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CNN Live At Daybreak
Kobe Bryant Case, Hearings on Accuser's Sexual History; Ten Marines Reportedly Wounded in Fallujah
Aired April 26, 2004 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning to you from the CNN global headquarters in Atlanta. I'm Carol Costello. We'll take you live to Eagle, Colorado, in just a moment, but first here are the latest headlines right now.
West of Baghdad in the city of Fallujah intense fighting this morning on the city's northwest side. Ten Marines have been injured in the fighting, four of them seriously. Cobra attack helicopters are being used in the fighting, as well as 500-pound bombs.
A British arms dealing accused of trying to smuggle a shoulder- fired surface-to-air missile into the U.S. has a pretrial this morning in New Jersey.
This is Memorial Day in Israel. The Jewish state is paying homage to the thousands of soldiers and civilians killed in wars.
(WEATHER BREAK)
COSTELLO: Today begins three days of closed hearings in the Kobe Bryant case. At issue once again is the accuser's past, and more specifically her sexual history.
For a look at the arguments, let's head live to Eagle, Colorado, and Adrian Baschuk.
Good morning -- Adrian.
ADRIAN BASCHUK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Carol.
Kobe Bryant has to interrupt his playoff run and make into court at 8:30 a.m. today. These three days of hearings are the last scheduled round before a trial date may finally be set.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BASCHUK (voice-over): Fresh off of Sunday's Lakers-Rockets playoff game, Kobe Bryant must refocus his game on the legal battle of his life. Since the last preliminary hearing, a loss for team Bryant. Judge Terry Ruckriegle ruled that the accuser's medical and mental health records will remain sealed and confidential.
CYNTHIA STONE, COLORADO COALITION AGAINST SEXUAL ASSAULT: We thought that he had swung the pendulum back to where it should be.
BASCHUK: The Colorado Coalition Against Sexual Assault argues that Kobe Bryant's superstar status unfairly hurts the alleged victim.
STONE: This woman's life has been made hell, frankly.
BASCHUK: The accuser's mother has written the judge a letter pleading that hundreds of death threats had been made against her daughter's life. She spoke out at a National Victims' Rights Week rally in Denver last week.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to thank my daughter for teaching me about courage. I'm proud to be her mom.
BASCHUK: Closed-door pretrial hearings will resume on what portions of the accuser's sexual past will be admitted in the trial as evidence, a defense challenge to the state's rape shield law.
LARRY POZNER, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: The rape shield hearings, there is nothing that the law says is completely shielded. The law says how relevant is the evidence?
BASCHUK: Also, the judge is expected to address a possible trial date. Legal experts say if motions are still being argued in May, don't look for a trial to start until August.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
Before we even get to a possible trial date, Kobe Bryant must first enter a plea -- something he has not even done yet -- and formally declare his innocence before the court -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Adrian Baschuk reporting live this morning from Eagle, Colorado.
Michael Jackson is scheduled to be arraigned this week on child molestation charges, but when he heads into the Santa Barbara courtroom, he'll be without his usual high-profile defense team. Jackson has parted ways with attorneys Mark Geragos and Benjamin Brafman.
According to the Associated Press, Thomas Mesereau will take over as Jackson's lead counsel. Mesereau at one time was counsel for Mike Tyson, and he was also Robert Blake's attorney before leaving earlier this year due to irreconcilable differences.
Mesereau's former client, by the way, Robert Blake, will be back in court today with his fourth attorney. Count them, four. A judge will hear arguments on whether Blake's private investigator will be allowed to give his testimony before the trial begins. The defense is afraid the 77-year-old detective may not be available during a long trial.
Prosecution and defense attorneys will sum up their cases when the trial of former NBA star Jayson Williams resumes this morning. Williams is facing eight charges, including manslaughter. The jury will receive instructions tomorrow before beginning deliberations.
Coming up on DAYBREAK, we will have the latest for you out of Fallujah, Iraq. We're getting in new pictures. We'll explain what they are. Ten U.S. Marines wounded there this morning.
And, one rookie gets a rocky welcome to the pros. We've got all the highs and lows from the NFL draft this weekend.
And then, musical lyrics no composer could make up, inspired by none other than Donald Rumsfeld.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COSTELLO: It's 6:38 Eastern Time. Welcome back to DAYBREAK.
We've been following the situation out of Fallujah, Iraq, all morning long. There is fighting going on there between the Marines and Iraqi insurgents.
David Clinch is here to tell us more of what's happening right now.
DAVID CLINCH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL EDITOR: Yes, Carol, we're getting an assemblage of video and information from our pool, friends in Fallujah today. The video that we're seeing right now live, we're told, is the scene of a mosque, which was destroyed by the U.S. forces when they, Marines, reported that they were receiving fire from this mosque.
If you remember a few weeks ago when the U.S. forces initially moved in, we had these shots of mosques in the background as the Marines were marching in, and we were hearing that the clerics in the mosques were calling for resistance to the Marines as they moved it.
It's now moved beyond that to the fact that the insurgents are apparently basing themselves in the mosques themselves and firing directly at the Marines.
COSTELLO: So, let me get this straight. The Marines have destroyed that mosque...
CLINCH: The Marines...
COSTELLO: ... on purpose?
CLINCH: ... spotting fire coming from that mosque, we're told, called in air support. There were helicopters and fighter jets in the air over Fallujah today. I couldn't tell you exactly what hit that location, but the Marines have the ability at a moment's notice when they see incoming fire to call in air support.
COSTELLO: And the reason I'm sort of emphasizing that this was a mosque is because there's a general assumption that whenever you hit something like that, it will incite people even more.
CLINCH: Right. Well, this is the very hot issue. It was a hot issue when they moved in, because if you remember on at lease a couple of occasions, the U.S. did hit buildings adjacent to mosques, even hitting mosques themselves, only -- in their view, only when they can establish beyond that that they are being fired upon from those mosques.
Red Cross International rules basically establish that any building that is being used to fire offensively at the other side becomes a legitimate target.
COSTELLO: And interestingly enough, in Najaf, another city...
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: ... apparently insurgents are stockpiling weapons inside mosques there.
CLINCH: Right. Well, true. There are mosques and there are mosques, though. There are mosques in Fallujah, which are holy and revered by the people who live there. The mosque in Najaf, the central mosque there is the -- one of the most important mosques for Shiite Muslims throughout the world. It's a very different question than what we're hearing, seeing here in Fallujah.
But on the other hand, it is a sensitive issue. You were talking earlier about these joint patrols that are about to happen. The violence today, we're told by our pool reporters -- and this is a live picture we're seeing from Fallujah right now -- the violence started this morning when the Marines by themselves tried to venture out into one part of town. You see the explosions happening right here live. This is amazing stuff.
COSTELLO: Now, are the explosions coming from the ground or from the air?
CLINCH: I'm obviously not in a position to tell you for sure.
COSTELLO: I'm sorry.
CLINCH: But we do know that the sequence that the Marines have been following is they see incoming fire coming to their positions. They are in a position to immediately call in air support, both gunships and fighter jets above, triangulate the target they're aiming for, and destroy it. That is the sequence that we've been seeing over the last few days, and they continue to do this. Obviously, again reminding the audience, this is happening with the theoretical cease- fire existing until at least Tuesday when an all-out assault might happen if the U.S. sees this insurgency continuing.
COSTELLO: And again, to make clear, the U.S. is going to try another tact before perhaps that all-out offensive.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: They're going to have Iraqi security forces walking alongside U.S. Marines...
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: ... through the streets of Fallujah rooting people out. CLINCH: Right. We haven't seen that begin yet. When it does begin, it's going to be very interesting to see how successful that is.
COSTELLO: David Clinch, many thanks.
CLINCH: All right.
COSTELLO: Live pictures from Fallujah this morning.
Your news, money, weather and sports. It is 6:42 Eastern Time. Here's what's all new this morning.
Kobe Bryant will be in court for hearings today. Attorneys are expected to present arguments on whether the sexual history of Bryant's accuser should be introduced as evidence.
In money news, the brand spanking new $50 bill will be unveiled today. The new bills are expected to look pretty much like those new colorful $20 bills. Production of the new 50s is set to begin this summer.
In sports, an attorney for Olympic gold medalist Marian Jones denies drug allegations. The "San Francisco Chronicle" reports a lab owner tied to a steroid probe told federal agents he gave Jones performance-enhancing drugs in exchange for endorsements.
In culture, Denzel Washington's "Man on Fire" is tops at the box office with a $23 million take. It was Washington's biggest opening since his Oscar-winning performance in "Training Day."
(WEATHER BREAK)
COSTELLO: Those are the latest headlines for you. Still to come on DAYBREAK, the winners and losers in the NFL draft. We'll share some of the cheers and jeers you might have missed over the weekend.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COSTELLO: All right, we're back now. We want to talk more about what's happening right now in Fallujah.
David Clinch is here to try to help us sort through this. It's very -- well, it's not really that confusing, but we don't know exactly what's going on.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: That heavy, black smoke, where is that coming from?
CLINCH: Well, I should explain. The means of communication with Fallujah are very difficult. We've got a pool reporter there. He's reporting for us and all of the U.S. networks. We are trying to establish contact with him. He has been able to tell us the U.S. airport has been able to call us in.
Actually, I think our pool reporter is about to give us a report from Fallujah.
COSTELLO: Let's go to -- let's go to him now.
KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Live to tape where you can take these images live. This is the northwest edge of Fallujah. What we're seeing now is heavy plumes of black smoke rising from two buildings, where Marines were pinned down by insurgent fire earlier this morning.
Before dawn, a Marine platoon headed out from their position, where I'm standing now, a small base, and headed across to the southeast edge of a cemetery, to those two buildings that are now on fire. The Marine platoon occupied those buildings for the space of about five hours, and then, in the words of one Marine, all hell broke loose.
Insurgents had massed in the vicinity of those two buildings, and opened fire with rockets, with mortars, with automatic machine gunfire. And the Marines were really fighting for their lives for the space of about an hour and a half in those two buildings.
The company commander, Captain Douglas Zimbeck (ph), says that he's very proud of his soldiers, and he says -- quote -- "His men fought like lions."
What they did do after about an hour and a half of fighting in those positions that are now on fire, they pulled back, pulled back to this small base about 200 yards away and continued the firefight with what Captain Zimbeck (ph) described as a large number of insurgents.
Now, we are told by Captain Zimbeck (ph) that four of his Marines are pretty seriously wounded, in his words. He also says that six other Marines have received shrapnel wounds and have been bleeding, but they are believed to be OK.
Since that firefight, Cobra attack helicopters have been called in, in the last few minutes. We've heard those two Marine Cobra attack helicopters raking the area with heavy machine gunfire from those helicopters. And also from a position further back than where we're standing, Marines have been sending in 81-milimeter mortars, and this is what has impacted those two buildings there, setting them on fire and sending these heavy plumes of black smoke into the air over the northwest edge of Fallujah.
Now, beyond that point, to the left of where we're looking now, lay a mosque. And in the course of the firefight, Marines reported that they were receiving sniper fire from that mosque. The minaret of that mosque has now been leveled. It was a minaret that stood possibly 50-60 feet high. There's now nothing left of that minaret.
We've also been hearing, though, from Baghdad that coalition authorities have extended the deadline for insurgent forces to hand over their weapons and to really agree to a cease-fire that would see Marines taking their weapons, arresting some of the ringleaders, but this so far hasn't happened. According to Marine commanders, the insurgents so far have only handed in aging and rusting weapons they describe as junk.
And as we saw from this firefight this morning, there is no sign that the insurgents are about to give in, about to surrender their weapons and about to lay down their arms.
Again, as I say, this on the northwest edge of Fallujah. This is where over recent days the heaviest cease-fire violations have been taking place. As we speak now, as well we can see Cobra attack helicopters wheeling over in the distance again. Marines in the position where we are now, taking up positions in bunkers and looking out, making sure that there are no insurgents leaving those buildings, which are now on fire, in case there are snipers. And also heavy machine guns are on hand, and they will certainly engage those forces.
Just to recap then, as I say, intense firefights this morning on the northwest edge of Fallujah a Marine platoon comes under heavy fire. And we understand from the company commander four Marines pretty seriously wounded, in his words. Six others at least have received shrapnel wounds.
This is Karl Penhaul reporting from the northwest edge of Fallujah for the U.S. networks pool.
COSTELLO: All right, we see what's happening in Fallujah right now. A couple of questions for David Clinch right now.
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: He says that this part of Fallujah, where this industrial park is, of course, the cease-fire was never really firmly in place.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: In other parts of the city, in other parts of Fallujah, is there a definite cease-fire?
CLINCH: Well, the absence of fighting could be the equivalent of a cease-fire, is the way it's described to us. There has been less fighting in other parts of the city, even to the point -- and we were talking about this earlier -- where we continue to see even today more families moving back into Fallujah. The way it's being described to us is that there are parts of town where you can go and live relatively free. The insurgents, at least a portion of them, have chosen this part of town. The Marines, of course, have chosen their positions, and this is where the fighting is happening.
We were talking about rules of war earlier and taking the high ground. Rules of war as well, pick your battleground. And clearly, the insurgents believe that they have some kind of an advantage being in this area.
COSTELLO: Something that could turn explosive is the destruction of this mosque, and snipers were apparently shooting at Marines. They fired back.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: And it, in essence, destroyed this mosque.
CLINCH: Yes. Now, again, not the first time we've seen this. The Marines and the U.S. forces in general have hit mosques before when it is clear to them that fire is coming from those mosques to their position. There is a precedent for that.
Obviously, the more it happens, the more that it's reported. And, of course, again, in the region, something that we always have to be aware of, we see something. We see our perspective on this. In the Arab world, these things, of course, are put out with a different perspective, and that is part of the story. Whether the Marines like it or not, destroying mosques doesn't go down that well on Al Jazeera, et cetera.
Now, obviously, on the other hand, if fighting is going on, that is something the Marines believe that they have to do to protect themselves.
Look at these pictures here.
COSTELLO: Oh, my goodness! We have Jim...
CLINCH: That's live.
COSTELLO: We have Jim Clancy in Baghdad as well, because there was some violence there, too, this morning.
Jim -- are you with us?
JIM CLANCY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I certainly am, Carol. Good to join you and David.
COSTELLO: What do you have to tell us, Jim?
CLANCY: Well, we had another -- we had an explosion. I don't want to say another explosion -- we haven't quite determined what the source of this one was -- a huge explosion in Baghdad.
According to eyewitnesses on the scene being quoted by news agencies here, this was a blast that occurred after about a dozen U.S. soldiers approached a site in Baghdad. They were trying to enter that site when the explosion occurred. We've seen a videotape showing burning Humvee vehicles that were apparently parked outside.
We just talked to the U.S.-led coalition. They are telling us that there were no U.S. casualties in this. Now, that's conflicting with other accounts.
This does not appear right now to be a roadside bomb. It completely flattened the building there. It's in an area where there are numerous chemical companies, chemical storage sites, some of whom have been -- some of which have been searched in the past by the U.S. military looking for links or hints to some of the explosives that have been troubling U.S. troops and aiding the insurgents across Iraq. COSTELLO: And there were some American injuries there, weren't there, Jim? Although we're not sure how many.
CLANCY: Well, there may well have been, and all of the indications are that there would have almost had to have been some U.S. injuries there or coalition injuries. However, as I just said, that the coalition is telling us no injuries.
And that is often the case, until and unless they get the information and get it confirmed. This can be an hours-long process. I'm afraid we just have to be patient as we wait for those kinds of confirmations to come in.
COSTELLO: And, David, let's get back to these pictures coming out of Fallujah right now. We're seeing very large explosions...
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: ... which makes you wonder what are in those buildings. Because I know this is an industrial area in Fallujah.
CLINCH: Right. Exactly. Karl Penhaul, the pool reporter reporting for us and the other U.S. networks, making it clear that there was an on-the-ground fight at one point in these buildings. The Marines pulled back. Gunships were hauled in, and they've hit these buildings.
Whether those explosions are caused only by the missiles or perhaps by weapons or other things in those buildings, we will not know. I mean, the information flow in Baghdad is slow enough. The information flow here is what you see is what you know.
COSTELLO: Exactly.
CLINCH: Until the Marines have an opportunity to go back to those buildings at some point, if they do, we don't know exactly what's causing the explosions, other than the fact that they are being hit by gunships from above.
COSTELLO: And, again, in case you're just joining us, 10 U.S. Marines have been injured, four quite seriously. Six have shrapnel wounds.
You know, Jim Clancy, this happens on a day when the Iraqis released pictures of their new flag.
CLANCY: That's right. There is a new flag that's put out by the Iraqi Governing Council. I don't think it's getting a lot of interest even from Iraqis today. Many of them are wondering about it. I don't know. I guess you're showing perhaps this flag to the viewers, a white background with a crescent on it, an Islamic crescent. The white background is said to represent peace. Two blue stripes along the bottom of the flag is said to represent, of course, the two great rivers of Iraq, the Tigris and the Euphrates. Also, in the middle there, a yellow stripe, representing the Kurdish minority in Iraq.
So, that is the proposed new flag. We'll see how it goes over with the Iraqi citizens, who were very...
(CROSSTALK)
COSTELLO: Yes, all trying to get to that -- all trying to get to that June 30 deadline when the transfer of power is to happen. But the violence just keeps happening, especially in cities like Fallujah. And tell us...
CLANCY: Well, that's right. And, you know...
COSTELLO: Go ahead, Jim.
CLANCY: Carol, right now, what you're seeing there in Fallujah, very important questions being asked. Is this a last-ditch effort by the insurgents there to confront U.S. forces on the eve of when they are hoping they can begin joint patrols to bring some semblance of order there? Certainly, it's saying that the calls for a cease-fire are not being heeded by the insurgents themselves. Perhaps Iraqis look at the pictures and say, the U.S. is escalating the situation. They are not responding in kind. They are making matters worse.
COSTELLO: Jim Clancy, many thanks to you.
A last question for you, David. These Iraqi security personnel who are supposedly going to patrol the streets of Fallujah, along with U.S. Marines, are they willing, are they able?
CLINCH: Yes. Well, it's a very good question. We have seen, and the U.S. forces have told us on many occasions, where they have relied on Iraqi forces to turn up. They haven't turned up. But we do know that in Fallujah itself and other hot areas that the United States military has gone out of its way to define and to train and to clarify exactly which Iraqi forces they want to work with. And we have good reason to believe that they have an element of the Iraqi military that they have picked out to work with them.
Whether they'll be able to go out in the streets is another question completely. And, you know, you have this in Fallujah. You have that massive explosion in Baghdad. You have U.S. troops replacing the Spanish, who are leaving in Najaf. This is all over the country today, and it's quite difficult to pull it all back together.
COSTELLO: All right, but we will try. David Clinch, many thanks.
Thank you for joining DAYBREAK. "AMERICAN MORNING" starts right now.
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Aired April 26, 2004 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning to you from the CNN global headquarters in Atlanta. I'm Carol Costello. We'll take you live to Eagle, Colorado, in just a moment, but first here are the latest headlines right now.
West of Baghdad in the city of Fallujah intense fighting this morning on the city's northwest side. Ten Marines have been injured in the fighting, four of them seriously. Cobra attack helicopters are being used in the fighting, as well as 500-pound bombs.
A British arms dealing accused of trying to smuggle a shoulder- fired surface-to-air missile into the U.S. has a pretrial this morning in New Jersey.
This is Memorial Day in Israel. The Jewish state is paying homage to the thousands of soldiers and civilians killed in wars.
(WEATHER BREAK)
COSTELLO: Today begins three days of closed hearings in the Kobe Bryant case. At issue once again is the accuser's past, and more specifically her sexual history.
For a look at the arguments, let's head live to Eagle, Colorado, and Adrian Baschuk.
Good morning -- Adrian.
ADRIAN BASCHUK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Carol.
Kobe Bryant has to interrupt his playoff run and make into court at 8:30 a.m. today. These three days of hearings are the last scheduled round before a trial date may finally be set.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BASCHUK (voice-over): Fresh off of Sunday's Lakers-Rockets playoff game, Kobe Bryant must refocus his game on the legal battle of his life. Since the last preliminary hearing, a loss for team Bryant. Judge Terry Ruckriegle ruled that the accuser's medical and mental health records will remain sealed and confidential.
CYNTHIA STONE, COLORADO COALITION AGAINST SEXUAL ASSAULT: We thought that he had swung the pendulum back to where it should be.
BASCHUK: The Colorado Coalition Against Sexual Assault argues that Kobe Bryant's superstar status unfairly hurts the alleged victim.
STONE: This woman's life has been made hell, frankly.
BASCHUK: The accuser's mother has written the judge a letter pleading that hundreds of death threats had been made against her daughter's life. She spoke out at a National Victims' Rights Week rally in Denver last week.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to thank my daughter for teaching me about courage. I'm proud to be her mom.
BASCHUK: Closed-door pretrial hearings will resume on what portions of the accuser's sexual past will be admitted in the trial as evidence, a defense challenge to the state's rape shield law.
LARRY POZNER, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: The rape shield hearings, there is nothing that the law says is completely shielded. The law says how relevant is the evidence?
BASCHUK: Also, the judge is expected to address a possible trial date. Legal experts say if motions are still being argued in May, don't look for a trial to start until August.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
Before we even get to a possible trial date, Kobe Bryant must first enter a plea -- something he has not even done yet -- and formally declare his innocence before the court -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Adrian Baschuk reporting live this morning from Eagle, Colorado.
Michael Jackson is scheduled to be arraigned this week on child molestation charges, but when he heads into the Santa Barbara courtroom, he'll be without his usual high-profile defense team. Jackson has parted ways with attorneys Mark Geragos and Benjamin Brafman.
According to the Associated Press, Thomas Mesereau will take over as Jackson's lead counsel. Mesereau at one time was counsel for Mike Tyson, and he was also Robert Blake's attorney before leaving earlier this year due to irreconcilable differences.
Mesereau's former client, by the way, Robert Blake, will be back in court today with his fourth attorney. Count them, four. A judge will hear arguments on whether Blake's private investigator will be allowed to give his testimony before the trial begins. The defense is afraid the 77-year-old detective may not be available during a long trial.
Prosecution and defense attorneys will sum up their cases when the trial of former NBA star Jayson Williams resumes this morning. Williams is facing eight charges, including manslaughter. The jury will receive instructions tomorrow before beginning deliberations.
Coming up on DAYBREAK, we will have the latest for you out of Fallujah, Iraq. We're getting in new pictures. We'll explain what they are. Ten U.S. Marines wounded there this morning.
And, one rookie gets a rocky welcome to the pros. We've got all the highs and lows from the NFL draft this weekend.
And then, musical lyrics no composer could make up, inspired by none other than Donald Rumsfeld.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COSTELLO: It's 6:38 Eastern Time. Welcome back to DAYBREAK.
We've been following the situation out of Fallujah, Iraq, all morning long. There is fighting going on there between the Marines and Iraqi insurgents.
David Clinch is here to tell us more of what's happening right now.
DAVID CLINCH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL EDITOR: Yes, Carol, we're getting an assemblage of video and information from our pool, friends in Fallujah today. The video that we're seeing right now live, we're told, is the scene of a mosque, which was destroyed by the U.S. forces when they, Marines, reported that they were receiving fire from this mosque.
If you remember a few weeks ago when the U.S. forces initially moved in, we had these shots of mosques in the background as the Marines were marching in, and we were hearing that the clerics in the mosques were calling for resistance to the Marines as they moved it.
It's now moved beyond that to the fact that the insurgents are apparently basing themselves in the mosques themselves and firing directly at the Marines.
COSTELLO: So, let me get this straight. The Marines have destroyed that mosque...
CLINCH: The Marines...
COSTELLO: ... on purpose?
CLINCH: ... spotting fire coming from that mosque, we're told, called in air support. There were helicopters and fighter jets in the air over Fallujah today. I couldn't tell you exactly what hit that location, but the Marines have the ability at a moment's notice when they see incoming fire to call in air support.
COSTELLO: And the reason I'm sort of emphasizing that this was a mosque is because there's a general assumption that whenever you hit something like that, it will incite people even more.
CLINCH: Right. Well, this is the very hot issue. It was a hot issue when they moved in, because if you remember on at lease a couple of occasions, the U.S. did hit buildings adjacent to mosques, even hitting mosques themselves, only -- in their view, only when they can establish beyond that that they are being fired upon from those mosques.
Red Cross International rules basically establish that any building that is being used to fire offensively at the other side becomes a legitimate target.
COSTELLO: And interestingly enough, in Najaf, another city...
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: ... apparently insurgents are stockpiling weapons inside mosques there.
CLINCH: Right. Well, true. There are mosques and there are mosques, though. There are mosques in Fallujah, which are holy and revered by the people who live there. The mosque in Najaf, the central mosque there is the -- one of the most important mosques for Shiite Muslims throughout the world. It's a very different question than what we're hearing, seeing here in Fallujah.
But on the other hand, it is a sensitive issue. You were talking earlier about these joint patrols that are about to happen. The violence today, we're told by our pool reporters -- and this is a live picture we're seeing from Fallujah right now -- the violence started this morning when the Marines by themselves tried to venture out into one part of town. You see the explosions happening right here live. This is amazing stuff.
COSTELLO: Now, are the explosions coming from the ground or from the air?
CLINCH: I'm obviously not in a position to tell you for sure.
COSTELLO: I'm sorry.
CLINCH: But we do know that the sequence that the Marines have been following is they see incoming fire coming to their positions. They are in a position to immediately call in air support, both gunships and fighter jets above, triangulate the target they're aiming for, and destroy it. That is the sequence that we've been seeing over the last few days, and they continue to do this. Obviously, again reminding the audience, this is happening with the theoretical cease- fire existing until at least Tuesday when an all-out assault might happen if the U.S. sees this insurgency continuing.
COSTELLO: And again, to make clear, the U.S. is going to try another tact before perhaps that all-out offensive.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: They're going to have Iraqi security forces walking alongside U.S. Marines...
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: ... through the streets of Fallujah rooting people out. CLINCH: Right. We haven't seen that begin yet. When it does begin, it's going to be very interesting to see how successful that is.
COSTELLO: David Clinch, many thanks.
CLINCH: All right.
COSTELLO: Live pictures from Fallujah this morning.
Your news, money, weather and sports. It is 6:42 Eastern Time. Here's what's all new this morning.
Kobe Bryant will be in court for hearings today. Attorneys are expected to present arguments on whether the sexual history of Bryant's accuser should be introduced as evidence.
In money news, the brand spanking new $50 bill will be unveiled today. The new bills are expected to look pretty much like those new colorful $20 bills. Production of the new 50s is set to begin this summer.
In sports, an attorney for Olympic gold medalist Marian Jones denies drug allegations. The "San Francisco Chronicle" reports a lab owner tied to a steroid probe told federal agents he gave Jones performance-enhancing drugs in exchange for endorsements.
In culture, Denzel Washington's "Man on Fire" is tops at the box office with a $23 million take. It was Washington's biggest opening since his Oscar-winning performance in "Training Day."
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COSTELLO: Those are the latest headlines for you. Still to come on DAYBREAK, the winners and losers in the NFL draft. We'll share some of the cheers and jeers you might have missed over the weekend.
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COSTELLO: All right, we're back now. We want to talk more about what's happening right now in Fallujah.
David Clinch is here to try to help us sort through this. It's very -- well, it's not really that confusing, but we don't know exactly what's going on.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: That heavy, black smoke, where is that coming from?
CLINCH: Well, I should explain. The means of communication with Fallujah are very difficult. We've got a pool reporter there. He's reporting for us and all of the U.S. networks. We are trying to establish contact with him. He has been able to tell us the U.S. airport has been able to call us in.
Actually, I think our pool reporter is about to give us a report from Fallujah.
COSTELLO: Let's go to -- let's go to him now.
KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Live to tape where you can take these images live. This is the northwest edge of Fallujah. What we're seeing now is heavy plumes of black smoke rising from two buildings, where Marines were pinned down by insurgent fire earlier this morning.
Before dawn, a Marine platoon headed out from their position, where I'm standing now, a small base, and headed across to the southeast edge of a cemetery, to those two buildings that are now on fire. The Marine platoon occupied those buildings for the space of about five hours, and then, in the words of one Marine, all hell broke loose.
Insurgents had massed in the vicinity of those two buildings, and opened fire with rockets, with mortars, with automatic machine gunfire. And the Marines were really fighting for their lives for the space of about an hour and a half in those two buildings.
The company commander, Captain Douglas Zimbeck (ph), says that he's very proud of his soldiers, and he says -- quote -- "His men fought like lions."
What they did do after about an hour and a half of fighting in those positions that are now on fire, they pulled back, pulled back to this small base about 200 yards away and continued the firefight with what Captain Zimbeck (ph) described as a large number of insurgents.
Now, we are told by Captain Zimbeck (ph) that four of his Marines are pretty seriously wounded, in his words. He also says that six other Marines have received shrapnel wounds and have been bleeding, but they are believed to be OK.
Since that firefight, Cobra attack helicopters have been called in, in the last few minutes. We've heard those two Marine Cobra attack helicopters raking the area with heavy machine gunfire from those helicopters. And also from a position further back than where we're standing, Marines have been sending in 81-milimeter mortars, and this is what has impacted those two buildings there, setting them on fire and sending these heavy plumes of black smoke into the air over the northwest edge of Fallujah.
Now, beyond that point, to the left of where we're looking now, lay a mosque. And in the course of the firefight, Marines reported that they were receiving sniper fire from that mosque. The minaret of that mosque has now been leveled. It was a minaret that stood possibly 50-60 feet high. There's now nothing left of that minaret.
We've also been hearing, though, from Baghdad that coalition authorities have extended the deadline for insurgent forces to hand over their weapons and to really agree to a cease-fire that would see Marines taking their weapons, arresting some of the ringleaders, but this so far hasn't happened. According to Marine commanders, the insurgents so far have only handed in aging and rusting weapons they describe as junk.
And as we saw from this firefight this morning, there is no sign that the insurgents are about to give in, about to surrender their weapons and about to lay down their arms.
Again, as I say, this on the northwest edge of Fallujah. This is where over recent days the heaviest cease-fire violations have been taking place. As we speak now, as well we can see Cobra attack helicopters wheeling over in the distance again. Marines in the position where we are now, taking up positions in bunkers and looking out, making sure that there are no insurgents leaving those buildings, which are now on fire, in case there are snipers. And also heavy machine guns are on hand, and they will certainly engage those forces.
Just to recap then, as I say, intense firefights this morning on the northwest edge of Fallujah a Marine platoon comes under heavy fire. And we understand from the company commander four Marines pretty seriously wounded, in his words. Six others at least have received shrapnel wounds.
This is Karl Penhaul reporting from the northwest edge of Fallujah for the U.S. networks pool.
COSTELLO: All right, we see what's happening in Fallujah right now. A couple of questions for David Clinch right now.
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: He says that this part of Fallujah, where this industrial park is, of course, the cease-fire was never really firmly in place.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: In other parts of the city, in other parts of Fallujah, is there a definite cease-fire?
CLINCH: Well, the absence of fighting could be the equivalent of a cease-fire, is the way it's described to us. There has been less fighting in other parts of the city, even to the point -- and we were talking about this earlier -- where we continue to see even today more families moving back into Fallujah. The way it's being described to us is that there are parts of town where you can go and live relatively free. The insurgents, at least a portion of them, have chosen this part of town. The Marines, of course, have chosen their positions, and this is where the fighting is happening.
We were talking about rules of war earlier and taking the high ground. Rules of war as well, pick your battleground. And clearly, the insurgents believe that they have some kind of an advantage being in this area.
COSTELLO: Something that could turn explosive is the destruction of this mosque, and snipers were apparently shooting at Marines. They fired back.
CLINCH: Right.
COSTELLO: And it, in essence, destroyed this mosque.
CLINCH: Yes. Now, again, not the first time we've seen this. The Marines and the U.S. forces in general have hit mosques before when it is clear to them that fire is coming from those mosques to their position. There is a precedent for that.
Obviously, the more it happens, the more that it's reported. And, of course, again, in the region, something that we always have to be aware of, we see something. We see our perspective on this. In the Arab world, these things, of course, are put out with a different perspective, and that is part of the story. Whether the Marines like it or not, destroying mosques doesn't go down that well on Al Jazeera, et cetera.
Now, obviously, on the other hand, if fighting is going on, that is something the Marines believe that they have to do to protect themselves.
Look at these pictures here.
COSTELLO: Oh, my goodness! We have Jim...
CLINCH: That's live.
COSTELLO: We have Jim Clancy in Baghdad as well, because there was some violence there, too, this morning.
Jim -- are you with us?
JIM CLANCY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I certainly am, Carol. Good to join you and David.
COSTELLO: What do you have to tell us, Jim?
CLANCY: Well, we had another -- we had an explosion. I don't want to say another explosion -- we haven't quite determined what the source of this one was -- a huge explosion in Baghdad.
According to eyewitnesses on the scene being quoted by news agencies here, this was a blast that occurred after about a dozen U.S. soldiers approached a site in Baghdad. They were trying to enter that site when the explosion occurred. We've seen a videotape showing burning Humvee vehicles that were apparently parked outside.
We just talked to the U.S.-led coalition. They are telling us that there were no U.S. casualties in this. Now, that's conflicting with other accounts.
This does not appear right now to be a roadside bomb. It completely flattened the building there. It's in an area where there are numerous chemical companies, chemical storage sites, some of whom have been -- some of which have been searched in the past by the U.S. military looking for links or hints to some of the explosives that have been troubling U.S. troops and aiding the insurgents across Iraq. COSTELLO: And there were some American injuries there, weren't there, Jim? Although we're not sure how many.
CLANCY: Well, there may well have been, and all of the indications are that there would have almost had to have been some U.S. injuries there or coalition injuries. However, as I just said, that the coalition is telling us no injuries.
And that is often the case, until and unless they get the information and get it confirmed. This can be an hours-long process. I'm afraid we just have to be patient as we wait for those kinds of confirmations to come in.
COSTELLO: And, David, let's get back to these pictures coming out of Fallujah right now. We're seeing very large explosions...
CLINCH: Yes.
COSTELLO: ... which makes you wonder what are in those buildings. Because I know this is an industrial area in Fallujah.
CLINCH: Right. Exactly. Karl Penhaul, the pool reporter reporting for us and the other U.S. networks, making it clear that there was an on-the-ground fight at one point in these buildings. The Marines pulled back. Gunships were hauled in, and they've hit these buildings.
Whether those explosions are caused only by the missiles or perhaps by weapons or other things in those buildings, we will not know. I mean, the information flow in Baghdad is slow enough. The information flow here is what you see is what you know.
COSTELLO: Exactly.
CLINCH: Until the Marines have an opportunity to go back to those buildings at some point, if they do, we don't know exactly what's causing the explosions, other than the fact that they are being hit by gunships from above.
COSTELLO: And, again, in case you're just joining us, 10 U.S. Marines have been injured, four quite seriously. Six have shrapnel wounds.
You know, Jim Clancy, this happens on a day when the Iraqis released pictures of their new flag.
CLANCY: That's right. There is a new flag that's put out by the Iraqi Governing Council. I don't think it's getting a lot of interest even from Iraqis today. Many of them are wondering about it. I don't know. I guess you're showing perhaps this flag to the viewers, a white background with a crescent on it, an Islamic crescent. The white background is said to represent peace. Two blue stripes along the bottom of the flag is said to represent, of course, the two great rivers of Iraq, the Tigris and the Euphrates. Also, in the middle there, a yellow stripe, representing the Kurdish minority in Iraq.
So, that is the proposed new flag. We'll see how it goes over with the Iraqi citizens, who were very...
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COSTELLO: Yes, all trying to get to that -- all trying to get to that June 30 deadline when the transfer of power is to happen. But the violence just keeps happening, especially in cities like Fallujah. And tell us...
CLANCY: Well, that's right. And, you know...
COSTELLO: Go ahead, Jim.
CLANCY: Carol, right now, what you're seeing there in Fallujah, very important questions being asked. Is this a last-ditch effort by the insurgents there to confront U.S. forces on the eve of when they are hoping they can begin joint patrols to bring some semblance of order there? Certainly, it's saying that the calls for a cease-fire are not being heeded by the insurgents themselves. Perhaps Iraqis look at the pictures and say, the U.S. is escalating the situation. They are not responding in kind. They are making matters worse.
COSTELLO: Jim Clancy, many thanks to you.
A last question for you, David. These Iraqi security personnel who are supposedly going to patrol the streets of Fallujah, along with U.S. Marines, are they willing, are they able?
CLINCH: Yes. Well, it's a very good question. We have seen, and the U.S. forces have told us on many occasions, where they have relied on Iraqi forces to turn up. They haven't turned up. But we do know that in Fallujah itself and other hot areas that the United States military has gone out of its way to define and to train and to clarify exactly which Iraqi forces they want to work with. And we have good reason to believe that they have an element of the Iraqi military that they have picked out to work with them.
Whether they'll be able to go out in the streets is another question completely. And, you know, you have this in Fallujah. You have that massive explosion in Baghdad. You have U.S. troops replacing the Spanish, who are leaving in Najaf. This is all over the country today, and it's quite difficult to pull it all back together.
COSTELLO: All right, but we will try. David Clinch, many thanks.
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