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American Morning
'Kamber & May'; 'Paging Dr. Gupta'
Aired June 09, 2004 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: A beautiful shot of the fountain here in New York City.
Welcome back, everybody. Just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING.
In just a few minutes, will the Reagan family's long and excruciating struggle with Alzheimer's transform the debate in Washington D.C. over stem cell research? We'll get perspective from the right and the left on this controversial subject. We talk to our friends Kamber and May this morning.
Also we're taking a look at a new round of ads from the dairy industry, which suggests that milk and yogurt can help you lose weight. Is it true? Dr. Sanjay Gupta is going to join us with a reality check on that.
But first, let's go back to Washington D.C. and Bill Hemmer.
Hey, Bill. Good morning again.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Soledad. Good morning again to you. After spending the last few days in Simi Valley, in California, it is no understatement to say that the crowds that turned out to visit the casket of Ronald Reagan were absolutely enormous. They're saying 106,000 in total, over that about 30 to 34 hour period. Each person that came through was given a memento, a little placard, a little card, that recognizes their presence their and recognizes the life of Ronald Reagan. On it, "With gratitude for your expression of sympathy in honoring the life of Ronald Wilson Reagan, Simi Valley, California, Ronald Reagan Presidential Library."
We expect large crowds again in Washington later tonight, 8:30 local time, when the president's body lies in state in the Rotunda of the Capitol building. When President Bush eulogizes the former president on Friday at the National Cathedral, comparisons between the two now inevitable, we are told by many political advisers. Is that a good or bad thing, for either President Bush or Senator Kerry? Let's talk about it with Kamber and May. Democratic consultant Victor Kamber is our guest here in D.C.
Victor, good morning to you.
VICTOR KAMBER, DEMOCRATIC CONSULTANT: Good morning, Bill. How are you?
HEMMER: I'm doing just fine, thank you. Also in L.A., former RNC communications director Cliff May.
How are you, Cliff? Good morning to you as well.
CLIFF MAY, FMR. RNC COMM. DIR.: I'm good. Good morning, Bill. Good morning, Vic.
HEMMER: I'm going to start close to home here, in our nation's capital. Five months away, Victor. Does Reagan's passing influence President Bush, Senator Kerry, or can we know at this point?
KAMBER: Well, I think today it's all about Ronald Reagan. He's being lionized in a way I think is deserving of a person who was extremely popular within his own party, with both parties as a human being popular. While some of his policies were not terribly accepted everywhere, he as a human being was.
I think, truthfully, in the short run, George Bush suffers, because George Bush is a disciple of Ronald Reagan, and he's not able to deliver in the way that Ronald Reagan delivered. But I think that short run is just that. I think within several weeks of this ceremony and this funeral, we'll be back to the campaign and the issue will be about George Bush or John Kerry, not Ronald Reagan.
Cliff, the suggestion there is that the great communicator makes the current president not look like such a great communicator? Your thoughts?
MAY: There's no question that Ronald Reagan had an ability to communicate that was astonishingly good and it's a really the standard for everyone to meet.
But Ronald Reagan was something else. He was a man who believed in his convictions, had the courage of his convictions. He said things that were not popular at the time, when he called the Soviet Union "evil empire," people, maybe, Victor, were totally scandalized by that. The Soviet Union was an empire. That's why it sent soldiers into Czechoslovakia, Hungary, it was evil. I don't know what else you would call the Gulag Archipelago. He stood up to America's enemies, and even when that was not popular, he showed leadership, and that may redown to Bush's benefit as he tries to do something similar now.
HEMMER: On stem cell research -- Victor, start us off on this one -- Nancy Reagan has put a face on this clearly in the national conscience over the several weeks and going forward. That's at odds to what the White House thinks about this. Does that debate know come front and center. Does it change at all right now with the passing of Ronald Reagan?
KAMBER: Again, I think in the short run, it does raised issue, the fact that also 58 senators and 206 House members recently wrote to George Bush, urging him to put out an executive order that would deal with the stem cell research issue, and use some federal funds for experimentation and for research.
I think in the short run, again, George Bush does nothing. He will alienate his constituency, that hardcore that is anti-this issue. I think Nancy Reagan, clearly, raises the visibility and keeps the issue alive. I think after the election will be the real test of where this issue goes.
HEMMER: Do we wait until December then, Cliff?
MAY: Well, look, I think where we can agree, is we want to find the most effective treatments as quickly as possible. We also want to be careful of some moral lines, not to cross them. If Nancy Reagan wants to get into this debate, having dealt with Alzheimer's and probably studied it for years, she should. There is a difference between embryonic stem cell research, embryos out of the product of human cloning, or abortions, and adult stem cell research, which is making great strides.
I think this is an important debate to have. It shouldn't be simply political; it should be on what is best for patients who are suffering, and again, with some respect for certain moral lines in terms of creation of human life for harvesting.
HEMMER: Just about 30 seconds left, third topic, if we can squeeze it in here. The $10 bill -- does Ronald Reagan replace Alexander Hamilton? Cliff, what do you think?
MAY: I would prefer that he not replace Alexander Hamilton, who as you look back in history, was a very important voice in terms of our economic structure.
But Jackson on the $20? I think that may be a good way to memorialize one ever the most -- there are two consequential presidents in the 20th century, we're going to see. One was FDR, a Democrat. One was Ronald Reagan, a Republican. Both deserve to be memorialized.
HEMMER: What about it, Vic?
KAMBER: I think it's too early to know. I think like postage stamps, where there's a federal law that gives a time, I think there needs to be a time between the passing of a great leader and putting them on coinage or dollars, and I don't know what that time is, five, 10 years. And frankly, if anything, I think we should create two new bills, A $500 and $1,000 bill, put them back in circulation. I don't think we replace people. I think we find another way to honor them.
HEMMER: Thank you, gentlemen, Kamber and May. Kamber and May. Victor Kamber, Cliff May from D.C. and from Los Angeles this morning.
Nice to see you, guys -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: All right, Bill, thanks.
The latest pictures back from Mars now. NASA scientists took a big risk sending the rover Opportunity over the steep edge of a crater. They're not really sure if it can climb back out. But if it confirms what the rover Spirit just found, it'll be well worth it.
Astrophysics professor Charles Liu joins us this morning with more on this.
Nice to see you.
CHARLES LIU, ASTROPHYSICIST: Hello. Good to see you.
O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.
Let's talk a little about what the Spirit is doing. They're talking about the "Salty Trench." What's it doing there?
LIU: Right. Well, if you can think of a Galapagos tortoise doing a wheelie, that's kind of what Spirit is doing.
O'BRIEN: So that's a big, old tortoise?
LIU: Right. Well, here on Earth, we often talk about going down the Grand Canyon, as you move further and further down, you see the different layers, and that tells you what the history of the Earth was during that time. Well, on Mars, even if you go down a few inches or a few feet, it can tell you about thousands, or even millions of years of evolution of the soil, and of the soil construction there.
So what's happening is that when Spirit grinds its wheels into the soil, and then steps back, or rolls back, and then takes measurements of the chemicals in the soil, we can find out the history of what's there. And the history seems to be that it is a salty ocean, and it's been deposited salts as the ocean dried up millions of years ago.
O'BRIEN: So salt is really the critical find here, because you assume when you're finding salt, then there was an ocean there at one point?
LIU: Salt and water. You have to figure out not only that the salt is there, and you also have to know how the salt got there. Usually here on Earth, something like a salt flat. You have salt water, and then the water dries out, you have salt there. And the different levels of the concentration as you go down a trench or down a crater or something is exactly what tells you how it got there.
O'BRIEN: Opportunity, we have a couple of photos I want to talk about. The first is called the Path to Endurance. Let's take a look at this photo, if we could put it up on the screen for a sec.
What are we looking at here?
LIU: Well, this is just the view that we are trying to go to this crater called Endurance. Now that the Spirit and the Opportunity missions have lasted and been so successful, they're trying to take sort of little riskier gambles to try to catch really big scientific returns.
O'BRIEN: There's nothing to lose at this point.
LIU: That's right.
O'BRIEN: They've well down what they set out to do.
LIU: Exactly. Now this crater Endurance is about the size of a football field, and you can imagine has a lip on the side.
O'BRIEN: And while you're talking, we've got a downward view that I want to show everybody.
LIU: OK, wonderful.
The idea is that if we can go down this edge, it's kind of like going down the Grand Canyon, but in a miniature way, and so the further down you can go on the slope, the more we learn about the history of Mars at that area.
O'BRIEN: But it's risky, because of course you can get down, you may not able to get back up, and you can get down and you can tip over and just be useless, right?
LIU: Exactly. They've been running both computer simulations and mechanical models for several days now, trying to be very careful about what they're doing. It's a 25-degree angle going down. That's a pretty heft slope, even here on Earth for a typical SUV; 25 degrees is a challenge.
O'BRIEN: So for a little rover, it could be tricky.
LIU: Yes. But it's worth the risk. If we can find things that are are -- there's a tiny, tiny chance, we may even be able to find fossilized life along this trench once it goes through -- that's very, very tiny, but if it were, it would change our entire view of the universe.
O'BRIEN: And again, they did what they set out to do. So there's really not a huge risk to the...
LIU: That's right. Right now, it's just icing on the cake, and fantastic icing.
O'BRIEN: Yes, that's a nice way to put it. Astrophysics Professor Charles Liu, nice to have you in the studio for coming in to talk to us about this.
LIU: My pleasure. Thanks for having me. Thanks for being with us here in the studio.
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning: Maybe if you ate more cheese, you could shed some pounds. That's what all the ads are saying, at least. Is it hard to believe? Dr. Sanjay Gupta stops by with a reality check this morning.
Also we're "Minding Your Business" with a different spin on Reaganonomics. We'll take a look at how the president put a face on a company, and then put the company on the map. That's ahead. We're back in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) O'BRIEN: Have you seen the new ads? The dairy industry says that adding milk and other dairy products to your daily diet could help you lose weight, but the new claims have others asking, got credibility?
Dr. Sanjay Gupta joins us with a reality check on this.
Does drinking dairy or taking in diary actually make you lose weight?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it could. And they're actually basing a lot of this on a very small study of 32 obese adults.
O'BRIEN: One study, 32 people?
GUPTA: One study. Well, there've been other studies, but the one study that we're focusing on is one that was done independently. A lot of the other studies you read about were actually funded by the dairy industry, so we were very cautious of this.
But you brought up these new ads. Usually, people are used to seeing the old milk mustache, but now you're seeing all sorts of new ads. Take a look there. Really sort of touting, likening milk, or yogurt or cheese to losing weight.
O'BRIEN: What's the theory behind it?
GUPTA: Well, it's interesting, because really don't know why it is if you drink milk, or yogurt or cheese, you'd actually lose weight, but people believe that maybe it's just that you feel more full after you eat these sorts of products.
There's also the notion that they have a lot of amino acids, which are a type of protein that will help you protect muscle and lose fat more readily. And then there's another notion -- I'm giving you a lot here -- but the calcium itself actually induces fat to break down. So you break down more fat.
What is known, from this small study, is that a lot of the fat that was lost was actually around the abdomen, as opposed to other places. Yes, may not work for you.
O'BRIEN: Quick, give me a glass of milk.
GUPTA: But you know that abdominal fat you and I have talked about, particularly concerns for heart decease and things like that.
O'BRIEN: Interesting. So are there planning to do any more independent studies, as you say. When the dairy industry funds a study, of course, everyone looks at it sort of twice, because they have their own interests at heart. Are there more studies planned, with more than 32 people?
GUPTA: Yes. You got to do the larger studies before anybody is going to start advocating dairy as a general rule, and I should point out in the study that we talked about, even though it's small, some of the results. Everyone that was in the study actually had to cut down 500 calories a day already, and they separated them into three groups: people who took three dairy servings a day, people who took one, and people who just got their calcium as supplements. See, look at the numbers there. Those who ate three daily servings a day, they had 11 percent weight loss, about a pound a week at average for them. Calcium supplements, 8.6 percent weight loss. Then the dairy, one or extra serving, 2.5 percent weight loss. So the people who were eating three daily servings, if they also cut 500 calories a day, seemed to get the most benefit from dairy, again, in a study of 32 people.
O'BRIEN: Any correlation between dairy and high-protein, low- carb diets? I mean, because it Doesn't seem like some dairy products, of course high protein, but some are also relatively high carb?
GUPTA: Right, so the Atkins Diet, we looked at some of that as well. They actually advocate some dairy products in their diet, as well, for probably the same reasons we were just talking about. It has the high protein quality, and it may be serving to protect your muscle mass, while allowing your fat to dissolve. It's part theoretical. They do seem to work in animal studies. You're going to need to lead much larger human studies before you can advocate it.
O'BRIEN: So an interesting claim.
GUPTA: We'll keep an eye on the ads.
O'BRIEN: Yes, interesting. All right, Sanjay, thanks.
GUPTA: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: Thank you.
Still to come this morning, the attorney general in the hot seat. We're going to tell you why he was grilled by Congress, just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Forty-nine minutes past the hour now, time to take a look at some of the other stories making headlines today with Heidi Collins.
Hello. Good morning again.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Hello. Good morning to you. And good morning to you, everybody.
The U.N. Security Council unanimously endorsing Iraq's new government. Council members voted yesterday to adopt a much-debated resolution on Iraqi sovereignty. The measure also allowed U.S.-led multinational forces to stay in Iraq after the June 30th power handover.
President Bush is calling the resolution, quote, "a great victory for the Iraqi people." Attorney General John Ashcroft defending U.S. policy on interrogating terror suspects. The attorney general was asked to comment yesterday on reported memos that allowed U.S. officials to use torture in dealing with detained al Qaeda and Taliban members. Mr. Ashcroft refused to give details, but insisted that President Bush did not authorize the use of any illegal techniques.
Congressional investigators are upset about unused airline tickets that were bought by the Pentagon. The report finds the Defense Department wasted $100 million on tickets that sat unused for six years. An earlier investigation found the Pentagon bought almost $70,000 first-class tickets for employee whose should have flown in coach for a lot less money.
Tivo, the popular digital video recorder, is starting a service that will let consumers download movies and music. Tivo so says it's new technology will let you get your selections from the Internet and download them to the hard drive on your video recorder. Tivo, though, is not saying how much this new little feature will cost.
And hold off on that wedding gift for J-Lo and Marc Anthony if you have one sitting by you, at least for now anyway. Jennifer Lopez is dodging reports that she is a Mrs. Lopez and Anthony reportedly tied the knot Saturday in a private ceremony in L.A. but mum's the word on this. And now, some people are speculating Lopez might be pregnant. So we talked about this with our "90 Second Pop" panel a little bit earlier.
O'BRIEN: There are people with pictures.
COLLINS: They say they saw the pictures, right?
O'BRIEN: And there are friends who say they went to the wedding.
COLLINS: Right.
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: I got them a blender, you know?
O'BRIEN: They don't need a blender.
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Well, we'll see, right?
COLLINS: Yes.
O'BRIEN: As long as they're in the news, that's all that matters, I'm sure.
COLLINS: That's correct.
O'BRIEN: All right, Heidi, thanks.
Well, a company Ronald Reagan helped put on the map is now offering a sweet tribute. With that and a preview of the markets this morning, Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business." You know I love when you bring food.
SERWER: I love that, too. I bring these to you. And you know, Ronald Reagan, remember, for tax cuts, fighting the cold wear, but even more than that, maybe jelly beans. The president who put jelly beans on the map, Ronald Reagan. And he put this company Jelly Belly on the map.
It all goes back to 1967, Soledad, his love affair with jelly beans. He started eating them to help quit smoking.
And a lot of trivia here about this company. It's in Fairfield, California.
This is a mosaic they've made. This a picture, Soledad, made from jelly beans, that famous photograph of Reagan that was on the cover of "Time" and "Newsweek" last week. All kinds of jelly bean tributes. Licorice was his favorite flavor. He ordered 7,000 pounds for his 1981 inauguration, and get this, he actually -- Ronald Reagan invented the blueberry jelly bean, because he wanted to have red, white and blue. You can see there's a blue one here. Here is the licorice, his favorite.
The company, it's a great success story, 670 employees; 500,000 visitors a year go to their plant, and, you know, the CEO said, Ronald Reagan put us on the map and made our company a success story. So just a little piece of Reagan trivia out there.
O'BRIEN: That's a great story.
SERWER: That's really interesting stuff, isn't it?
O'BRIEN: Want to talk about the market?
SERWER: Yes, just quickly. Yesterday we were up for the third day in a row, a little bit of a success story here going on. Stock futures down a little bit this morning. However, one stock we'll be watching, Coca-Cola. President and CEO Stephen Hire (ph) will be leaving the company, so we'll be checking that out a little bit later.
O'BRIEN: All right. Thanks, Andy, appreciate it.
SERWER: You're welcome.
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, the very latest in the Scott Peterson trial, revealing a turning point. Laci's stepfather tells jurors why the Rocha family started thinking that Scott Peterson was guilty. We've got analysis from Jeff Toobin just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Welcome back. Jack's got the file.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Want to play some more tic tac toe? I'm one up.
O'BRIEN: No, because I don't know what you're talking about.
CAFFERTY: All right. I whipped her soundly.
It's Wednesday, things people said that got our attention over the past week, beginning with this, "Gee, I need more ugly pictures of me." That would be Linda Tripp, the Monica Lewinsky figure, on barring press coverage of a vacation tour she's organizing. Are there any other kind?
"There are some laggards hanging out there, and I'm going to putting my hand in their wallets," Irish rock star Bono on European Union nations who have not ponied up the money they committed to overseas aid. I like Bono. Does some good stuff.
I love this -- "I would never have done it if I knew. It didn't have a name on it," Orange County North Carolina school board president Keith Cook, who for most of the graduation speech to his students, he plagiarized a speech by former Health and Services Secretary Donna Shalala. Cook first said he wrote the speech, later admitted taking it off the Internet. He resigned this week. School's chancellor giving the graduation speech to his students...
O'BRIEN: And didn't realize he was plagiarizing.
CAFFERTY: Of course he realized.
O'BRIEN: It didn't have a name on it, he said.
CAFFERTY: He didn't write it. He took it off the Internet. It belonged to somebody besides him. He been write it. It was somebody else's.
O'BRIEN: "Find the pro-lifers in a newsroom. That's harder than finding Waldo," David Yarnold, the editor of the opinion pages of "The San Jose Mercury News," on a study that found 7 percent of reporters at national news organizations are self-described conservatives, 34 percent self-identified liberals.
And finally this, "I am a bath connoisseur. I have bath salts, bath beads. I can make you the best bath in the world. And after my bath, I walk around naked for 10 minutes to air dry." This would be P. Diddy telling us much more than any of us want to know about his bathing habits on the -- I don't know, he's in "Raisin in the Sun" over here on Broadway. A Bath connoisseur. I wouldn't have thought of him in exactly that way.
O'BRIEN: It's the walking around naked for 10 minutes part that's...
CAFFERTY: Under any circumstances.
(LAUGHTER)
O'BRIEN: All right, Jack. Thanks -- Bill.
CAFFERTY: Yes. HEMMER: Soledad, thanks. Next hour here, they are the indelible images of the past. JFK Jr., saluting his own father's casket as it passed by back in 1963. In a moment, what can we expect to see this week from President Reagan's state funeral. We talk to a man deeply involved in the ceremonies. He will be there front and center later this evening. He's leading the procession. He's our guest in a moment. Live in Washington, at AMERICAN MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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Aired June 9, 2004 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: A beautiful shot of the fountain here in New York City.
Welcome back, everybody. Just about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING.
In just a few minutes, will the Reagan family's long and excruciating struggle with Alzheimer's transform the debate in Washington D.C. over stem cell research? We'll get perspective from the right and the left on this controversial subject. We talk to our friends Kamber and May this morning.
Also we're taking a look at a new round of ads from the dairy industry, which suggests that milk and yogurt can help you lose weight. Is it true? Dr. Sanjay Gupta is going to join us with a reality check on that.
But first, let's go back to Washington D.C. and Bill Hemmer.
Hey, Bill. Good morning again.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Soledad. Good morning again to you. After spending the last few days in Simi Valley, in California, it is no understatement to say that the crowds that turned out to visit the casket of Ronald Reagan were absolutely enormous. They're saying 106,000 in total, over that about 30 to 34 hour period. Each person that came through was given a memento, a little placard, a little card, that recognizes their presence their and recognizes the life of Ronald Reagan. On it, "With gratitude for your expression of sympathy in honoring the life of Ronald Wilson Reagan, Simi Valley, California, Ronald Reagan Presidential Library."
We expect large crowds again in Washington later tonight, 8:30 local time, when the president's body lies in state in the Rotunda of the Capitol building. When President Bush eulogizes the former president on Friday at the National Cathedral, comparisons between the two now inevitable, we are told by many political advisers. Is that a good or bad thing, for either President Bush or Senator Kerry? Let's talk about it with Kamber and May. Democratic consultant Victor Kamber is our guest here in D.C.
Victor, good morning to you.
VICTOR KAMBER, DEMOCRATIC CONSULTANT: Good morning, Bill. How are you?
HEMMER: I'm doing just fine, thank you. Also in L.A., former RNC communications director Cliff May.
How are you, Cliff? Good morning to you as well.
CLIFF MAY, FMR. RNC COMM. DIR.: I'm good. Good morning, Bill. Good morning, Vic.
HEMMER: I'm going to start close to home here, in our nation's capital. Five months away, Victor. Does Reagan's passing influence President Bush, Senator Kerry, or can we know at this point?
KAMBER: Well, I think today it's all about Ronald Reagan. He's being lionized in a way I think is deserving of a person who was extremely popular within his own party, with both parties as a human being popular. While some of his policies were not terribly accepted everywhere, he as a human being was.
I think, truthfully, in the short run, George Bush suffers, because George Bush is a disciple of Ronald Reagan, and he's not able to deliver in the way that Ronald Reagan delivered. But I think that short run is just that. I think within several weeks of this ceremony and this funeral, we'll be back to the campaign and the issue will be about George Bush or John Kerry, not Ronald Reagan.
Cliff, the suggestion there is that the great communicator makes the current president not look like such a great communicator? Your thoughts?
MAY: There's no question that Ronald Reagan had an ability to communicate that was astonishingly good and it's a really the standard for everyone to meet.
But Ronald Reagan was something else. He was a man who believed in his convictions, had the courage of his convictions. He said things that were not popular at the time, when he called the Soviet Union "evil empire," people, maybe, Victor, were totally scandalized by that. The Soviet Union was an empire. That's why it sent soldiers into Czechoslovakia, Hungary, it was evil. I don't know what else you would call the Gulag Archipelago. He stood up to America's enemies, and even when that was not popular, he showed leadership, and that may redown to Bush's benefit as he tries to do something similar now.
HEMMER: On stem cell research -- Victor, start us off on this one -- Nancy Reagan has put a face on this clearly in the national conscience over the several weeks and going forward. That's at odds to what the White House thinks about this. Does that debate know come front and center. Does it change at all right now with the passing of Ronald Reagan?
KAMBER: Again, I think in the short run, it does raised issue, the fact that also 58 senators and 206 House members recently wrote to George Bush, urging him to put out an executive order that would deal with the stem cell research issue, and use some federal funds for experimentation and for research.
I think in the short run, again, George Bush does nothing. He will alienate his constituency, that hardcore that is anti-this issue. I think Nancy Reagan, clearly, raises the visibility and keeps the issue alive. I think after the election will be the real test of where this issue goes.
HEMMER: Do we wait until December then, Cliff?
MAY: Well, look, I think where we can agree, is we want to find the most effective treatments as quickly as possible. We also want to be careful of some moral lines, not to cross them. If Nancy Reagan wants to get into this debate, having dealt with Alzheimer's and probably studied it for years, she should. There is a difference between embryonic stem cell research, embryos out of the product of human cloning, or abortions, and adult stem cell research, which is making great strides.
I think this is an important debate to have. It shouldn't be simply political; it should be on what is best for patients who are suffering, and again, with some respect for certain moral lines in terms of creation of human life for harvesting.
HEMMER: Just about 30 seconds left, third topic, if we can squeeze it in here. The $10 bill -- does Ronald Reagan replace Alexander Hamilton? Cliff, what do you think?
MAY: I would prefer that he not replace Alexander Hamilton, who as you look back in history, was a very important voice in terms of our economic structure.
But Jackson on the $20? I think that may be a good way to memorialize one ever the most -- there are two consequential presidents in the 20th century, we're going to see. One was FDR, a Democrat. One was Ronald Reagan, a Republican. Both deserve to be memorialized.
HEMMER: What about it, Vic?
KAMBER: I think it's too early to know. I think like postage stamps, where there's a federal law that gives a time, I think there needs to be a time between the passing of a great leader and putting them on coinage or dollars, and I don't know what that time is, five, 10 years. And frankly, if anything, I think we should create two new bills, A $500 and $1,000 bill, put them back in circulation. I don't think we replace people. I think we find another way to honor them.
HEMMER: Thank you, gentlemen, Kamber and May. Kamber and May. Victor Kamber, Cliff May from D.C. and from Los Angeles this morning.
Nice to see you, guys -- Soledad.
O'BRIEN: All right, Bill, thanks.
The latest pictures back from Mars now. NASA scientists took a big risk sending the rover Opportunity over the steep edge of a crater. They're not really sure if it can climb back out. But if it confirms what the rover Spirit just found, it'll be well worth it.
Astrophysics professor Charles Liu joins us this morning with more on this.
Nice to see you.
CHARLES LIU, ASTROPHYSICIST: Hello. Good to see you.
O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.
Let's talk a little about what the Spirit is doing. They're talking about the "Salty Trench." What's it doing there?
LIU: Right. Well, if you can think of a Galapagos tortoise doing a wheelie, that's kind of what Spirit is doing.
O'BRIEN: So that's a big, old tortoise?
LIU: Right. Well, here on Earth, we often talk about going down the Grand Canyon, as you move further and further down, you see the different layers, and that tells you what the history of the Earth was during that time. Well, on Mars, even if you go down a few inches or a few feet, it can tell you about thousands, or even millions of years of evolution of the soil, and of the soil construction there.
So what's happening is that when Spirit grinds its wheels into the soil, and then steps back, or rolls back, and then takes measurements of the chemicals in the soil, we can find out the history of what's there. And the history seems to be that it is a salty ocean, and it's been deposited salts as the ocean dried up millions of years ago.
O'BRIEN: So salt is really the critical find here, because you assume when you're finding salt, then there was an ocean there at one point?
LIU: Salt and water. You have to figure out not only that the salt is there, and you also have to know how the salt got there. Usually here on Earth, something like a salt flat. You have salt water, and then the water dries out, you have salt there. And the different levels of the concentration as you go down a trench or down a crater or something is exactly what tells you how it got there.
O'BRIEN: Opportunity, we have a couple of photos I want to talk about. The first is called the Path to Endurance. Let's take a look at this photo, if we could put it up on the screen for a sec.
What are we looking at here?
LIU: Well, this is just the view that we are trying to go to this crater called Endurance. Now that the Spirit and the Opportunity missions have lasted and been so successful, they're trying to take sort of little riskier gambles to try to catch really big scientific returns.
O'BRIEN: There's nothing to lose at this point.
LIU: That's right.
O'BRIEN: They've well down what they set out to do.
LIU: Exactly. Now this crater Endurance is about the size of a football field, and you can imagine has a lip on the side.
O'BRIEN: And while you're talking, we've got a downward view that I want to show everybody.
LIU: OK, wonderful.
The idea is that if we can go down this edge, it's kind of like going down the Grand Canyon, but in a miniature way, and so the further down you can go on the slope, the more we learn about the history of Mars at that area.
O'BRIEN: But it's risky, because of course you can get down, you may not able to get back up, and you can get down and you can tip over and just be useless, right?
LIU: Exactly. They've been running both computer simulations and mechanical models for several days now, trying to be very careful about what they're doing. It's a 25-degree angle going down. That's a pretty heft slope, even here on Earth for a typical SUV; 25 degrees is a challenge.
O'BRIEN: So for a little rover, it could be tricky.
LIU: Yes. But it's worth the risk. If we can find things that are are -- there's a tiny, tiny chance, we may even be able to find fossilized life along this trench once it goes through -- that's very, very tiny, but if it were, it would change our entire view of the universe.
O'BRIEN: And again, they did what they set out to do. So there's really not a huge risk to the...
LIU: That's right. Right now, it's just icing on the cake, and fantastic icing.
O'BRIEN: Yes, that's a nice way to put it. Astrophysics Professor Charles Liu, nice to have you in the studio for coming in to talk to us about this.
LIU: My pleasure. Thanks for having me. Thanks for being with us here in the studio.
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning: Maybe if you ate more cheese, you could shed some pounds. That's what all the ads are saying, at least. Is it hard to believe? Dr. Sanjay Gupta stops by with a reality check this morning.
Also we're "Minding Your Business" with a different spin on Reaganonomics. We'll take a look at how the president put a face on a company, and then put the company on the map. That's ahead. We're back in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) O'BRIEN: Have you seen the new ads? The dairy industry says that adding milk and other dairy products to your daily diet could help you lose weight, but the new claims have others asking, got credibility?
Dr. Sanjay Gupta joins us with a reality check on this.
Does drinking dairy or taking in diary actually make you lose weight?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it could. And they're actually basing a lot of this on a very small study of 32 obese adults.
O'BRIEN: One study, 32 people?
GUPTA: One study. Well, there've been other studies, but the one study that we're focusing on is one that was done independently. A lot of the other studies you read about were actually funded by the dairy industry, so we were very cautious of this.
But you brought up these new ads. Usually, people are used to seeing the old milk mustache, but now you're seeing all sorts of new ads. Take a look there. Really sort of touting, likening milk, or yogurt or cheese to losing weight.
O'BRIEN: What's the theory behind it?
GUPTA: Well, it's interesting, because really don't know why it is if you drink milk, or yogurt or cheese, you'd actually lose weight, but people believe that maybe it's just that you feel more full after you eat these sorts of products.
There's also the notion that they have a lot of amino acids, which are a type of protein that will help you protect muscle and lose fat more readily. And then there's another notion -- I'm giving you a lot here -- but the calcium itself actually induces fat to break down. So you break down more fat.
What is known, from this small study, is that a lot of the fat that was lost was actually around the abdomen, as opposed to other places. Yes, may not work for you.
O'BRIEN: Quick, give me a glass of milk.
GUPTA: But you know that abdominal fat you and I have talked about, particularly concerns for heart decease and things like that.
O'BRIEN: Interesting. So are there planning to do any more independent studies, as you say. When the dairy industry funds a study, of course, everyone looks at it sort of twice, because they have their own interests at heart. Are there more studies planned, with more than 32 people?
GUPTA: Yes. You got to do the larger studies before anybody is going to start advocating dairy as a general rule, and I should point out in the study that we talked about, even though it's small, some of the results. Everyone that was in the study actually had to cut down 500 calories a day already, and they separated them into three groups: people who took three dairy servings a day, people who took one, and people who just got their calcium as supplements. See, look at the numbers there. Those who ate three daily servings a day, they had 11 percent weight loss, about a pound a week at average for them. Calcium supplements, 8.6 percent weight loss. Then the dairy, one or extra serving, 2.5 percent weight loss. So the people who were eating three daily servings, if they also cut 500 calories a day, seemed to get the most benefit from dairy, again, in a study of 32 people.
O'BRIEN: Any correlation between dairy and high-protein, low- carb diets? I mean, because it Doesn't seem like some dairy products, of course high protein, but some are also relatively high carb?
GUPTA: Right, so the Atkins Diet, we looked at some of that as well. They actually advocate some dairy products in their diet, as well, for probably the same reasons we were just talking about. It has the high protein quality, and it may be serving to protect your muscle mass, while allowing your fat to dissolve. It's part theoretical. They do seem to work in animal studies. You're going to need to lead much larger human studies before you can advocate it.
O'BRIEN: So an interesting claim.
GUPTA: We'll keep an eye on the ads.
O'BRIEN: Yes, interesting. All right, Sanjay, thanks.
GUPTA: Thank you.
O'BRIEN: Thank you.
Still to come this morning, the attorney general in the hot seat. We're going to tell you why he was grilled by Congress, just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
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O'BRIEN: Forty-nine minutes past the hour now, time to take a look at some of the other stories making headlines today with Heidi Collins.
Hello. Good morning again.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Hello. Good morning to you. And good morning to you, everybody.
The U.N. Security Council unanimously endorsing Iraq's new government. Council members voted yesterday to adopt a much-debated resolution on Iraqi sovereignty. The measure also allowed U.S.-led multinational forces to stay in Iraq after the June 30th power handover.
President Bush is calling the resolution, quote, "a great victory for the Iraqi people." Attorney General John Ashcroft defending U.S. policy on interrogating terror suspects. The attorney general was asked to comment yesterday on reported memos that allowed U.S. officials to use torture in dealing with detained al Qaeda and Taliban members. Mr. Ashcroft refused to give details, but insisted that President Bush did not authorize the use of any illegal techniques.
Congressional investigators are upset about unused airline tickets that were bought by the Pentagon. The report finds the Defense Department wasted $100 million on tickets that sat unused for six years. An earlier investigation found the Pentagon bought almost $70,000 first-class tickets for employee whose should have flown in coach for a lot less money.
Tivo, the popular digital video recorder, is starting a service that will let consumers download movies and music. Tivo so says it's new technology will let you get your selections from the Internet and download them to the hard drive on your video recorder. Tivo, though, is not saying how much this new little feature will cost.
And hold off on that wedding gift for J-Lo and Marc Anthony if you have one sitting by you, at least for now anyway. Jennifer Lopez is dodging reports that she is a Mrs. Lopez and Anthony reportedly tied the knot Saturday in a private ceremony in L.A. but mum's the word on this. And now, some people are speculating Lopez might be pregnant. So we talked about this with our "90 Second Pop" panel a little bit earlier.
O'BRIEN: There are people with pictures.
COLLINS: They say they saw the pictures, right?
O'BRIEN: And there are friends who say they went to the wedding.
COLLINS: Right.
ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: I got them a blender, you know?
O'BRIEN: They don't need a blender.
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Well, we'll see, right?
COLLINS: Yes.
O'BRIEN: As long as they're in the news, that's all that matters, I'm sure.
COLLINS: That's correct.
O'BRIEN: All right, Heidi, thanks.
Well, a company Ronald Reagan helped put on the map is now offering a sweet tribute. With that and a preview of the markets this morning, Andy Serwer is "Minding Your Business." You know I love when you bring food.
SERWER: I love that, too. I bring these to you. And you know, Ronald Reagan, remember, for tax cuts, fighting the cold wear, but even more than that, maybe jelly beans. The president who put jelly beans on the map, Ronald Reagan. And he put this company Jelly Belly on the map.
It all goes back to 1967, Soledad, his love affair with jelly beans. He started eating them to help quit smoking.
And a lot of trivia here about this company. It's in Fairfield, California.
This is a mosaic they've made. This a picture, Soledad, made from jelly beans, that famous photograph of Reagan that was on the cover of "Time" and "Newsweek" last week. All kinds of jelly bean tributes. Licorice was his favorite flavor. He ordered 7,000 pounds for his 1981 inauguration, and get this, he actually -- Ronald Reagan invented the blueberry jelly bean, because he wanted to have red, white and blue. You can see there's a blue one here. Here is the licorice, his favorite.
The company, it's a great success story, 670 employees; 500,000 visitors a year go to their plant, and, you know, the CEO said, Ronald Reagan put us on the map and made our company a success story. So just a little piece of Reagan trivia out there.
O'BRIEN: That's a great story.
SERWER: That's really interesting stuff, isn't it?
O'BRIEN: Want to talk about the market?
SERWER: Yes, just quickly. Yesterday we were up for the third day in a row, a little bit of a success story here going on. Stock futures down a little bit this morning. However, one stock we'll be watching, Coca-Cola. President and CEO Stephen Hire (ph) will be leaving the company, so we'll be checking that out a little bit later.
O'BRIEN: All right. Thanks, Andy, appreciate it.
SERWER: You're welcome.
O'BRIEN: Still to come this morning, the very latest in the Scott Peterson trial, revealing a turning point. Laci's stepfather tells jurors why the Rocha family started thinking that Scott Peterson was guilty. We've got analysis from Jeff Toobin just ahead on AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
O'BRIEN: Welcome back. Jack's got the file.
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Want to play some more tic tac toe? I'm one up.
O'BRIEN: No, because I don't know what you're talking about.
CAFFERTY: All right. I whipped her soundly.
It's Wednesday, things people said that got our attention over the past week, beginning with this, "Gee, I need more ugly pictures of me." That would be Linda Tripp, the Monica Lewinsky figure, on barring press coverage of a vacation tour she's organizing. Are there any other kind?
"There are some laggards hanging out there, and I'm going to putting my hand in their wallets," Irish rock star Bono on European Union nations who have not ponied up the money they committed to overseas aid. I like Bono. Does some good stuff.
I love this -- "I would never have done it if I knew. It didn't have a name on it," Orange County North Carolina school board president Keith Cook, who for most of the graduation speech to his students, he plagiarized a speech by former Health and Services Secretary Donna Shalala. Cook first said he wrote the speech, later admitted taking it off the Internet. He resigned this week. School's chancellor giving the graduation speech to his students...
O'BRIEN: And didn't realize he was plagiarizing.
CAFFERTY: Of course he realized.
O'BRIEN: It didn't have a name on it, he said.
CAFFERTY: He didn't write it. He took it off the Internet. It belonged to somebody besides him. He been write it. It was somebody else's.
O'BRIEN: "Find the pro-lifers in a newsroom. That's harder than finding Waldo," David Yarnold, the editor of the opinion pages of "The San Jose Mercury News," on a study that found 7 percent of reporters at national news organizations are self-described conservatives, 34 percent self-identified liberals.
And finally this, "I am a bath connoisseur. I have bath salts, bath beads. I can make you the best bath in the world. And after my bath, I walk around naked for 10 minutes to air dry." This would be P. Diddy telling us much more than any of us want to know about his bathing habits on the -- I don't know, he's in "Raisin in the Sun" over here on Broadway. A Bath connoisseur. I wouldn't have thought of him in exactly that way.
O'BRIEN: It's the walking around naked for 10 minutes part that's...
CAFFERTY: Under any circumstances.
(LAUGHTER)
O'BRIEN: All right, Jack. Thanks -- Bill.
CAFFERTY: Yes. HEMMER: Soledad, thanks. Next hour here, they are the indelible images of the past. JFK Jr., saluting his own father's casket as it passed by back in 1963. In a moment, what can we expect to see this week from President Reagan's state funeral. We talk to a man deeply involved in the ceremonies. He will be there front and center later this evening. He's leading the procession. He's our guest in a moment. Live in Washington, at AMERICAN MORNING continues.
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