book that became the blueprint for the Third Reich.

While in prison for the Beer Hall Putsch, the 1923 attempt to overthrow the government, Adolf Hitler wrote "Mein Kampf," "My Struggle," as a Nazi manifesto. A road map to power to demonize Jews, avenge Germany's humiliation after World War I and seek more lebensraum, room for Germans to live.

After the horrors of World War II, Germany banned "Mein Kampf" along with swastikas and Nazi salutes. But a prominent German Jewish author has made headlines by saying it's time to legalize "Mein Kampf."

RAFAEL SELIEMANN, AUTHOR: I believe the Germans are now ready, they are democratic and I don't think that they need watchdogs.

BURNS: Some say a regime known for book burnings shouldn't be exercised in a similar way.

(on camera): I could be arrested if I held up a copy of "Mein Kampf," but this is what the book leads to. Now a museum called the Topography of Terror, this is what's left of the Nazi Gestapo and the SS Secret Police headquarters, and the nerve center and the holocaust.

(voice-over): Split feelings here over whether to lift the book ban which makes it verboten to buy or sell the manuscript. Even on the Internet.

"I didn't hear or know about it in school," she says. "And if there was an appropriate explanation, then one would have better understood the war and what came before it."

"I don't want to read it," he says. "I think its trash."

Like Hitler's bunker, now covered by a playground, some ask whether keeping "Mein Kampf" of out of sight will keep the Nazi genie in a bottle or help erase the past.

Chris Burns, CNN, Berlin. (END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: President Bush travels to Florida today to talk the environment. A live report from the sunshine state is ahead when CNN LIVE TODAY continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired April 23, 2004 - 11:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: It is 11 a.m. on the East Coast, 8 a.m. on the West Coast. From CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Daryn Kagan.
Up first this hour on CNN, he walked away from the NFL playing field to join the Army after September 11 stirred his patriotism. Now former Arizona Cardinal Pat Tillman has been killed in action in Afghanistan. Our Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr joins with us this developing story -- Barbara.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Daryn, word reaching the Pentagon overnight that Pat Tillman was killed in action in southeastern Afghanistan. Yesterday his family now has been notified, we are told.

Pat Tillman had joined the U.S. Army Special Operations after the 9/11 attacks. He and his brother both giving up careers in sports to join the U.S. Military.

Pat Tillman was a safety for four years with the NFL with the Arizona Cardinals football team. Basically walking away from it all after the 9/11 attacks, joining the U.S. Military, joining the Rangers. He served a tour in Iraq and apparently now was in southeastern Afghanistan.

That is a part of Afghanistan that has been extremely dangerous. U.S. Special Forces, other conventional forces, Afghan army units have all been operating along that southeastern border region looking for Taliban and al Qaeda. There have been sporadic fire fights in that region over recent days and weeks.

This issue, however, Daryn, very sensitive here at the Pentagon. We are asked by Pentagon officials to remind people, of course, that hundreds of U.S. Troops have died in recent years in the war in Afghanistan, in the war in Iraq. Their names largely passing unnoticed by the public. But Pat Tillman was a name, a role model for many young Americans who watched him walk away from an NFL football career and join the U.S. military -- Daryn.

KAGAN: And it is with all due respect to the families that have lost loved ones in Iraq and in Afghanistan that we do report the story. As you said, he had some amount celebrity when he went off and his brother as well joined the military.

Ironic that we talk about the request on the Pentagon on a day when we're also talking about upset from the administration about the photos that have been released of other soldiers who were killed on duty.

STARR: This was a very unusual case. Under the Freedom of Information Act some photos on were released to a Web site that the Pentagon, perhaps, did not mean to release. They do not show these types of photographs of U.S. military remains being returned to Dover Air Force Base.

Nonetheless, these photographs never meant to be seen, only for history, have now been published, now coming out. This young man, you see, a soldier saluting his comrades. These pictures are very respectful, showing the ritual and ceremony that the U.S. military grants those come who are coming back.

It's just a very unusual look at what really happens for those making the final journey home.

KAGAN: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon. Barbara, thank you for both of those reports.

We want to get back to the Pat Tillman story, once again the former Arizona Cardinal. He walked away from his NFL career to join the Army along with his brother. He has been killed while serving in Afghanistan.

For more on the sports angle of the story, let's bring in Chris Dimino, 790 the Zone here in Atlanta. Chris, I would imagine you're getting a lot of phone calls, about this today.

CHRIS DIMINO, RADIO HOST: Yeah, Daryn. A lot of it when the news first broke. Certainly a lot of people figured out really where Pat Tillman fit in the NFL and why ultimately he did what he did. Choosing to go and serve.

Then again not serve in a way that he was going to go to bases and shake hands. it was much, much more than that. And the special training that required him to be in battle with something that he knew was going to have to happen first. This is not one of those situations where an agent or an athlete was looking for publicity because of some charity work. This goes way beyond that obviously.

KAGAN: He did it very privately. Once he made his decision he just left, he gave no interviews. Also there was some that tried to derive him, saying his career wasn't all it was going to be in the NFL. And yet, this was a man who always was trying to seek to go to the next level, even trying to beat his size in the position he was playing in the NFL.

DIMINO: Well this will sound strange as well. Football is a violent game and I think everybody knows that. I think what they take for granted everybody enjoys playing football.

Pat Tillman was one of those guys who enjoyed playing football. He enjoyed what went on the field and the contact and the things he had to do to play his position, at that level. Find the football and the guy with it and do something about it. I don't think Pat Tillman was on the down side. What I think Pat Tillman was kind of a throwback and I think it's easy to look at a guy who is undersized and say ago oh, well, $3.6 million on the table that he walked away from. It lets me know that someone had an interest in his football playing abilities.

KAGAN: How can the NFL go and honor him? How do you think, Chris?

DIMINO: That's a great question and I'm glad you brought up the sensitivity issue because it's a sensitive issue when with people serving in this situation. I'm sure the NFL will make note of it. It hasn't happened very often.

I think you'll go back to Vietnam to find another player who was killed in action. Buffalo Bills player back in the '60s and I think the NFL duly has to make note of it. But I also think they have to be sensitive to the issue that many of the people watching on TV every Sunday.

The people who drive the NFL are in situations where they have family members as well who are involved right now or who unfortunately might have passed.

KAGAN: Right and not just them, but the actual troops themselves. I'm sure the NFL making available their games overseas.

DIMINO: I think what you also have to take is this: you have to understand and appreciate what somebody was willing to give up. We all have thing in life we say we want to do life's circumstances might not allow us to do them.

He and his brother have decided especially after 9/11 that this was not something that could be overlooked any longer. It was an urge he and it was more than that, and he took action. I think that's what you honor. In my opinion more than the fact that he was an NFL player.

KAGAN: Good point. Chris Dimino, 790 the Zone here in Atlanta. Chris, thank you for your thoughts. We'll let you get back to the show here in Atlanta.

DIMINO: OK, Daryn, thank you.

KAGAN: We move on with other news. From the White House on down, officials are concerned about the possibility of a terrorist attack on U.S. soil. They're especially worried about events like political conventions and national holidays. Our Justice correspondent Kelli Arena has more on that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As al Qaeda or its associates are being blamed for the latest bombing in Riyadh, U.S. officials are becoming increasingly convinced another attack on U.S. soil could take place in the next few months. JOHN ASHCROFT, ATTORNEY GENERAL: There is, without a doubt in my mind a very serious level of activity of terrorism which concerns me greatly. We know that the terrorists have often sought symbolic targeting.

ARENA: Ashcroft's comments follow warnings from a myriad of officials from the President on down.

ROBERT MUELLER, FBI DIRECTOR: I think we have to be concerned about the possibility of terrorism attacks between now and the fall. The attacks in Madrid just before the elections there, we should we certainly have noted and we believe al Qaeda has noted.

ARENA: What's more, terrorism analysts believe Islamic extremists are becoming more angry as the U.S. continues to fight for democracy in Iraq. Officials say there is no credible or specific information regarding an attack. No time, place or tactic. Although there is speculative chatter to that effect.

REP. PORTER GOSS (R-FL), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: We are going to be on our guard. It will make it harder for the terrorists, but wherever they stick their heads up, they know we're going to be ready to come and get them.

ARENA (on camera): On a more positive note, counter terrorism officials say the public remains very much on guard. They say calls continue to come in from helpful citizens, reporting what they believe to be suspicious behavior.

Kelli Arena, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: From torn off roofs to toppled power lines, another day of severe weather in Oklahoma, are more storms in the forecast?

Plus, lifting the ban on "Mein Kampf." Why a German Jewish author wants his country to make Hitler's book available to a new generation of Germans.

And you've heard of Spider-Man, but what about Blak? Find out why his comic books are flying off the shelves that's all ahead on CNN LIVE TODAY.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(WEATHER REPORT)

KAGAN: Learning from the past. A German Jewish author is pushing Germany to drop the ban on Hitler's book, "Mein Kampf." but how do other Germans feel about that?

Plus the danger remains in Iraq, are Americans still interested in rebuilding the country we have the online buzz when CNN LIVE TODAY continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAGAN: Let's get you up to speed on the Middle East. Israeli troops staged raids across the West Bank today. Four Palestinians were killed. Israel says the men were militants aligned with the al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade or Yasser Arafat's Fatah movement. One of them was a civilian caught in the crossfire.

Now to concern about freight trains and chemical plants here in the U.S. as potential targets tend to increase. Some law makers and activists warn that terrorists could use freight trains carrying hazardous materials as weapons of mass destruction.

Security experts have also warned about the potential danger of chemical plants that could become targets. For some insight on just how vulnerable targets like freight trains and chemical plants might be, let's bring in former FBI investigator Bill Daly he is now with Controller's Risk Group and he is in New York City. Bill, good morning.

BILL DALY, FORMER FBI INVESTIGATOR: Good morning.

KAGAN: First of all. Let's just talk about how the infrastructure is set up across the U.S. You have train stations, and you have chemical plants and industrial sites close to population centers economically that has made sense.

DALY: Absolutely. When we developed these over the years it wasn't with the thought of trying to put them off into the desert some place away from where people lived. It was meant to give people jobs, meant to be near coastal looks where we could deliver raw materials to get to manufacturing sites to finished goods and as part of our economy.

Yes, they are embedded next to major metropolitan areas including places like here in New York City where there is some vulnerability, absolutely.

KAGAN: And even like what we've seen happen in the last 24 hours, in North Korea even though the North Koreans are saying that was an accident with the explosion, it is a good reminder of just how devastating something like that can be.

DALY: Oh, it is. And you know, it is not something that has gone unnoticed. If you remember going back several decades now to the Popol (ph) incident in India where thousands of people were killed because of the release of some gas.

The chemical industry has taken a number of steps to be able to limit the exposure of contaminants out into the air. Now this doesn't mean if somebody was to cause an explosion or disrupt the operation that things would not escape.

It means they've done some steps to be able to contain or limit the exposure at plants, but once we get into the area of transporting material such as this, whether it's by tanker truck or by tanker car and railroad, there certainly is an increased explosion because they're outside the confines of those plants and it is something the Homeland Security, Coast Guard and even the Chemical Association itself has looked at.

KAGAN: So how do you come up with a good working model of an economic situation that makes sense and yet trying to keep people safe?

DALY: Well, it certainly it is a balance. It's a balance between keeping these plants going, making them viable so they can produce raw and finished materials and also be able to make them more secure.

On the plant level it, actually becomes a little bit more academic because we have a closed proximity. We have a perimeter. We have a square, a circle we can work with.

It's once they start moving outside of those confines that we're concerned, but we have taken steps and the government has taken steps to limit the exposure during transport by making sure that the carriers themselves have certain licenses that people of background checks making sure that manifests and other information is more closely held and limiting the amount of material that might be transported any one time.

It's not to say that we're not exposed but I think if we look at the spectrum of exposure we have in our country from terrorists is that there are some other more desirable targets. Ones that are in the more public vein, one that are softer that could affect our economy affect citizens in a more direct way without having to go through several hurdles in order to get to the target much like you would at a chemical plant.

KAGAN: I'd love to ask you more questions on that.

In the minute we have left, I want to go from trains to planes, the Homeland Security Department looking at airport screeners, coming out with a very disturbing assessment whether they're a private company or the government running things, they're all doing a poor job.

DALY: It's sobering for people like all of us who travel. I'm actually surprised because in my certainly with a keen eye to it being in the industry, when I go through security is that they're doing much more.

I mean, just the other day I was asked to go through some special screening where they've gone through physically, my briefcase and my luggage. Taking off shoes. You know, it's very surprising and disappointing to hear that maybe these vulnerabilities, but they have been done with penetration studies that the government has conducted and it will be very interesting to hear what Homeland Security Department has to say about this.

In my own personal opinion as I looked at it, I would have said that time I would have said that there is more of a deterrent effect. There are more things going on. Apparently this study suggesting that the nuts and bolts of it aren't as we would have expected.

KAGAN: Shocking to those of us who travel so much. Really? That was all for nothing, apparently not. So far, it would appear doing better for many people traveling across the country.

Bill Daly, thanks for stopping by.

DALY: Thank you very much.

KAGAN: On to Germany. Some people say it's time to lift the government ban on Hitler's manifesto "Mein Kampf." Our Chris Burns has more from Berlin.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRIS BURNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It was ridiculed as the hysterical ranting of a jailed extremist. A book that became the blueprint for the Third Reich.

While in prison for the Beer Hall Putsch, the 1923 attempt to overthrow the government, Adolf Hitler wrote "Mein Kampf," "My Struggle," as a Nazi manifesto. A road map to power to demonize Jews, avenge Germany's humiliation after World War I and seek more lebensraum, room for Germans to live.

After the horrors of World War II, Germany banned "Mein Kampf" along with swastikas and Nazi salutes. But a prominent German Jewish author has made headlines by saying it's time to legalize "Mein Kampf."

RAFAEL SELIEMANN, AUTHOR: I believe the Germans are now ready, they are democratic and I don't think that they need watchdogs.

BURNS: Some say a regime known for book burnings shouldn't be exercised in a similar way.

(on camera): I could be arrested if I held up a copy of "Mein Kampf," but this is what the book leads to. Now a museum called the Topography of Terror, this is what's left of the Nazi Gestapo and the SS Secret Police headquarters, and the nerve center and the holocaust.

(voice-over): Split feelings here over whether to lift the book ban which makes it verboten to buy or sell the manuscript. Even on the Internet.

"I didn't hear or know about it in school," she says. "And if there was an appropriate explanation, then one would have better understood the war and what came before it."

"I don't want to read it," he says. "I think its trash."

Like Hitler's bunker, now covered by a playground, some ask whether keeping "Mein Kampf" of out of sight will keep the Nazi genie in a bottle or help erase the past.

Chris Burns, CNN, Berlin. (END VIDEOTAPE)

KAGAN: President Bush travels to Florida today to talk the environment. A live report from the sunshine state is ahead when CNN LIVE TODAY continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com